SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
Considering that Aerith and Cloud are both mimicking Zack's mannerisms and gestures, I wonder if they feel a sort of wistful nostalgia around each other? Cloud more subconsciously than Aerith, I would guess.


Lol, I've seen extreme CAs who were absolutely adamant that the kids were carrying buster swords because of Cloud, not Zack. Granted, they hadn't even played Remake and they have a vested interest in not playing Remake. But considering that it doesn't make sense for them to make those homemade swords for patrol before Cloud's even made it back to the Leaf House from saving the other kids, I can just imagine Zack visiting the Leaf House with Aerith and sitting around crafting them for the kids. I just really wanted to see it too. 😭 (Is greedy, lol.)
While playing through Crisis Core, it's pretty clear the Buster Swords were in reference to Zack
 

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
And also, could I also ask for verification on whether these are real or not? I think I heard it dropped before on this forum of fake phone wallpapers, so it had me curious. And I know Tres' analysis hasn't been updated in a long time and was finished about a decade ago, so maybe new information has come to light on them that I wasn't aware of.

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If any of these is going to be is going to be fake, I'd have to guess the Mickey and Minney Mouse one - Cloud and Tifa are kinda out of place.

Found the source for some of these, and it validates the rest of these.
The Valentine looking one is in fact from january of 2012. The wedding one with minnie and mickey is from june of the same year. I believe the other two to be from December 2011.

All of them are from the KH mobile game by the same studio as Airborne Brigage. It ended mid 2012.


Here's a post from a decade ago talking about them. The links to them on the S-E site are dead, but there's a blog link further down that page that shows evidence they were created by S-E, basically.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
Only in the sense that it hurts them. The refusal to see what's there is entirely willful.
Instead of creating a false persona they create a false narrative, genius.

No, there are definitely two leggers way into four leggers. I don't know why but they exist.
I managed to forget people are like that, why do you have to remind me?!

I make the specific point for Dissidia 012 because in spite of having no real world impediment to it- Maaya Sakamoto was signed up to the game to play Lightning - they chose to NOT include Aerith in any way to the plot or even the combat outside of an assist character.
Although that "Save her...save my friend" line probably set us back a bit, Dissidia when evaluated is definitely CT.

I'm aware what's said there is "nakama", but what do they make of it? Anyway, yeah, I might even argue that Aerith is fanservice in part 3 of the re;trilogy, part of me thinks all this multiversal stuff was thought up to include Aerith more in the story.

Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, who knows.
You aren't wrong, Angelalex just was a source of a lot of sillier as opposed to outright infuriating ones. Like Flower Field Spirit Sex with Aerith.
He legit believed that happened in AC's credits and wrote fanfic about it.
What did they make of ACC removing Aerith from the credits? Going off of this, probably not very well.

Are the rabid weasels nesting inside?
Free of charge.

She's Jealous of him and that means Bugeria is the true ship of FF7!

Guys, new triangle just dropped!
But wait! What about her childhood friend Zack!

This LTD just got a whole lot bigger...
Which is absolutely fair, they're part of the twist, and the game wants you focusing on Aerith primarily so it can do its double rug pull, the direct one of her death and the second one they used her to hide in plain sight, Cloud's true identity, motivations, etc.
Yeah, this is why I saw they want you to see Aerith date the most, it's basically her last non-spiritual moment with Cloud before she croaks.

And it's also why I've always thought Clerith was bait, bait so good that people are still falling hook, line, and sinker for it 27 years later. 30 by the time they're faced with the method behind the magic.

Google's AI is fucking terrible and has been using the Onion as a source. Never confuse a search aggregate with a source.
Oh no this is far worse. I actually don't think googles AI thing was implemented over here in Europe, or maybe just the EU due to some consumer protection thing I'm not aware of.

Anyway, this was just a reddit post, no AI feeding it to me. Only a couple more scrolls until you see the GameFaqs thread saying the same thing.
I would take all accusations like "Tifa is boring" or "they have no chemistry" as the whining of those who didn't get what they wanted and thus need to shit on the cool toy another kid got.
Yeah, if it's one thing I've noticed it's that Cleriths are directly unwilling to properly engage with the story and characters out of what really seems like jealousy.

Seriously, every time somebody speaks good about Tifa, they get accused and harassed. IIRC they did to MaximillianDood when he was playing through the game and said that Tifa was the secondary protagonist.
It's not so much the harshness of the accusations, but the frequency of it among the fandom. Like the hottest average take about Aerith from Camp CT is that she is unintentionally 'using' Cloud as a stand in for Zack even though she's consciously trying to move on from Zack with him, and that it can seem like she's trying to make moves on Cloud despite knowing what Tifa feels, though I do think we might be supposed to take this as Aerith hoping she had a place in his heart even though she knew she couldn't really compete so she could be let down easy and suffer a heartbreak to move on, problem being Cloud is so laser focused he never understood that Aerith was even flirting with him.
I've always seen it that Aerith was trying to move on from Zack with Cloud, but because they were uncannily similar it made it very hard for her. Sort of a two steps forward, one step back situation.

Oh, right, I want to jump back to the media literacy topic a bit. A little while ago, I saw a clerith react to a short little animation where Aerith and other FF7 characters were put into the Ouran High Host club opening animation in place of the regular characters, and the clerith was exulting over Aerith being made the main character and Tifa being "a side character like she's supposed to be." Setting that latter part aside, they seemed to think Aerith was put in the role of Haruhi as commentary on her being the romantic lead, and not, you know, sharing her voice actor.
Going back to what MaximillianDood said, Tifa really is much more suited to be called a secondary protagonist than Aerith, that's why it always annoys me seeing people say that "this is a game between Cloud, Aerith, and Sephiroth"...how? Aerith is completely missing from the latter half of the game. Guess who is actually present for the latter half of the game?

Apparently by Anastar, I have to wonder... does she think these characters have wills and voices outside what their creators and writing teams give them? Does she think there's a "real" Cloud and Aerith out there? There were fucking Sephiroth and Snape Wives who believed they existed on another plane of existence. I would not put it past this woman and it would actually explain some things.
This image is so funny I actually went looking for it to post here but couldn't find it, and yeah I think it is from Anastar.

And something else about characters not being real, I think it's Hirohiko Araki who seems to think that he doesn't really have free reign to do what he wants with his characters...they just characterise themselves. Strange.

and also, damn right Nojima and Kitase won't be happy about it! You're fucking up their story!

---------
Also, I want people who say Crisis Core isn't canon to the re;trilogy to ask themselves where Zack got the buster sword.
 
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Yoru

Pro Adventurer
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I'm sorry, but I can't take them seriously. I can't imagine them as anything other than 14-year-olds who don't get out of the house enough.

It's so cringe. I'm sorry but it really is.

There is no side. There's just a story written by Nojima, which the developers are trying to portray to the best of their ability and budget.

The developers are so dedicated to Clerith that they chose to use the game's most fanservice moment to favor the other side. Really 4D chess masterminds... ffs expressing themselves on social networks should only be allowed after medical consultation...
 
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abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
See, the funny part to me is that they claimed that the mocaps were Cloti, but then proceeded to consult the mocap.
 

pxl_pushr

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Pixel
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I'm sorry, but I can't take them seriously. I can't imagine them as anything other than 14-year-olds who don't get out of the house enough.

It's so cringe. I'm sorry but it really is.

There is no side. There's just a story written by Nojima, which the developers are trying to portray to the best of their ability and budget.

The developers are so dedicated to Clerith that they chose to use the game's most fanservice moment to favor the other side. Really 4D chess masterminds... ffs expressing themselves on social networks should only be allowed after medical consultation...
Yeah, the devs don’t think in terms of ships or which shipping side they’re on. They’re all just characters in a story to them, and those characters will interact in ways that progress and elevate the story.

Why did Cloud and Aerith get a long, sweet goodbye? Because they wanted to respect Aerith and the relationship she had with Cloud. He doesn’t reciprocate the feelings she puts out there, but he still treats her tenderly. Because he cherishes everyone.

Why does Cloud kiss Tifa and only her? Because their feelings are mutual even if there’s still tension between them due to his identity crisis.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
Why did Cloud and Aerith get a long, sweet goodbye? Because they wanted to respect Aerith and the relationship she had with Cloud. He doesn’t reciprocate the feelings she puts out there, but he still treats her tenderly. Because he cherishes everyone.
Let's be honest, that's totally not their last meeting, and it's hardly their last goodbye. Are they going to be able to help themselves in part 3? I don't think so.
 

pxl_pushr

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Pixel
Let's be honest, that's totally not their last meeting, and it's hardly their last goodbye. Are they going to be able to help themselves in part 3? I don't think so.
Maybe, but i just can’t see them immediately ruining Aerith’s goodbye marathon with her showing up regularly in part 3.

Personally, the wait will be easier for me if I choose to have some faith in them.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
Let's be honest, that's totally not their last meeting, and it's hardly their last goodbye. Are they going to be able to help themselves in part 3? I don't think so.

It should be. I'm sorry but honestly if this wasn't all about saying goodbye, then this ending is the worst. And the writing of Aerith's character definitely screwed up.
 

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
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pxl_pushr

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Pixel
It should be. I'm sorry but honestly if this wasn't all about saying goodbye, then this ending is the worst. And the writing of Aerith's character definitely screwed up.
And it’d be such a weird fumble to make because I assumed all three games are supposed to work as one story when held up together.

If it’s not goodbye, then why burn that much time on it when you could’ve avoided all the drama by just sticking as close to a 1:1 retelling of her death without all the allusions to finality.

They’re trying to recreate the same emotions as we had way back when, which is the point of the perspective shift imo. Using Cloud’s pov is perfect for that.

In part 3, the most you’ll get for 90% of the game is maybe the occasional hint that she’s doing stuff in the LS, but you won’t see her until maybe the very end.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
They’re trying to recreate the same emotions as we had way back when, which is the point of the perspective shift imo. Using Cloud’s pov is perfect for that.

In part 3, the most you’ll get for 90% of the game is maybe the occasional hint that she’s doing stuff in the LS, but you won’t see her until maybe the very end.

I'm supposed to be sad. No way I care about her death if she's doing her Jedi ghost thing during all part 3.

As I've said before, bringing out the violins and trying to get me to cry for 2 chapters only to tell me that “everything's ok” is killing replayability for me.

If she's more alive than alive, apart from the fact that you can't touch her, I don't see how that's dramatic.

And it destroys Advent Children even more.

tl;dr: The dead should stay dead and not be able to interact directly with the living.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
Personally, the wait will be easier for me if I choose to have some faith in them.
I wish I could, but they didn't exactly do Aerith many favours in the re;trilogy did they? Especially not in Rebirth. Which makes it hard for me to have faith for part 3 when the groundwork is already lain...and not well.

If it’s not goodbye, then why burn that much time on it when you could’ve avoided all the drama by just sticking as close to a 1:1 retelling of her death without all the allusions to finality.
To bait people and keep people talking for the next couple years. Nomura said that they wanted to add some mystery to the re;trilogy to keep new and old fans engaged.

They’re trying to recreate the same emotions as we had way back when, which is the point of the perspective shift imo. Using Cloud’s pov is perfect for that.
I'd argue they aren't. With the original they wanted you to have feelings of reality and not hollywood...but let's be honest, feelings of reality were the last things I was feeling during Rebirth's ending.

I think Nomura said something about changing the emotions they want to convey, they want to go with a denial angle this time. Which is funny because people are saying she isn't dead.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
To bait people and keep people talking for the next couple years. Nomura said that they wanted to add some mystery to the re;trilogy to keep new and old fans engaged.

The point is, this is the last game. They don't need to trick people anymore because... this is the moment when mysteries become explanations. It's no longer teasing, it's climax and final conclusion.

The previous 2 installments were 80% relecture and expansion, and 20% “keeping people interested”. 20% of which will no longer exist because there's nothing to introduce behind it.

So for now, I'm still in the camp: She's dead. We left her behind in the end cinematic, so there's no reason to see her again just yet. And by the time we do, Cloud himself will be fully aware that she's dead. And maybe we'll even get an explanation of what these other worlds are, and by then Zack's part will be concluded too.

All of which is to say that there's no proof at the end of Rebirth that we won't be replaying the same story. People already thought that at the end of Remake we could only go for nonsense, and in the end we got exactly the same game, except that Cloud blocked Aerith's death in his head.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
Oh no, I don't think they'll put more bait in part 3, I'm saying the whole "will she live?" in the marketing and "is she alive?" in Rebirth itself and how complicated everything is makes me think a lot of stuff is just theory fodder so people don't get bored waiting for part 3.
 

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
It is possible we get a moment with Aerith before the end, but only as part of Zack's story. We have space for perhaps 3 cuts to them, not including the very final battle, and if they're in the final battle, one of them needs to be the two of them figuring out what's going on and that they need to join the fight somehow. However, they should not interact with the main cast at any point before this, and not at all before that final battle.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
I even think that Aerith will be Zack's quest and that we'll just be following him, as in Rebirth. And he'll be the one to find her at the very end (maybe when he realizes he's been dead all along).

Maybe I'm wrong. The first teaser/trailer should quickly make us understand what kind of marketing we're getting into.

But for the time being, I really think they're going for an unattainable Aerith. And Zack's reward, as it is for players who are fans of the character, is to find her with him towards the very end of his arc.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
Zack is supposed to be super important to Remakes. That's what they kept saying. And so far, sorry son, but you've been "useless" in this new arc.

I think the whole point of this is that he saves Aerith from Sephiroth in the LS, and that it's thanks to him that she can be “there” at the end to stop the meteor.
 

Eerie

Fire and Blood
It is possible we get a moment with Aerith before the end, but only as part of Zack's story. We have space for perhaps 3 cuts to them, not including the very final battle, and if they're in the final battle, one of them needs to be the two of them figuring out what's going on and that they need to join the fight somehow. However, they should not interact with the main cast at any point before this, and not at all before that final battle.
I kinda think alike; to me Aerith is dead and will only show up to Cloud at the very end, like in the OG. Rebirth's ending solidifies this to me, as it shows that Cloud cannot see the real Aerith in the Lifestream, even if the FMV makes you believe otherwise. It's really well done but yeah, she's gone.
 

nars305

🎵 I am so, so bored 🎶
Part of me felt like the way they handled Aerith’s death was to make sense of the fact that Cloud had seemed to move on from her death pretty quick based on what I’ve seen some of yall say.

Maybe they didn't want it to seem that way in the remake.

But I agree, based on how she doesn’t get on the ship it only makes sense for her to appear how Zack did in Rebirth to make sense of their relationship and how they help save the world.

But I feel like the more Cloud interacts with Zack and Aerith, the less his grief in AC makes sense.
 

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
Maybe, but i just can’t see them immediately ruining Aerith’s goodbye marathon with her showing up regularly in part 3.

Personally, the wait will be easier for me if I choose to have some faith in them.
I think she'll have a similar amount of scenes that Zack did in Rebirth. Maybe a little more, since she's more important to the plot.
 

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
It should be. I'm sorry but honestly if this wasn't all about saying goodbye, then this ending is the worst. And the writing of Aerith's character definitely screwed up.
Based on my interpretation of the ending, I don't see how there wouldn't be another goodbye for Cloud specifically.
 
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