Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
Not to sound old and bitter, but welcome to 1997 through the present day. That's always been the case with the hardcore culty cleriths.
SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
- Start date
Maidenofwar
They/Them
I wanted to say things should always change with perspective and be flexible and don't get stuck in the past or at least in you're going to stay there do so in peace and enjoy your content respectfully. For example I was always adamant Aerith was genuinely interested in Cloud and used the Ultimania quote about her being able to see through but if part 3 is hard-core ZA well then I'll just have to accept that. I might be salty but not really especially if they get kiss/full body hug/etc.
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
I would state that Aerith could be interested in Cloud for Cloud, wants to be, even, but she never gets the chance. Consciously, she is trying to move on. Subconsciously, she's trying to recapture what she felt with Zack and fell into a little mental trap of "he reminds me of Zack, it must be the same sort of love" and when she realizes she hasn't actually met Cloud for Cloud yet it's too late.
That said, I do think she and Zack will get a happy reunion- or at least as happy as being reunited in the afterlife is, anyways.
Sacky
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- SackyBoy
Yeah its just wild to see that the main reddit which normally doesn't allow this has these people everywhere xd
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
They're extra salty with how much attention Tifa has been given lately. Even the ones who don't overtly hate her are having gnawing doubts about their various copes so they're going on the offensive.
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
I don't really understand why... I mean, they held hands so obviously there's nothing to be afraid of. /s
Okay, that's mean. But in all seriousness, my experience with Reddit has taught me that a subreddit's rules don't matter if any of the mods are biased, which appears to be the case in all the FF subreddits.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
I mean, it's only going to get worse when they'll truly launch P3.
So far I've seen racist (and towards people who like her, not characters) and super sexist/mysogin tweets and I'm like ".... good luck in p3 guys".
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Been replaying OG and I’m actually spotting very tiny hints that foresight has always been a part of this story but I just finished NC and…
Boy did I forget how interesting it is that Tifa’s focus coincides with the game finally telling you the truth. That and taking Vincent through the whirlwind maze just makes sense to me.
I just can’t see it walking back any of the developments from the first two games, there just isn’t any time to do it convincingly. Especially when they spent so much time in Rebirth saying “Loveless still matters, and it’s still about Zack. Oh and was originally about Jenova.”
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
The implosion is gonna be pretty big it seems.
I wonder what the cope will be when it finally comes.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
Disc 2 always had a very heavy focus on Tifa and CT, which is why since even before Remake, CTs were more impatients for that part of the story lol. Literally, NC scene, Junon escape, Tifa as party leader, Mideel, Lifestream scene, Highwind scene, the ending. These are absolutely fantastic and are tied to Tifa, so it always makes me scratch my head when I see some extremists say CA will kiss in p3. Like, no they aren't going to. The game isn't going in that direction.
And that's without talking about Rocket Town, the Huge Materia questline, Wutai, Fort Condor, going back to the City of the Ancients and getting all the limits, etc.
The reason why CA had all these goodbyes is because... it's the end. When she held his hand after the Sephiroth fight, Aerith was telling Cloud goodbye (which is why the scene after is so jarring but it makes sense if it's Jenova/his weak mind imagining he managed to save her). She definitely did not talk to him again, IMHO. And she won't until she saves him after the last fight against Sephiroth in p3, I think. At some point, the feeling of loss is going to kick in.
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
Basically this, Part 3 is too crowded to set up a CA romance now. It should have been set up in Rebirth if that was the payoff they were going for. They literally have no time to undo the romance with Tifa and replace it with Aerith romance stuff. They would also have to spend time making sure Zack still gets a good payoff.
They simply don't have time. They might have if they started it in Part 2 but they didn't. They've spent too much time setting up Cloti.
MissMDusk
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Mari
Logged onto twitter after what feels like months and it's still a blood bath.
Question, can I check if Zack has ever been described as a 'taisetsuna hito'(?), or has it just been Aerith?
Saw some Japanese twitter user say one source from a CT user apparently says "his (cloud's) best friend Zack and precious person Aerith" and not Zack being described as "precious person", not sure if this is accurate and wasn't about to delve into the CA side of twitter to check lol.
Question, can I check if Zack has ever been described as a 'taisetsuna hito'(?), or has it just been Aerith?
Saw some Japanese twitter user say one source from a CT user apparently says "his (cloud's) best friend Zack and precious person Aerith" and not Zack being described as "precious person", not sure if this is accurate and wasn't about to delve into the CA side of twitter to check lol.
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
Taisetsu -na- hito and josei, but yes. Don't worry, I keep messing that one up too, because your brain is primed for a no because it's commonly used as a linkage particle, but it's not actually used here.
Oh, and Jessie is ALSO Taisetsunahito.
MissMDusk
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Mari
Amazing, thanks!
Then can I also check that this is not a romantic term? Or depends on the context?
Also extreme CAs are so aggressive on twitter my god... I slightly fear the devs read this and think it's the norm/majority opinion.
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
It could be used as a romantic term, but you wouldn't take it's usage as automatically romantic, unlike with taisetsuna josei or dansei. Like, unless it was the guy's mother, you'd never use josei without romantic implications, and even then it's a bit odd to use even for your mom.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
Seeing that Hamaguchi follows at least one big CT fan account as well as other CTs and tours and sees just how much Tifa is cheered on everywhere... Nah. They know they've done a proper job at least with the Re-trilogy re: CT and properly showed that they are the main pair.
Also I think they wouldn't care. Nojima isn't going to back down, he's said it, Nomura said it.
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
I can't really blame them. They have to really twist things in order for their ship to sail and it's harder for them to prove their side.
I expect the closer we get to Part 3's release, the more desperate they'll be in trying to get things to change. They claim that the kiss means nothing but deep down, I expect it actually scares them. I suppose that's a bit mean to say but I would wager it's the truth.
imach0c0
Pro Adventurer
During the ending, one of the things that stood out to me was Aerith having Cloud commit to taking care of Sephiroth (esp when she told Cloud to do the opposite in the Sleeping Forest). The Aerith that appears after the AC-esque CA scene was unsettling due to her body language and facial expressions, it didn't feel natural.
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Eerie
Fire and Blood
That's exactly the part of the scene and the line that makes me go "this is not Aerith. This is a Jenova trick. Aerith wouldn't want him to go after Sephiroth, not in this state."
At least when they talk, this is not Aerith. I suspect that when we see Cloud paying attention to her, it's not Aerith, but when he's not looking/not onscreen, then it's Aerith (for the whole scene).
imach0c0
Pro Adventurer
Yea, I think there is a mix of Jenova!Aerith and real!Aerith because of how the camera cuts between Cloud's POV and the player's POV when Aerith is there/not there.
I think the one that says goodbye in the end is real!Aerith because of the how its shot with the reunion flowers in the distance.
The Aerith that interacts with RedXIII I am not sure about as I can see it going both ways. I'm inclined to think its real!Aerith due to her sad expression. But it could be Jenova!Aerith, if she is trying to play tricks on him too.
Also, the way she does the "call up smoke" pose feels mechanical. Its interesting she does it twice - once under the Tiny Bronco and then with Cloud.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
There's this thing that is: Cloud cannot see the real Aerith, because she's dead and they're not in the Lifestream (I think showing herself to him happens later, when she has a better grasp of her powers, right now she's still very close from our Aerith in Rebirth). So every time he's seen Aerith since the bizarre lake scene, it's not her he's seen.
Which means, every time Cloud "sees" Aerith in the last scene, it's not her. So who is it? Well we know he's being manipulating by a certain alien... it has to be Jenova, and if you look closely at the lake scene then it makes even more sense: Tifa nearly brings him back just with a sigh, and Jenova can't have that so she makes him see Aerith to keep her hold onto him.
This is why every time Cloud sees Aerith in the last scene, it's not her. He can't see her and we clearly see Aerith "disappearing" from where she was right when Cloud does not look. He looks again? She's there again.
The only time when I think it should be Aerith is when we see Aerith but we don't see Cloud and he's not paying attention to her. So with Yuffie and with Red and Tifa: she is telling them goodbye. And last of course when the Tiny Bronco flies away, of course it's her too.
But whenever he looks at her and when they chat goodbye? Yeah it's not her. It's a personality based on who Cloud thought Aerith was and his memories of her, which is why the scene begins with a good callback to the park CA scene but then ends up distorted. Jenova was ready to go but Cloud thought Aerith would want to know he's going after Sephiroth: Jenova jumps on the occasion because yes, she wants him to "reunite" with Sephiroth, but it also shows the clear disconnect between Cloud's idea of Aerith and the real Aerith. There are some parts of her he grasps quite well, and others he just doesn't understand - nor did make the effort to understand while she was alive. I think this is also part of his guilt.
Which means, every time Cloud "sees" Aerith in the last scene, it's not her. So who is it? Well we know he's being manipulating by a certain alien... it has to be Jenova, and if you look closely at the lake scene then it makes even more sense: Tifa nearly brings him back just with a sigh, and Jenova can't have that so she makes him see Aerith to keep her hold onto him.
This is why every time Cloud sees Aerith in the last scene, it's not her. He can't see her and we clearly see Aerith "disappearing" from where she was right when Cloud does not look. He looks again? She's there again.
The only time when I think it should be Aerith is when we see Aerith but we don't see Cloud and he's not paying attention to her. So with Yuffie and with Red and Tifa: she is telling them goodbye. And last of course when the Tiny Bronco flies away, of course it's her too.
But whenever he looks at her and when they chat goodbye? Yeah it's not her. It's a personality based on who Cloud thought Aerith was and his memories of her, which is why the scene begins with a good callback to the park CA scene but then ends up distorted. Jenova was ready to go but Cloud thought Aerith would want to know he's going after Sephiroth: Jenova jumps on the occasion because yes, she wants him to "reunite" with Sephiroth, but it also shows the clear disconnect between Cloud's idea of Aerith and the real Aerith. There are some parts of her he grasps quite well, and others he just doesn't understand - nor did make the effort to understand while she was alive. I think this is also part of his guilt.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
Something Kitase said was he/they were aware of players not continuing the game after losing Aerith, so I wonder if they are going to do anything with that.
I also thought it was interesting when asked what their favourite Cloud and Aerith scenes were both Kitase and Hamaguchi said the sky and roof scenes.
"My best friend Zack, and my precious Aerith ..." should surprise nobody except real antis/trolls that think Cloud really hates/loathes Aerith and really can't stand to be around her hardly.
I also thought it was interesting when asked what their favourite Cloud and Aerith scenes were both Kitase and Hamaguchi said the sky and roof scenes.
"My best friend Zack, and my precious Aerith ..." should surprise nobody except real antis/trolls that think Cloud really hates/loathes Aerith and really can't stand to be around her hardly.
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
Just to note, Zack is also referred to as Taisetsunahito - in another quote, but also alongside Aerith- which I think was done precisely to put the two of them on the same level so people would understand Aerith is precious to him in the same way that Zack is.
Rin
Pro Adventurer
The Dirge of Cerberus character sheet/guide also describes Zack and Aerith as Cloud's "best friends" who sacrificed their lives for him. I would assume 'best friends' is translated from the same 'Taisetsunahito' term.
The chances of Aerith NOT being playable to some degree in part 3 seem very slim. She never got her strongest weapon (Princess guard) or her strongest limit break (Great Gospel) and she canonically needs to obtain the latter to heal the children and Cloud in Advent Children.
The chances of Aerith NOT being playable to some degree in part 3 seem very slim. She never got her strongest weapon (Princess guard) or her strongest limit break (Great Gospel) and she canonically needs to obtain the latter to heal the children and Cloud in Advent Children.