SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 18 Spoiler Discussion

[The Twilight Mexican]

I really did not need to know that it sounds like they don't know what exactly is going to happen in the games after the Remake...

That's a lot to read into a fairly mundane comment, though. He may just want to see how folks are intepreting it.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Naw. For better or worst, this is all very intentional. This confirms what I had said before, in that they know what they're doing and this set up is a way for them to lead into the next part and keep fan expectation heightened. The entire drawback of a remake is that it's totally expected. This answers that.

For better or worst for some, it's no different than when us Kingdom Hearts fans see a mindscrew secret ending and have to wait a year and a half to get any context or clarity about direction or depth regarding the next story. It's just a mystery now, but again. I'm not worried!

Let them bring their Jenovas and their Sephiroths. Cause trouble til their heart's content. They'll do as life/SE dictates and they'll make it good. They'll nail it.

 

[Wol]

I really did not need to know that it sounds like they don't know what exactly is going to happen in the games after the Remake...

SQ Official Survey
-"Do you want Zack to live?"

Tumblr users: well of course


I mean, saying they want to hear fans while ignoring what a good chuck of them wanted in the first place is lol

 

[oty]

Well, atleast we know they know about the complaints, since Twitter is filled with them lol

Also, texture patch. Cmon SE

 

[Tetsujin]

At 00:15 the camera pulls up to reveal Sephiroth. At 00:22 his sword has pierced Aerith.

Seven seconds till the end?

 

[Makoeyes987]

Would they really make a reference like that...?

Have they ever done a reference so precise and hidden before?

That'd be wild if they thought like that, but could it be that precise?

 

[Dark and Divine]

Out of curiosity, did anyone used "Assess" in Sephiroth?

 

[Wol]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/168653-final-fantasy-vii-remake/78569301

some interesting theories...

he's suggesting that there isnt time-travel, but since the will of the Planet is fixed anyone Ancient or anyone carrying Jenova's cells can see the future.

Sephiroth knows about the future.

therefore, the Lifestream works like Chaos in XIII saga.

 

[Tetsujin]

Out of curiosity, did anyone used "Assess" in Sephiroth?

Yeah, it just says "couldn't read" lol

 

[Teioh]

Okay. Finished the game. This chapter, I hated it. From the moment it started me with the motorcycle game all the way to the credits. Shout out to Rufus and the Shinra execs and also to Biggs and Marlene, you were a bright light in whatever that was I just played. Also was it just me or was the hair textures and Sephiroth's wing a little off in this part? Maybe it's always been that way in battles and I only noticed it now because of how annoyed I was

Anyway, I'm gonna go and deny that any of that last part of the chapter happened. It was totally a hallucination caused by Jenova Dream. Yup, that's what happened, I definitely just fought Jenova at the end of that road and nothing weirder than that happened. Yup.

 

[Wol]

Okay. Finished the game. This chapter, I hated it. From the moment it started me with the motorcycle game all the way to the credits. Shout out to Rufus and the Shinra execs and also to Biggs and Marlene, you were a bright light in whatever that was I just played. Also was it just me or was the hair textures and Sephiroth's wing a little off in this part? Maybe it's always been that way in battles and I only noticed it now because of how annoyed I was

Anyway, I'm gonna go and deny that any of that last part of the chapter happened. It was totally a hallucination caused by Jenova Dream. Yup, that's what happened, I definitely just fought Jenova at the end of that road and nothing weirder than that happened. Yup.

It was an hallucination... from the writers and director, that is.

its reeks of bad taste, its tone dissonant, and the list goes on... Btw, I enjoyed the Compilation, loved the movie, they had their problems but they felt like something it could happen in that world, not an aberration.

 

[Razuun]

I can't help but think the reading that this is a changed timeline is somewhat premature.

ORIGINAL Stamp's Champs

It's a hint that Zack is the 'original', I think that's the purpose of it.
Cloud is called Stamp repeatedly throughout the game. Zack is the original 'Stamp'.

This is where the Zack flashback ends.
I.E Zack is still about to die.

My theory is that the Whispers are basically the Weapons of Fate. They're there to make sure that the life cycle of the planet is predictable. I.e to be consumed by Chaos and collected by Omega. Sephiroth wants to defy that natural fate with Meteor. He can't do that with the Whispers in the way. So he manipulates them and manipulates Cloud's party to defeat them so he can enact his plans. Which is still Meteor. This isn't future post AC Sephiroth.

 

[Eerie]

It's not Stamp, it's "Stamp's Champs" as written, so it's one of Stamp's sidekicks instead. I have to agree that Zack's still about to die though, it was just shown like it was in the OG (+CC), for the sake of showing that powerful moment of when Cloud came back to Midgard versus how he left, everything he lost and gained, and so that Aerith would have a hint that Cloud is definitely linked to Zack, as she probably guessed when she saw his sword on his back at the very beginning.

 

[Lex]

At 00:15 the camera pulls up to reveal Sephiroth. At 00:22 his sword has pierced Aerith.

Seven seconds till the end?

That line, as soon as I heard it, reminded me of Buffy's infamous "little miss muffet counting down from 730". I'm sure it did the same thing to you?

I think this explanation is as plausible as anything else I could come up with tbh.

 

[Tetsujin]

My theory is that the Whispers are basically the Weapons of Fate. They're there to make sure that the life cycle of the planet is predictable. I.e to be consumed by Chaos and collected by Omega. Sephiroth wants to defy that natural fate with Meteor. He can't do that with the Whispers in the way. So he manipulates them and manipulates Cloud's party to defeat them so he can enact his plans. Which is still Meteor. This isn't future post AC Sephiroth.

He might not be from the future but at the very least he has knowledge of it

 

[Lex]

We need to talk about the Jenova battle music.

Fuck me sideways. I was almost disappointed during this and then 5:00 happened and I nearly burst into tears. I'm so happy with it.

 

[crazyrabbits23]

For a remake that was hyped as "expanding Midgar" it certainly failed to deliver on that front. If anything it feels even more linear and restrained than the PS1 version.

LMAO

The only way someone would say this was the case is if they were an ultra-purist looking at the original game through rose-tinted glasses. The devs literally took locations that were just a handful of static images and greatly boosted the amount of content within each location. Chapter 3 alone took a location (the slums) that was just three top-down images with a handful of interiors and easily tripled (if not quadrupled) the amount of NPC-specific content, added in a half-dozen chapter-specific sidequests, tied said sidequests into tangible rewards (a bonus scene/choice that impacts a later chapter) and factors in the materia-specific research missions.

In fact, I'd argue that the choice system (specifically within Wall Market and via the variables that influence the choice of whether you talk to Tifa/Barrett at Aerith's house after the plate falls) are far beyond what the original game was capable of, with multiple sets of factors (including # of sidequests completed, varying sets of missions that can be tackled and the aforementioned choices in earlier chapters all changing later events.

The new locations are hardly anything to write home about, mostly consisting of generic looking factories over and over again, and every location just feels like a series of linear hallways.

And from what I've played so far, the new setpieces (the destruction in Chapter 2, Jessie's house, the first motorcycle chase and the factory raid) are just as good as the rest of the game, with plenty of entertaining NPC dialogue to match.

The ONLY time you're ever allowed to do any kind of exploring of your own is in the few chapters which let you do sidequests, which mostly consist of generic RPG stuff i.e killing rats in an abandoned warehouse, playing hide and seek with children all over town, and so on. Otherwise you're gated off from going in any direction the game doesn't want you to go yet.

The only time the content in Midgar significantly changed (before the Midgar Raid, which is just running through tunnels and collecting a couple of optional items at the Shinra Building) was on the return trip if you got the key from Mideel, and the "bonus" content there was nothing to write home about (a couple of items [Thief Glove/Tifa's weapon] and a couple of unique encounters [Cid fixing the Wall Market machine/Aeris ghost]). Beyond that, it was almost exactly the same. The sidequests and bonus content here have choices that are built into multiple playthroughs, paths that incentivize exploration [Corneo's secret stash] and plenty more to see and do throughout the chapters, including sidequests that factor into later development. I don't recall any circumstance where the devs said that Midgar would be fully open-world, and the final game doesn't do much different that the original didn't already do.

 

[Tetsujin]

We need to talk about the Jenova battle music.

Fuck me sideways. I was almost disappointed during this and then 5:00 happened and I nearly burst into tears. I'm so happy with it.

Yeah, I posted about it in the ch 17 thread: https://thelifestream.net/forums/threads/ffvii-r-chapter-17-spoiler-discussion.22423/

 

[Lex]

Someone just said to me that each of the whispers are Cloud, Tifa and Barret from the future.

Does that vibe with anyone else's interpretation? Has it been discussed in here? I haven't looked into their assess info enough to determine that.

 

[Tetsujin]

Someone just said to me that each of the whispers are Cloud, Tifa and Barret from the future.

Does that vibe with anyone else's interpretation? Has it been discussed in here? I haven't looked into their assess info enough to determine that.

Their enemy intel bit says they are protecting the future timeline that gave shape to them or something and saying one of them fights with a sword, one with bare hands and the other with guns (they are gun arms).

I don't think it's them per se but who knows

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

It's one of those things that seems like it could be relevant, but who knows at the moment. May be related to Cloud, Tifa, and Barret, though some speculate it may be Sephiroth's influence manifesting in a similar manner to how it did in Kadaj (swordsman), Loz (brawler), and Yazoo (marksman).

If we conclude, though, that Seph didn't have any control over the Whispers until he absorbed them following the Whisper Harbinger battle, it seems less likely to be related to him.

 

[Theozilla]

Though the fact that Sephiroth is able to speak through the Whispers before they attack the Sector 7 Slums in Chapter 4 when Cloud was asleep I think indicates he was able to have some degree of interaction/manipulation of them before the Whisper Harbinger was defeated.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Though the fact that Sephiroth is able to speak through the Whispers before they attack the Sector 7 Slums in Chapter 4 when Cloud was asleep I think indicates he was able to have some degree of interaction/manipulation of them before the Whisper Harbinger was defeated.

Seph doesn't need the Whispers to facilitate speaking into Cloud's mind, though. He can do that with the Jenova connection they already share. Those Whispers may have been there to wake him up since Seph was telling him to sleep.

 

[Theozilla]

Seph doesn't need the Whispers to facilitate speaking into Cloud's mind, though. He can do that with the Jenova connection they already share. Those Whispers may have been there to wake him up since Seph was telling him to sleep.

Perhaps, but it seems kinda overly coincidental that a Whisper was hovering over Cloud (I don’t think it was morning yet) while Sephiroth was speaking to Cloud; and for it to not be an indication that there is a connection between the two seems even more unlikely considering standard audio-visual cinematic language.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I mean, I'm sure they wanted us to think there was a connection between the two at thay moment. They've wanted us to think that ever since they unveiled the Guardians last June. Why else would they have picked the black-robed Dementor look for them in the first place?

It was misdirection, though, with the twist being that they're adversaries.