Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge's Roles in the Remake Thread

[fancy]

Oh, Jairus. I really hope this doesn't come across as condescending tripe because this comes from a softy-butt (that's me), but I do genuinely feel a sort of sadness reading through this thread because I can tell how much this means to you and I wish that you did not feel so alone. I so, so empathise with the feeling. I also so, so empathise with the feeling of being pitted against everyone else in a group setting, especially when you believe so strongly in what you stand for. But I reckon that's going to continue being the case so long as this conversation keeps going on and you continue to isolate yourself from the community on this particular front.

This is no one's fault—as it's been stated before, no one owes you their agreement, validation, or even their understanding of your particular ideas just because you believe so strongly in them, and I'm not suggesting that the community has failed to 'side' with you on this because they haven't tried to empathise with you—I've seen some very empathetic and patient posts from most of our members.

But this what I mean when I say this thread has become something of a black hole. It's become a cycle of rehashing the same arguments and disagreements and I seriously believe that the person who is getting the most hurt by all of this is you, Jairus, as you appear to have the most stake in it. So, I suppose I'm imploring you to walk away from this discussion altogether. You and I and everyone else can see clearly that it is going nowhere. We can, mayhaps, revisit the possibilities of Jessie x Cloud after the first game releases, eh? It's less than two months now, ooh, how exciting!

Let's all of us give it a rest. Reconnect and celebrate on other fronts that are a little bit less controversial ha. Like how lovely Jessie looks in the Remake haha.

I like you, Jairus. I want to remind you of that. And I give a shit. That's why I've bothered to type this all out in the first place. I just so want to see you back away from this whole debacle because I believe that you're hurting yourself and seeing that hurts me a bit as well.... :/

Edited for corrections, rephrasings, and to add in this cute ass monkey gif, okay Jairus, this is me and you rn okay!?

I care!

 

[Ite]

 

[Jairus]

I do appreciate what you've said, fancy. thank you. And I like you too. I would just ask that it not just be me that is told to walk away from it, as I shouldn't be singled out. But everyone who's been arguing with me. Please ask them to do it as well. Directing it only at me doesn't make me feel any better, I'm afraid. But as for my part, I'll shift the subject so we can try to move on.

I'm very interested to learn more about Jessie's background and how she came to learn her skills and join Avalanche. And if she is who I think she is (or rather, used to be) based on what little I know of the leaks and what's been inadvertently spoiled for me, that will give her a very remarkable place in VII's lore even apart from her role as a member of Avalanche.

Spoiler: Possible spoilers ahead

What little I've learned of her background from leak spoilers is that Jessie was once a well-known stage actress. Which makes you wonder - during that time, did she ever perform in LOVELESS? And if so...

There's a fairly strong resemblance between Jessie and the LOVELESS poster girl, aside from the length of her hair. Now, I'm aware that SE has a tradition of sorts of making the poster girl look like one of the female characters of the game, but what if it's more than that this time? What if the LOVELESS poster girl not only looks like Jessie, but is Jessie? The difference in hair length can be explained easily enough - she could have had it shorter when she was younger, then grew it out after she quit acting. If Jessie is the LOVELESS poster girl, that would be very cool, I think, and an amazing addition to her character. Of course, I could be wrong and it could be someone else entirely, I don't know. We'll find out soon enough, I guess.

Oh and fancy, I like us being up to monkey business like that.

 

[fancy]

Indeed, when I wrote:

Let's all of us give it a rest. Reconnect and celebrate on other fronts that are a little bit less controversial ha. Like how lovely Jessie looks in the Remake haha.

I was addressing the community as a whole, haha, sorry that wasn't made clear! I did direct most of the post at you in particular, though, because of what you wrote about feeling like you're being ganged up on and because I believe the cycle of conversation this thread's taken has been the most emotionally detrimental to you. It's all out of concern ya know! Just wanted to let you know that I, again, empathise and care so you realise that you really aren't so alone. I'm sure loads of other members empathise with you, too, even if they don't necessarily agree with your theories.

Haha, and VERY interesting theory under the spoiler tag.

Oh, and I'd like to thank you for making this attempt to shift the tone of this general conversation. I hope things can play out a lot less combatively from this point on lmao and a lot more productively! I don't mean to be a bossy-butt and dictate what folks talk about, of course, haha, but it did seriously concern me seeing where the thread was going and I feared that nothing good was really coming out of it so felt the need to speak up. Thanks for hearing me out, yay!

And right isn't the monkey business the cutest?? It's how I feel!

 

[Jairus]

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that line, fancy. My bad. I do really appreciate your empathy and understanding. Glad you like my theory! I guess we'll find out if it's true in a month or so.

Want a banana? I like bananas.

 

[Jairus]

Sorry for the double post, but I thought of something related to my theory and wanted to share. It's just a fun thought, nothing more, really. Anyway, here goes:

Spoiler

If Jessie is the LOVELESS poster girl, it makes me wonder if she's told Barret, Tifa, Biggs, and Wedge or if she's kept it to herself. If they don't know, it might make a funny scene to see Biggs and Wedge getting all startstruck and tongue-tied when they find out she was a famous celebrity once upon a time - maybe even one they admired (fanboys, you know?). She might have gone by a stage name when she was an actress instead of her real name of Jessie, which might partly explain if they don't know who she was. It just seems like it would be funny to see them suddenly find out that this girl they've been pals with for who knows how long was actually a big star back in the day. Double takes galore, especially if when Biggs and Wedge found out, they were doing something like debating the relative hotness of said star, all while having no idea that she's the girl standing and smirking only a few feet away.

 

[FFShinra]

Never really interacted with you fancy, but lemme say, I appreciate your Deepika Padukone appreciation.

*flees the thread*

 

[Alex Strife]

Ody, I'm willing to give it a rest if everyone else is. I'm tired of hearing people going on and on and on about how bad an idea it is or the reasons they think it won't work. That doesn't help. I shouldn't have to be the only one to give it a rest, and I don't want to be singled out. It's not just me.

I understand what you're saying, Alex, and I know you're just trying to help. I appreciate it. Maybe I got a little too attached to her, I don't know. I don't really know why. I get what you're saying with your example, but it's not been a 1 on 1 conversation, it's been a many on 1 argument. And that's part of what perpetuates it. I may have said some things I shouldn't, but I also shouldn't be the only one who has to watch what they're saying. How they say things should be addressed as well. It's not just me, and some of the things I said were in response to such comments made to me in the first place.

I wrote the below message after reading Fancy's. I didn't want to delete it after I wrote it, but I don't want to come across as ignoring the advice of "giving it a rest"... Consider the following message "not-canon", I suppose? If it's better off being deleted, let me know and I'll do that .

Spoiler

I know it's not a 1 on 1 conversation most of the time, don't worry. My example was just that, an example. And it's meant to represent a pocket of what often happens here.

You say you're tired of hearing people going on and on about how bad an idea it is... But you see. That's their opinion. If after explaining your reasoing they still don't change their thinking, that's fine. They have the right to having a different opinion.

What happens is that you repeatedly bring up the topic very often. So naturally, reply to you. And since their opinion is different to yours, we have the "conflict" once again.

How to fix this? Well, I think basically we have these options:

You continue to say the same things and people ignore you

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will feel ignored.

You stop bringing up the topic

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will not be able to talk about what you want to talk.

People agree with you just to prevent arguments

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will be lied to and isolated by virtue of people not taking you seriously.

You accept that people have different opinions

+ There won't be arguments.
- Nothing (?)


Of course, you can also do some nice hybriding like bringing up the topic less AND accepting that people have different opinions. That may be healthy for everyone since you won't feel so "attacked" and people will feel less like the only thing they do with you is discuss the same topic over and over.

For example, I'm not here hours everyday so I don't get to read every single message every person writes... and I'm sure you're an interesting guy with lots of things to say but "all I see" from you is Jessie.

Notice that I'm not touching the topic of HOW things are said, since I feel that's only a consequence of the main issue. For the record, I've seen you've had a certain tendency to misunderstand things others have said as offensive or attacking when they weren't. You should stop assuming the default answer from people is attacking you or disrespecting you. That would help!

 

[Odysseus]

No, shush, Fancy's post ended it, it's done now

 

[Jairus]

I wrote the below message after reading Fancy's. I didn't want to delete it after I wrote it, but I don't want to come across as ignoring the advice of "giving it a rest"... Consider the following message "not-canon", I suppose? If it's better off being deleted, let me know and I'll do that .

Spoiler

I know it's not a 1 on 1 conversation most of the time, don't worry. My example was just that, an example. And it's meant to represent a pocket of what often happens here.

You say you're tired of hearing people going on and on about how bad an idea it is... But you see. That's their opinion. If after explaining your reasoing they still don't change their thinking, that's fine. They have the right to having a different opinion.

What happens is that you repeatedly bring up the topic very often. So naturally, reply to you. And since their opinion is different to yours, we have the "conflict" once again.

How to fix this? Well, I think basically we have these options:

You continue to say the same things and people ignore you

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will feel ignored.

You stop bringing up the topic

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will not be able to talk about what you want to talk.

People agree with you just to prevent arguments

+ There won't be arguments.
- You will be lied to and isolated by virtue of people not taking you seriously.

You accept that people have different opinions

+ There won't be arguments.
- Nothing (?)


Of course, you can also do some nice hybriding like bringing up the topic less AND accepting that people have different opinions. That may be healthy for everyone since you won't feel so "attacked" and people will feel less like the only thing they do with you is discuss the same topic over and over.

For example, I'm not here hours everyday so I don't get to read every single message every person writes... and I'm sure you're an interesting guy with lots of things to say but "all I see" from you is Jessie.

Notice that I'm not touching the topic of HOW things are said, since I feel that's only a consequence of the main issue. For the record, I've seen you've had a certain tendency to misunderstand things others have said as offensive or attacking when they weren't. You should stop assuming the default answer from people is attacking you or disrespecting you. That would help!

Like it said, it's not that their opinions are different, it's that they keep listing out all the ways they think it can't work and tearing it apart again and again when they respond instead of just sticking to saying they disagree and leaving it at that. Because I don't like to leave arguments to what I'm saying unanswered and unaddressed - it feels like giving in if I do. And the fact that it's so one-sided - that is, I get almost nothing but disagreement. If it were more of a mixed reaction, I don't know that I would have pushed it so strongly.

But I don't want to start this whole thing again, so how about we leave it at that? To get away from it and back to the previous subject, what did you think of my theory, Alex?

 

[Odysseus]

@Jairus I know we already talked about your theory in private, but I do think its actually compelling. You should share the picture you showed me.

EDIT: oh, I'm a moron. You already did. Well...

Spoiler

The thing that has me the most convinced is the jaw line and the nose. Those are actually nearly the same! Knowing that Jessie is apparently a former stage actor in her backstory, it all kinda just fits together. I'm down for this theory. Given the precedent set by Advent Children and Dirge of making the girl on the loveless poster look like one of the main girls (Tifa in dirge, Aerith in AC) having that as an actual plot point this time could be fun.

 

[Alex Strife]

To get away from it and back to the previous subject, what did you think of my theory, Alex?

You mean the one with the the Loveless poster? That'd actually be kind of cool

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

That would be legit cool. I hope that happens now.

 

[Pizzachu]

Spoiler: About Jairus' Theory

That would be really neat! What if we were able to watch LOVELESS and she was the lead role?

 

[Jairus]

Yeah, I hope we get to see some flashbacks of her time from when she was doing that, it would be nice to show that side of her character and what she was like back then.

And maybe see her in a nice, fancy dress if we're really lucky...

 

[looneymoon]

Jessie is THIRSTY for Cloud's BALLS (a pair she mentions, by name).

With that level of thirst, she deserves a good slice of that Cloudy V-Card.

 

[ForceStealer]

 

[Rydeen]

This is a subjective question, but: is Jessie really thirsty to the point of it eclipsing her character development? I've seen posts mentioning how it's excessive and that she's annoying, and being a Jessie fan, I'm nervous about it.

 

[ForceStealer]

People need to relax. It's one mission. She'll get time to be fleshed out later.

 

[Rydeen]

How long is the demo, anyway (irl time wise)? I don’t intend to play it.

 

[looneymoon]

It's hilarious and relatable. very accurate to my #mood when I use to swipe right on pretty blonde boys on tinder.

 

[Ite]

This is a subjective question, but: is Jessie really thirsty to the point of it eclipsing her character development? I've seen posts mentioning how it's excessive and that she's annoying, and being a Jessie fan, I'm nervous about it.

I feel like your mileage may vary on this and our opinions might unfairly poison the well, so I’ve spoiler tagged my hot take on the subject:

Spoiler

It got a bit much for me for a couple of reasons.

1) Eyes on the prize, y’know? This is a serious operation and there’s a fine line between some winking levity and me doubting that you are sane. “Help a girl out, would ya?” is not naturalistic at all, feels like written dialogue rather than something a human would exclaim when their leg has been pinned by a concrete slab. You would have to be so deliberate to conjure a phrase like that at a time like that, when the OG’s “My leg is stuck!” is more natural.

2) She’s the only girl with spoken lines, and is boy-obsessed, and I don’t think that’s a coincidence? The writers are male. It’s one of those things in stories that bugs the hell out of me. The fact that her thirstiness is immediately derided by Biggs makes the free-spoken sexuality equate to a loss of status. At times, I was wondering if Cloud was going to say “Shut up, the men are talking.” It wasn’t a great look.

 

[oty]

Spoiler

I think we are judging her character by a literal 30 minute slice of a game.

I do understand the talks about she being the only female and of course she's infatued with the main character, but honestly, Jessie is looking to be a very strong female character. She's cool, she's confident. She knows what she is doing. And she saw someone pretty and she just knows she can rock it. She isnt submissive. She flirts with him, and doesnt care what other people might say. It very much gives a vibe that she is in control. Thats why I'm not a huge fan of the rock section, where Cloud goes to "save" her. Specially the second one, where you are leaving, since she already had to be helped before. But yea, take those scenes away and you have a mass of people saying that they changed the game for SJWs smh....

She might have gone a lil bit overboard here and there, but it makes sense even with what we are presented. She is certainly aware of the risks. I am sure the rest of the game will expand that even more. I mean, if I'm not mistaken, there is some pretty big stuff all for all with Jessie later in the game. Hope I wasnt jebaited.

 

[ForceStealer]

I feel like your mileage may vary on this and our opinions might unfairly poison the well, so I’ve spoiler tagged my hot take on the subject:

Spoiler

It got a bit much for me for a couple of reasons.

1) Eyes on the prize, y’know? This is a serious operation and there’s a fine line between some winking levity and me doubting that you are sane. “Help a girl out, would ya?” is not naturalistic at all, feels like written dialogue rather than something a human would exclaim when their leg has been pinned by a concrete slab. You would have to be so deliberate to conjure a phrase like that at a time like that, when the OG’s “My leg is stuck!” is more natural.

2) She’s the only girl with spoken lines, and is boy-obsessed, and I don’t think that’s a coincidence? The writers are male. It’s one of those things in stories that bugs the hell out of me. The fact that her thirstiness is immediately derided by Biggs makes the free-spoken sexuality equate to a loss of status. At times, I was wondering if Cloud was going to say “Shut up, the men are talking.” It wasn’t a great look.

Spoiler

Point number 1 is fair, although I don't particularly mind. FF7 was never a source of naturalistic dialogue.

Point number 2 I disagree with though. Particularly on the loss of the status point. Especially considering she winds up deriding him quite a bit more for his outlook. And there's nothing to suggest she's broadly boy-obsessed. Just that she has the hots for Cloud specifically.

How long is the demo, anyway (irl time wise)? I don’t intend to play it.

Your first time through, probably about an hour. On subsequent playthroughs as you get more accustomed to the combat system you can probably halve that.

 

[Makoeyes987]

It's not, and people claiming so are being hyperbolic. All they need to do is have Cloud run into the laser traps to see just how truly thirsty she really is