LTD, round 3: This time, we settle it with Jello Wrestling

[Edley]

Dudley, you have it backward. Cloud, Aerith and Denzel are the family here. Tifa's the one who so rudely inserts herself. I mean, taking in a homeless, dying child and caring for him, loving him? Who does that bitch think she is?

Chloe/Eber ... Cler! I've been so blind. And changing his translation to Abel was just a dirty Cloti plot to hide the truth.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Go say that to them, Ryu. Please?

Feel free to C/P that wherever.

Shoot, I thought you switched the character you were talking about at the end of the sentence... man, I mean, Aerith got jealous over Zack - even though he was entirely hers - and Tifa got jealous over Cloud - even though he's entirely hers. XD

And here I thought Tifa's jealousy meant something.

It does. It means Tifa is insecure, and doesn't hide it as well as Aerith.

What does that mean when she gets jealous that Denzel learned how to clean by Cloud in CoT then? XD

Well, being hurt isn't quite the same as being jealous, but if it is jealousy, in this case, it's probably that Denzel is opening up to Cloud and not her.

Denzel is criminally underrated as a compilation character IMO. His story is infinitely more interesting than any of the characters introduced in CC or DC.

Idunno. Shelke/ Shalua are at least somewhat interesting. He's definitely got a more interesting story, dunno about the hyperbole of infinitely, tho.

That being said, there's a reason why we never get internal perspective from Aerith once Cloud and Tifa adopt him. Even if she had designs on "meeting" Cloud again, those desires would have been dropped once the Strife family comes to be. Any other action would decimate her character.

But don't you see, Materia Jesus can do no wrong! Rightness is defined by what she does! Ergo, if she does it, it is correct!

Decimate, or make better?

Zim: Better. Definitely Better.

Dudley, you have it backward. Cloud, Aerith and Denzel are the family here. Tifa's the one who so rudely inserts herself. I mean, taking in a homeless, dying child and caring for him, loving him? Who does that bitch think she is?

She thinks she's a kind, compassionate person in a relationship. How DARE SHE, the tawdry malicious whore? Acting with care and compassion towards others, the clingy slut.

 

[Dashell]

Go say that to them, Ryu. Please?

C/Ped some of it

Zack was a good BF to Aerith... sure maybe she realized she preferred Cloud's shy awkwardness to a guy who can talk to any girl, but that doesn't mean that Zack is a whore. It means Aerith is human

 

[Vendel]

Holy fucking shit.

I was just talking about Tifa's crush on Cloud. I don't think she loves him for what he truly is, but for what she wants him to be.

She keeps talking herself into believing that he's another Zack
..................
the Promise was essentially a red herring that fell apart during the Lifestream event. The Promise was based entirely on false pretenses, just like Tifa watching the papers for a picture of Cloud was based on false pretenses, and Tifa watching for Cloud when the Shinra troops came to Nibelheim was based on false pretenses. She wasn't watching for Cloud, but for an idealized version of a SOLDIER - who was really Zack.

So that raises the question: who is Tifa really in love with? Zack or Cloud?

How in the hell can you get Tifa and Aerith mixed up in the "wants Cloud to be Zack" department?

And the idea that the promise is a red herring? FFS!

I need to play some L4D...

 

[Dashell]

A promise based on false pretenses... carved in Cloud's heart forever!...

makes perfect sense


anyway regardless of what Tifa thought Cloud was going to be like when he returned, she still accepted him for who he was. That's the part they seem to forget.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Holy fucking shit.



How in the hell can you get Tifa and Aerith mixed up in the "wants Cloud to be Zack" department?

And the idea that the promise is a red herring? FFS!

I need to play some L4D...

It occurred to me at this point to suggest someone mod L4D so that all the infected were replaced by crazy as shit pinkers (for reasons of therapy) , but then it occurred to me that all you'd really need to do was recolor their clothing pink and maybe make the Hunters' duct tape into ribbons and it'd be impossible to tell the difference already

 

[jelly]

How is it 'a lot' to assume? It's the typical assumption, in fact. Hell, after sleeping with each other, sleeping with each other in a literal sense only makes sense.

It's what I would probably assume too. But I'm only playing safe and not assuming anything in this case. Is it really that bad?

That would require giving a shit about the LTD and romance in a game that only vaguely pays lip service to the romance of the most romantically minded games, and doesn't even mention the only fuckdamn wife of the lot.

Yeah, I know. To people who give a shit about the LTD, it's about the LTD. And for those who don't a give a shit, it's not. And it is vague lip service, and SE likes doing that. That's all I was saying.

Again, I repeat the mantra- if Cecil no get no nookie, then nobody no get no nookie.

If you say so...

An assumption you only seem to make because you don't want to envision the two sharing a room even though it's the general standard for grown men and women living together.

No, I actually like envisioning Cloud and Tifa sharing a room and having sex. I just didn't see it there.

Some people might think my interpretations are not worth taking seriously and that it's stupid to not see something so obvious to them. But I can agree to disagree.

Spoiler

I knew I wasn't making it up in my head. :p

Which would only be relevant until Barret leaves. Which was 1 week after 7th Heaven opened. Next thing we see she is in a separate room.

Which page did it say she's in a separate room? ^^;

And well, I still wouldn't get why she didn't always have her own room to start with. :\

Actually, I'm sure he was talking about Aerith given the scenery and the fact that he looked up as he said it. Recall the last scene like that involving him in the bottom of the Northern Crater.

In any event, given that he's still hung up on his guilt and wanting to meet Aerith to get her forgiveness during the time of Dissidia, I don't feel that line is implied to be romantic.

Given what I know about the game, that would be my interpretation of what he was talking about too.

I was just talking about Tifa's crush on Cloud. I don't think she loves him for what he truly is, but for what she wants him to be.

She keeps talking herself into believing that he's another Zack
..................
the Promise was essentially a red herring that fell apart during the Lifestream event. The Promise was based entirely on false pretenses, just like Tifa watching the papers for a picture of Cloud was based on false pretenses, and Tifa watching for Cloud when the Shinra troops came to Nibelheim was based on false pretenses. She wasn't watching for Cloud, but for an idealized version of a SOLDIER - who was really Zack.

So that raises the question: who is Tifa really in love with? Zack or Cloud?

They didn't keep in touch so what else was she supposed to do? If someone said they're going to try be on the newspaper then I'll look for them in the newspaper. I think Tifa would've been happy to see Cloud in Nibelheim, she just didn't know what to look for. When she found out that Cloud was there to save her, she considered him as being her hero and keeping the promise. I don't think being a famous SOLDIER was the most important thing to her. It was probably more important to Cloud.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Holy fucking shit.



How in the hell can you get Tifa and Aerith mixed up in the "wants Cloud to be Zack" department?

And the idea that the promise is a red herring? FFS!

I need to play some L4D...

So, wait, how is Cloud and Tifa's promise a false pretense?
And how in the seven names of fuck is Cloud as of disc one not categorically a false pretense shown to the world, himself included?

It's what I would probably assume too. But I'm only playing safe and not assuming anything in this case. Is it really that bad?

Not bad, just confusing.

Yeah, I know. To people who give a shit about the LTD, it's about the LTD. And for those who don't a give a shit, it's not. And it is vague lip service, and SE likes doing that. That's all I was saying.

Fair enough. I don't think it's deliberate, though.

If you say so...

I do. Because Cecil deserve nookie.

No, I actually like envisioning Cloud and Tifa sharing a room and having sex. I just didn't see it there.

Fair enough, I just don't quite see the train of thought you're following here, though.

Some people might think my interpretations are not worth taking seriously and that it's stupid to not see something so obvious to them. But I can agree to disagree.

Really, I'm just asking you to 'show your work' more or less. Your ideas aren't impossible, but they're not narratively parsimonious, if that makes sense to you.

Which page did it say she's in a separate room? ^^;

It does not in CoT, explicitly, but she does share the room at the top of the stairs with Denzel any time 'her room' is talked about.

And well, I still wouldn't get why she didn't always have her own room to start with. :\

Didn't have enough beds yet?
Or maybe she did and slept with Tifa while she adjusted. She was four at the time.
Being overly literal, it never said she didn't have her own room and I can't imagine Barret didn't make her own, just that she slept with Tifa for the first week after they finished the house.

Given what I know about the game, that would be my interpretation of what he was talking about too.

It's either Aerith, Zack, or both.

They didn't keep in touch so what else was she supposed to do? If someone said they're going to try be on the newspaper then I'll look for them in the newspaper. I think Tifa would've been happy to see Cloud in Nibelheim, she just didn't know what to look for. When she found out that Cloud was there to save her, she considered him as being her hero and keeping the promise. I don't think being a famous SOLDIER was the most important thing to her. It was probably more important to Cloud.

Well, let's see, who was it that dropped literally everything to take care of a comatose Cloud, who is it that 'knows him all too well and supports the mentally weak side of him?' Tifa, that's who. Cloud GETTING into SOLDIER was never important, Tifa just believed he would. Even if he doesn't, it's fine, but she still believes he can.


Seriously, though, How the flying fuck is Tifa's promise 'false pretenses' and yet Aerith WHO FALLS FOR A MINDSCREW CLOUD BECAUSE HE REMINDS HER OF HER OLD FLAME not?

 

[Dashell]

Seriously, though, How the flying fuck is Tifa's promise 'false pretenses' and yet Aerith WHO FALLS FOR A MINDSCREW CLOUD BECAUSE HE REMINDS HER OF HER OLD FLAME not?

Because she can see through to Cloud and knows the real him! This is an ability of hers. Quit ignoring Square and twisting quotes

 

[Ryushikaze]

Because she can see through to Cloud and knows the real him! This is an ability of hers. Quit ignoring Square and twisting quotes

Even though all Square says is that she eventually sees through the fucking facade, never that she knew the real fucking Cloud.
And even though square fucking said she saw Zack in Cloud, that she overlaps Cloud and her first love- at least three or four times- and why she acts as she does towards Cloud is explained in FF7, etc. etc. etc.
Yeah, I'm fucking ignoring shit and twisting quotes. Pull the other one. It's got bells on.

And again, that STILL doesn't fucking explain how C and T's promises is false damn pretenses.

 

[Isabella]

Tifa's described as knowing Cloud best and accepting him as he is. Aerith is described as overlapping her feelings for Zack onto Cloud, of behaving the way she does because of Zack.

I feel like I'm in Backwardland. I seriously need to lose the bookmark to this place. For my own peace of mind.

 

[Dashell]

Tifa's ideal man is Zack you guys, seriously... where are you even getting that TIfa loves the real Cloud? He will never be the man Tifa wants him to be.

 

[Tennyo]

People who like to claim that Tifa was really the one who loved the Zack in Cloud don't seem to take into account that fact that Tifa didn't just up and ditch him once she realized it was all a facade.

 

[Dashell]

I did bring that up once, I was told about how the promise scene Tifa just wanted a SOLDIER and only said "IF you become famous" and then told to go to TNC.

 

[Ryushikaze]

I did bring that up once, I was told about how the promise scene Tifa just wanted a SOLDIER and only said "IF you become famous" and then told to go to TNC.

But then she also 'believes in a Cloud who has become excellent'
She believes in Cloud, sticks by him when he's a vegetable, when it's revealed he was never SOLDIER. Knows him all too well and supports the mentally weak side of him.
It's not about Cloud making it or not. That's not vital. She believes he can do it, but it's hardly a necessity for her.

 

[Dashell]

No she believed in the promise, not him.

 

[Ryushikaze]

No she believed in the promise, not him.

Can I just say Picard, Riker, Worf, LaForge, and Benjamin Cisco at that?

 

[Dashell]

YOU can, but I won't let anyone else

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Hey guys, all the promise stuff is just standard issue Pinkers being unable to even shift the goalpost, so they have to fall back on batshit insane things like swapping Aerith and Tifa so Cloti arguments become Clerith ones. Nothing new right?

On a more important note: Cecil and Rosa had a fuckin' kid. Name of Ceodore, I believe? So unless the answer to the age old children's question "where do babies come from?" is very different in the world of FFIV, Cecil got nookie. Rest assured of it.

 

[Isabella]

And Aerith thinks and feels he is a ladies man, that's all that matters.

It's Aeris, not some random person we don't know.

And I take her word over pretty much anything else other people have to say.

Aeris is my BFF! She wouldn't lie to meeeee!

Sorry, but this borders on creepy.

 

[Dashell]

I don't understand why Aerith being jealous of the girl's Zack talks to makes her delusional O_o

 

[Ryushikaze]

Hey guys, all the promise stuff is just standard issue Pinkers being unable to even shift the goalpost, so they have to fall back on batshit insane things like swapping Aerith and Tifa so Cloti arguments become Clerith ones. Nothing new right?

On a more important note: Cecil and Rosa had a fuckin' kid. Name of Ceodore, I believe? So unless the answer to the age old children's question "where do babies come from?" is very different in the world of FFIV, Cecil got nookie. Rest assured of it.

Obviously, EG. My statement is a snarky way of saying 'Look, if Cecil, the only man in Dissidia to marry and have kids, has no mention of said wife, then romance is NOT FUCKING IMPORTANT to Dissidia'

Aeris is my BFF! She wouldn't lie to meeeee!

Sorry, but this borders on creepy.

It's damn creepy, and really swings us right back to the first Church of Materia Jesus territory.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Obviously. And I chose to make what I thought would be a funny extension of your snark. I succeeded in that if no one else laughed, fuck 'em cause I did. But y'know, feel free to be a dick about it

 

[jelly]

On a more important note: Cecil and Rosa had a fuckin' kid. Name of Ceodore, I believe? So unless the answer to the age old children's question "where do babies come from?" is very different in the world of FFIV, Cecil got nookie. Rest assured of it.

I never said Cecil never got any nookie. ><

 

[Dashell]

Obviously. And I chose to make what I thought would be a funny extension of your snark. I succeeded in that if no one else laughed, fuck 'em cause I did. But y'know, feel free to be a dick about it

We can't take you anywhere