Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)

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Tetsujin

he/they
AKA
Tets
G7EbDx7.gif
 

Erotic Materia

[CONFUSED SCREAMING]
Honestly not saying this to insult the guy, but his posts sound like schizophrenic ramblings. Words that technically make sense, but there's no theme connecting them. Like free association writing, but without end.
 
I hope the carcass of Sapphire Weapon will be visible from your perspective when approaching the Underwater Reactor and when you leave at the start of the submarine section.

One thing I only just now realized is that I've long held the headcanon that Weapon can't die but that they only go to sleep and regenerate, unless some big planetary force (like Holy) tell them to stop being active. It's a probable misreading of what Ifalna says in the tapes at Icicle Inn.
PS1, Japanese line:
「ウェポンが消えることはありません。
 …この星のどこかで眠っているのです」

PS1, English line:
“Weapon cannot vanish.
…it remains asleep
somewhere on the Planet.”
The line is in response to Gast asking “So, Weapon no longer exists on this Planet?”, so Ifalna may simply be stating that Weapon don't just disappear on their own, stating nothing about their regenerative capabilities.

Since Omega Weapon is part of the planet's whole cycle-shindig I reckon that particular one is effectively immortal and will simply regenerate when the time is right, but I'm not sure how to view the five anti-Jenova Weapon (Sapphire, Ultimate/Ultima, Diamond, Emerald and Ruby).

All this speculative interpretation aside, I wouldn't put it past Square if they changed the Underwater Reactor scenario so that Sapphire Weapon started to regenerate and that it had to be quelled with submarine missiles to postpone its re-awakening. I hope they don't go that route because it would diminish the satisfying impact from the Junon cannon blowing Sapphire Weapon's head off, though admittedly depicting Weapon as an eternally regenerating zombie would make them a bit scarier as threats.

Is anyone hoping that Ruby- and Emerald Weapon will be integrated into story scenes? With the Remake generally turning the dial up to eleven it seems tempting to include Emerald Weapon somewhere in the Underwater Reactor scenario. By nature of it being a mako reactor it definitely makes sense as a target for EW to focus in on, destroying the reactor and some Shinra subs and nearly taking our protagonists down as well.

Story-wise I don't think we need to see each planetary Weapon definitively defeated in the main, obligatory narrative. There is something to be said about optional super-bosses remaining undisclosed as to whether they were defeated in the narrative or if the victory over them *only* exists in gameplay. But I am tempted to see the Weapons, particularly Ruby and Emerald, integrated into story scenarios.

Should Ruby Weapon emerge and tear down the Gold Saucer, forcing the money-drenched Dio to face the angry inhabitants of Corel Prison after he's crash-landed on the ground? Should this somehow be integrated into the North Corel scenario with the Huge Materia? Many options that are at the risk of bloating- and dragging the story, but interesting possibilities nonetheless.
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
I hope the battles against the weapons take some inspiration from Shadow of the Colossus in being able to convey a sense of scale while fighting.

While the battle against Whisper Harbinger was fun, I don’t want the battles against the weapons to have to be through smaller sized proxies, that wouldn’t be satisfying (like imagine if in FFX the only way to damage Sin was through beating up the sea parasites who lived on Sin’s body).

FFXV Kingsglaive I think demonstrated that they at least know how to convey the scale of the Weapons at least in pre-rendered animation (like they literally had Diamond weapons) hopefully that can translate well to gameplay.
 
A macabre thing to wish for, but I hope that in Aerith's death scene that the Masamune clearly penetrates her heart and not just her abdomen.

This strikes at the heart (pun intended) of why I had difficulty taking the death scenes of Biggs and Jessie seriously: Their deaths are purely cinematic/dramatic and without the visuals to convince me that they are actually dying. Years of in-depth movie analyses, and learning more about how people actually die, makes it difficult to take a large number of movie- and video game deaths seriously. I feel obnoxious from this nitpickiness but it is nevertheless a very real pet peeve of mine.

Aerith's original death scene has famously been picked apart in the same way. The general conclusion is that Aerith's lower body would have been paralyzed and she may suffer some internal bleeding that may kill her in a number of hours or days, but the intended impression of a near-instant death simply cannot apply under scrutiny. If the Remake changes the death scene to include a more decisive killing blow that would heighten the impact of the scene for me.


Personally I hope they don't go the route popularly speculated of having Aerith die by Cloud's sword. I feel that it's taking the drama one step too far and perhaps even in a lazy manner. It's a challenge to Remake the original death scene and keeping its impact while still retaining the same elements. If they change the manner of Aerith's death, then yes that's an easy way to achieve a heightened, shocking impact. But given Cloud's mental struggles (very human mental struggles I should add), I have difficulty seeing Cloud becoming anything other than catatonic after his own sword is plunged into Aerith. The "Cloud kills Aerith" scenario doesn't work in my mind because it's too much for the story to continue after that point.

The original game did it right by Cloud *almost* killing Aerith but getting snapped out of it at the last moment. It addresses the known threat of Sephiroth's mind control over Cloud but without taking the consequence so far that he ACTUALLY kills one of his friends.
 

KindOfBlue

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Blue
Aerith's original death scene has famously been picked apart in the same way.
You know...I think maybe, just maybe, FF7 fans are notoriously bad at reading too much into things

It's a challenge to Remake the original death scene and keeping its impact while still retaining the same elements.
I’m afraid that’s already an impossible task when like everybody already knows she dies

It addresses the known threat of Sephiroth's mind control over Cloud but without taking the consequence so far that he ACTUALLY kills one of his friends.
I wonder if people felt the same way about killing Aerith in the first place considering how many people wanted a way to bring her back...I dunno, for all the work done to establish that something is going to be different only for it to be exactly the same seems underwhelming to me, and I can’t imagine any other way to have nearly as much impact other than raising the stakes.

Thinking outside of myself for a second, if they did go in that direction, I doubt the average person is going to pay much mind to overanalyzing the intricacies of why it works or why it doesn’t work because the average audience member isn’t a nerd like us who likes to debate pixels with strangers on the internet. My guess is that for most people, it’ll be tragic as hell whether you knew about the OG death or not.

I could be wrong of course, but that direction doesn’t seem as polarizing to me as something like, say, TLOU2. I’m sure some of us might roll our eyes at it, but my bet is that most people would probably be wrecked by something like that and if they’re looking to evoke those same feelings people had with the OG, I don’t think just copying it will be enough to satisfy the devs.
 

Kuraudo.

Pro Adventurer
A macabre thing to wish for, but I hope that in Aerith's death scene that the Masamune clearly penetrates her heart and not just her abdomen.

This strikes at the heart (pun intended) of why I had difficulty taking the death scenes of Biggs and Jessie seriously: Their deaths are purely cinematic/dramatic and without the visuals to convince me that they are actually dying. Years of in-depth movie analyses, and learning more about how people actually die, makes it difficult to take a large number of movie- and video game deaths seriously. I feel obnoxious from this nitpickiness but it is nevertheless a very real pet peeve of mine.

Aerith's original death scene has famously been picked apart in the same way. The general conclusion is that Aerith's lower body would have been paralyzed and she may suffer some internal bleeding that may kill her in a number of hours or days, but the intended impression of a near-instant death simply cannot apply under scrutiny. If the Remake changes the death scene to include a more decisive killing blow that would heighten the impact of the scene for me.


Personally I hope they don't go the route popularly speculated of having Aerith die by Cloud's sword. I feel that it's taking the drama one step too far and perhaps even in a lazy manner. It's a challenge to Remake the original death scene and keeping its impact while still retaining the same elements. If they change the manner of Aerith's death, then yes that's an easy way to achieve a heightened, shocking impact. But given Cloud's mental struggles (very human mental struggles I should add), I have difficulty seeing Cloud becoming anything other than catatonic after his own sword is plunged into Aerith. The "Cloud kills Aerith" scenario doesn't work in my mind because it's too much for the story to continue after that point.

The original game did it right by Cloud *almost* killing Aerith but getting snapped out of it at the last moment. It addresses the known threat of Sephiroth's mind control over Cloud but without taking the consequence so far that he ACTUALLY kills one of his friends.
The only thing with Remake as with President Shinra death scene... Will be the lifestream particles... If you die straight then your body should vanish on the same moment.
In President Shinra's death scene we don't see it clearly but it's off-screen since straight after his body diseppears.
So for Aerith I don't know how they will translate this.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
The only thing with Remake as with President Shinra death scene... Will be the lifestream particles... If you die straight then your body should vanish on the same moment.
The FFVII games, novels, etc. are pretty consistent with bodies usually sticking around. Those that vanish, though, typically have either:

- been experimented on and, as such, were severely compromised; e.g. a Sephiroth copy in FFVIIR or the numerous Genesis copies experiencing degradation in "Crisis Core"

- been exposed to a significant amount of a volatile Lifestream-based substance; e.g. Grimoire Valentine in "Dirge of Cerberus"

- been people whose bodies were composed of a Lifestream-based substance to begin with; e.g. the Sephiroth remnants in "Advent Children"
 
You must have noticed all the dead bodies hanging off railings and whatnot on the way up the Sector 7 support pillar. Unless we're meant to assume they're merely unconscious. One could make that argument, but it would be a silly one. We see bodies when we need to see bodies and when we don't need to see them they vanish so as not to clutter up the field.
Plus, why invent graves if bodies dissolve moments after death?

I actually came here to say there is no way SE will ever be able to replicate the shocking impact of Aerith's death in the OG. That worked because we weren't expecting it. Now we are. The best they can do is replace the shocking impact by some stunningly clever twist we didn't predict, which isn't the same thing at all.

The more the Remake replaces something simple and honest with some clever and contrived, the worse it gets.
 

Ite

Save your valediction (she/her)
AKA
Ite

14:05 and 14:10 body diseppearing as lifestream.

I don’t think anyone is disputing that in the video game, enemies dissolve after you slay them. My argument is that what we’re seeing as players is an abstraction that doesn’t reflect the world as the characters see it.

In the original Final Fantaay VII, enemies shook and dissolved into red mist instead of green embers. No one would argue that death in that universe involves dissolving into red mist. It’s just how the game broadcasts to the player that the enemy is defeated.
 

cold_spirit

he/him
AKA
Alex T
You must have noticed all the dead bodies hanging off railings and whatnot on the way up the Sector 7 support pillar. Unless we're meant to assume they're merely unconscious. One could make that argument, but it would be a silly one.

I uhhh actually checked the bodies on the way up the Sector 7 pillar before and most (possibly all?) are just slightly breathing...
 
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