SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
- Start date
Hix
Pro Adventurer
No Promises to Keep being some bizarre, ill-placed love ballad written spur of the moment for Cloud alone was always narratively inconsistent in the extreme. We've said here for some time that it needed to be interpreted in light of her character as presented in the games. In Rebirth for instance, before the song Aerith openly admits to still being in love with Zack and after the song is shown to still be trying to shoehorn Cloud into the Zack shaped hole in her heart - right up until the end - before admitting he's just not a fit. Where's the narrative consistency here?
But now we know for definite. NPTK is a song not about any specific individuals, but all the individuals and her entire life and feelings and experiences. The 2 weeks she knew Cloud surely were special, but ultimately were flash in the pan compared to the rest of the 21 years of her existence. The people she knew, the family she had, the life of a Cetra. Everything in this song.
I guess what I'm saying here is, there's so much to Aerith. Trying to force every little thing she does to be validation of CA is an assassination on the character that has been intricately woven by the devs to be far, far more complex than just one exceedingly nuanced relationship. It's why I struggle with the chutzpah of Cleriths who continually accuse those who cannot get on board with the CA ship, through sheer inability to deny the story as presented, of "hating Aerith" - yet it is by virtue of forcing her into the role of Tifa, that of Cloud's own closest "personal connection", that the biggest hatred of Aerith, the real Aerith, shows itself in the fandom.
In any case, now the pieces can fit together. Aerith sings her song for, and about, everyone she cares for ahead of making the ultimate sacrifice. Remove that and what are you left with? Some awkward love confession that Cloud doesn't reciprocate? A confusing mishmash of signals given her growing realization of her fondness for Zack and Cloud's growing realization that Zack and Aerith are a thing? Just awkward, uncomfortable and overly dramatc. I'm glad we can listen to this song now and enjoy it as part of the beautiful story the developers have created for us.
But now we know for definite. NPTK is a song not about any specific individuals, but all the individuals and her entire life and feelings and experiences. The 2 weeks she knew Cloud surely were special, but ultimately were flash in the pan compared to the rest of the 21 years of her existence. The people she knew, the family she had, the life of a Cetra. Everything in this song.
I guess what I'm saying here is, there's so much to Aerith. Trying to force every little thing she does to be validation of CA is an assassination on the character that has been intricately woven by the devs to be far, far more complex than just one exceedingly nuanced relationship. It's why I struggle with the chutzpah of Cleriths who continually accuse those who cannot get on board with the CA ship, through sheer inability to deny the story as presented, of "hating Aerith" - yet it is by virtue of forcing her into the role of Tifa, that of Cloud's own closest "personal connection", that the biggest hatred of Aerith, the real Aerith, shows itself in the fandom.
In any case, now the pieces can fit together. Aerith sings her song for, and about, everyone she cares for ahead of making the ultimate sacrifice. Remove that and what are you left with? Some awkward love confession that Cloud doesn't reciprocate? A confusing mishmash of signals given her growing realization of her fondness for Zack and Cloud's growing realization that Zack and Aerith are a thing? Just awkward, uncomfortable and overly dramatc. I'm glad we can listen to this song now and enjoy it as part of the beautiful story the developers have created for us.
Last edited:
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- thetriplerhyme
okay I was wrong it was a theme song as Remake's hallow is about Cloud, Rebirth is about Aerith's and her feelings for everyone. I guess now I understand that the last part
Take my hand and believe
We can be together evermore
Is a plea of wanting to spend more time to everyone. Its sweet I appreciate it and Nojima thank you!
Take my hand and believe
We can be together evermore
Is a plea of wanting to spend more time to everyone. Its sweet I appreciate it and Nojima thank you!
Maidenofwar
They/Them
Some people just want to take every little thing CA has away from them I guess. Oh well. Can't have any happiness in this house. The amount of glee, crowing, etc, vindication of people's joy being taken away from them on twitter is going to suck.
Last edited:
Yoru
Pro Adventurer
Maybe because it's not a thing from the start. Maybe because Aerith as a character is much more than just her relationship with Cloud. And yes, we can't say the same with Tifa. Because as a character, she is written with a relation with Cloud first and foremost.
This is not about Love Triangle War. You (i'm not aiming you, just the extreme CAs) made a headcanon too much of a deal. This is just not how these characters have been written. Ever.
You have all the rights in the world to cherish characters differently. But you can't impose something the creator is obviously "against".
Aerith is a fantastic character. Because she's much more than just a love interest. She's a sunshine and at the end of the journey, literally a Goddess. The embodiment of the planet herself.
That's how she's been written. That's her role in this story. Nothing more, nothing less.
Yoru
Pro Adventurer
See ? It doesn't matter. They're too deep in their delulu. That's why i'm not engaging with them anymore. It's just not worth it. They'll die with their headcanon. Nothing we can do about it. Just let them in their closed chamber. If they're happy with their fantasy, good for them.
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- thetriplerhyme
@Legend45 change into thumbnail for easy access.
the fact that when its all about the lyrics Nojima first said 'he wrote it to make sure she's not singing for anyone specific Zack or Cloud" kinda hits. He further explain it in the end.
It all makes sense I kinda have a change of heart to Aerith. She always a deep one and hard to understand I seriously thought her friendship with others is undermine bec of ending but she cherished everyone.
In the street she lost her mother Ifalna and she is 'found' by Elmyra
In the street as well she lost Zack and found Cloud and others.
Now she will be separated from them again to everyone in the team who will move on w/o her in part 3
the fact that when its all about the lyrics Nojima first said 'he wrote it to make sure she's not singing for anyone specific Zack or Cloud" kinda hits. He further explain it in the end.
It all makes sense I kinda have a change of heart to Aerith. She always a deep one and hard to understand I seriously thought her friendship with others is undermine bec of ending but she cherished everyone.
In the street she lost her mother Ifalna and she is 'found' by Elmyra
In the street as well she lost Zack and found Cloud and others.
Now she will be separated from them again to everyone in the team who will move on w/o her in part 3
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
Figured as much about the song.
Well, I mean… it’s fine, if they still want to believe it’s about CA. But they have no proof he said this because of death threats.
And I gotta be honest, most of these people are aware that the type of fans who send death threats are not the majority and it’s not indicative that all CT fans are like that.
I say the same for CA too. Extremists exist on both sides but the devs know they aren’t the majority.
That’s some copium.
Well, I mean… it’s fine, if they still want to believe it’s about CA. But they have no proof he said this because of death threats.
And I gotta be honest, most of these people are aware that the type of fans who send death threats are not the majority and it’s not indicative that all CT fans are like that.
I say the same for CA too. Extremists exist on both sides but the devs know they aren’t the majority.
they are consuming a completely different piece of media compared to everyone else
AncientGrimoire
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Grim
I know it may not seem this way, but this greater level of insight into the song should be seen as a victory for Aerith’s character, not be seen as anything being “taken away” from her, just because what she’s singing about isn’t exclusively about Cloud.
This key exposition as to the meaning behind the lyrical content establishes this is Aerith literally baring her soul onstage, laying out all of her heart’s secret desires, wishes, and hopes.
I’m sorry, but it would be a huge disservice to Aerith at her core if all that was in her heart was just her emotions and feelings for Cloud. It would be in direct contravention of all the bonds, and love, she was able to forge with all the others. Aerith is a woman who is terrified of loneliness, so it would be a strange choice for her to only seek to reunite with just the one person, should fates allow.
The song speaks to her desire to never be parted from all those she holds dear, she’s singing about her Promised Land if you like, a world where none of her loved ones are taken from her, and a world where she herself isn’t taken from those she loves.
I hope you and others can maybe come to appreciate that this is actually a wonderful moment for Aerith as a whole. It paints her as a woman who has reflected deeply on all the relationships she’s made on her journey, and how it feels for her to slowly be coming to accept her responsibilities that might take her down a path where she may never see these people again.
I think it’s far more beautiful, richer, and emotionally expressive a ballad and character moment for Aerith, than it being just a love song for Cloud.
I’m glad they said this cause now the actual song and lyrics make fucking sense. (Other then her turning into Whitney Huston)
It’s not about taking away CA shit or whatever, it’s the fact that their headcanon what in complete contradiction to what is actually being shown by the Devs
It’s not about taking away CA shit or whatever, it’s the fact that their headcanon what in complete contradiction to what is actually being shown by the Devs
shady
Pro Adventurer
I’m sorry I don’t want to be rude but “Take every little thing CA” has is a crazy take. It’s clear the song was never CA’s song to be taken away in the first place but it was automatically taken as such by people who twisted what the author intended. Now the author and writer of the song has come out and said what it’s really about and it’s no surprise people are happy and feel vindicated when what they said has been right all along after having the song twisted and rubbed in their faces for months.
Not only this but what Nojima has said makes Aerith’s character look a million times better in this game. Aerith loves everybody, including Ifalna and Elmyra, it makes way more sense for her to cherish all the bonds she has made and live in fear of losing everything she built rather than a love song to Cloud that made absolutely no sense to sing at the Golden Saucer when Cloud was standing 5 feet to her right and she had no idea she was going to die
LunarTarotGirl
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Lunarae
I'm a little surprised anyone is surprised here. Aerith's monologue and her song is part of her journey. It's her final farewell. Part of her story. It does include her feelings for Cloud and Zack both but that's not the only thing. The trailer was baity because the song itself wasn't about the thing the marketting made it seem about (just her love life, shipping) her feelings are included as part of her journey. (It's about her)
And have I not been saying it since the beginning. I was never going to take the bait of the marketting or the fanservice we get because I know in the end what they're going to say.
But I'm glad? people aren't thinking of Aerith as as shallow as they apparently were before this interview. I have always known she wasn't.
And have I not been saying it since the beginning. I was never going to take the bait of the marketting or the fanservice we get because I know in the end what they're going to say.
But I'm glad? people aren't thinking of Aerith as as shallow as they apparently were before this interview. I have always known she wasn't.
Last edited:
making this song be about Aeriths feelings for everyone, her mother, and her role and what she knows is going to happen is so much fucking better for her character then “Tifa tells her Zack is likely dead, then proceeds to write ‘love song’ for Cloud whilst he doesn’t say anything and is holding someone else’s hand”.
This literally makes her a better character for it. But I don’t even think these hardcore CAs like Aerith tbh, they don’t even talk about ToTP like that
This literally makes her a better character for it. But I don’t even think these hardcore CAs like Aerith tbh, they don’t even talk about ToTP like that
Sacky
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- SackyBoy
A lot of the time, the toxic hardcore Cleriths speak about Aerith as if shes the worst but then shes nothing like how they describe her at all and really she just represents the Love of Life and The Planet. You play the game and you don't get this impression then you see all the frustrating takes.
Legend45
Pro Adventurer
I believe that Aerith has always been and always will be the planet's ''heroine''
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Very well said, very well said indeed.
I think that the light is finally being shown into the corners of the dark room.
The LTD is finally ending. It is not being vindictive to want this craziness to stop.
"The reunion at hand may bring joy; it may bring fear. But let us embrace whatever it brings..."
LunarTarotGirl
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Lunarae
I don't think that's what Nojima is trying to do. He's just talking about lyrics he wrote and answering to that. I don't think he is taking anything away but clarifying and of course the song includes her feelings for Cloud in it. There are lines that make that clear and it directly refers to her monologue which includes her complex feelings for him. But then also of course Cloud would not be the only person in her heart at journey's end. As her theme song it would include her entire journey.
This song is about Aerith. Her life. Her love. Her journey. If anything Nojima's comment is giving her full ownership of her arc.
Ofc but they hate that’s her storyline and she doesn’t have Tifas role
It’s so strange
I’ve never seen any story ever be deliberately misrepresented like this when the most important revelation in the entire game is that the whole reason for any of the events of the game happening were because of Clouds love for Tifa and him wanting to become soldier. Which is literally the start of the whole sequence of events
That is literally the most important part of FF7
How do you misinterpret the most important scenes of the entire game
KindOfBlue
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Blue
Praise be unto our Lord and Savior Nojima-sama.
For the actual normal Cloud and Aerith shippers, no need to worry. The song is still just as much about Cloud as it is about everybody else Aerith loves.
For the weirdos who think everything in the story is about Cloud and Aerith and were so sure that Tifa was just an option because “why else would a Cloud x Aerith love song be the theme if they’re not the intended canon couple?”, welp, sucks for them.
Last edited:
LunarTarotGirl
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Lunarae
Also now I'm pretty sure the line Promises to Keep We Won't Ever Need line specifically is a reference to her theme of reunion throughout the game as well. Her knock out line in battle "We'll meet again I know it." Is very telling, as are her flowers how she talks about them. The Promised Land and the fact Zack made a promise to meet her before he disappeared. He didn't come back. .
So she is telling Cloud and the party, Zack's spirit... Her loved ones that she wants to believe they are guaranteed to meet again (reunion) without needing to make any promises. Because she wants to believe there is no uncertainty. That reunion in life or in the Promised Land is a guarantee. With everyone in her life.
It's a very pretty sentiment.
So she is telling Cloud and the party, Zack's spirit... Her loved ones that she wants to believe they are guaranteed to meet again (reunion) without needing to make any promises. Because she wants to believe there is no uncertainty. That reunion in life or in the Promised Land is a guarantee. With everyone in her life.
It's a very pretty sentiment.
Last edited:
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Still trying to catch up with this thread (been really busy and there's a lot of nice insights here from these past weeks), but I wanted to chime in real quick to talk about a few things I've (and others) been noticing recently.
I'm not a mod or anything, so feel free to ignore my suggestions, but it would be nice if we could refrain from bringing things from Twitter just to mock someone's interpretations. This thread is a nice breath of fresh air amidst the madness that is the LTD precisely because we discuss things and consider other interpretations with as much respect as we can, which makes this place a much safer space for everyone to join (even when there's clearly a majority of CTs around here). If you see an argument/interpretation you want to discuss, you can always explain it with your own words instead of just bringing them up with nothing else to add, imo.
I'm not a mod or anything, so feel free to ignore my suggestions, but it would be nice if we could refrain from bringing things from Twitter just to mock someone's interpretations. This thread is a nice breath of fresh air amidst the madness that is the LTD precisely because we discuss things and consider other interpretations with as much respect as we can, which makes this place a much safer space for everyone to join (even when there's clearly a majority of CTs around here). If you see an argument/interpretation you want to discuss, you can always explain it with your own words instead of just bringing them up with nothing else to add, imo.