Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
Continuing on from this front page post
And you haven't answered the facts I have presented to you from in AND out of the the original game.
It's also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making, hence bringing it up was irrelevant to arguing against my points, hence you attacked a strawman.
Ah, I see we're in the blatant Ad Hominem stage of debate. Right on schedule.
On the contrary, she liked Cloud DESPITE not knowing who he was, which is why she wanted to get to meet the real him, instead of just thinking of him in terms of Zack once more, as she admits to doing on that same date sequence.
It wasn't. Nibelheim? Aerith was a major reason why everyone else wanted to go after Sephiroth, and while certainly no small reason, it was an ADDITIONAL reason for Cloud and Tifa to want to hunt him down.
KH2 doesn't, and it turns out KH doesn't either. Itadaki Street Special doesn't.
Even FFT doesn't focus on this. Cloud's more concerned about finding Buster than Aerith (who he just happens to run into) which is actually a more retread theme (The importance of a sword as a symbol of people, hopes and dreams)
But this is a disingenuous point, because it ignores a couple things
1. Aerith was just as important to Tifa, Marlene, Barett, Yuffie, even Cid.
2. Cloud's culpability in the matter. 'I nearly killed you' is pretty hard to get over.
3. Cloud would have felt much the same about the situation had Yuffie been up there. Zack's death likewise haunts Cloud 2 years after the events of FF7.
How is it putting it too strongly? And why does it suddenly not count, even though he reaffirms these feelings and confirms them with Tifa at the end of the game?
How was 'Tifa not there in a way Aerith was.' Please elaborate, as this makes no sense.
But that's not what Cloud's line at the end of FF7 means. Cloud and Tifa are basically comisserating in 'Hey, if we die, at least we can go meet our fallen friend Aerith again.'
What's sad, dear child, is your ignorance of named fallacies, including what is apparently your favorite.
The strawman fallacy, child, is to attack an argument different than the one your opponent presented and treating that as their argument. Whether by intent or by careless reading, you have repeatedly misrepresented my statements here to you. Those distortions you are addressing instead of my arguments are the strawmen.
Now then, I can quite easily support an argument using only the original game as evidence. I see absolutely no reason to do so, however, when you will not.
What's amusing, here, however, is the inadvertant nostalgia you're giving me. Not a one of your arguments contain arguments that Cloud romantically loves Aerith. You've given a few arguments that Aerith loves Cloud, but this is not in contention nor is it relevant.
In your bruhaha with Vendel, you're asserting that something that calls Cloud an actual Ex-SOLDIER is a more authoritative source than the rest of the compilation, including the various official sourcebooks released by Square themselves.
Also, kid, if you want to try and throw someone's words back in their face, make sure you're using them correctly. Calling this exchange a 'strawman game' doesn't wound me, it reads more as a tacit admission that you have been misrepresenting my points.
Eidolon Sniper said:
And you haven't answered the facts I have presented to you from in AND out of the the original game.
It's also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making, hence bringing it up was irrelevant to arguing against my points, hence you attacked a strawman.
Ah, I see we're in the blatant Ad Hominem stage of debate. Right on schedule.
On the contrary, she liked Cloud DESPITE not knowing who he was, which is why she wanted to get to meet the real him, instead of just thinking of him in terms of Zack once more, as she admits to doing on that same date sequence.
It wasn't. Nibelheim? Aerith was a major reason why everyone else wanted to go after Sephiroth, and while certainly no small reason, it was an ADDITIONAL reason for Cloud and Tifa to want to hunt him down.
KH2 doesn't, and it turns out KH doesn't either. Itadaki Street Special doesn't.
Even FFT doesn't focus on this. Cloud's more concerned about finding Buster than Aerith (who he just happens to run into) which is actually a more retread theme (The importance of a sword as a symbol of people, hopes and dreams)
But this is a disingenuous point, because it ignores a couple things
1. Aerith was just as important to Tifa, Marlene, Barett, Yuffie, even Cid.
2. Cloud's culpability in the matter. 'I nearly killed you' is pretty hard to get over.
3. Cloud would have felt much the same about the situation had Yuffie been up there. Zack's death likewise haunts Cloud 2 years after the events of FF7.
How is it putting it too strongly? And why does it suddenly not count, even though he reaffirms these feelings and confirms them with Tifa at the end of the game?
How was 'Tifa not there in a way Aerith was.' Please elaborate, as this makes no sense.
But that's not what Cloud's line at the end of FF7 means. Cloud and Tifa are basically comisserating in 'Hey, if we die, at least we can go meet our fallen friend Aerith again.'
What's sad, dear child, is your ignorance of named fallacies, including what is apparently your favorite.
The strawman fallacy, child, is to attack an argument different than the one your opponent presented and treating that as their argument. Whether by intent or by careless reading, you have repeatedly misrepresented my statements here to you. Those distortions you are addressing instead of my arguments are the strawmen.
Now then, I can quite easily support an argument using only the original game as evidence. I see absolutely no reason to do so, however, when you will not.
What's amusing, here, however, is the inadvertant nostalgia you're giving me. Not a one of your arguments contain arguments that Cloud romantically loves Aerith. You've given a few arguments that Aerith loves Cloud, but this is not in contention nor is it relevant.
In your bruhaha with Vendel, you're asserting that something that calls Cloud an actual Ex-SOLDIER is a more authoritative source than the rest of the compilation, including the various official sourcebooks released by Square themselves.
Also, kid, if you want to try and throw someone's words back in their face, make sure you're using them correctly. Calling this exchange a 'strawman game' doesn't wound me, it reads more as a tacit admission that you have been misrepresenting my points.
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