SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 18 Spoiler Discussion

Fangu

Great Old One
Okay Zack looks downright gorgeous. I think I'm in love.

I had to come here because I was reading comments on YouTube about alternate timelines and I was all WHAT THE FUCK, glad it's looking like that's fake news x)
 

Gazzdw

Lv. 25 Adventurer
AKA
Gaz
A thought I had regarding Sephiroth controlling the watchers - Isn't there key art ( might also be the Seph PlayStation background theme) that shows the Watchmen swirling around him? To me that insinuates he controls them.
 

Noble0ne

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Noble
Did you not read my post? Fake news... I think not... More so people are holding on to the chance for game two, to clarify that
 
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The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
True that, I was just referring to the theory that Cloud was the one to hide it; Zack making his speech with it already like this means the Buster Sword was already like in the OG when Cloud rolled in Midgar in the Remake.
Well, it means one vision or the other isn't completely reliable. Probably the flash forward, if I had to guess, but you never know.

Okay Zack looks downright gorgeous. I think I'm in love.

I had to come here because I was reading comments on YouTube about alternate timelines and I was all WHAT THE FUCK, glad it's looking like that's fake news x)
Still unclear right now. There is definitely some temporal manipulation at work, but what it entails we don't yet know. =(
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
A thought I had regarding Sephiroth controlling the watchers - Isn't there key art ( might also be the Seph PlayStation background theme) that shows the Watchmen swirling around him? To me that insinuates he controls them.

I thought so as well, however there are several instances where they outright oppose what would be in his interest and through a complete analysis of what they do and don't do, they really aren't under his control.

It's more akin to him exploiting them near the end.
 

Noble0ne

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Noble
A thought I had regarding Sephiroth controlling the watchers - Isn't there key art ( might also be the Seph PlayStation background theme) that shows the Watchmen swirling around him? To me that insinuates he controls them.
It's not extreme left or extreme right... There is a grey area... He clearly has influence on them... The question is to what extent... Because if you seen the whole game he clearly does not have full control... That like saying because sephirtoh manipulated cloud once in the OG that cloud is 100% Sephiroths puppet
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
The best way I can think of keeping the gold cross-guard theory alive, is that Zack put the steel bolt box on while they were on the run. Perhaps some naive attempt to make the sword less recognizable? (Or maybe not so naive since there are other giant swords for Cloud to buy in both the OG/Remake, so maybe giant swords are more common in their world) Or perhaps it was Zack’s way of trying to protect the cross-guards from “wear and tear” while on the run?
 

Noble0ne

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Noble
Less recognizable hahaha that big ole thing... Lol not disagreing, I have no stakes in this back and forward but that was funny...

Considering all the kids in the remake with buster swords on there backs this could be legit... Like buster sorwds may be a common sword look

Funny how all the weapon shops make words and we see solder 3rd class wielding swords too so I can dig it
 

Wol

None Shall Remember Those Who Do Not Fight
AKA
Rosarian Shield
It's not extreme left or extreme right... There is a grey area... He clearly has influence on them... The question is to what extent... Because if you seen the whole game he clearly does not have full control... That like saying because sephirtoh manipulated cloud once in the OG that cloud is 100% Sephiroths puppet
there are more indications than that.

1. They merge with Seph after generic dark giant is defeated
2. Seph seems to throw them against the party during the final fight.

honestly both them and Seph are pretty chill around each other
 

Noble0ne

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Noble
honestly felt more like he did to show he could kill them if he wanted to.
Fair enough... But that would mean he's watching the party & Avelanche like Santa clause for real for real.

He thusly saved Aerith from the turks To kill her later...

He Hurt Jesse in sector 7

He took & maybe killed wedge for whatever reason

He stopped hojo from telling cloud he's not soldier first class.

He covered Midgar in ghost for whatever reason...

He already Has the Degenrating retired Cloak SoIlders with tattoos... What he still need the ghost for too... But maybe your right... Will have to wait till game two
 

Wol

None Shall Remember Those Who Do Not Fight
AKA
Rosarian Shield
Fair enough... But that would mean he's watching the party & Avelanche like Santa clause for real for real.

He thusly saved Aerith from the turks To kill her later...

He Hurt Jesse in sector 7

He took & maybe killed wedge for whatever reason

He stopped hojo from telling cloud he's not soldier first class.

He covered Midgar in ghost for whatever reason...

He already Has the Degenrating retired Cloak SoIlders with tattoos... What he still need the ghost for too... But maybe your right... Will have to wait till game two
might be that he controls them when he feels is useful, or maybe both his and theirs agenda is the same.

but Seph do talk about defying fate, so who knows, I think he's trying to shape the story just like Caius did in XIII-2
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
Jabs at the game aside, if you analyze the totality of Arbiter of Fate events that transpire within the story, the commonality they all share is that they "course correct" situations that would deviate from their path as shown before in FFVII.

How these deviations occur, seems to almost entirely be in connection to Sephiroth or his influence. Interestingly enough, these forces are side by side each other in numerous scenes or events. Between Cloud either having visions of Sephiroth that distract him, move him to make different choices, or even attempting to slow him down from actually meeting Aerith, the Whispers somehow try to intercede at certain points.

There's an implied tug-of-war between these two forces, with Sephiroth's presence in the Shinra Building exacerbating their manifestation. To the point that they cluster, surround Midgar entirely, and create a singularity to the past (and apparently even the future) that Sephiroth tries to exploit until he's beaten back. The "Seven seconds till the end" line speaks to the amount of time left for that singularity to remain active. He's seemingly baiting Cloud and the others to make a change that would in essence do his work for him. They avoid taking the bait since the progression of Zack's journey and inevitable conclusion remain in tact and Cloud and the others move on.

There is definitely some sort of force at work that appears to be trying to protect the Planet from the perceived distortions Sephiroth is trying to manifest, because he clearly wants to try accelerate his plans. I think Destiny's Crossroads is a clear reference to how in essence Sephiroth nearly skipped ahead to the part he wins through using the planet's own Temporal defense against him.
 

Noble0ne

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Noble
might be that he controls them when he feels is useful, or maybe both his and theirs agenda is the same.

but Seph do talk about defying fate, so who knows, I think he's trying to shape the story just like Caius did in XIII-2
Then there is the fact that he chopped a bunch of them in half with one slice at the end... Why kill your own minions, ... Ohh whait he's a crazy villain, so yeah could still be 100% or maybe just when convenient. It's a cliff hanger for sure
 
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