LTD, round 3: This time, we settle it with Jello Wrestling

[Isabella]

How is a two-year relationship shallow but a two-week acquaintance true love? I just don't get it.

 

[Dashell]

In the same frightening way that closeted homophobes have their urges occur to them.

Is this experience talking?

 

[Ryushikaze]

Is this experience talking?

It's observation talking. I've seen a number of closeted gay and bi people lash out against homosexuality because they themselves feel the 'urges.' I have also seen deeply religious people who know their beliefs to be untenable but who cannot bear to lose them react in the same fashion. I've also seen people who were column A and column B.

The pinkers are just more of the same.

Oh, and Bella, because the two week one involves Aerith. It's MAGIC...

 

[Vendel]

Oh, and Bella, because the two week one involves Aerith. It's MAGIC...

 

[Fighter]

If you put them side by side Z/A had more of everything that C/A had. They even have the real tragic love. Zack died trying to come back to her even after all these years and she was still waiting.

 

[Raquelborn]

I know Square asked Japanese fans about there favorite Final Fantasy couple.

http://member.square-enix.com/jp/membersvo...search=1&page=1
AerithxZack won with 78 votes. TifaxCloud has 41 votes and AerithxCloud was 21 votes.

This is interesting, but for goodness sake that's only 140 fans out of...hundreds of thousands and millions? It's hardly representative of the entire fan base. I doubt SE would start back pedalling on anything Clerith because of it. It'd be asinine.

SE honestly don't care that much about shippers anyway. We're a small percentage really. As long as the couple fits best with the character developments and has the best role for the rest of the story that's all that's going to matter to the creators. It bothers me how many shippers think choosing one couple over another would actually affect sales (lol).

 

[Dashell]

This is interesting, but for goodness sake that's only 140 fans out of...hundreds of thousands and millions? It's hardly representative of the entire fan base. I doubt SE would start back pedalling on anything Clerith because of it. It'd be asinine.

You are aware there were MANY more votes that weren't related to Cloud Tifa and Aerith right?

 

[Raquelborn]

You are aware there were MANY more votes that weren't related to Cloud Tifa and Aerith right?

Like Zack and Aerith? If so then yes, I'm not blind.

 

[Dashell]

Well okay there were more than just FFVII couples I mean. I'm not sure how many but... yeah that doesn't represent the entire population but I think it's safe to say that Zerith is pretty damn popular.

 

[Fighter]

There is no doubt popular demand plays a part in what you get in entertainment. But what the clerii suggest is an utter exaggeration. It all just sounds like they are making an excuse for being wrong, "It's not that we were wrong there are just too many fanboys horny for big breasted sluts.... and CC is just an evil retcon."

People have called Z/A before CC. They've called the sex thing before the 'risqué' interview. They've explained Cloud and Tifa's relationship before the Ultimanias, before CoT even.

For half of the fandom, no, for most of the fandom the Compilation just confirmed what they already thought.

 

[Ryushikaze]

If you put them side by side Z/A had more of everything that C/A had. They even have the real tragic love. Zack died trying to come back to her even after all these years and she was still waiting.

Z/A has 'anything' of everything C/A wants to have, you mean. Z/A is the reality to which C/A is the illusory mirror.

There is no doubt popular demand plays a part in what you get in entertainment. But what the clerii suggest is an utter exaggeration. It all just sounds like they are making an excuse for being wrong, "It's not that we were wrong there are just too many fanboys horny for big breasted sluts.... and CC is just an evil retcon."

Nevermind the whole heterosexual female contingent of the 'C/T is canon' side, or the guys and gals who prefer other FF females but can still see that C/T makes sense...

People have called Z/A before CC. They've called the sex thing before the 'risqué' interview. They've explained Cloud and Tifa's relationship before the Ultimanias, before CoT even.

Yes. Yes we have.

For half of the fandom, no, for most of the fandom the Compilation just confirmed what they already thought.

Hell, some of it the compilation didn't 'confirm,' it just clarified.

 

[Vendel]

Is anyone else sick and tired of seeing Tifa's complicated feelings being used as proof of a romantic relationship between Cloud and Aerith?


Let us break this down shall we?

A close friend as well as rival?
The complicated emotions she feels towards Aerith.

「Both of them share feelings for Cloud 」 — Tifa was close to Aerith, who can also be called a love rival.

So the first thing that stands out here is the questioning nature of this quote.
It is not stating Aerith is a love rival. It is saying She could be called that. At least from Tifa's perspective. This says nothing about Clouds thoughts.

With that point in mind, they were also good friends. Nevertheless, it is not hard to imagine that she carries complex feelings as a woman toward Aerith, who had built up a special bond with Cloud that was different from Tifa’s.

Of special note. Cloud's 'special' bond with Aerith is in the past tense. It is not a current bond. Aerith is dead folks. Also pinkers seem to forget that Tifa also has a special bond with him. Yet somehow Aerith's is romantic and Tifa's isn't?

Tifa’s complicated feelings continue even in AC, two years after Aerith had departed the world. This was due to the fact that Cloud, succumbing to the notion that Aerith’s death was his fault and condemning himself, construed that Denzel was “the child which Aerith brought here” and took care of him. In addition, Cloud had also gone away to the church that Aerith had been in. The thing which she is unable to hide in her irritation towards Cloud is the fact that he isn’t merely dragging the past around, but because that reason might perhaps be related to Aerith.

Again SE pointing out that Cloud dragging the past around is a bad thing. Notice Tifa is not jealous of Aerith in AC. She is upset that her dear friends memory is causing Cloud pain.


The pinkers like to combine this with Tifa's "maternal feelings" as some sort of grand proof that Cloud and Aerith have a romantic bond and Tifa can plainly see it. Or some such nonsense.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

The pinkers, much like God, sure do say a lot of hibbity bibbity gibity swibbity.

Finally a chance to use lines from Little Nicky in the LTD, I can die in peace now.

 

[Isabella]

If I and a friend of mine had feelings for the same man, I'd have complicated feelings toward her too, whether he preferred one, both or neither of us. It creates a strange dynamic, because you're essentially wishing for someone you care about to lose so that you may win. Assuming you genuinely care about your friend, that can lead to a degree of guilt.

And that's before your friend gets murdered, and guilt over that murder is preventing the guy from moving forward.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Back in college, my room-mate and I (who were close enough that we considered each other brothers) were both pursuing the same girl. He got chosen over me in the end. And indeed, exactly what Isabella (not including the murder part of course) occurred, there was guilt during the competition as we were competing, he felt guilt after his "victory" as it were, etc. Complicated feelings indeed.

 

[Dashell]

I just don't get why Aerith being jealous of Tifa ONLY makes sense if CxA are official... uhm.. what? Aerith was jealous of Tifa too.

Also I've been thinking... there was "feelings of desire" and "the One That I Love"
Both lost a great deal of Cleriths... I'm predicting a third impact that they won't be able to recover from and we might finally be able to put an end to this.

(The fighting BTW)

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Put on the pink glasses, drink a glass of pink kool-aide, and read your pink bible Q. Then and only then will you see the bullshit truth.

 

[Dashell]

... or wait would we say "koibito" was the first impact and then group "feelings of desire" and THe One that I Love as one?

 

[Ⓐaron]

I just don't get why Aerith being jealous of Tifa ONLY makes sense if CxA are official... uhm.. what? Aerith was jealous of Tifa too.

They wouldn't be convinced Clerith was canon if they could weigh evidence objectively and avoid using double standards

 

[Dashell]

okay I can't edit since you quoted.. I mean Tifa being jealous of Aerith.

 

[Eerie]

「Both of them share feelings for Cloud 」 — Tifa was close to Aerith, who can also be called a love rival.

I always thought this quote referred to Disc One of the game, when Aerith was still alive? Since Aerith was so straightforward in her feelings, Tifa did get jealous, yet at the same time, she was still Aerith's friend.

With that point in mind, they were also good friends. Nevertheless, it is not hard to imagine that she carries complex feelings as a woman toward Aerith, who had built up a special bond with Cloud that was different from Tifa’s.

Yes, because Aerith died - as Bella stated, guilt and all that jazz thrown in the mix, because well, Tifa *is* the one chosen by Cloud, after all. But if anything, this quote clarifies that Cloud and Aerith's relationship was never romantic.

Tifa’s complicated feelings continue even in AC, two years after Aerith had departed the world. This was due to the fact that Cloud, succumbing to the notion that Aerith’s death was his fault and condemning himself, construed that Denzel was “the child which Aerith brought here” and took care of him. In addition, Cloud had also gone away to the church that Aerith had been in. The thing which she is unable to hide in her irritation towards Cloud is the fact that he isn’t merely dragging the past around, but because that reason might perhaps be related to Aerith.

Contrarily to Bill, I do believe that there's a hint of jealousy in those complicated feelings, as well as guilt and friendship - she's wondering why Cloud is dragging the past around, IMHO. However, her jealousy is because Cloud seems to be chosing to drag the past around [and thus focuses on Aerith - and Zack for that matter, but she isn't aware of Zack] rather than chosing their family which upsets her. She knows why Cloud feels guilty, yet she can't be helped feeling pained by the fact that he's been hiding it all from her, when his family could bring him the support he needs.

That's why the bedroom scene in AC was so important to me; because not only it had that feeling of a woman telling her man to stop being an idiot, but also because it refocuses Cloud on his family and the problem they're facing. That the kids and HIS kids need him. That he's an idiot because they are supposed to be a family, and that she's been hurt by his behaviour. Because she scolds him, he is able to go and save them - and be forgiven by Aerith in the meantime.

As Cloud told Sephiroth, "there's nothing that's not important"; Tifa and the kids, Aerith, Zack, they all are special in his heart, all in different ways. And he will fight for them.

 

[Dashell]

So who thinks I should make this my sig on CxA?

Spoiler: hint

highlight it in Internet Explorer... yeah I know you don't USE internet explorer but it doesn't work in any other browser

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Syn, your whole post deserves a resounding "This!" I never even thought of it, but comments about Tifa feeling jealous of Aerith could be largely/entirely about her open, straightforwardness. Tifa is shy, and she's jealous that Aerith can vocalize her feelings so much more easily than she can. I agree with the rest of your post too, good show.

 

[Ⓐaron]

okay I can't edit since you quoted.. I mean Tifa being jealous of Aerith.

Either way, my point stands

Also that sig is so awesome that you'd probably get banned for using it

 

[Dashell]

Well they have some people who lurk here so I can't use it now anyway