Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)

[Kain424]

Hian, I see what you're saying. And it's actually odd even in the original game. No one really makes reference to what exactly Cait Sith even is. Do they know all along he is a fake stuffed robot thing? I suppose all they really need to do is set up his design as a variation on something that already exists. Like, fine, the mog/moogle/whatever is some kind of robot ostensibly being controlled by that cat (which is controlled by Reeve somehow). But why does no one question the talking cat? Are they numb to it because of Nanaki's introduction as a verbose beast?

 

[Gary Caelum]

Damn I think I was the one I started talking about Cait Sith. I take it back. Ctrl+Z

 

[ChipNoir]

Hian, I see what you're saying. And it's actually odd even in the original game. No one really makes reference to what exactly Cait Sith even is. Do they know all along he is a fake stuffed robot thing? I suppose all they really need to do is set up his design as a variation on something that already exists. Like, fine, the mog/moogle/whatever is some kind of robot ostensibly being controlled by that cat (which is controlled by Reeve somehow). But why does no one question the talking cat? Are they numb to it because of Nanaki's introduction as a verbose beast?

View attachment 2504

Cait Sith
Hey you!! What're you lookin' so down for!?
How 'bout it? Want me to read your fortune!? A bright future! A happy future!
Oh, but don't hold it against me if it's not a great prediction!
Oh, so sorry! I'm a fortune telling machine. The name's...
Cait Sith.

Cait obviously states itself as a sentient robot that works for the Gold Saucer. Since advance AI is common enough that half the enemy population is robotic enemies, Cait isn't really that weird. A little weirder that for once something mechanical doesn't want to kill you but...Yeah.

 

[Roger]

I dunno if I agree with that, Shinra abruptly pulled the world out of the Dark Ages less than 50 years ago. Discarded machines going haywire in the wild, robots being repurposed for private ends is one thing, a brand new state of the art custom made AI being developed anywhere other then Shinra (as indeed, it clearly was), isn't really a possiblity I think was sufficiently established in this world.

 

[ChipNoir]

I dunno if I agree with that, Shinra abruptly pulled the world out of the Dark Ages less than 50 years ago. Discarded machines going haywire in the wild, robots being repurposed for private ends is one thing, a brand new state of the art custom made AI being developed anywhere other then Shinra (as indeed, it clearly was), isn't really a possiblity I think was sufficiently established in this world.

I've always suspected Dio and ShinRa are business partners.

 

[Roger]

Dyne choosing the day of AVALANCHE's arrival of all days to slaughter the Shinra presence at the Golden Saucer probably allowed Dio to present a false image of autonomy.

 

[ChipNoir]

Dyne choosing the day of AVALANCHE's arrival of all days to slaughter the Shinra presence at the Golden Saucer probably allowed Dio to present a false image of autonomy.

I don't quite follow...

 

[Kain424]

Cait Sith
Hey you!! What're you lookin' so down for!?
How 'bout it? Want me to read your fortune!? A bright future! A happy future!
Oh, but don't hold it against me if it's not a great prediction!
Oh, so sorry! I'm a fortune telling machine. The name's...
Cait Sith.

Cait obviously states itself as a sentient robot that works for the Gold Saucer.

Ah, yes. Thank you.

As much as I hate to say it, I think that makes even its appearance far less goofy throughout. It could be a literal recreation of Cait Sith's cartoon appearance and now it would make sense in the context of every scene. He's like one of those animatronics at Chuck E. Cheese, but a bit more dexterous. Or, at least, that's how he would be represented until it's revealed the A.I. is also controlled by Reeve.

 

[ChipNoir]

Ah, yes. Thank you.

As much as I hate to say it, I think that makes even its appearance far less goofy throughout. It could be a literal recreation of Cait Sith's cartoon appearance and now it would make sense in the context of every scene. He's like one of those animatronics at Chuck E. Cheese, but a bit more dexterous. Or, at least, that's how he would be represented until it's revealed the A.I. is also controlled by Reeve.

Yep. Pretty much.

 

[Kain424]

I think it's fine. I can even picture it. Since it's not meant to really match up to reality anyway, the only place where this may look especially odd is when Cait Sith pretends to be a reporter.

 

[Clement Rage]

We only get to see Shinra's tech because they're the core of the game, doesn't mean no one else produces anything like it. I don't think the 'hanged man' receptionist is a man in a costume.

Re Cloud, one word descriptors are probably not going to be entirely accurate. It's like describing Cloud as 'whiny' or 'angsty' in AC when what he's upset about is watching multiple people be killed in front of him and being terminally ill!. Much of his personality in the OG is malleable anyway, given he's an amalgam of different people's memories and the player's dialogue choices.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I've always suspected Dio and ShinRa are business partners.

Suspect no more. Shin-Ra probably owns the place, and Dio is just the manager. Thus, the Shin-Ra guards everywhere.

I don't know why the English localization botched this, but when Dio introduces himself as the owner, what he actually called himself is the 園長 -- i.e., a curator, like a park director or elementary principal.

Also, the info board/directory at the entrance that attributes the welcome message to "Dio"? Actually says "Shin-Ra" there.

 

[Clement Rage]

That honestly bothers me a bit. Makes the world smaller.

 

[Theozilla]

So that’s why Reeve was able to have Cait Sith pass as a Gold Saucer employee/installment so easily.

 

[jazzflower92]

We only get to see Shinra's tech because they're the core of the game, doesn't mean no one else produces anything like it. I don't think the 'hanged man' receptionist is a man in a costume.

Re Cloud, one word descriptors are probably not going to be entirely accurate. It's like describing Cloud as 'whiny' or 'angsty' in AC when what he's upset about is watching multiple people be killed in front of him and being terminally ill!. Much of his personality in the OG is malleable anyway, given he's an amalgam of different people's memories and the player's dialogue choices.

I think Shinra would have sabotaged the competition to be the sole monopoly.

 

[Roger]

Shinra displaced all government of the Midgar continent, is responsible for the destruction of nearly all major villages on the Corel continent and won a massive war against the Wutai continent. This world was always presented as already in the palm of Shinra's hand. Dio ought to be no exception.

 

[Gary Caelum]

Is there lore regarding the pre-Shinra world then? I don't remember anything along those lines.

 

[ForceStealer]

Not much. There was coal, and Shinra was just a weapons manufacturer. So presumably there were nations for Shinra to sell the weapons to, we only really know of Wutai though. What became Midgar was a group of close-by towns...

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Not much. There was coal, and Shinra was just a weapons manufacturer. So presumably there were nations for Shinra to sell the weapons to ...

Yeah, that's how they came to power. There was an international war during which Shin-Ra developed SOLDIER and artificially produced materia for the winning side.

After the war, everyone had become so dependent on Shin-Ra for everything that they were just handed the reins.

 

[Clement Rage]

But making literally everything is a bit too cartoony to me.

 

[ForceStealer]

Fairly standard for FF, not much reason for the game's story to go into it for what it was trying to do.

 

[jazzflower92]

But making literally everything is a bit too cartoony to me.

Hey, but it's fantasy.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

They don't make literally everything. Don't forget the President who-is-not-Pres-Shinra in the Honeybee Inn who's come to Midgar to meet Pres Shinra. That said, the control of our infinitely more complex world's economy is being concentrated in an ever smaller number of hands. The logical conclusion is for everything to be run by one company.

 

[Kain424]

Yeah, that's pretty much 80s film dystopia for you, which was clearly an influence in Final Fantasy VII. What is sort of interesting in there is the complete lack of oversight and regulation, leading multiple individuals to sell whatever they want. From materia, to weapons, to salvaged junk. Sure, nothing is stopping ShinRa from barging in and forcing the end of any one of their businesses through force, but it's basically a right-wing capitalist dream come true.

 

[Ite]

Lovin this talk right now. FF7 introduced me to anti-capitalism (among other themes) and often when I see conglomerates blobbing over small businesses I can’t help but think of Shinra.