The First Epic LTD of TLS forums

[Dashell]

All right I guess me and Rob are a couple and we don't share a bed. I didn't see that you were getting at that Cloud didn't want to wake Tifa up. For some reason that didn't cross my mind thus it did not compute. But I just wanted to point out one more thing, don't hate me though. IF they didn't share a bed, just because she asked him if he loves her while he was sleeping one night doesn't mean she watches him every night.

Don't worry I like your posts and ideas and what not. I just wish Square would be more direct with this stuff. I mean would a kiss be so much to ask? SOMETHING? I don't see why they're so indirect.

 

[Vendel]

I have to say, I've been reading and approving (do you feel thankful, punk? well, do you?) your recent approach to some of the recent debate, and it's an angle that few who don't agree never consider - that the logic of the story can be discovered without the need for vasts amount of quotes from either side.

Go on.....

If one sits and looks at a scene, the first thing they need to do is decide on the possibilities then assess which possibilities carry plausibility in themselves and the greater whole. As has been said many times (Bella in particularly springs to mind on this one), the "other" perspective greatly stands on foundations built on singular moments that are viewed from a narrow perspective. Single events and narrow perspective are poor bedfellows, as they tend to merge to a point where one loses touch with simple common sense; one becomes so embroiled in what one wants to believe they lose the simple foundations found in human behaviour itself.

Indeed.

And this is where this post gets its props - it doesn't look to counter evidence, merely to unravel the common sense. And I think offering two simple angles on the same scene from a simple character perspective is a very good way of doing this. If the characters are not romantically involved - what does this say about the character? What does that reduce her emotions to becoming?

*nods*

The most obvious one is a point I've seen Ryu and Null make time and time again (and I must confess to having made it a few times myself) - once we take away "game time" in FF7 and study the timeline, what makes most sense to Cloud's actions?
*snip*
Now - which one of those is the most likely? Did the storytellers want any of the heroes - Cloud, Aeris or Tifa to be wankers?

#3

All right I guess me and Rob are a couple and we don't share a bed. I didn't see that you were getting at that Cloud didn't want to wake Tifa up. For some reason that didn't cross my mind thus it did not compute.

I'm not denying it's Clouds bed. Or that he used to sleep in it. All I am saying is that sometime in the 2 years in CoT they start sharing a bed. And Cloud keeps a bed in his empty, dingy, run down looking office as a place to crash for WHATEVER reason.

But I just wanted to point out one more thing, don't hate me though. IF they didn't share a bed, just because she asked him if he loves her while he was sleeping one night doesn't mean she watches him every night.

See my post on the last page for what I think of that scene.

Don't worry I like your posts and ideas and what not.

As do I.

___

 

[Dashell]

Go on.....

Vendel rocks

Also in all honesty, in CoT I imagined them sharing a room but not necessarily a bed. But that might stem from my lack of being able to ever share a bed with anyone.

And just to prove I'm pro Cloti. I got the Sims 3 yesterday, and this was one of the first families I made. It's supposed to be Cloud and Tifa but there's... no custom content yet so I had to make due:

See my post on the last page for what I think of that scene.

I did and I loled, but my point was she might have just gone into his room one night. Maybe she was getting even for all the times he caught him watching her sleep...because it's Tifa and who WOULDN'T do that?

 

[Vendel]

Vendel rocks

No need to stop there.

Also in all honesty, in CoT I imagined them sharing a room but not necessarily a bed. But that might stem from my lack of being able to ever share a bed with anyone.

They share a room at the very least.

And just to prove I'm pro Cloti. I got the Sims 3 yesterday, and this was one of the first families I made. It's supposed to be Cloud and Tifa but there's... no custom content yet so I had to make due:

Well the noises at the beginning made me wonder who was eating what......

I did and I loled, but my point was she might have just gone into his room one night. Maybe she was getting even for all the times he caught him watching her sleep...because it's Tifa and who WOULDN'T do that?

Humor aside. The scene is very very creepy and pathetic if she is hovering over him in his room. I don't care if it's for 10 min.

 

[Dashell]

Humor aside. The scene is very very creepy and pathetic if she is hovering over him in his room. I don't care if it's for 10 min.

I dunno... Rob came in here one morning singing Christmas songs... my god that was weird... anyway, bed time.

 

[Vendel]

I dunno... Rob came in here one morning singing Christmas songs... my god that was weird... anyway, bed time.

Was Rob just standing over your bed staring at you until you went to sleep again?

 

[Dashell]

No things were odd enough as is... also it says that in CoT (That she watched him go back to sleep)? I missed that I guess... yeah definitely at least in the same room.
... k now go back to your Tifa sig plz.

 

[Vendel]

No things were odd enough as is... also it says that in CoT (That she watched him go back to sleep)? I missed that I guess...

Uh...Cloud goes back to sleep and she talks to him some more.

Cloud closed his eyes.

“Let’s work hard together.”

Tifa waited for his answer, though she couldn’t hear it even if she waited until the morning.

So yeah....stalkerish.....

... k now go back to your Tifa sig plz.

Herc would not approve of that.

 

[Dashell]

Uh...Cloud goes back to sleep and she ask him another question.

Oh yeah if he loved Marlene... poor Cloud can't get any sleep
...MUAHAHAHA..

Herc would not approve of that.

Your MOM wouldn't approve of that... wait

god.. fuck it's 6 AM and I'm not tired thanks to you guys... I hope you're happy.

 

[Vendel]

god.. fuck it's 6 AM and I'm not tired thanks to you guys... I hope you're happy.

"No Mr. Bond. I expect you to die."

 

[Raquelborn]

Okay, FINE. Cloud and Tifa having sex under the highwind is basically what happened because whoever mentioned making out, ..well if they made out (which is probable) they might as well of had sex. I guess it's because I wasn't feeling the whole ~they're probably going to die~ thing during that scene when I played the game that I just didn't get the impression that it was a climax (hahaha pun intended) to anything sexual to seal feelings etc.

Either way, assuming they did have sex it makes the whole becoming awkward and having "silly conversations" during CoT even more depressing. I know that was due to Cloud having guilt/geostigma and not their sex life or whatever, but still, it makes me feel worse for Tifa. IMO.

No I quoted the line perfectly. My examples were just that. Examples.

Actually your addition of "now" at the beginning of the sentence changes how it could be read. But nvm.

So Tifa walks into Clouds room. Makes sure that he is asleep. And begins talking to him. Then when Cloud wakes up she just continues talking to him? Then Cloud falls asleep with her still hovering there?

Lol. That's exactly how I took it when I read it both the first and second time. No joke.

I just wish Square would be more direct with this stuff. I mean would a kiss be so much to ask? SOMETHING? I don't see why they're so indirect.

QFT. Even stroking her face in the church scene like he did in the reactor would of been suffice for me. Ah well...

Just something little by the way, but the only bedroom/bed we never get to see or have a mention of is Tifa's. If Cloud and Tifa do sleep together it blatently isn't in that "shitty bed". Out of pure fanness I would have liked to of seen her room.

Also I can't find where it has ever said that the room the cot is in is referred to as an office. Anyone? Although the desk is referred to as Cloud's by Marlene in ACC, that isn't enough to assume the room is a full on office or that it's his personal bedroom.

Ps. I'd also like to say that the entire room is shitty, not just the bed. Which is why I wouldn't be suprised it it did turn out to be Cloud's bedroom afterall.

 

[Edley]

I think it's kind of immaterial whether they were sleeping together between VII and AC. The question is do you really think they're not together after AC?

 

[I Am Not Me]

This just in:

New Clerith proofz found by yours truly!

What, only Aerith mentioned in Cloud's character profile? In Squall's, Zidane's, and Tidus' profiles, only the names of their love interests are mentioned (Rinoa, Garnet, and Yuna). Could it be that Clerith is ttly thar in Dissidia?!

Can we say CANONZ?



*playing rapid for Monkeyshines*

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

What, only Aerith mentioned in Cloud's character profile? In Squall's, Zidane's, and Tidus' profiles, only the names of their love interests are mentioned (Rinoa, Garnet, and Yuna). Could it be that Clerith is ttly thar in Dissidia?!

Can we say CANONZ?



*playing rapid for Monkeyshines*

Which is why they mentioned Rosa in Cecil's profile, amirite?

The person who impacted their journey is mentioned. In 8, it happens to be Rinoa, 9, Garnet, 10, it's Yuna. But in other games, the love interest did not create the most impact in-game, and thus aren't mentioned.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

I must ask, exactly where did this belief that Cloud and Tifa shared a bed come from?

Logically, Tifa has to have her own room separate from Cloud's, the bed we seen in Cloud's room isn't big enough for two people. Yes, she could have a bed large enough for two people in her own room, but then, why would Cloud continue to have his own room and his own bed if he was sleeping in Tifa's room?

 

[Ⓐaron]

'Cause leaving it there's less work than getting rid of it? Plus it gives him a place to crash if they have a fight/he's up late working and doesn't want to wake her up.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

Fair enough, but that's only half the answer I was looking for. Where does the belief come from that the two of them share a bed?

 

[Ⓐaron]

Vendel summed it up here.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

So, they have to be sharing a bed because Tifa asked Cloud if he loved her?

 

[Ⓐaron]

you're ignoring the context of the line.

Granted, they might not be sharing the same bed, they might only be sharing the same room. But either way.

See also here.

 

[lunar_crimson]

I cba to read every post atm so pardon I may have to be curt.. but I gather the topic is about Cloud's office/room/clot/bed and whether or not he shares a bedroom with Tifa…

Quotes from CoT:

During their holiday, Tifa and Marlene were cleaning the room that was now Cloud’s office.

So according to some, this office was supposed to be Cloud's bedroom before it became his office. But instead of calling it Cloud’s bedroom that is also now his office, it is referred to as THE room that is NOW Cloud’s office.

Could it be it was a spare room before it became Cloud’s office and y’know, just maybe, Cloud and Tifa were and still are sharing the same bedroom.

After kissing the sleeping children on the face she went into Cloud’s office. She brushed away the dust on the family photo they had taken and then tried calling him.

Cloud’s office referred to as his office. Simple.

“Shall I join you?” There was something she wanted to talk to him about.
“I want to drink alone.”
Hearing that, Tifa lost control and said, “Then drink in your room.”

Notice the office is never, EVER, referred to as Cloud’s bedroom. And his office is HIS ROOM, y’know?

Also, I can’t speak for others, but a scenario like this isn’t uncommon. I interpreted this as Tifa hinting to Cloud that he could just drink in HIS room with the cold cot, because he wasn’t going to sleep in THEIR bedroom tonight. The emphasis is on HIS room. And just to emphasize again: 1) This is the ONLY time Cloud’s office is referred to as his room 2) Never is his office referred to as his bedroom 3) In case some people dunno, Cloud’s office alone, is his room.

And considering Cloud said “I want to drink ALONE,” I think it’s fairly understandable that Tifa’s reaction is only a natural response from a woman who feels her hubby is taking her for granted. So yeah, he could just drink/sleep in HIS room if he really wants to be alone.

...

I think somee of the things that go on between Cloud and Tifa are very subtle, but if you pay attention I think it's fairly reasonable to assume Cloud and Tifa do indeed share a bedroom.

I feel the need to further illustrate the point in my last post. The infamous Cloud sleeping "do you love me" scene.

So here we have what I myself and most logical people imagine the scene playing out as.

Spoiler

Pretty standard strained relationship situation.


Now let us imagine this a little differently. From say a PN POV.

Spoiler

"Holy stalker Batman".


As you can plainly see. One scenario makes sense. The other....less so. Case closed.

Just because.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

you're ignoring the context of the line.

And you're ignoring the question. Not complicated: "what makes you think Cloud and Tifa were sharing a bed?" Don't send me on a scavenger hunt through the thread, just answer me.

Notice the office is never, EVER, referred to as Cloud’s bedroom. And his office is HIS ROOM, y’know?

Also, I can’t speak for others, but a scenario like this isn’t uncommon. I interpreted this as Tifa hinting to Cloud that he could just drink in HIS room with the cold cot, because he wasn’t going to sleep in THEIR bedroom tonight. The emphasis is on HIS room. And just to emphasize again: 1) This is the ONLY time Cloud’s office is referred to as his room 2) Never is his office referred to as his bedroom 3) In case some people dunno, Cloud’s office alone, is his room.

And considering Cloud said “I want to drink ALONE,” I think it’s fairly understandable that Tifa’s reaction is only a natural response from a woman who feels her hubby is taking her for granted. So yeah, he could just drink/sleep in HIS room if he really wants to be alone.

When I was a kid my parents said "go to your room". They never called it a bedroom, so does this mean I was actually sleeping with them? They never said "go to your bedroom", so am I supposed to have slept somewhere else?

Trying to understand where this comes from but it seems to be a play on semantics.

 

[lunar_crimson]

So are you saying Tifa is not referring to Cloud's office? Because the contention here isn't semantics. The contention is whether Cloud's office is an office with a cot or whether the office is Cloud's permanent bedroom AND office.

 

[Ⓐaron]

And you're ignoring the question. Not complicated: "what makes you think Cloud and Tifa were sharing a bed?" Don't send me on a scavenger hunt through the thread, just answer me.

I already did answer you in my initial post, via the post of Vendel's I linked. Any other interpretation of the scene other than that they are sharing a room makes Tifa a sad and pathetic stalker, which is clearly not what the writers had in mind when they wrote the character.

When I was a kid my parents said "go to your room". They never called it a bedroom, so does this mean I was actually sleeping with them? They never said "go to your bedroom", so am I supposed to have slept somewhere else?

Trying to understand where this comes from but it seems to be a play on semantics.

office=room. Again, it's not that complicated.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

So are you saying Tifa is not referring to Cloud's office? Because the contention here isn't semantics. The contention is whether Cloud's office is an office with a cot or whether the office is Cloud's permanent bedroom AND office.

And it's never stated to be either/or in the novella, so let's assume it's just the office then? As quoted above, Tifa says "drink in your room". Sounds to me like Cloud has his own room separate from hers. I don't see why she has to specifically address it as a bedroom in order for it to be that.

office=room. Again, it's not that complicated.

And yet room =/= bedroom. Saying "room" instead of "bedroom" means that Cloud and Tifa clearly share a bed. Ah yes, not complicated at all, just a bit tortured.

I already did answer you in my initial post, via the post of Vendel's I linked. Any other interpretation of the scene other than that they are sharing a room makes Tifa a sad and pathetic stalker, which is clearly not what the writers had in mind when they wrote the character.

Well that logic is so wrong I don't know where to start. You think that Tifa being Cloud's room makes her a pathetic stalker, so they have to share a bed so she doesn't come off that way? Huh? I never thought they shared a bed and never saw Tifa as a stalker because of that scene.