SPOILERS Predictions for Part 2? (*Open Spoilers for Part 1*)

[LNK]

Here’s what I don’t think will happen: we’ll be seeing other FF characters appear in Remake. I don’t think Sora or Lightning are going to show up. That’s about the only bit of restraint I trust them to have.

Would you be open to maybe Rin or Brother?

 

[LNK]

They may think so, but I don't think they're right.

Although to be fair, most people are not aware of all the interviews the writers have given, nor have they read fan translations of the Japanese exclusive novella that shows a part of the Remake story that's happened after part 1.

So I imagine a lot of people will be surprised when Part 2 doesn't go off the script they expect. And that'll be a surprise by not being surprising.

Oh yeah, I don't think they're right, but I can't blame em.
I hope you're right about it being a surprise by not being surprised. I'd be surprised if that wasn't a surprise by not being surprising. Wait what? Lol sorry. I'm high right now

@Odysseus yes! The theories are crazy lol

 

[Odysseus]

I'll accept no less than the invisible man in FF1 appearing.

Maybe he was there all along?

 

[Roundhouse]

Zack turning up/being used during the North Crater bit is a very interesting idea, Ody...

 

[Odysseus]

Zack turning up/being used during the North Crater bit is a very interesting idea, Ody...

My idea isn't that he'd actually appear there, that would ruin it. I'm thinking more that he shows them a vision of him off doing whatever he's doing.

 

[Roundhouse]

What better kick in the teeth would there be than him being physically there, though? Perhaps Sephiroth timing the revelation for just when Zack catches up with them...

 

[Odysseus]

I guess he'd save everyone from Rufus then? Which would be a good excuse for the party to never get the Highwind so they don't need to figure out how to do an airship lol.

(SARCASM)

 

[Ite]

I hope you're right about it being a surprise by not being surprised. I'd be surprised if that wasn't a surprise by not being surprising.

That’s just what they want you to think! And then BAM! They surprise you with a surprising surprise right as the unsurprising surprise was not surprising.

 

[Makoeyes987]

You know, I honestly don't understand what the point of these zany theories/possibilities even are.

Like, just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should. Everything in a story should have a purpose. A theme. A meaning that's meant to be communicated to the audience.

The reason why Part 1 worked, was because it simultaneously told the story of FFVII in a modern triple AAA game adaption, while doing something new with the concept of a game remake, all while challenging the audience over their expectations, the reasoning for keeping things the same, and showing how the characters would act when confronted with a "remake" type scenario. That's the hook.

However, all of that premise and thematic intention needs the original FFVII plotline to bounce off of. You can't contrast and explore this type of remake with the characters if you simply abandon the entirety of the original story and it's themes, just to inject random noise and chaos as a substitute to what the story is. There's a limit. Furthermore, FFVII-R confronting those themes from the OG with that perspective in mind, seems to be the intention they're going for, so to abandon that entirely by doing just random shit, defeats whole point.

What's communicated by just randomly having Zack show up and completely derailing all of the character growth and progression of Cloud and the others? What's gained from that? What's communicated by that? Other than just using Zack as some blunt tool because he's there, and what are tools for, if not to be used?

There's a clear theme, intent, and purpose to bringing things together and subverting expectations at the right moment. Challenging an audience's expectations. But, in order to do that, you have to give the audience expectations in the first place. You gotta play something straight, in order TO surprise them. If all the Remake is, is pouring all FFVII "ingredients" into a blender and hitting "puree", what is the audience going to take from that?

Episode Intermission, the longest love letter to the Compilation, had a set path and restraints to using elements from the Compilation. It fit. It told a story and communicated something. And it wrapped around to the next arc of the FFVII story. If they're going to carefully craft and subvert expectations there, while also keeping things coherent and not just chaotic.. I'm pretty positive they see the reason to keep things in check, and not just commit to authorial chaos.

 

[Roundhouse]

All my joking aside, I think that they are going to keep to the core of VII, while changing things up along the way, yeah. I think the idea of Zack showing up at the Northern Crater is a good one though, because it doesn't derail Cloud at all -- I just remembered that Cloud basically goes completely missing for a while, then is found in a comatose state for another patch of time. Meanwhile, the other characters take over the missions....what a perfect chance to use Zack in a big way. When Cloud eventually returns, his old identity is restored anyway.

 

[null]

My idea isn't that he'd actually appear there, that would ruin it. I'm thinking more that he shows them a vision of him off doing whatever he's doing.

I think Laguna-style crossovers would be pretty cool. The party goes unconscious at various points for... reasons and we get to play as Zack and his posse for a while.

 

[Tetsujin]

We desperately need Part two lol. These theories are getting nuts.

It's why I've enjoyed watching playthroughs from people with no prior FFVII experience. No galaxy brain stuff, just fresh perspectives and more grounded speculation.
Kinda helps you anchor your views of certain scenes when you turn off your veteran fan brain and see how it's supposed to read to a complete newbie.

Like the scene with Zack returning to Aerith's church after Intermission.
To a newcomer it reads as it happening in the present and him having just arrived there, with him saying Aerith's name all dramatic-like being the reveal and confirmation that he is indeed the former boyfriend Aerith talked about earlier in the game. It's a purpose this scene serves that I didn't even pick up on because obviously as a longtime fan I just take knowledge of who Zack is for granted. For someone with no knowledge of FFVII, this plays like a minor reveal.

Which in turn helps me see another reason why Zack's Cloud is not shown in the scene - as a newbie you'd still understand that the scene with Zack carrying Cloud towards Midgar has to take place in the past. So if you show Zack arriving at the church with Cloud in tow...it would probably just read like another flashback instead. So they likely do want you to think that this takes place in the here and now.

Eitherway, it's fun seeing those perspectives.
Newbies: Grounded and more sensible takes, but lack context to understand the craziness that actually does lie underneath it all
Veterans: Have all the context, but are likely to come up with galaxy brain theories that might miss the forest for the trees

The truth is probably somewhere in between so I like to keep both in mind

 

[Roundhouse]

Great gif...my fav scene from that film.

 

[Roundhouse]

Someone on resetera is playing og ff7 for the first time and doesn't like Aerith because they say she is too 'submissive' and boring...........and people are assuring them that remakeaerith is improved.

What.....how can you possibly misinterpret the og characterisation like that?? I'm baffled.

 

[ForceStealer]

All my joking aside, I think that they are going to keep to the core of VII, while changing things up along the way, yeah. I think the idea of Zack showing up at the Northern Crater is a good one though, because it doesn't derail Cloud at all -- I just remembered that Cloud basically goes completely missing for a while, then is found in a comatose state for another patch of time. Meanwhile, the other characters take over the missions....what a perfect chance to use Zack in a big way. When Cloud eventually returns, his old identity is restored anyway.

By what? Instead of giving Tifa and Cid a chance to lead the party while questioning Cloud's true nature we just sub out Cloud with his copy-paste duplicate?

This is what I mean, almost every scenario I can think of where Zack becomes involved in the main story is not additive, but subtractive. A Zack fanboy/girl's fanfic.

The only thing that sounds good to me is periodic, playable cutaways to an alternate, "what if...?" scenario where we see how things might have gone had Zack and Cloud arrived in Midgar together. That would be pretty fun, imo, but there's no way that's all they're gonna do, lol.

Enjoyable story meaning…the story we already know we like?

Yes. The one you might expect to encounter in a remake. Funny, that.

 

[KindOfBlue]

Yes. The one you might expect to encounter in a remake. Funny, that.

So in other words, the story that the devs still intend to tell and have consistently said they’d be respectful to? Just seems odd to me to automatically dismiss the prospect of Zack being involved as “subtractive” when the story hasn’t even been told yet

 

[cold_spirit]

By what? Instead of giving Tifa and Cid a chance to lead the party while questioning Cloud's true nature we just sub out Cloud with his copy-paste duplicate?

To be fair, Cid is literally sleeping when he's nominated to be the party's leader. And when he is leader, nothing significant happens to him character development-wise. As for Tifa, she's party leader for such a brief time that it's more of a footnote.

With Zack being the leader, there’s a bit of potential to show how necessary Cloud is to the group dynamic. I would have it so that the party becomes dysfunctional under Zack’s guidance. This would highlight the balance Cloud brings. Zack is a stereotypical hero, but his charisma isn’t what this party needs. It needs Cloud's calmness, his carefulness. Only he can bring everyone together. I think that would bring a newfound appreciation to both characters.

Though I'm expecting the story to go off the rails by that point so this is kinda a moot point for me.

 

[Odysseus]

hasn’t even been told yet

This is why I kind of came to hate speculation. All of you are getting your hopes up about things that could happen, or alternatively being giant pessimistic doomers about everything.

We have barely any context for anything, we don't understand what could change, what could stay the same, what the goal of the project is, etc. Arguing with what we "know" is a moot point when new elements none of you even know to think about could be introduced and change everything. It's pointless.

Look at what's happening here: we're discussing the merits of Zack taking over as party lead in after Cloud leaves, when the very nature of Zack in the story is still basically unknown. The amount of assumptions happening here is silly.

The clearest, most beaten-over-the-head thing about Zack is that he exists in another world. The goddamn chip bad, the fact he has his own Buster Sword, and his own CLOUD for that matter, all point to this, along with the not-so-subtle commentary from the Ultimania about him. So what's gonna happen? Is he gonna jump world-lines via some additional bullshit? Has he already done that via the whispers dying and merging timelines or something dumb like that? What cause does he have to follow in the footsteps of the party? Nobody knew where they were going, after all. How do you reconcile the fact that there are TWO CLOUDS?? You don't. Nobody talks about that because it is inconvenient for the story they concoct in their heads.

Obviously, obviously he has to end up getting involved somehow. That's a given. But it is way, waaaay too early in the game to make any real assumptions about how that will be. You don't know, I don't know, only Square knows. I feel like everyone is just stressing out about hypotheticals right now, and I know damned well that only end in tragedy.

Square knows how people feel about this. Even my normie, non-obsessed friends have shown a lot of apprehension about Zack being alive and joining the party, and Aerith living for that matter. You know why? Because FF7 stops being FF7 at that point. It becomes something else then. I know Square knows this, and I am choosing, perhaps foolishly, to believe that they aren't stupid enough to go ahead and break everything anyway. I know that's already happened for some people, like Ite and Shademp, but I still think everything can work out in a satisfying way. I'd be lying if I said the discussion of how they could be a bunch of blithering idiots and ruin everything isn't a source of stress for me though, because I don't have THAT much faith in them.

Part 2 is when things basically have to become clearer, and observing how Zack is used there will probably make speculating about his larger role far easier than the two scenes we have with him now. Until I see where things go for myself, I've chosen simply not to think too hard about it, because all that results from that is what's happening here. Bleh.

 

[Roundhouse]

I just want to add that Marle is definitely Future Marlene.

 

[Odysseus]

I just want to add that Marle is definitely Future Marlene.

Well, obviously

 

[Roundhouse]

[Thanks for this perfect reaction image, Cold.]

 

[Makoeyes987]

This is why I kind of came to hate speculation lol. All of you are getting your hopes up about things that could happen, or alternatively being giant pessimistic doomers about everything.

To clarify I am neither getting my hopes up to any significant degree nor am I pessimistic over anything about the Remake. I'm comfortably chill and excited.

I think speculation is a natural function of any serialized or sequential work. It's not inherently bad or anything, and mirrors the attitudes of the one doing the speculating.

Look at what's happening here: we're discussing the merits of Zack taking over as party lead in after Cloud leaves, when the very nature of Zack's very nature in the story is still basically unknown. The amount of assumptions happening here is silly.

 

[cold_spirit]

I feel like everyone is just stressing out about hypotheticals right now, and I know damned well that only end in tragedy.

... I know Square knows this, and I am choosing, perhaps foolishly, to believe that they aren't stupid enough to go ahead and break everything anyway. I know that's already happened for some people, like Ite and Shademp, but I still think everything can work out in a satisfying way.

Does it always have to be one or the other? Either a disappointed theorist or disillusioned fan? Whenever I approach these conversations I genuinely try to give meaningful comments. When Part 2 releases, I will set aside my speculation and listen to the story the creator's want to tell. We don't have to put ourselves in "camps". There is a third option where we balance criticism and open-mindedness.

 

[Odysseus]

Thanks for making me notice I typed "the very nature" twice in a row lol. My dang cat distracted me.

I think speculation is a natural function of any serialized or sequential work. It's not inherently bad or anything, and mirrors the attitudes of the one doing the speculating.

On the surface it is innocent enough, and I agree it's pretty natural, but the insidious side of things is the biases people form along the way. The Attack on Titan fandom is what really put me off to it, but even here I feel like people's already negative feelings will be magnified by other people's increasingly ridiculous galaxy-brained takes. In the long run it creates a more hostile environment, as people who already had low opinions of what Square is doing will just assume worse with time, and what should be a fun way to pass the time becomes something pretty dour and stressful.

We don't have to put ourselves in "camps".

We don't have to, but people will. In my experience, anyway. Maybe not here, but elsewhere.

 

[Roundhouse]

I see no harm in theorising....as long as it's in good faith and people are respectful to one another. (Admittedly I mainly post tongue in cheek/jokey stuff, but I'll try to be more serious.)