Jessie, Biggs, and Wedge's Roles in the Remake Thread

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Hate to jump in the middle of this, but I really don't understand why you can't see how much of a zealot you're being about the whole Jesse thing. I like her too, but.. come on, man. Aeris and Tifa are two of the most iconic videogame characters of all time. They are core to the game's overall story; Jesse's not. I, personally, would rather see an infinite information flow about both of them over anything about Jesse (even though I like Jesse.)

It's precisely because Aerith and Tifa are so well-known that they don't need any more attention or promotion. It's time they allowed their spotlight to be shared for once. And I would argue that Jessie will play a fairly significant role in Part 1, so she should be promoted more than she has been. Would it really hurt for SE to give her just one promo piece that's only about her, that centers on her and her alone? Would that be such a threat to Aerith and Tifa?
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Yeah, she has a theme. But where's the SE tweet and promo vid solely about her? They did a group tweet about the trio but couldn't be bothered to do individual tweets about each of the three. SE can make characters besides the mains marketable if they want to. I'm just tired of the same characters getting most of the attention all the time. And while the mains have a bunch of officially-released HD screenshots, Jessie and the rest of the trio only have one. Would it kill SE to release a few more? Or what about an Avalanche trio PS4 theme? But I doubt they'll do that since they're *gasp* not playable characters.
 

Knights of the Round

Pro Adventurer
It's precisely because Aerith and Tifa are so well-known that they don't need any more attention or promotion.

That's your opinion. Many don't share it, and at this point you just reak of someone who can't handle alternate viewpoints.

Again I, personally, am more interested in seeing more of Tifa and Aeris than I am of anything regarding Jesse. I like them more. You're not, obviously, and that's cool. I'm not going to try and force my viewpoint down your throat like you've done on several threads around here just because you have a different view than me.

That's what compromise and discussion is all about. Sharing your own views, but also understanding that others have their own and don't take well to constant 'preaching'.
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Others here can't seem to handle mine. They don't even want to talk about it. It goes both ways. I'm not trying to preach, just to remind people that there are characters in the game other than the mains and that they could be given some of the same kind of thought, promotion, and attention as the mains. That's all.

Tell me something. Who needs more attention? Someone who already has a lot, or someone who traditionally has been overlooked and overshadowed and often forgotten? And even now is still often put aside because the other is more popular. You say you like Jessie, but you don't seem to like her enough to give her just as much thought and attention as Aerith and Tifa. I don't see what's so wrong with doing that, though. It's not like it's not possible or anything.
 
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The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
Others here can't seem to handle mine. They don't even want to talk about it.

People have talked about it, but there's nothing more to say until we play the game. When the news was released that the tragic trio would be getting expanded depictions, everyone reacted positively to that. As each new detail featuring them has come along, fans have continued reacting positively.

On the other hand, when there were long stretches of almost no news or promotional media, hardly any discussion happened about any of the characters -- because there wasn't as much to talk about.

Jairus said:
Tell me something. Who needs more attention? Someone who already has a lot, or someone who traditionally has been overlooked and overshadowed and often forgotten?

Neither when they're both fictional characters. :monster:
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
People have talked about it, but there's nothing more to say until we play the game. When the news was released that the tragic trio would be getting expanded depictions, everyone reacted positively to that. As each new detail featuring them has come along, fans have continued reacting positively.

On the other hand, when there were long stretches of almost no news or promotional media, hardly any discussion happened about any of the characters -- because there wasn't as much to talk about.

Nothing more to say? What about opinions about how they've been promoted? Thoughts about how else it could be done? Speculation about what we might learn about them? Acknowledging the disparity in how they've been shown on SE's Twitter/Facebook pages compared to other notable NPC's? Noting what they've gotten and not gotten as far as official promotion? Acknowledging the almost total absence of any hint of their expanded backstories in the promotion they do have? Noticing that they've never been shown or promoted as individual characters, only together as a group? And not being opposed to them getting such individual promotional attention sometimes to let us see them apart from the group?

Neither when they're both fictional characters. :monster:

You know what I mean. Who should be given more thought and attention? Someone who already has a lot, or someone who traditionally has been overshadowed and overlooked?
 

Maidenofwar

They/Them
I never had a go at Jessie :smashedmonster:

Anyway there's still a few days left until the official release, so there's still time for more Jessie promo stuff which I think you'll get to enjoy in peace if so :pinkmonster:
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Sorry about that, got you mixed up with someone else. :mon:

And I wasn't yelling at Aerith, just wanted people to remember she's not the only girl in the game, is all.
 

Knights of the Round

Pro Adventurer
Others here can't seem to handle mine. They don't even want to talk about it. It goes both ways. I'm not trying to preach, just to remind people that there are characters in the game other than the mains and that they could be given some of the same kind of thought, promotion, and attention as the mains. That's all.

Tell me something. Who needs more attention? Someone who already has a lot, or someone who traditionally has been overlooked and overshadowed and often forgotten? And even now is still often put aside because the other is more popular. You say you like Jessie, but you don't seem to like her enough to give her just as much thought and attention as Aerith and Tifa. I don't see what's so wrong with doing that, though. It's not like it's not possible or anything.
Personally, I don't need "reminding" of anything. I've played this game 1000+ hours and am aware of every character that's in it, as well as their history.

Most here are enthusiasts and, I would imagine, fall into a similar bucket.

As for your question to me about 'who needs more attention' - I'd say, probably, the characters that are going to garner the most interest from fans or potential new players. And that would be Tifa and Aeris, because, frankly, they're more interesting to most people - including me. So, my answer back to you would be..

"Tifa and Aeris."

Now, the question becomes 'Can you accept that' or are you going to continue down the path of trying to convince me that Jesse deserves more attention? And then, the question becomes, 'Why do you feel you have to convince me or anyone else of anything?' And, 'Why can people not decide for themselves who they wish to see more of?'
 

Kratos

Pro Adventurer
Nothing more to say? What about opinions about how they've been promoted? Thoughts about how else it could be done? Speculation about what we might learn about them? Acknowledging the disparity in how they've been shown on SE's Twitter/Facebook pages compared to other notable NPC's? Noting what they've gotten and not gotten as far as official promotion? Acknowledging the almost total absence of any hint of their expanded backstories in the promotion they do have? Noticing that they've never been shown or promoted as individual characters, only together as a group? And not being opposed to them getting such individual promotional attention sometimes to let us see them apart from the group?

I think you might have to realize that for most people, the disparity doesn't register because Jessie is already getting promoted more than anyone would have expected. This is a character who has had zero mainstream attention since the game launched - even within her own franchise, which is famously self-referential (I think she literally just has an expy in FFXIV?) - and suddenly she's showing up in major tweets and almost all of the promotional materials. For most people, that's a lot of Jessie, and they're enjoying it, and so they just don't share your opinion that she's been short-changed somehow.

And I mean - Marlene hasn't gotten her own short, or render. Elmyra hasn't, Johnny hasn't, Rufus hasn't, most of the Shinra upper brass (Reeve, Scarlet, Palmer) haven't. In the original game, Jessie is only about as important as any of them (except Johnny). Which isn't a slight! I like those characters, and am excited to see them all portrayed and expanded on. But the point is that there are lots of secondary characters who are reasonably important who haven't gotten any focus either, and so people aren't really up in arms that Jessie - originally of similar importance - has gotten the spotlight that she has.

You know what I mean. Who should be given more thought and attention? Someone who already has a lot, or someone who traditionally has been overshadowed and overlooked?

No, but, that's just it - that logic works for real people, but when it comes to marketing, the things that get marketed are the things that hype people up. Fictional characters can't get their feelings hurt by being ignored, and the main cast hypes people up more - it's that simple.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
@Kratos pretty much answered everything better than I ever will, so I'll mostly leave it at that.

Only other thing I will add is that there has been occasional speculation regarding what we may learn about the trio, going all the way back to when it was announced that they would have an expanded presence -- e.g. folks have wondered if we'll find out whether that one WRO chick in the train graveyard in "Dirge of Cerberus" was Wedge's sister or Biggs' sister.
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
What I'm saying is, why can't SE also
Personally, I don't need "reminding" of anything. I've played this game 1000+ hours and am aware of every character that's in it, as well as their history.

Most here are enthusiasts and, I would imagine, fall into a similar bucket.

As for your question to me about 'who needs more attention' - I'd say, probably, the characters that are going to garner the most interest from fans or potential new players. And that would be Tifa and Aeris, because, frankly, they're more interesting to most people - including me. So, my answer back to you would be..

"Tifa and Aeris."

Now, the question becomes 'Can you accept that' or are you going to continue down the path of trying to convince me that Jesse deserves more attention? And then, the question becomes, 'Why do you feel you have to convince me or anyone else of anything?' And, 'Why can people not decide for themselves who they wish to see more of?'

But you don't know what the remake will give us concerning Jessie. Why can't SE promote all three at the same time? There's nothing stopping them from making a character like her marketable. And if you paid any attention to the reactions from the demo, people are liking Jessie a lot. So there's no reason she can't be used to get such attention from players and fans based on that. I'm just trying to get you to consider wanting to see more of characters besides Aerith and Tifa, that's all.

If you're aware of all the characters in the game, then give thought and attention to more than just the mains.

I think you might have to realize that for most people, the disparity doesn't register because Jessie is already getting promoted more than anyone would have expected. This is a character who has had zero mainstream attention since the game launched - even within her own franchise, which is famously self-referential (I think she literally just has an expy in FFXIV?) - and suddenly she's showing up in major tweets and almost all of the promotional materials. For most people, that's a lot of Jessie, and they're enjoying it, and so they just don't share your opinion that she's been short-changed somehow.

Major tweets? I can only remember three official tweets that she's been a part of, and in every single one she's been grouped with Biggs and Wedge. Not once has she been shown in an official tweet/post all by herself, something that focuses on her alone, unlike other NPC's. Even a random quest giver got an individual tweet. But she hasn't, and she's more important to the story than he is. Outside the trailers and demo, the trio have been virtually ignored for the most part. And never shown separately as individual characters with their own individual stories. Only ever as a group.

And I mean - Marlene hasn't gotten her own short, or render. Elmyra hasn't, Johnny hasn't, Rufus hasn't, most of the Shinra upper brass (Reeve, Scarlet, Palmer) haven't. In the original game, Jessie is only about as important as any of them (except Johnny). Which isn't a slight! I like those characters, and am excited to see them all portrayed and expanded on. But the point is that there are lots of secondary characters who are reasonably important who haven't gotten any focus either, and so people aren't really up in arms that Jessie - originally of similar importance - has gotten the spotlight that she has.

Fair enough, but SE did say in interviews that they specifically wanted to expand and develop the trio in particular. But the non-video marketing and promotion for them - what little there's been - hasn't matched up with that promise.

No, but, that's just it - that logic works for real people, but when it comes to marketing, the things that get marketed are the things that hype people up. Fictional characters can't get their feelings hurt by being ignored, and the main cast hypes people up more - it's that simple.

Except as I said, there's nothing wrong with SE making a character like Jessie marketable. They could do tweets/posts/biovids teasing a bit of her expanded backstory, hinting at the possibility of her being a guest fighter like Red, give more official HD screenshots than just the single one she has. Same for Biggs and Wedge. Show a bit of what their expansion and development looks like. They said the trio is important to the story, but they've never been shown as individual characters.

During the interview video, they were only discussed as a group but not as separate characters with their own unique stories distinct from each other. And that's how they've always been treated in the promotion and marketing. Just once, I'd like to see SE have a tweet/post/biovid that's just about Jessie and her alone. Same for Biggs and Wedge. Give them all some individual promotion as separate characters for once instead of always being lumped together.

Only other thing I will add is that there has been occasional speculation regarding what we may learn about the trio, going all the way back to when it was announced that they would have an expanded presence -- e.g. folks have wondered if we'll find out whether that one WRO chick in the train graveyard in "Dirge of Cerberus" was Wedge's sister or Biggs' sister.

Occasional speculation. But no more since more's been revealed about them? And what about the rest of what I asked about? Those things aren't noticed or talked about?
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Yes, I do, Ry. It's just the near constant worship of the MC's irritates me, is all. There are other characters in the game to give attention to. That's all I'm trying to say.
 

Erotic Materia

[CONFUSED SCREAMING]
I'm starting to wonder if you even like the game aside from Jessie...
At this point, Jessie has been ruined for me. I honestly had no expectations for or against anything Jessie-related prior to the last few months. Hell, I would have probably liked the refreshing possibility of a little fling with her before she dies. But now, I'm to the point where I'd be glad if she turns out to be nothing more than a platonic minor character that never sees any kind of romantic reciprocation from Cloud.

Is that petty? Absolutely. But I'm so tired of hearing about it, I've been poisoned against the idea.
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Why should what someone else says have any effect on what you think of her? And if you weren't initially against the idea of her getting some romantic reciprocation from Cloud in the first place, why didn't you ever say so? Might've saved us both some headaches.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
If you're aware of all the characters in the game, then give thought and attention to more than just the mains.

Why should he (or someone else)? Maybe he/they doesn't/don't want to.

Jairus said:
Even a random quest giver got an individual tweet. But she hasn't, and she's more important to the story than he is.

Probably so, but if it's Chadley you're talking about, he's apparently going to be integral to the gameplay; so, still occupying a significant aspect of the player's experience.

Can you give some of that thought and attention you were talking about to him as well? Or will you begrudge him being allowed to share in a miniscule amount of the marketing limelight compared to what Jessie has already occupied?

Jairus said:
Occasional speculation. But no more since more's been revealed about them?

That's the thing, isn't it? Not much else has been revealed about them outside the leaks many players have been avoiding.

Jairus said:
And what about the rest of what I asked about? Those things aren't noticed or talked about?
As I said previously, Kratos probably answered you better than I could about all that.
 

Jairus

Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
Why should he (or someone else)? Maybe he/they doesn't/don't want to.

I'm not saying anyone has to. It's just, like said, seeing all the fawning over the MC's irritates me sometimes. It just comes across that people forget there are other characters in the game, too.

Probably so, but if it's Chadley you're talking about, he's apparently going to be integral to the gameplay; so, still occupying a significant aspect of the player's experience.

Can you give some of that thought and attention you were talking about to him as well? Or will you begrudge him being allowed to share in a miniscule amount of the marketing limelight compared to what Jessie has already occupied?

I don't mind him being shown off, I was just saying that with all these other NPC's getting individual tweets/posts, the fact that the members of the trio haven't gotten such individual attention is what bothers me. They're always lumped together, never highlighted separately as individual characters with their own stories. And nobody else seems to notice that.

That's the thing, isn't it? Not much else has been revealed about them outside the leaks many players have been avoiding.

But things could still be speculated about, talked about. Compared to many of the other NPC's, SE's been pretty tight-lipped about them. We still don't know, for example, if they'll act as guest fighters like Red at some point.

And EM, I'm really sorry I made you feel the way you do. I never meant to ruin her for you. Isn't there any way that can be changed?
 

Knights of the Round

Pro Adventurer
At this point, Jessie has been ruined for me. I honestly had no expectations for or against anything Jessie-related prior to the last few months. Hell, I would have probably liked the refreshing possibility of a little fling with her before she dies. But now, I'm to the point where I'd be glad if she turns out to be nothing more than a platonic minor character that never sees any kind of romantic reciprocation from Cloud.

Is that petty? Absolutely. But I'm so tired of hearing about it, I've been poisoned against the idea.

At this point I’m hoping a zombie version of her is revived and she takes Aeris’ place on the altar before Sephiroth.

And makes another revival appearance to get 'Aire Tam Storm' KO'd by Emerald Weapon at the end-game.

I liked her before...
 
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