Faith v. 3.0 (Cloti Club)

[Master Bates]

^Yes, that was what we were talking about. It's an ancient Clerith fic and was pretty popular within the fandom for a time, nearly to the level of "Cloud Mows the Lawn".

 

[Eerie]

Now that I think about it, it is strange that a women like her remained single for so long. She could have any man she wanted for the past 7 years or so. Except, she stayed single. I wonder why...

As I was stating, in I don't remember what thread, there are several things at play now:
- Zangan brought her there, between life and death
- she had her father and whole town to mourn, that's not exactly easy when you are the sole survivor of your hometown (the survivor guilt, eep!)
And to this you add that she didn't know Cloud was there, she hoped that he was still somewhere, that she had by that time a very solid crush on him and that he was his only link to everything that she had lost.

I do believe that it's at that time that her crush began to transform into love, because of everything she projected onto him. Just as Tifa was Cloud's proof that he was "himself", Cloud was Tifa's link to "home". They have been each other's crutch for a long time, until they met again for Tifa, and a little while longer for Cloud. In hindsight, this is probably why Tifa's theme is a duet.

 

[Graymouse]

As I was stating, in I don't remember what thread, there are several things at play now:
- Zangan brought her there, between life and death
- she had her father and whole town to mourn, that's not exactly easy when you are the sole survivor of your hometown (the survivor guilt, eep!)
And to this you add that she didn't know Cloud was there, she hoped that he was still somewhere, that she had by that time a very solid crush on him and that he was his only link to everything that she had lost.

I do believe that it's at that time that her crush began to transform into love, because of everything she projected onto him. Just as Tifa was Cloud's proof that he was "himself", Cloud was Tifa's link to "home". They have been each other's crutch for a long time, until they met again for Tifa, and a little while longer for Cloud. In hindsight, this is probably why Tifa's theme is a duet.

I think longing for someone makes the desire to be with that person very powerful and once you are back together, you never want to let go of it again.

Just like like Andrea said, when you backtrack back through. "Did you find what you were looking for?" "I did thanks to you", "Good, now never let that go."

I know it seems like we just keep going in circles in this thread and discuss the same things over and over again.

 

[Graymouse]

Which version of Tifa's Theme do you prefer?

OG
AC
Remake

 

[DutchDread]

This thread is a safe space though

I really experienced it like that when coming back after after that discussion, was like coming back home after work. I may need a hug from Cloud (platonically of course, just like those hugs he gives Tifa XD)

- Zangan brought her there, between life and death

I've been wondering about this, I thought I remembered Zangan being the one who finds Tifa but I wasn't sure exactly when or how.
If she's found before Hojo finds Cloud and Zack, then why didn't Zangan try to save Zack as well? If Hojo found Zack and Cloud before Tifa, why didn't he take Tifa? You can always use a test subject can't you?

Perhaps HOJO thought she was dead?

Especially Tifa in hindsight that was a bad decision, girl can fight on par with a super soldier wielding a 6 ft long sword, a HUGE cyborg dude with a machinegun for an arm, and an ancient magical being.....using just her fists.

Girl would have been soldier first class easily with some enhancements, she makes Cloud look like a pushover.

Which version of Tifa's Theme do you prefer?

OG has some nostalgia, but I think remake is probably best.

 

[Eerie]

Zack was much more closer to the stairs than Tifa whom Cloud had cleared out of the way, if my memory is right. From Zangan point of view, if he comes first, he sees his student dying, versus a SOLDIER who was friend with the one who killed an entire town dying. He can probably save only one, so the choice is an easy one since he has ties to one and the other might be troubles.

If Hojo comes in first, then he probably doesn't think much of Tifa, and focuses on the SOLDIER and the grunt that took down Sephiroth.

I wonder if we'll see more of that scene, I know it has been changed a bit in CC, or was it the anime thing? They may want to try and combine two scenes into one and give a definitive version.

 

[Vortigern]

Which version of Tifa's Theme do you prefer?

OG
AC
Remake

Are we talking purely Tifa's main theme or are remixes fair game for mention? Either way, my answer is Remake but Star of Seventh Heaven hits me so good. Mmm mmm MMM!

 

[iamhorde]

Which version of Tifa's Theme do you prefer?

OG
AC
Remake

Remake! I have the Tifa PS4 theme and sometimes I just turn it on to listen to Tifa's theme, haha.

I really experienced it like that when coming back after after that discussion, was like coming back home after work. I may need a hug from Cloud (platonically of course, just like those hugs he gives Tifa XD)

It almost sounds like you're coming back from the shipping warfronts. Welcome home brave men and women. Here's a really good GMW of Cloud x Tifa for your viewing pleasure. It takes the perspective of Cloud wanting Tifa to notice the true him with a clever use of lyrics from Goo Goo Dolls' Iris.

And I don't want the world to see me
'Cause I don't think that they'd understand
When everything's made to be broken
I just want you to know who I am​

 

[Yumelinh]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1267949136747233280

 

[Ite]

Zangan would have shown up first, as he was in the area while Hojo, presumably, was on another continent and wouldn’t have gotten there for several days. Since Cloud and Zack were both impaled, he probably just stepped over them.

I always saw Tifa as bitter and aromantic, singularly focused on her own survival and revenge. Doesn’t really fit with Remake’s cold-feet scared-kitten Tifa. Don’t really know what to think of her now. Sounds like Marle just cockblocked her for 5 years idk

 

[Yumelinh]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1268066200048680961

 

[Yumelinh]

I always saw Tifa as bitter and aromantic, singularly focused on her own survival and revenge. Doesn’t really fit with Remake’s cold-feet scared-kitten Tifa. Don’t really know what to think of her now. Sounds like Marle just cockblocked her for 5 years idk

Honestly, I don't think her Remake personality really goes again your initial claim here, and judging by what Barret said in his resolution scene she seems to be quite firm when she wants to decline a guy.

Also, there's the fact she is much more mellow when she's around Cloud and the people she's close with, so there's little room to judge.

 

[DutchDread]

I always saw Tifa as bitter and aromantic, singularly focused on her own survival and revenge. Doesn’t really fit with Remake’s cold-feet scared-kitten Tifa. Don’t really know what to think of her now. Sounds like Marle just cockblocked her for 5 years idk

Honestly, I don't think her Remake personality really goes again your initial claim here, and judging by what Barret said in his resolution scene she seems to be quite firm when she wants to decline a guy.

Also, there's the fact she is much more mellow when she's around Cloud and the people she close with, so there's little room to judge.

I really can't imagine her being anything besides "warm", even as a barmaid to customers. I just think that before Cloud was there, there probably was never genuine happiness underneath that smile, which means she was never attracted to anyone. I honestly think that when Cloud returned, that's probably the first time she actually felt happy, like she wasn't drowning, because for once, something was returned to her.

I do think she's probably a virgin, she's 20 I think, which is late, but not uncommonly so in our world. So the question would be if we'd expect her to be a late or an early bloomer, and considering what she went through, and her subsequent focus on revenge, I think the years probably passed without her ever being much pre-occupied with romance or even sex.
The only situation honestly where I can imagine her having had sex, was if at some point it all just became too much for her, and she just needed to be comforted in some way, even if it were just a meaningless physicality. But even that, considering the fact that after the 7 plate drop she STILL only went for a hug makes me think it's unlikely, one thing I believe for sure, she never had sex because she was happy.


(ps, I don't think Aerith would be a virgin, I think that as far as SE is concerned no one ever has sex in these games even people with kids, (wait, honeybee inn, scratch that), but just from intuition, in those 2 years with Zack, after he was in all that pain? I think it happened, but that might be because I don't want Aerith to have died a virgin XD)

 

[Vortigern]

I do think she's probably a virgin, she's 20 I think, which is late, but not uncommonly so in our world. So the question would be if we'd expect her to be a late or an early bloomer, and considering what she went through, and her subsequent focus on revenge, I think the years probably passed without her ever being much pre-occupied with romance or even sex.
The only situation honestly where I can imagine her having had sex, was if at some point it all just became too much for her, and she just needed to be comforted in some way, even if it were just a meaningless physicality. But even that, considering the fact that after the 7 plate drop she STILL only went for a hug makes me think it's unlikely, one thing I believe for sure, she never had sex because she was happy.

Copying over a response from discord I had about this very topic alittle over a week ago regarding my take on Cloud and Tifa's 'experience' leading in to Remake.

I'd definitely go with both being virgins. Cloud joins the military with an obsession connected to an infatuation. His failure to get into SOLDIER probably put him in a poor mood and felt too guilty to let loose while focusing and doubling down on his efforts to improve as his yearning for Tifa remained. Zack and other Shinra grunts might have tried to get him to open up and go out on the town but I doubt it ever lead to any one night stands before the whole Nibelheim Incident and the years that follow that whole mess for sure keep Cloud's cherry intact.

Tifa would be emotionally scarred after Nibelheim. Once she recovers she might not remember everything clearly but enough remains with her to send her into a dark place. Who knows how much time passes before she landed her gig at Seventh Heaven and finally got some firm ground under her feet to build a new life. She certainly wouldn't have time for any relationships prior to that. And even after that, she would still be closed off and lowkey focused on her hatred of Shinra which inevitably leads to her supporting and joining Avalanche.

I'm not sure if Cloud would be as consistently on her mind as she is in Cloud's as she may think something happened to him so I think her virginity remaining intact might be less to do with a desire to remain pure for Cloud and just her being too emotionally scarred and having no interest in romance or relationships all that much.

 

[Graymouse]

I never would have thought that this would come up in this thread. I love it! Good speculation and discussion.

I would have like to think that they both saved themselves for each other, but I don't think that would practical in this sense. However, I do believe that they are both Virgins, up until the High WInd Scene of course!

Blood everywhere all over the rocks, the grass, or wherever they laid.

 

[Cat on Mars]

Blood everywhere all over the rocks, the grass, or wherever they laid.

Where does this idea come from? Tifa's 20, she's a martial artist and I'm sure she has used tampons/FFVII's equivalent. And she knows who to take care of herself, if you know what I mean...
Blood? Unless she's on her period when that scene happens I have my doubts.

 

[Graymouse]

Where does this idea comes from? Tifa's 20, she's a martial artist and I'm sure she has used tampons/FFVII's equivalent. And she knows who to take care of herself, if you know what I mean...
Blood? Unless she's on her period when that scene happens I have my doubts.

Read the room, man! I was talking about popping cherries. Of course I was being over dramatic.

I guess my joke wasn't as good as I thought it was in my head. Oh well.

 

[Cat on Mars]

Now I'm thinking about the period sex possibilities.

Spoiler: BECAUSE I'M DISGUSTING

 

[minami758]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1267949136747233280

Ahhhh! I had never realized this before?? How did I never notice this. I pulled up a playthrough and yeah he only stops to look at the water tower and Tifa's house. Damn that's a crazy detail.

 

[Graymouse]

Remake! I have the Tifa PS4 theme and sometimes I just turn it on to listen to Tifa's theme, haha.

I do this all the time. Since I have the Tifa Theme on my PS4 (of course I do) I just turn on my PS4 and let it play while I do things around the house.

Now I'm thinking about the period sex possibilities.

Spoiler: BECAUSE I'M DISGUSTING

View attachment 6439
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I wish I hadn't clicked on the spoiler tag...

 

[Yumelinh]

(ps, I don't think Aerith would be a virgin, I think that as far as SE is concerned no one ever has sex in these games even people with kids, (wait, honeybee inn, scratch that), but just from intuition, in those 2 years with Zack, after he was in all that pain? I think it happened, but that might be because I don't want Aerith to have died a virgin XD)

IT HAPPENED! There's nothing to disprove my claim in canon material, therefore it's true!

That's also why both Cloud and Tifa jumped from a confession straight to sex in the HW scene: the world was ending and they were just not going to dying virgins there

But jokes aside, I agree with both you and @Vortigern, the circumstances seem to have worked against them when it comes to having any previous romantic experience, so there's very little room for them to have been in any other relationship prior the FFVII. Maybe Tifa could have had a boyfriend or maybe a fling prior to Nilbeheim incident? but judging by how she acted in CC regarding Cloud is very unlikely as well.

Ahhhh! I had never realized this before?? How did I never notice this. I pulled up a playthrough and yeah he only stops to look at the water tower and Tifa's house. Damn, that's a crazy detail.

Neither did I and now I just want them to add this in the Kalm flashback in the Remake or else I'll riot!!

 

[Cat on Mars]

(ps, I don't think Aerith would be a virgin, I think that as far as SE is concerned no one ever has sex in these games even people with kids, (wait, honeybee inn, scratch that), but just from intuition, in those 2 years with Zack, after he was in all that pain? I think it happened, but that might be because I don't want Aerith to have died a virgin XD)

I like to think that too but I'm afraid the words "platonic romance" were used in Idon'tknowwhatversionof Ultimania to describe Aerith and Zack's relationship...


And this was my reaction. Or something like this, you get the idea.
I wasn't happy.

I wish I hadn't clicked on the spoiler tag...

Well, that's on you. I said it was disgusting.

Maybe Tifa could have had a boyfriend or maybe a fling prior to Nilbeheim incident? but judging by how she acted in CC regarding Cloud is very unlikely as well.

Yep, she had a thing with Zack because there wasn't much to do in Nibelheim while the characters were waiting for Sephiroth to flip his lid. First time things got a bit out of hand, several times after that was totally on purpose.
Nah, I concur it's very unlikely. And later Tifa has been too busy running a bar, street fighting and plotting revenge. I bet she's been masturbating a lot waiting for Cloud so yep, she's a virgin for sure.

 

[Graymouse]

I am sorry guys, but I want to have one post about the LTD, Please indulge me. I feel this is a safer place to post this, I didn't want to stir the pot too much over there. I already went overboard one time already.


I feel that Cloud X Tifa shippers are more accepting of the other side when it comes to LTD. Why is that? Do you suppose? Is it that we don't have the need to push a narrative, because all you have to do is play the game to understand the Cloud X Tifa pairing? I still don't understand how, Cloud would be that hung up on a dead girl, when he has Tifa who is still living, and who has already confessed her feelings for him. Standing before him.

The other side have been for the longest time pushing hard against anything that has to do with Tifa X Cloud. They are trying their hardest to twist and change the text into their pairing. I know it is fun to talk about what could have been. But, in reality, it can never be. She is dead. Sorry that she is but she is. Besides, I don't think Aerith would want Cloud to be hung up on her in the first place.

I can use the "Look forward, not Back" line as defense here, that Aerith says herself. So that is not a valid argument. I wanted to type that out in the LTD but, it probably wouldn't have been nice. "If you can't say nothing nice, don't say anything at all." Applies, in this case. I am sorry guys.

Back to our regular schedule program...

 

[Cat on Mars]

feel that Cloud X Tifa shippers are more accepting of the other side when it comes to LTD. Why is that? Do you suppose? Is it that we don't have the need to push a narrative, because all you have to do is play the game to understand the Cloud X Tifa pairing? I still don't understand how, Cloud would be that hung up on a dead girl, when he has Tifa who is still living, and who has already confessed her feelings for him. Standing before him.

Short answer:
Yes.
Long answer:
They're Disney fans. The more clichéd and unrealistic the romance, the better.

Cloud and Tifa shippers have nothing to prove. The OG, Compilation and Remake speak for themselves, and SE has demonstrated in full that they can still tell stories with Tifa and Cloud in a relationship after the OG.
And that burns some Cleriths with searing pain, because they won't have that. They can't have that. If they can't have and enjoy more Clerith moments, nobody is allowed to enjoy anything.
That's why they're so vicious; they're desperate. They know it isn't real and it's all in their heads, but they won't listen to Aerith.

 

[Ruri]

The famous quote, from this site: 'In order to prove Clerith, you need to first disprove Cloti' still rings true to this very day.

I don't know why but I know I have not bumped into many C/A shippers who are willing to accept that Cloud and Tifa share anything romantic. Mind boggling because they would have an easier life if they just accept things as they are. Even with the remake, I have seen the argument: Tifa is crying in her resolution because she knows Cloud loves Aerith. There's a whole, whoooooooole lotta pulling from the back-end and reaching for the stars to come up with these interpretations and while I said in the LTD thread, I would like to be a multi-shipper, it is these kind of fans and these kind of reads on the games story that push me away from trying to vibe with the other side at any point. Also, the Tifa hate is intense.

That's the most impolite I will be and I'll emphasis on 'certain fans' to not generalize an entire fandom.