Geostigma
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- gabe
Great post. I'm replying on my break from home my thoughts might be disjointed as I try to cook some lunch but I really want to reply while my thoughts are still fresh and not fried by being yelled at at work 
Over all in addition to your thoughts (which I agree with) I also think over all the "support meta" delivers additional issues to Zenyatta directly in a two fold manner.
First : There are to few support champions currently. This affects Zenyatta because it effects his nerf/buff cycle due to the spectrum of the current supports he has to contend with. Currently the diversity pools of the supports while certainly diverse , aren't wide enough to impact them in a meanful QoL way. Where as nerfs make it quite easy to draw a line between which are S tier and which are Niche.
Secondly : Lucio and Mercy are fucking amazing. Over all their purpose in a team composition does everything Zenyatta wants to do but exceedingly better, aside from doing meaningful burst damage. Here's the thing though you have attack heroes who do that better as well.
I'm going to cite the OG invitational that went on this weekend as a talking point how ever I want it noted I acknowledge that the game Pros play is drastically different then the game we play. With that said I still think it brings in meaningful incite for these heroes.
IIRC Zenyatta was only picked once this tournament and for a very specific play and point. He was played on Kings Row attack side by Faze because they NEEDED to cap and get to point to extremely fast in order to win.
You can view the game here at about 29 minutes in
http://www.gosugamers.net/overwatch...6580-faze-ow-vs-northern-gaming-red?vod=54485
The idea was to basically burst down the front line using Discord and if necessary use transcendence to buy time and lock in the point.
And it almost worked if not for the fact that NGR had Lucio and Mercy. And more so that Faze didn't have Mercy.
Mercy basically gives you a mulligan and forces your enemy to ACE you twice, and in the same train of thought Lucios ultimate is a quick reset as well if timed correctly. Having both gives you enough passive heals and reset opportunities to stick onto a point long enough to win.
Zenyattas Ultimate while being really effective just doesn't beat being able to revive an entire team or being able to restore their health and give massive overshields.
His ability to burst the front line doesn't count for anything when Mercy can just ult and in a high damage environment she is guaranteed to get her ult back easily in 20 or so seconds meaning she is ready to go again by the next reset, meanwhile a Zenyatta team is basically dead half way through the fight that occured after her first ult. Assuming they even won it initially as arguably Damaged boosted Pharah can put in more work to an entire back line then a discording a single front liner.
This entire tournament we saw almost universally that all comps had Mercy and Lucio with a tank and flex tank comp. The only matches that had any alterations to the Support meta were the Faze game that fieled the Zenyatta and IIRC Hollywood on Defense we saw Sym used to facilitate covering Point A+ TP's back to point. Other then that Lucio+Mercy was just to great of a combo to forego.
Over all I agree with you Zen needs changes , I think tinkering with his LoS issues is the right direction but over all I do think Lucio and Mercy together are just far to appealing to pass up on.
I do think it would be interesting rather then nerfing Lucio Mercy , that future supports have better Synergy with Zen and Sym instead making for diverse team compositions.
Over all in addition to your thoughts (which I agree with) I also think over all the "support meta" delivers additional issues to Zenyatta directly in a two fold manner.
First : There are to few support champions currently. This affects Zenyatta because it effects his nerf/buff cycle due to the spectrum of the current supports he has to contend with. Currently the diversity pools of the supports while certainly diverse , aren't wide enough to impact them in a meanful QoL way. Where as nerfs make it quite easy to draw a line between which are S tier and which are Niche.
Secondly : Lucio and Mercy are fucking amazing. Over all their purpose in a team composition does everything Zenyatta wants to do but exceedingly better, aside from doing meaningful burst damage. Here's the thing though you have attack heroes who do that better as well.
I'm going to cite the OG invitational that went on this weekend as a talking point how ever I want it noted I acknowledge that the game Pros play is drastically different then the game we play. With that said I still think it brings in meaningful incite for these heroes.
IIRC Zenyatta was only picked once this tournament and for a very specific play and point. He was played on Kings Row attack side by Faze because they NEEDED to cap and get to point to extremely fast in order to win.
You can view the game here at about 29 minutes in
http://www.gosugamers.net/overwatch...6580-faze-ow-vs-northern-gaming-red?vod=54485
The idea was to basically burst down the front line using Discord and if necessary use transcendence to buy time and lock in the point.
And it almost worked if not for the fact that NGR had Lucio and Mercy. And more so that Faze didn't have Mercy.
Mercy basically gives you a mulligan and forces your enemy to ACE you twice, and in the same train of thought Lucios ultimate is a quick reset as well if timed correctly. Having both gives you enough passive heals and reset opportunities to stick onto a point long enough to win.
Zenyattas Ultimate while being really effective just doesn't beat being able to revive an entire team or being able to restore their health and give massive overshields.
His ability to burst the front line doesn't count for anything when Mercy can just ult and in a high damage environment she is guaranteed to get her ult back easily in 20 or so seconds meaning she is ready to go again by the next reset, meanwhile a Zenyatta team is basically dead half way through the fight that occured after her first ult. Assuming they even won it initially as arguably Damaged boosted Pharah can put in more work to an entire back line then a discording a single front liner.
This entire tournament we saw almost universally that all comps had Mercy and Lucio with a tank and flex tank comp. The only matches that had any alterations to the Support meta were the Faze game that fieled the Zenyatta and IIRC Hollywood on Defense we saw Sym used to facilitate covering Point A+ TP's back to point. Other then that Lucio+Mercy was just to great of a combo to forego.
Over all I agree with you Zen needs changes , I think tinkering with his LoS issues is the right direction but over all I do think Lucio and Mercy together are just far to appealing to pass up on.
I do think it would be interesting rather then nerfing Lucio Mercy , that future supports have better Synergy with Zen and Sym instead making for diverse team compositions.
