The Final Fantasy VII LTD Thread (Round 4)

[Ryushikaze]

I maintain the funeral scene was shown with romantic overtones. There's tons of ways to convey platonic grief and that was one of the lousiest if that was the point. (On the other hand, this the same team responsible for the AV system, so who knows.)

On the other hand, about the only way it could get more romantic was with a goodbye kiss.

Also, Tifa loved Fake Cloud all the same, so what gives.

Like I said, it's a giant ass can of worms, and more has to do with the conflation of Zack and Cloud than how well she knew Chocobutt.

Other sources say that Aerith understood Cloud's character because she has a knack for sensing these things in people. So... if sources say she saw beyond his facade, and sources say she loved him... maybe we could put two and two together?

Which source do you refer to? I recall sources saying things that she had Glimpsed beyond the facade, but never got to know the real Cloud before her demise.

Anyways Quex, I'm interested in the quotes from Dismantled. I (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) always felt a little alienated by the Compilation (wtf SE y u do this), and reading about the original game scenarios and such is interesting to me.

also, on the subject of Zack and Aerith's intimacy, could they have been talking about whether or not they fucked? I MEAN IT SEEMS RIDICULOUS but that's a common interpretation of "they weren't intimate" in English.

When Quex showed me that line, my response was 'Aww, Zack and Aerith died virgins. Probably. That's sad for them.'

although to be honest, I felt like the whole "zack is a nice dude and loved aerith" thing was kinda retconned. when I first played the game/read old info Zack was always made out to be a ladies' man.

Well, We got a lot of fragmentary information about Zack in the old game and old info, and taken as a whole, it does paint a contradictory picture, but again, I think this is a bit deliberate. The clearest picture we ever see of Zack is Cloud's recollection of him in the truck, where he does come across as a pretty nice dude, and considers living with a girl whose mom doesn't like him very much. With narrative Parsimony, that's very likely (and now confirmed) to be Aerith.

So Zack being a Lady's man doesn't preclude him actually loving Aerith.

 

[Tifabelle]

Romanticized means "to make romantic"

Not necessarily. Romanticize means to make something more dramatic as to invoke strong emotions (not necessarily romantic ones) and sensations. It takes something rational and makes it slightly more irrational. Hence why Cloud is standing in a seemingly bottomless lake. It's for effect.

when I first played the game/read old info Zack was always made out to be a ladies' man.

Because Aerith rationalizes that he may have found someone else after meeting his parents? Because Aerith calls him a ladies man in Maiden? Because Zack didn't want to go to her because she lived with her mom?

I'm not denying Zack is a ladies' man, but the original game left little impression of Zack at all.

 

[OneWingedDemon]

Romanticized means "to make romantic"

I think she is referring to romantic in terms of style and excess of the sentimental, not in the hawt loving sense. Romanticizing war, for instance, because that's the first quote that popped into me head.

 

[Winter]

Which source do you refer to? I recall sources saying things that she had Glimpsed beyond the facade, but never got to know the real Cloud before her demise.

aw hell, I haven't looked up a quote in ages, I really haven't. Considering how much I debate that's probably extremely lazy of me.

do we have like... a quote database... or... something

When Quex showed me that line, my response was 'Aww, Zack and Aerith died virgins. Probably. That's sad for them.'

hahaha me too.

Because Aerith rationalizes that he may have found someone else after meeting his parents? Because Aerith calls him a ladies man in Maiden? Because Zack didn't want to go to her because she lived with her mom?

I'm not denying Zack is a ladies' man, but the original game left little impression of Zack at all.

that's why I said played the game/read old info. But it is true, the original game doesn't say much about him at all. It seemed to be sort of a common fandom assumption or something along those lines.

 

[ForceStealer]

Considering her archetypes of pure girl/savior, I wouldn't be surprised if she was. She was 17 when she was with Zack, right? That's not super young or anything, but its also not unheard of to be a virgin at that age.

As for Zack, I dunno about that. If he were really a ladies man, then, well...

 

[Winter]

Considering her archetypes of pure girl/savior, I wouldn't be surprised if she was.

Yeah, but Aerith's been described as mischievous too, and she's a hell of a flirt. She played the role of a prostitute pretty damn well (lol 100 gil for a flower)

I'd like to think she lost it at some point before she died.

actually, given that Zack was in a test tube for so long (how old IS Zack, anyways?) even if he was a ladies' man he could possibly have been the one to die a virgin, ahaha.

 

[Tifabelle]

aw hell, I haven't looked up a quote in ages, I really haven't. Considering how much I debate that's probably extremely lazy of me.

Ditto

It seemed to be sort of a common fandom assumption or something along those lines.

It is. He was like that in CC, but when did Maiden come out? That must be where it came from.

 

[ForceStealer]

Zack is two years older than Cloud, I wanna say. So he was 23 when he died, but yes, he lost 4 years in a test tube, with a fifth on the run (18 during the Nibelheim incident).

 

[OneWingedDemon]

I maintain the funeral scene was shown with romantic overtones....On the other hand, about the only way it could get more romantic was with a goodbye kiss.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcHhlcxUkP4&feature=related

gets me every time.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Considering her archetypes of pure girl/savior, I wouldn't be surprised if she was. She was 17 when she was with Zack, right? That's not super young or anything, but its also not unheard of to be a virgin at that age.

15-17, yes.

As for Zack, I dunno about that. If he were really a ladies man, then, well...

Well, he didn't die a Virgin, technically, but the less said about Hojo the better.

Yeah, but Aerith's been described as mischievous too, and she's a hell of a flirt. She played the role of a prostitute pretty damn well (lol 100 gil for a flower)

I'd like to think she lost it at some point before she died.

Oh, so YOU'RE the one making the prostitute jokes.

actually, given that Zack was in a test tube for so long (how old IS Zack, anyways?) even if he was a ladies' man he could possibly have been the one to die a virgin, ahaha.

Zack is a year older than Aerith. He has been listed as being born in 84 and 85, but is consistently listed as a year older than Aerith- who was born in 85 in all instances.

Oh, and Maiden came out in 2005, attached to the end of the Ultimania Omega. It's actually AFTER the index, and I do not think included in it. I'll have to check that.

 

[null]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcHhlcxUkP4&feature=related

gets me every time.

Great comeback.

But come on, there's enough bromantic tension in that movie to carry a season of Six Feet Under.

 

[ForceStealer]

I considered making a joke about Zack and Hojo, but decided against it. Leave it to Ryu

 

[Madame Mayor]

Which source do you refer to? I recall sources saying things that she had Glimpsed beyond the facade, but never got to know the real Cloud before her demise.

Ya, it's knowing Cloud is not the real Cloud, not knowing the real Cloud. Which is basically what we get from her date.

"I've been chasing you around cause you remind me of my ex but I think I'm finally ready to move on. I know there's something funny about you, and I want to figure out what it is."

 

[null]

Maiden came out in 2005, attached to the end of the Ultimania Omega.

Maiden came out in 2005

Maiden came out

Maiden

Maiden

Why

WHY will this unholy non-canon word not curse itself out of existence

 

[Tifabelle]

Why

WHY will this unholy non-canon word not curse itself out of existence

LOL. We were speculating where the conception of Zack being a ladies man came from.

 

[Winter]

haters gonna hate

 

[null]

LOL. We were speculating where the conception of Zack being a ladies man came from.

Oh. It's from the original game. Aerith talks about Zack when they reach Gongaga.

haters gonna hate

I think hate might be too mild of a word.

 

[Tifabelle]

Oh. It's from the original game. Aerith talks about Zack when they reach Gongaga.

I just checked the script because I don't remember that. But you are correct sir. She does say this:

"He loved women, a real lady's man. He probably found someone else..."

Although she could be rationalizing, but that's where fan perception came from.

 

[Winter]

tbh, given the blunt sort of person Aerith was I never took her to be the type to lie to herself.

I stand by the belief that SE has crappy writers, not that Aerith was an idiot.

I mean really, denial is fine. Like 4 years of it is fucking over-the-top. She would not be that hung up over that shit 5 years later.

HEY, THIS IS NOT A PERSONAL INSULT TO YOUR PERSONAL DENIAL

jfc get over yourself people

 

[Celes Chere]

hand reaching

Code for: Closet Zack x Angeal fans!

with him hitting on Cissnei

Lol is it just me, or am I the only one that saw Zack being sort of stand-offish towards Cissnei? I cannot recall him hitting on Cissnei much at all, except maybe their first meeting before he even knew Aerith. And even then, that was barely hinted. Cissnei is the one that hits on Zack imo, and Zack does not acknowledge it. It's proven even moreso on the beach, when Cissnei goes "Aerith, again?" and he's all "CISSNEI, Y U NO GET YOUR OWN LIFE?" Then goes on to say that Aerith is one of a kind. Doesn't sound like he's thinking much of other women.

And I don't think Ladies Man = Playboy automatically. =| I mean, there is info on Zack complimenting a female TURK member, and the receptionist like Force said, but there's a difference between calling a girl pretty and actually having a thing for them. xP

 

[Winter]

he just knew that Cissnei was a lesbian, and accepted her life decisions.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Why

WHY will this unholy non-canon word not curse itself out of existence

Someone asked when it came out. I answered. I don't think it's part of continuity any more than you do. It can't be, anymore.

Not unless we're playing 'Unreliable Aerith' straight to the HILT.

 

[Madame Mayor]

tbh, given the blunt sort of person Aerith was I never took her to be the type to lie to herself.

I stand by the belief that SE has crappy writers, not that Aerith was an idiot.

Wait being in denial means you're an idiot?

 

[Winter]

oh come on, the "aerith is in serious denial and is making excuses" theory reeks of bullshit, not only because it's vastly out of character for her, but also because her "denial" spans so much of the compilation that it stops making SENSE.

I've never bought it. Do I need to copy and paste old posts of mine? BECAUSE I WILL

lazy

 

[Ryushikaze]

tbh, given the blunt sort of person Aerith was I never took her to be the type to lie to herself.

Not CONSCIOUSLY, no. But in the game she really does come to the realization that she has been doing just that.

I stand by the belief that SE has crappy writers, not that Aerith was an idiot.

You don't have to be an idiot to lie to yourself subconsciously.

Lol is it just me, or am I the only one that saw Zack being sort of stand-offish towards Cissnei? I cannot recall him hitting on Cissnei much at all, except maybe their first meeting before he even knew Aerith. And even then, that was barely hinted. Cissnei is the one that hits on Zack imo, and Zack does not acknowledge it. It's proven even moreso on the beach, when Cissnei goes "Aerith, again?" and he's all "CISSNEI, Y U NO GET YOUR OWN LIFE?" Then goes on to say that Aerith is one of a kind. Doesn't sound like he's thinking much of other women.

Zack was standoffish towards Cissnei and she was never even considered a potential love interest by the crew.

And I don't think Ladies Man = Playboy automatically. =| I mean, there is info on Zack complimenting a female TURK member, and the receptionist like Force said, but there's a difference between calling a girl pretty and actually having a thing for them. xP

Zack's a flirty guy, but that doesn't make him a sleaze.