SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 8 Spoiler Discussion

[LicoriceAllsorts]

We have to assume Cloud just puts them hors de combat.
The question of why the Turks haven't brought Aerith in years ago, since they know where she lives, always hung over the OG. The Remake has addressed it, and gone with the most popular fan rationale. After all, if Aerith thinks Rude and Reno aren't all bad, then they really can't be all bad, can they?
I am looking forward to potential banter betwen Turks and Aerith in the Wutai section, if it still happens.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Reno calling Aerith princess and saying she already had a bodyguard was one for the Reno/Aerith shippers methinks!

 

[Tennyo]

People...ship Reno and Aerith?

Not there's anything wrong with that. It just seems kind of random.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

People ship the Shinra helicopter and Fenrir

Reno/Aerith is actually not that unusual

 

[Roger]

We have to assume Cloud just puts them hors de combat.
The question of why the Turks haven't brought Aerith in years ago, since they know where she lives, always hung over the OG. The Remake has addressed it, and gone with the most popular fan rationale. After all, if Aerith thinks Rude and Reno aren't all bad, then they really can't be all bad, can they?
I am looking forward to potential banter betwen Turks and Aerith in the Wutai section, if it still happens.

Reno definitely wasn't asking Aerith if she'd like to be brought in when she fell down from the balcony. They were gonna bring her whether she liked it or not, same with Rude. There's little point in Elmyra telling Aerith about Rude if he was just collecting the daily "no thank you, I'd like to continue my freedom". However long you feel the Turks protected Aerith, they've gone from quiet bodyguards to would be kidnappers by the time the game starts.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Indeed they have. The question, however, was why they didn't kidnap her years ago. The OG never explained it. The Remake has.

I'm going to stick my neck out even further here and say that we don't know for sure in the Remake that Reno has come to take her in. That's a holdover from the OG. He even says to Cloud, "You've got the wrong idea." Now, because of sound reproduction issues, I've never been able to hear their dialogue in its entirely so I might have missed something, but that line suggested to me that he might mean Cloud was wrong to assume Reno meant Aerith any harm.

After Cloud decimated Reno, Rude was sent in to see just what the hell was going on, and possibly to establish whether Aerith was still safe. The matter wasn't so pressing that it couldn't be put on hold while they dealt with the plate drop. They didn't definitively move to 'arrest' her until Tseng found her actively putting her life in danger.

 

[Roger]

Indeed they have. The question, however, was why they didn't kidnap her years ago. The OG never explained it. The Remake has.

What's the answer?

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

That she had to come willingly or it wouldn't work.
It's never explicitly stated, so anyone who likes is free to doubt it, but it seems clear to me that Shinra took her in at that particular moment in time because she was risking her own neck, running around in Sector 7, associating with terrorists. They allowed her an illusion of freedom until it became too dangerous; they can't risk losing their most precious asset.

 

[Roger]

That she had to come willingly or it wouldn't work.
It's never explicitly stated, so anyone who likes is free to doubt it, but it seems clear to me that Shinra took her in at that particular moment in time because she was risking her own neck, running around in Sector 7, associating with terrorists. They allowed her an illusion of freedom until it became too dangerous; they can't risk losing their most precious asset.

Reno was clearly gonna take her right then and there in church anyway, ignorant of who Cloud was.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

I'm not so sure about that. But like I said, I'd have to see all the dialogue to have a clearer idea. He certainly does warn the troopers not to harm a hair of her head, and he's not worried about pursuing her. Maybe because he's established that she's not in any immediate danger from Cloud?

 

[Roger]

I'm not so sure about that. But like I said, I'd have to see all the dialogue to have a clearer idea. He certainly does warn the troopers not to harm a hair of her head, and he's not worried about pursuing her. Maybe because he's established that she's not in any immediate danger from Cloud?

He also says "We bring her in, in one piece." And regardless of how poorly he briefed the troopers on not harming her before hand, it stands that they at least had a reason to think they had a reason to be going to the church that day?

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Fair enough, I forgot that line. I wonder what it was that made them decide on that particular day to end her freedom? At any rate, bringing her in wasn't their top priority.

 

[Theozilla]

Her disagreement is earnest enough that she is okay with Cloud killing her supposed own bodyguard's men on her behalf. It's not all fun and giggles with the Turks and Aerith is familiar enough to know that too.

I mean both the OG and Remake have always been kinda callous in the treatment of grunts. And as others have said death in the heat of combat is often viewed different than death after you soundly beat beat your opponent. And not every single win Cloud has against human opponents in the game are meant to indicate fatalities. Like in Chapter 3, the Shinra grunts Cloud and Tifa defeat are explicitly stated to not be dead, or Cloud’s many fights against Beck and his Bros or the Coliseum beast-master.
And in addition to all of that, as others have mentioned Aerith specifically begs Cloud not to kill Reno. That definitely indicates a past connection between the two that wasn’t completely antagonistic.

He also says "We bring her in, in one piece." And regardless of how poorly he briefed the troopers on not harming her before hand, it stands that they at least had a reason to think they had a reason to be going to the church that day?

“Bringing her in” doesn’t necessarily mean bringing Aerith to the Shinra building then and there, in the context of the scene, it was more in reference to bringing her in from the rogue company she was keeping. Additionally Rude tells Aerith to “go home” after the end of their fight (which was instigated largely because Rude was giving “payback” for Reno) that indicates to me that the Turks were initially intending to put Aerith under a house arrest with her mom (likely because of the plate drop going down that day/evening) before she got caught up in the Plate business with Avalanche.

 

[Roger]

I mean both the OG and Remake have always been kinda callous in the treatment of grunts. And as others have said death in the heat of combat is often viewed different than death after you soundly beat beat your opponent. And not every single win Cloud has against human opponents in the game are meant to indicate fatalities. Like in Chapter 3, the Shinra grunts Cloud and Tifa defeat are explicitly stated to not be dead, or Cloud’s many fights against Beck and his Bros or the Coliseum beast-master.
And in addition to all of that, as others have mentioned Aerith specifically begs Cloud not to kill Reno. That definitely indicates a past connection between the two that wasn’t completely antagonistic.

Reno specifically says he'll miss the last one you finish off though. He's sarcastic about missing him, but it nevertheless indicates that he is gone and therefore, Reno could miss him.

“Bringing her in” doesn’t necessarily mean bringing Aerith to the Shinra building then and there, in the context of the scene, it was more in reference to bringing her in from the rogue company she was keeping.

Brings us back what did Reno and the guards, and considerable team of backup think they were going into the church for before meeting Cloud. If Aerith knows them so well, why did she think to hire Cloud as bodyguard and sic him on them. Dead or not, Reno is definitely injured. Is it so hard to believe Aerith might have valid reasons to distrust the Turks' intentions based on prior experience?

Additionally Rude tells Aerith to “go home” after the end of their fight (which was instigated largely because Rude was giving “payback” for Reno) that indicates to me that the Turks were initially intending to put Aerith under a house arrest with her mom (likely because of the plate drop going down that day/evening) before she got caught up in the Plate business with Avalanche.

Telephone call that ends the Rude fight indicates Reno and Rude weren't clued into the plate drop until after their dealings with Cloud and Aerith.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Perhaps Rude and Reno were simply told to make sure Aerith went home and stayed there. Perhaps, at that point, they didn't need to know why. They follow orders; they don't always know the rationale behind those orders.

Aerith's relationship with the Turks remains as unreadable as always. There's evidence for both sides.

 

[Shademp]

People ship the Shinra helicopter and Fenrir

Who am I to judge the passions of two consenting roaring engines

 

[Theozilla]

Reno specifically says he'll miss the last one you finish off though. He's sarcastic about missing him, but it nevertheless indicates that he is gone and therefore, Reno could miss him.

Oh, I should have made myself more clear, I agree that Cloud likely killed most of the Shinra grunts he fought in the Church battles, I was just making a more general point about Cloud's wins against human opponents not always equally fatalities.

Brings us back what did Reno and the guards, and considerable team of backup think they were going into the church for before meeting Cloud. If Aerith knows them so well, why did she think to hire Cloud as bodyguard and sic him on them. Dead or not, Reno is definitely injured. Is it so hard to believe Aerith might have valid reasons to distrust the Turks' intentions based on prior experience?

Oh I don't disagree that Aerith distrusts the Turks, but Aerith distrusting the Turks and her having a more familiar/cordial relationship with the Turks (in the Remake) aren't mutually exclusive aspects their relationship can have.

Telephone call that ends the Rude fight indicates Reno and Rude weren't clued into the plate drop until after their dealings with Cloud and Aerith.

Like what LicoriceAllsorts said, Reno and Rude's jobs to secure Aerith doesn't require them to be in the know of the Plate operation for their duties to be in service/beneficial to said operation.

 

[Tennyo]

People ship the Shinra helicopter and Fenrir

Reno/Aerith is actually not that unusual

I've just never seen it before is all.

 

[looneymoon]

I haven't had a chance to play through the entire chapter yet, but Reno was the first boss I had to get on my second attempt. Tough motherfucker...

Also I love my pink wife can she not die this time pls

(jk)

Spoiler

or am I

 

[Rydeen]

People ship the Shinra helicopter and Fenrir

Reno/Aerith is actually not that unusual

Shame; I ship the Shinra helicopter with Hardy Daytona.

 

[looneymoon]

I just finished the chapter and...

 

[Jairus]

You know, Aerith's nice and all, but did they have to let her have her line about the date all while Cloud might've already had one planned with Jessie if he had accepted her invitation in Chapter 4? It's like it was totally forgotten about. I know that Aerith would've had no idea and no way to know, but the writers did. Couldn't they have had Cloud say something like "Already got one." if he had accepted Jessie's invite earlier? To show that he'd done that and make the choice matter just a little?

Also, did not one of the shops in Sector 5 have a phone Cloud could've borrowed to call the 7th Heaven? Curious oversight, if you ask me. Cloud and Aerith didn't even think of it, and he's meant to be this seasoned fighter while's she's a street smart flower girl. Supposedly. Not one person in the entire sector has a phone? Kinda reminds me of Marlene in AC:C getting on Vincent for not having one - "You don't have a phone!?"

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

It's like it was totally forgotten about.

Spoiler: (Chapter 12 spoiler)

He brings it up later himself, and that's regardless of what the player chose.

I know that Aerith would've had no idea and no way to know, but the writers did. Couldn't they have had Cloud say something like "Already got one." if he had accepted Jessie's invite earlier?

But now he's got two.

 

[Jairus]

Spoiler

Yeah, that's true. I just wish it had been mentioned earlier along with there, when Aerith had her line about the date. And I thought he was talking about how the guys covered for him by saying he wanted a pizza to himself. But that could've referred to the date just as easily. It just seems like the writers are trying to push Aerith in your face to make you forget all about Jessie. She only got one chapter to shine, and even that she had to share with Biggs and Wedge. She never got a solo one with Cloud like Aerith did. They didn't have to move on to Reactor 5 as soon as they did. They could've drawn the story out more to give more time with her and the rest of the trio.

That'd be a little awkward though, wouldn't it? Especially if both girls had found out about the other's date?

 

[looneymoon]

I understood that Tifa's invitation to celebrate with matching outfits was a coy way of getting Cloud out on a date too. So really, he's had this discussion with all 3 girls.