LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Seconded!!
The General Turks Worship Thread
- Thread starter Fangu
- Start date
Seconded!!
Unlucky
WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
Oh gaiz I'm so happy that you like my artworks *sniff* I always loved sharing them here, in fact this is the only place outside of DA where I post it. I don't think they're really good enough but I badly wanna improve so I can post moar decent stuff.
I'll really think about this tumblr thing, I'll give you a heads up
He's an MMA fighter now, and he looks so different.
My mom had always questioned my taste back then, because she insists Tommy is cuter (which is true but I only realized now that I'm old
). Tomberly ( ) is really sweet, but I never paid much attention to Kimberly in particular. I don't hate her but I always felt she's getting too much attention for some unfair reason. I always loved Trini, but she's very underrated because Kimberly is girly and dainty and whatnot and every girl back then wanted to be her.
Sorry, didn't mean to rant, just sharing some childhood insights that stuck up to now
I'll really think about this tumblr thing, I'll give you a heads up
He's an MMA fighter now, and he looks so different.
My mom had always questioned my taste back then, because she insists Tommy is cuter (which is true but I only realized now that I'm old
). Tomberly ( ) is really sweet, but I never paid much attention to Kimberly in particular. I don't hate her but I always felt she's getting too much attention for some unfair reason. I always loved Trini, but she's very underrated because Kimberly is girly and dainty and whatnot and every girl back then wanted to be her. Sorry, didn't mean to rant, just sharing some childhood insights that stuck up to now
Unlucky
WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
Double poast:
So now that we've finished BC, I'm thinking what's it like if SE should make another Turk game for a console. I was immensely bored with BC and thank you guys for helping me through that, but I'm just not satisfied with it. One of my pet peeves is when the player Turk just head-on confronts the enemy (although that is out of the question, since it's a cellphone game and we haven't got much option). Another is that you can only choose one Turk to play for the entire game, and that's such a waste of chance to get to know the others. Say there's gonna be a new Turk game with a different gameplay, what would you guys suggest it should be?
(note: I know this happening is completely IMPOSSIBRU, but y'know, just for the sake of discussion)
For me, it's better off being a stealth game. Of course it depends on the mission, but I figured the Turks are most likely given reconaissance/ stealth missions anyway.
Hitman's gameplay is perfect. You can check it out here:
MGS is also good.
There also another game that I've mentioned in one of our streaming sessions before, Tenchu, which is about ninjas. The good thing about this is you don't have to invest on your character to level-up (unlike in BC), and each character has different moves/ weapons. This is from the first game which shows how simple it works (note the icon beside the life bar which helps you with stealth):
^The character used is strong but slow as compared to the other main character (female), who is faster but relatively weaker. There are other ones in the next installments, like one who uses his fists (like Rude
)
Head-on confrontation is possible (save for certain missions, iirc, which ends if you blow your cover) but it's going to affect your rating (and items you get) per level. Not to mention you're going to attract lots of enemies.
So what are your suggestions?
So now that we've finished BC, I'm thinking what's it like if SE should make another Turk game for a console. I was immensely bored with BC and thank you guys for helping me through that, but I'm just not satisfied with it. One of my pet peeves is when the player Turk just head-on confronts the enemy (although that is out of the question, since it's a cellphone game and we haven't got much option). Another is that you can only choose one Turk to play for the entire game, and that's such a waste of chance to get to know the others. Say there's gonna be a new Turk game with a different gameplay, what would you guys suggest it should be?
(note: I know this happening is completely IMPOSSIBRU, but y'know, just for the sake of discussion)
For me, it's better off being a stealth game. Of course it depends on the mission, but I figured the Turks are most likely given reconaissance/ stealth missions anyway.
Hitman's gameplay is perfect. You can check it out here:
MGS is also good.
There also another game that I've mentioned in one of our streaming sessions before, Tenchu, which is about ninjas. The good thing about this is you don't have to invest on your character to level-up (unlike in BC), and each character has different moves/ weapons. This is from the first game which shows how simple it works (note the icon beside the life bar which helps you with stealth):
^The character used is strong but slow as compared to the other main character (female), who is faster but relatively weaker. There are other ones in the next installments, like one who uses his fists (like Rude
)Head-on confrontation is possible (save for certain missions, iirc, which ends if you blow your cover) but it's going to affect your rating (and items you get) per level. Not to mention you're going to attract lots of enemies.
So what are your suggestions?
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
I think the reason I was inspired to write DIPOTP is because BC was unsatisfactory in so many ways. It does look as if it would be pretty boring to play, but then I don't know what kinds of limitation are inevitably put on a cell phone game. You're absolute right that the Turks should engage in as little conflict as possible while en route to their target, and never have a head-on confrontation if they can avoid it.
I'd love another, post DoG console game centred round the Turks, who are all still alive so it wouldn't be hard to bring them back. I don't know about stealth missions; I'm pretty crap at them because I don't have a steady hand. But I'd be willing to learn. I haven't played Type-0 but from what I gather, it shows that Square are capable of making a highly successful ensemble game (naturally, we don't get to play it) and the Turks are valuable intellectual property for them.
What would be cool, from a narrative point of view, is a game made up entirely of missions - training missions and peacekeeping missions in which you build up your stats and skills, because I like grinding - and seek and destroy or go-fetch missions through which, bit by bit, the player builds up an understanding of what is really going on. Information is doled out on a need to know basis, so each mission becomes like a piece of the big picture puzzle. It would also be good if you at least go on missions with a partner, and mix'n'match them. Some pairings, even if only hinted at, would also be welcome.
That said, wasn't there a James Bond game - Goldeneye? - which was supposed to be very good? That would be oppan Turk style.
I'd love another, post DoG console game centred round the Turks, who are all still alive so it wouldn't be hard to bring them back. I don't know about stealth missions; I'm pretty crap at them because I don't have a steady hand. But I'd be willing to learn. I haven't played Type-0 but from what I gather, it shows that Square are capable of making a highly successful ensemble game (naturally, we don't get to play it) and the Turks are valuable intellectual property for them.
What would be cool, from a narrative point of view, is a game made up entirely of missions - training missions and peacekeeping missions in which you build up your stats and skills, because I like grinding - and seek and destroy or go-fetch missions through which, bit by bit, the player builds up an understanding of what is really going on. Information is doled out on a need to know basis, so each mission becomes like a piece of the big picture puzzle. It would also be good if you at least go on missions with a partner, and mix'n'match them. Some pairings, even if only hinted at, would also be welcome.
That said, wasn't there a James Bond game - Goldeneye? - which was supposed to be very good? That would be oppan Turk style.
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
I’ll say again, as the constant BC apologist, there are some cool things about BC. The way your IRL cell phone would vibrate if you got a call in in game, the way your IRL cell location could correspond to your in came location, and using the camera phone feature interactively to create materia in game. You also do have the option to avoid fights, which I thought was pretty cool.
As a cell phone game, at the time it was made, it’s pretty clever.
That said, I feel like the story would have made for a better anime. It’s very plot heavy (which is good), but I’d prefer to have the plot without having to deal with mazes and puzzles. (I really hate mazes and puzzles. Seriously, you could make a video game about lab rats running various mazes and the game play would be comparable!)
That said, if there were to be a Turk game. (I’d rather have an anime!) I think it should be an RPG. I want FFVII games to stick to the RPG format. They tried doing a shooter in DoC, and the game play was…not good. I felt motion sick, and the game couldn’t figure out if it wanted to be a first person shooter or a third person shooter.
SquareEnix makes good RPGs, Final Fantasy is an RPG series, so I’d like to just stick with RPGs. That said, it doesn’t have to be turned based.
I loved the game play in KH Birth By Sleep quite a lot, and the way it forces you to play different character types (magic heavy, light and fast, big and strong). I like third person run around, beat up enemies, explore the world games with climbing, jumping, sneaking and exploring. In Birth By Sleep, you could cast spells, hack and slash, or shoot your enemies (because key blades can shoot things apparently), and all of it was a lot of fun. (If you own a PSP I recommend giving BBS a try, it’s a prequel game, so you don’t have to know the series to enjoy it and it’s fun.)
Another thing BBS did was give you the same story from different characters perspectives as their story lines happened in different places simultaneously, it would be cool to do something like where you're forced to play through different missions as different Turks, get to know each character and see different events through different perspectives.
Personally, I’d prefer a BC remake to a post DoC game because I’d like to explore Midgar.
Also, co-op missions where you can play with friends online/wirelessly, so like two people could grab a Turk and do missions together. Using the net to link a multiplayer handheld game would be awesome. (even if I would probably get my co-players killed).
As a cell phone game, at the time it was made, it’s pretty clever.
That said, I feel like the story would have made for a better anime. It’s very plot heavy (which is good), but I’d prefer to have the plot without having to deal with mazes and puzzles. (I really hate mazes and puzzles. Seriously, you could make a video game about lab rats running various mazes and the game play would be comparable!)
That said, if there were to be a Turk game. (I’d rather have an anime!) I think it should be an RPG. I want FFVII games to stick to the RPG format. They tried doing a shooter in DoC, and the game play was…not good. I felt motion sick, and the game couldn’t figure out if it wanted to be a first person shooter or a third person shooter.
SquareEnix makes good RPGs, Final Fantasy is an RPG series, so I’d like to just stick with RPGs. That said, it doesn’t have to be turned based.
I loved the game play in KH Birth By Sleep quite a lot, and the way it forces you to play different character types (magic heavy, light and fast, big and strong). I like third person run around, beat up enemies, explore the world games with climbing, jumping, sneaking and exploring. In Birth By Sleep, you could cast spells, hack and slash, or shoot your enemies (because key blades can shoot things apparently), and all of it was a lot of fun. (If you own a PSP I recommend giving BBS a try, it’s a prequel game, so you don’t have to know the series to enjoy it and it’s fun.)
Another thing BBS did was give you the same story from different characters perspectives as their story lines happened in different places simultaneously, it would be cool to do something like where you're forced to play through different missions as different Turks, get to know each character and see different events through different perspectives.
Personally, I’d prefer a BC remake to a post DoC game because I’d like to explore Midgar.
Also, co-op missions where you can play with friends online/wirelessly, so like two people could grab a Turk and do missions together. Using the net to link a multiplayer handheld game would be awesome. (even if I would probably get my co-players killed).
Octo
KULT OF KERMITU
- AKA
- Octo, Octorawk, Clarky Cat, Kissmammal2000
I think a Turks based game would have to be something along the lines of stealth/action. I'd want no half measures though, that genre of game tends to be very good or very bad.
But yeah I'd want the works, planting bugging devices, bombs, assasinations, surveillance, all that espionage stuff. Also I'd want all the Turks to be playable all the time, maybe some Veld and Vincent missions could be unlockable or something I dunno.
And yeah the ability to FULLY explore Midgar. I want to go to Goblins bar, or look in the other sectors and I want it to be busy. Not like 3 NPC's standing around kicking their heels. They could do that with Assasins Creed with a ridiculously detailed city so I'd love to see Midgar done like that. And not just Midgar some of the other locations too.
Also it would be awesome if it had 'romance' options like Mass Effect etc, just so we could all pursue our favourite ships
I'd like to see an anime series too, something in a similar vein to Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex.
We can dream I guess...
But yeah I'd want the works, planting bugging devices, bombs, assasinations, surveillance, all that espionage stuff. Also I'd want all the Turks to be playable all the time, maybe some Veld and Vincent missions could be unlockable or something I dunno.
And yeah the ability to FULLY explore Midgar. I want to go to Goblins bar, or look in the other sectors and I want it to be busy. Not like 3 NPC's standing around kicking their heels. They could do that with Assasins Creed with a ridiculously detailed city so I'd love to see Midgar done like that. And not just Midgar some of the other locations too.
Also it would be awesome if it had 'romance' options like Mass Effect etc, just so we could all pursue our favourite ships
I'd like to see an anime series too, something in a similar vein to Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex.
We can dream I guess...
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
I liked Hajime Tabata's idea. In 2010 he siad that if he were to make anygame for the 3DS it would be a BC remake:
Of course, this isn't actually going to happen, but I think it's an interesting idea.
Of course, this isn't actually going to happen, but I think it's an interesting idea.
Shademp
420
To repeat sentiments that have been spoken ever since 2004, when I waded through the 15 hours of utter pain that was Before Crisis I felt that it would have worked so much better as an animé rather than a cell phone game.
Sad truth is that the production cost would have skyrocketed in comparison to making the mobile game. It probably cost Square as much to make a handful of episodes as it did to create those animated trailers.
*dreams on*
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
Honestly, I'd settle for a manga version of Before Crisis. They have Manga for the Kingdom Hearts Games (the 358/2 one is really cute), so why not have a manga adaption of BC?
Shademp
420
A manga could certainly give Square a storyboard to work with. Start with a "cheap" manga, see how popular it gets, then if demand is high enough they turn it into an animé with the manga as a backbone.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Let's start our own game studio.
Soakette
Donator
- AKA
- Jess
I like the idea of an anime but in Last Order they made all the Turks look so sexy EXCEPT Rude! Seriously he had a big body and tiny little head! And you know I have to have Rude look good! I'd prefer CGI over anime though, He looked damn sexy in AC/C.
I also like Octos idea to have a romance option like in ME. Just to have the chance to romance Rude...omg I would die happy for real!
I also like Octos idea to have a romance option like in ME. Just to have the chance to romance Rude...omg I would die happy for real!
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
I'd make you a dating sim if it weren't for the copyright issues.
Unlucky
WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
Haha. My cousin and I have seriously planned that in the past. That, or starting our own comic/manga. Tis not an impossible dream, but we know better now that it ain't an easy one
But I'm still kinda seri0s about it Anyway.. I bring some
^... holy crap I'm in love.
Unlucky
WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
Double posting again to share these awesomeness from the last cosplayer in my previous post: (REALLY huge photos)
^the only thing off for me here is the white socks.
^ the angle of her head makes it look like it's pasted there but otherwise she looks really good in a suit!
You can check out more of her work here.
Also:
^the only thing off for me here is the white socks.
^ the angle of her head makes it look like it's pasted there but otherwise she looks really good in a suit!
You can check out more of her work here.
Also:
Am I imagining it or does Tseng look like Jake Sully here
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
Who is the first Tseng cosplayer. I really like her(his?) make up job. (Is it make up or is it photoshop?)
That first Tseng cosplayer is very pretty. It's like whoa, I love that!
That first Tseng cosplayer is very pretty. It's like whoa, I love that!
Unlucky
WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
Oh so he is a boy, a Russian boy. I am so bad at telling gender. It's like, I don't see race, I don't see gender, I just see pretty. Thanks for the link.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Wow, he's a guy? I thought he was a girl. I don't think I've ever seen a real-life guy with such perfect "bishie" features before. Russians really are good-looking people. Have you seen the Russian couple who cosplay Zack and Aerith? They are the spitting image of their characters.
Drax
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Benoist; Captain Highwind
I thought it was a painting.
CameoAmalthea
Pro Adventurer
Licorice and Me: "Wait he's a boy?"
Captain Highwind: "Wait he's human?"
I love cosplay.
And yes, he does look almost uncanny, hence my comment on the makeup, although I still can't tell if it's been shopped or how much, however, I know there are techniques to make yourself look almost inhumanely pretty, like the real life barbie and anime girl. I've never tried it myself, but it is interesting to see what you can do with makeup. I especially love the eyes.
Edit:
It's photoshopped, which explains a lot.
I asked him about his technique over on DA (He seems like a really nice guy) out of professional curiosity, (I've been trying to figure out how to bishify guys with make up.), and he explained he wasn't wearing any make up, they just touched it up a lot/added "makeup" in photoshop. Which explains why the photos look almost like a painting.
Captain Highwind: "Wait he's human?"
I love cosplay.
And yes, he does look almost uncanny, hence my comment on the makeup, although I still can't tell if it's been shopped or how much, however, I know there are techniques to make yourself look almost inhumanely pretty, like the real life barbie and anime girl. I've never tried it myself, but it is interesting to see what you can do with makeup. I especially love the eyes.
Edit:
It's photoshopped, which explains a lot.
I asked him about his technique over on DA (He seems like a really nice guy) out of professional curiosity, (I've been trying to figure out how to bishify guys with make up.), and he explained he wasn't wearing any make up, they just touched it up a lot/added "makeup" in photoshop. Which explains why the photos look almost like a painting.
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Shademp
420
I figure that posting this here will be amusing for the Turk fans...
So I'm trying to connect with my artistic side (which has been left completely in the dark since I was a kid) and I am looking at things from a new perspective, when it suddenly hits me as I'm watching ACC...RENO HAS A PONYTAIL.
Just...wow. Because I have zero visualization skill, I remember almost zero about what characters wear, what their hairstyle is etc other than vague abstract notions. Now when looking at Reno, I realize that if I had tried to draw him I would have completely forgotten his ponytail. What an odd feeling. I mean, I have *seen* the ponytail before, but at the same time I have not SEEN it. It was there, yet not there.
Having many of these WTF moments now when looking at FFVII characters and trying to memorize their appearance(s).
So I'm trying to connect with my artistic side (which has been left completely in the dark since I was a kid) and I am looking at things from a new perspective, when it suddenly hits me as I'm watching ACC...RENO HAS A PONYTAIL.
Just...wow. Because I have zero visualization skill, I remember almost zero about what characters wear, what their hairstyle is etc other than vague abstract notions. Now when looking at Reno, I realize that if I had tried to draw him I would have completely forgotten his ponytail. What an odd feeling. I mean, I have *seen* the ponytail before, but at the same time I have not SEEN it. It was there, yet not there.
Having many of these WTF moments now when looking at FFVII characters and trying to memorize their appearance(s).
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LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Considering the amount of study you've put into analysing the most minute details of this game's programming and design, I find it kind of endearingly absurd that you overlooked something every fangirl noticed about Reno within three seconds of first clapping eyes on him. Indeed, I would say his pony-tail - or as some would call it, his mullet - is positively iconic!!
Shademp
420
Looking into the game using tools has allowed me to spot some things about the appearance of the characters, but they all boil down to technical observations rather than the actual appearance. I know which fields have messed up field model animations (where the field models are turned into some form of shish-kebab) but I could not from memory tell what eye color a character has, what their hairstyle is, what their clothes look like (in detail) and so on. ...Ok I admit to remembering that Rude is bald.
Another technical observation is the fact that some models lack face textures. As we saw in this pre-release FFVII gameplay video, face textures were (at least sometimes) added after the character animations were finished. Sometimes they forgot to finish up. Reno actually lacks a face in two instances in the final game.
As it looks like in the field model viewer:
Where does this happen?
...
Granted that neither scene has an up-close shot of Reno, but in hindsight I'm surprised to not have spotted Reno's lack of a face in Gongaga.
Finally, Reno's face is strangely red in the final field where you encounter him, in the Midgar tunnels.
The only time you could possibly spot this in-game would be when you decline the opportunity to fight the Turks and they all turn so we can see their faces. I am yet to actually trigger this and check if this field model error only exists in the PC version or if it is there in the PSX game too. (There are presently no tools to view PSX field models, hence why I don't know)
I currently don't have a savefile where the fight with the Turks can be denied (and I'm not in the mood to mod forth the scenario). Perhaps somebody here can check if Reno's face is red in the tunnels in the PSX version?
Another technical observation is the fact that some models lack face textures. As we saw in this pre-release FFVII gameplay video, face textures were (at least sometimes) added after the character animations were finished. Sometimes they forgot to finish up. Reno actually lacks a face in two instances in the final game.
As it looks like in the field model viewer:
Where does this happen?
...
Granted that neither scene has an up-close shot of Reno, but in hindsight I'm surprised to not have spotted Reno's lack of a face in Gongaga.
Finally, Reno's face is strangely red in the final field where you encounter him, in the Midgar tunnels.
The only time you could possibly spot this in-game would be when you decline the opportunity to fight the Turks and they all turn so we can see their faces. I am yet to actually trigger this and check if this field model error only exists in the PC version or if it is there in the PSX game too. (There are presently no tools to view PSX field models, hence why I don't know)
I currently don't have a savefile where the fight with the Turks can be denied (and I'm not in the mood to mod forth the scenario). Perhaps somebody here can check if Reno's face is red in the tunnels in the PSX version?
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