General writing fiction discussion thrad.

[CameoAmalthea]

Lic I love your post - I read the various points (and recognized several of them from Tumblr) and thought 'well, some people like doing these exercises, and I guess if you know your characters really well, they don't take much energy to write down' - then when I read the line beneath them I just went HNNG DERES A RAISIN I WANTED 2 B SHIPPD W/ LIC

Because I've often frowned upon these posts, going 'ugh I could never bother with that'. Like you say, does one really need headcanons for everything about your characters? A lot of it is culturally based as well, and thus doesn't really say anything (important) about the character - that he likes classical music might be a very telling thing in France, but not in the UK, etc. How a person sleeps could also be very life phase based. There are different and better ways to say something about your characters, like doing a drabble or writing a small piece of dialogue.

If you asked me to answer these question about the characters I feel I know the best (from Ally: Fran, Balthier, Claire, Snow, Louis) I wouldn't be able to answer half of these questions without pondering really hard on it - and what would it be worth? Unless I needed it for a story, that is. You need to have written a lot of words about your characters to know them well enough to know everything there is to know - and I don't think you ever do. Get to know them that well, I mean. I know my Ally characters well enough to write them decently, but I don't really feel like I know them well. Sometimes they just leave for vacation without saying a word.

Edit: AAAA BOTH OCTO AND DAWN POASTED AAAAAA NEED TO REED EVRYTHANG

I run an ask blog on Tumblr for Rufus Shinra. It's part cosplay, part written responses. (if anyone is curious AskcosplayRufusShinra.tumblr.com) I find that it's a helpful writing exercise because it forces me to really get inside the characters head and think about things I wouldn't consider and how they might reflect the character. For instance, someone asked for a picture of Rufus's computer's wallpaper and it made me think about what his computer might look like and what that might mean for him as a person. (I didn't answer because I didn't really know the answer/I'd need help doing a mock up). I liked the idea of him having a professional, plain background, and then imagined what he might have for his personal background, if he'd have something sentimental like a picture of a pet.

I think thought exercises can be fun, although I don't have a head canon for everything, I sort of want to know what Rufus's sleeping position would be and what that might say about him. All the intimate details tell you something about a character. But on the other hand, if everything is symbolic it might be a bit ridiculous.

Character A is a serious person, so he drinks hard liquor and black coffee. I don't think seriousness is linked to your taste buds. A playful character might love vodka and hate super sweet mixed drinks, a serious person might like their coffee drowned in cream and sugar. I think characters are more real if everything about them isn't symbolic or part of some characterization plan.

As a cosplayer, my friends and I would sometimes jokes around by bantering "in character". One of the first times I hung out with my Reno after meeting him at a con he stopped to pick up coffee beforehand and called to ask if I wanted anything, and I asked for a coffee with a ton of cream and sugar.

"If you're Rufus Shinra, shouldn't drink it black," he teased, "cause you're all scary and serious, yo."

To which I replied, slipping into character. "If I'm Rufus I'll take my coffee however I damn well please, and you won't question me Turk."

"Yes, sir," he said.

We laughed, and I thanked him so much for stopping to get me coffee and I was glad that we were able to work off each other so well and improv in character. And in truth, I have no idea how Rufus Shinra would actually take his coffee and it seems like a pretty pointless head canon to have, but I know how Rufus would respond to someone questioning his taste and I think that's more important than the details.

I'm more interested in a character's personality, and I feel like tastes don't reflect personality, actions do and reasoning do. Preferences can be useful springboards for exploring actions and reasons.

Actions:

Does Rufus Shinra like cats? Maybe/maybe not. That's not the interesting question.

The interesting question is a cat ran out in front of his car would he swerve to hit it, swerve to avoid it, or disregard it completely, and why? Would he take the time to pet a cat he came across or get one out of a tree.

It's how people respond to situations that interest me, not their tastes, taste is arbitrary and often not a subject to choice. I like chai lattes with a shot of espresso, the coffee taste buried by sugar, spice, and milk, if instead I only took my coffee black, it would make absolutely no difference to who I am as a person, so why would it matter for a character?

The exception to this is preferences which have reasons.

Reasons:

Are you a cat person or a dog person?

I'm a dog person.

You know nothing more about me now, except for this one preference.

If I say instead, I'm a dog person because dogs are useful. I chose a large, black dog that's shaped like a wolf, because I know that people are more likely to find black dogs, wolf shaped dogs, and large more intimidating, so all together, I chose a very intimidating dog. Having any dog with you (even a small breed) decreases your chance of being sexually assaulted. I feel safer with a dog, safer still with one I know strangers are likely to find intimidating. Dogs also provide constant companionship and will always want your attention, so a dog can provide comfort and reassurance, reducing anxiety. I trained my German Shepherd mix from a puppy and he is obedient. I like the control I have over my dog, that I can work with him, teach him, and have him await my command because this is a relationship is something I built. My dog loves me, obeys me, and helps me feel secure, whereas my cat loves me, and is good at killing pest. The dog has more overall utility.

From that paragraph you now can infer something about me/my personality. It's the same for characters I write. Their preference do not matter, but the reason for those preferences, if any, do.

I feel like these memes can be useful insofar as they force writers to consider how a character might react to something or why a character has a preference (i.e. actions and reasons). The character's habits or tastes may not have much worth in exploring, but if they are tied to reactions or reasoning there can be some value/useful characterization to be gained.

 

[Clement Rage]

The most common tropes encountered while writing and how you handle them

I dunno. I'm fond of 'earn your happy ending', for whatever that's worth, but if you start thinking in tropes you just tie yourself in knots. Tvtropes is useful for things like 'how does an RPG work', but in terms of a writing guide, not so much.

I do tend to focus on teeth for some reason. I think it came from writing stuff where everyone wore masks, so I couldn't describe their eyes. Teeth express emotion, and they're a very useful thing to injure, because they don't impede someone the same way losing a hand does, but they're a serious, permanent injury that can have significant effects.

Hours spent reading vs writing vs reading/writing about writing (research, writing meta, etc)

Less than I used to. I don't keep track. Currently trying to work my way down the 'fantasy novels featuring strong female characters' list on goodreads.com. As for reading about writing, the ones I have read are pretty similar. 'take it seriously, don't give up, crap I got hit by a car, that sucked.'

Favourite subjects when writing (both consciously and subconsciously) vs the subjects you want to be interested in writing

Dunno, probably semi deconstruction, exploring how things would really work.

Stories/ scenes you struggled the most with, and why

Particular scenes are mostly okay, my biggest issue is getting from place to place effectively. Pacing is very difficult, and the passage of time. And description.

Thoughts on self insert (imagining yourself (too much) in your character's place): Do you do it? Consciously? Sub-consciously?]

Hopefully not, but in all honesty, probably. I wrote several stories that amounted to basically the same story (random lackey suffers a lot), and bits of me do slip in (I love the sound of rain, so Character X did too).

Thoughts on feedback. What kind do you want, what kind do you leave, what kind do you useful, what kind do you find useless

Ideally, honesty. I always seem to attract exactly one devoted fan that sticks through the whole story. I have difficulty with positive feedback sometimes, I might not always believe it unless there's some negativity as well (relatively few fanfic reviewers will say 'you suck' to your face, or if they do, don't explain why) The feedback I leave ranges from broadly supportive to needlessly bitchy, but I'm working on that. I always try to say something, though, beyond 'good, keep it up'. On fanfiction, if someone reviews me right after I review them, I tend to think 'okay, did I earn that, or is it just tit for tat?' The people I show my original stuff to are usually family or close friends, who also have a vested interest in being... well, optimistic.

Do you outline carefully, or do you jump straight into it?

I don't start a story unless I know the end (mostly). Lots will change in transit, at least once I made a snap decision that completely altered the course of a storyline, but I have at least some idea how things will develop sometimes years before I do anything with it. I have several vague outlines of stories that have been abandoned or never started, but they're all in my head.

What wip/ work in progress do you currently have in store, how long have they been there and if you're having problems with some of them, why

Several fanfics that may never see daylight or be completed, including a murder mystery where Rufus Shinra plays detective after he loses the Turks, most of my existing incomplete works (apart from Rin's unfortunate day, that's in such bad taste that it's dead.) A fair few original works of varying quality, a WWII novella that people I showed it to liked but was too lazy to research properly, a romance that turns into a serial killer story and a 'cabin in the woods' axe murderer type thing, the last two of which nothing has been committed to paper. A long term legacy of Kain fanfic between BO1 and BO2, and probably some other stuff.

 

[CameoAmalthea]

• Stories/ scenes you struggled the most with, and why

I struggle with writing descriptively. Some authors paint a detailed world, whereas my writing tends to be mostly dialogue or interior monologue and actions (maybe I’d be better doing screen plays rather than prose). I spend most of my time thinking, so I’m rarely aware of the world around me unless I’m actively choosing to be aware (such as going to a garden or museum where the point is noticing your surroundings). Perhaps because of this, my stories don’t have as many descriptions because I’m more in tune with how people interact than how the world looks.

• Thoughts on self insert (imagining yourself (too much) in your character's place): Do you do it? Consciously? Sub-consciously?

In fanfiction, I think I’m drawn to characters with whom I can relate. My Nunchaku (Turk) is his own character, but he is a lot like me. I share aspects of my personality with him, because I relate to his outlook as an optimistic, cheerful person. My Rufus shares my darker personality traits, my assertiveness, my ability to calculating and controlling. I understand these characters through the lens of my own experiences, and how I might react and I think this makes them realistic. They’re not simply an avatar for me, because I’m different than them, but I give them a part of myself because I think it is the part of them I related to that drew me to write them in the first place.

For my original work, I don’t think my characters are like me because I have to put so much work into creating them and the things that makes them, them, which is more removed. I feel like writing fanfic is more like relating to a character/exploring their personality.

• On feedback. What kind do you want, what kind do you leave, what kind do you useful, what kind do you find useless

I leave very long drawn out comments telling you everything I think. Long and drawn out tends to sum up how I communicate (I think a lot, all the time, so I say a lot). As for what I want, I guess as much as possible. I want to know everything my readers think. What made them laugh, what made them cry, what made them frustrated, I wish I could watch my readers to read and see what gets a reaction, because I love the idea that my writing can move them. I want to engage with my readers in a conversation about the story, because I like that they might be as interested in it as I am. I just like to know my story is liked and why it’s liked.

This isn’t very useful, per se, but I enjoy it and it might get me thinking

Reviews I useless: "Write More" "Please Update" "More" "I can't wait for more"

I appreciate your enthusiasm, but being told to keep going doesn't inspire me to write more. I'd rather have questions, engagement than two word things like "loved it" or "more please".

Even if a reader disagrees with how I'm writing a character or misinterprets what I'm writing, I feel like I learn something from that and from what they want. I might not take all suggestions, but at least they're engaged and it's something to think about. All I get from simple praise is that they liked it, but I want to know how, what, when, where and why they liked it/liked about it.

• Drabbles, do you do them, and do you benefit from them? If so, what?

Yes, though most of my “drabbles” are literary (I have a degree in creative writing, and somehow all the training in literary fiction has resulted in literary fanfic oneshots). Most of
mine are character exploration, so I think that’s useful

• Do you outline carefully, or do you jump straight into it?

I just jump straight in and do not plan at all for the most part. I start with a scene I want to write then the rest is filling in how the characters got there and what happened afterwards, mostly making up what I fill in as I go along.

• What wip/ work in progress do you currently have in store, how long have they been there and if you're having problems with some of them, why

Everything I do is a WIP and some have been unfinished for years. Because I make this up as I go along, so I can only write when the story comes to me. Sometimes the inspiration leaves because I don’t know how to make a scene work or where it should go next or how to get from where I am now to where I want the story to go.

 

[Fangu]

@cam, on those memes

First I have to note that I do think we agree on a lot of these points given the examples you made - on how 'being a dog person' isn't interesting until you explain why this person is 'a dog person', what it means to them. (More on that in a paragraph below.)

As a cosplayer I assume you adapt some of the methods an actor would do - i.e. exploring various situations in everyday life, forcing you to constantly consider 'what would this character do in my shoes'. If you're using it for interaction, that's awesome. (As in a coffee question leading to a relation question, as with that Reno.) I can imagine actors to a bigger degree has to focus on 'anything micro' because everything they do is so transparent - posture, voice, down to how they shake someone's hand or drink their coffee. A writer doesn't have to be that detailed - they can, but writing isn't visual as acting, as visual art differs to writing (in my opinion): Visual art goes through interpretations through the eye, writing creates images based on how the reader interprets the words.

My problem is with the energy vs usefulness thing. I don't find those small exercises (as) useful (as other things). They force me to think, but not on things that I feel matter to the character (for writing a story, and finding their place in it).

Another large problem I have with a lot of these memes is the the (cultural) conditions already set. Why is it interesting to know which flavour of Pop-tart Basch would prefer? With that question, it's not just a matter of taste; it's a is Basch a person who would prefer strawberry Pop-tarts question - then what is a 'person who would prefer strawberry Pop-tarts'? What is a 'dog-person'? What is usual for a person who takes their coffee black? Often you might end up pondering over the meaning of a cultural pre-set condition (or even a trope - i.e. 'tough people take their coffee black') instead of the character themselves, which is a good exercise nevertheless, but not useful for characterization.

Some people find crossovers/ AU's interesting and like to imagine stuff like what kind of soda Legolas would drink, or where in class he would prefer sitting. While I think those exercises can make for some amusing headcanons, I don't find them (that) relevant for character building. I would rather think in more general terms - 'if Legolas was on the subway and someone told him his ticket wasn't valid, how would he argue?' is a much more interesting take on it, because then we're talking the core of human behaviour; how we relate to a situation of significance between people, in this case the scenario dissected: 'A person society has placed in power (here assuming people in general actually respect the person in power - this isn't a given) is claiming you don't have passage rights over a written document, while the fault lies within a third party (the ticket machine) difficult to prove - do you lose your shit, walk away quietly or argue loudly'?

If a meme was to ask me what colour Fran's sheets are (with that wanting a headcanon on 'if she lived in our world, would she have feminine linen or would she put on the first she could find) I'd slap a 'non interesting' on it right away. I have no idea what kind of linen they have available in Balfonheim, or in Ivalice for that matter - and I'd rather not spend energy pondering up the entire story of 'how Ivalice do their beds' - what I do know, however, is that her curtains are tattered, because she does not pay attention to expense other than in the weapon in her hand or the garb on her back. Now it's become an interesting headcanon, and not a non-interesting 'our world' cultural based one.

Also I need to write up my own answers but I can't do all of them cus too many words I might just pick a few of them, using replies from yous guys. I love this thread <3

Edit: This written at 4 am. Edited it some at 9 when I was awake. X)

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

The thing is, I don't even know the answer to these head-canon memes for myself a lot of the time, never mind my characters.

What are everybody's thoughts on the ethics of pinching someone else's head canon? I have done this a few times: it was Karunguni who (to my knowledge) first suggested that the Train Graveyard would be a great location for a party, and I borrowed this idea because I liked it and thought it should be fanon that the youth of Shinra held wild parties down there on a fairly regular basis; another fic I read (Cities of Poison?) had Reno playing with his EMR to make the hairs on his arms stand on end, and this seemed to me so exactly like something he would do that I borrowed it. In both instances I gave credit to the originators, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it turned out that I've unconsciously borrowed ideas from other fics and simply forgotten that the ideas weren't my own to begin with. I read so many fics. And I am pretty sure I have picked up bits and pieces of other people's headcanon on tumblr and made them my own.

 

[Fangu]

^ Oh, I've done that, both consciously (as a homage, then credited) and subconsciously - pretty much all of it from pendency's XII fic The 'taking hunts', 'Fran the mechanic' and some of her speech pattern was conscious, and credited as a note in one of the chapters. The Moogles having an attitude (and being partly discriminating), Balthier always piloting the Strahl, Fran and Balthier smoking strong stuff from a pipe, even use of certain words ('Balthier (...) as he pilots the ship down', Fran's heels clacking against the floor) were all subconscious. But I figured since I already credited her once, I'm fine.

If people were to start adapting my headcanons as theirs, I'd be flattered. Or, not even flattered - I see it as a natural part of reading and being inspired. (The question now is - Before Fran met Balthier, she used to smoke leaf with the Garif, right? )

Edit: Also that stuff with Tseng being all straight (not in terms of sexuality) and correct is from various VII fics, DIPOTP first and foremost. (I've been so into XII recently inspo for my VII fics didn't cross my mind. From XIII I've had none - I don't think I've ever fully read a XIII fic except for one Pan wrote.)

 

[Keveh Kins]

Kinda depends on what it is that's being borrowed for me. Some things have become so ingrained in the fandom that it's just pointless trying to track down the original source. Like how a lot of fanfics have Reno's surname being Sinclair. Couldn't tell you who originally wrote it as that and if the notion took me I'd probably use it without crediting anyone because it's used so frequently anyway. Forrester was another surname for Zack that popped up a lot.

If there was a particular quirk or action or line or something that I was using, I'd absolutely give credit to the originator and probably ask them for permission first (though that's possibly a bit excessive, but ah, courtesy and all that). If you're borrowing sort of general personality traits it's a bit trickier because it's so vague, I'd probably just acknowledge it with a "Inspired by suchandsuch" in an Author's note or something to that effect. So long as you're putting your own spin on it and not just transferring someone else's character pound for pound into your own work.

 

[Fangu]

Okay save for a couple of points I'll answer all of these now.

The most common tropes encountered while writing and how you handle them

Everything including heterosexual romance. Nothing brings me that feeling of 'I've seen this story 10,000,000 times before' like when trying to come up a story within the genre of het romance. Trying to make it original is hard as fuck - and making it realistic can end up making it dull. What I think makes it hard is that as humans, we don't really like to look at other couples smooching. There's a very fine line between self insert and distancing yourself from the characters, while still making it an interesting enough story - because as Clement Rage wrote in the Fandom thread: There's nothing really interesting about romance (or shipping) than can add anything to a character - or is there? I think there is (usually not enough to carry a story in itself, though, but that's a whole different rant) but it has to be tightly knitted with character and psychology while still subverting most of the common tropes.

Hours spent reading vs writing vs reading/writing about writing (research, writing meta, etc)

Typically:

Reading: 1
Writing: 4
Writing about writing: 10

Yeah I suck

Favourite subjects when writing (both consciously and subconsciously) vs the subjects you want to be interested in writing

I sorta feel like cheating as this is snipped from Tumblr:

Interests: Genders, discrimination, money vs value (are rich people really so privileged none of their emotional issues are valid? hard to write without going 90210 trope-style), parent (mommy) issues, self worth, bullying, loss of control (and fears related), group thinking/ politics, innocence, hindsight is 20-20, scenes with a lot of action, mind vs body, oppression, disaster, sickness, romance, birth, death, all in the mindset of &#8216;this is so important but so incredibly dull, how do I make it original/ interesting&#8217;.

Attractions: Forgetting about plot and smarts and just being in the mindset of a character and just typing them out, wherever that leads. Usually leads to writing about lessons learned, loneliness, sacrifices, spite, anger, jealousy, but also friendship (&#8216;regular&#8217;, family and romantic, &#8216;connection&#8217; is a better word).

'Porn' used to be first on this list (because of the comfort) and although I still occasionally feel like typing up a feel-good hnngmf scene, it doesn't attract me as much as it used to. But I know that it's a thing where both the reader and I can find comfort, and so I should write one once in a while, because after all, escapism is a wonderful thing.

Stories/ scenes you struggled the most with, and why

I'll make this short, and this is going to sound weird for all the smut I've written: Sex. That is, honest, realistic, first-time we finally had each other sex. Or: Realistic, first-time we finally had each other kiss. Or even a touch. Intimacy between two characters I know well, rather. Oh dear lord how I struggled - I must have written 15,000 words, deleting them all in queue ending up with 150.

Storywise I struggle with anything that's supposed to sound intelligent, or that demands research. I feel like a complete klutz. Intricate plotlines takes me forever to develop (which is why you rarely see them) - it's something I want to get better at, though.

Thoughts on self insert (imagining yourself (too much) in your character's place): Do you do it? Consciously? Sub-consciously?

I'm typing up a separate rant on this, so leaving it for later.

Thoughts on feedback. What kind do you want, what kind do you leave, what kind do you useful, what kind do you find useless

I'm gonna leave this for later as I'd like to rant on it, but the short version is - used to be scared of criticism, now I wish people would pepper me harder, almost to the point of bleeding and crying. I honestly don't believe my writing to be that good, which I think might end up with me insulting people when they say they think it's good. But honest to God and whatnot, I think I have a few good things going, but seriously - seriously! Yeah. See this isn't even about feedback. I need to gather my thoughts for this.

Drabbles, do you do them, and do you benefit from them? If so, what?

I do if I'm completely constipated and really, really want to take a crap Not that I find all drabbles shait, no, not at all; they can be brilliant little pieces of writing. (Not mine though, they tend to be hideous which is why I've only posted one on AO3.) What I mean to say is, they're really good for just getting started if you really have no place to start.

Do you outline carefully, or do you jump straight into it?

I'll just throw in a link to this post.

What wip/ work in progress do you currently have in store, how long have they been there and if you're having problems with some of them, why

I have none. I did start a Basch Gen story, but it halted in the drafting stage when I realized the character I intended for a vital scene isn't present at that point in the story Also there was some Vossler/Penelo, but that didn't get part bullet point stage. Also there was some Balthier&Fran friends only adventure story thing, but I want to make it action and mystery plot driven and that is still only in its thinking stage so all I have is a page of bullet points and random notes tossed in there. Generally, I tend to be very monogamous with my stories - I start them and work on them until they're posted. Somehow I find it hard changing between stories, but that's because I'm easily distracted and have a poor short-term memory.

That reminds me, I had a Claire '20 years later' one-shot I was thinking of drafting... it was inspired by a woman at work who is part of the family that used to run the business - her take on her role in the company is interesting and I thought I could use it for one of my OC's. It would be writing to get something off my chest though, and I'd rather write a *clever* story, but hey... I should just admit already my stories are character driven first and foremost, and that I might never get past that stage.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Why would being rich and privileged invalidate one's emotions?

I was going to ask you this question on tumblr, but I didn't want to bring the wrath of a hundred thousand teenage anti-privilege campaigners down on my head.

"Wealth", like beauty, is something that, barring extremes, lies in the eye of the beholder. I mean, I'm sure Bill Gates would agree that he is eye-poppingly rich, and everyone would agree that the people who work in the garment factories of Bangladesh for a dollar a day are poor. But I don't know anyone who personally considers themselves to be rich; pretty much everybody I know thinks they don't have enough money. This has led to some pretty ludicrous conversations, such as the time I had to sit at my friends' dining table listening to the two of them (both doctors) talk about how poor they are, while they had a Volvo and a Mercedes sitting in the driveway.

I don't really know where I'm going with this line of discussion... Maybe what I'm asking is: what defines the validity of one's emotions, one's objective wealth or one's perceived wealth? Who are we, really: am I the person I think I am, or am I the person other people perceive me to be?

As many of you know, I work in an independent school for girls. All my students (white, black, Indian, Asian, and First Nations) are therefore de facto privileged, and all of them come from families most people would consider "rich" (although you'd be surprised at some of their circumstances). There is the occasional spoilt brat amongst them, but they are for the most part caring, intelligent, motivated, aware, compassionate young citizens who take advantage of their privileged position to do fundraising for a range of causes and volunteer their time and skills to help their community. Alot of parents make sacrifices to keep their kids in our school - but then again, the kind of sacrifice we're talking about is a foreign holiday, a bigger house, or a fancier car, not food or the electricity bill (although, again, you'd be surprised).

The suggestion that these girls' emotions and feelings are invalid because they have money is one that I find hard to get my head around. Money doesn't protect you from feeling ugly, fat, stupid, unpopular, unloved, clumsy or a failure. In some ways it can make it worse. When you have every privilege, and you still fail, you really have nobody to blame but yourself, and there's nowhere to turn that anger but inwsrds.

 

[Fangu]

Why would being rich and privileged invalidate one's emotions?

Well - you sort of answered it already:

I was going to ask you this question on tumblr, but I didn't want to bring the wrath of a hundred thousand teenage anti-privilege campaigners down on my head.

I might just be brain damaged from being too much around teens on the Internet - teens, who, if they are anything like me and my friends were at that age, are ideologist and brave and have it all worked out magnificently in theory and I get the urge to explain, through storytelling, that things aren't peach perfect just for coming from a good family or growing up with any sort of privilege.

Whenever I see someone calling Balthier's psychological issues with his father 'a rich kid's daddy issues' I feel like slapping someone. Snippet from Tumblr: I guess that&#8217;s one of the major criticisms towards Balthier&#8217;s character, that he&#8217;s a &#8216;rich kid with daddy issues (who could have just gone home to his money)&#8217; - leading me to wanting to put that exact prejudice into Fran.

'Your problems aren't valid because you're privileged' is just a cheap, cheap way of taking the easy way out, justifying all your prejudice (and to some extent, hate) towards people who might be hurting just as much (or more) than you. Money does not solve all your problems. A lot of people have a hard time grasping this because they have an all-consuming struggle for money and believe that if they had money, all their problems would be solved. Human behaviour doesn't work that way.

"Wealth", like beauty, is something that, barring extremes, lies in the eye of the beholder.

Exactly. There's a reason you see children playing happily in the worst of slums. I'm not saying that's a reason to keep people in the slums, gods no - just that the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, no matter how the fence and the two patches of grass look like in the first place.

Money doesn't protect you from feeling ugly, fat, stupid, unpopular, unloved, clumsy or a failure. In some ways it can make it worse. When you have every privilege, and you still fail, you really have nobody to blame but yourself, and there's nowhere to turn that anger but inwsrds.

Amen. Also I think a lot of rich kids are under severe pressure because of the social rules some people with too much money tend to build around themselves. Which brands to we buy, which people do we speak to and not... I've seen kids from the West Side of the city I live in and some of them are so magnificently awful I can't even begin to imagine the social pressure they're living under. They represent an image for their family name, like you say, in some ways it can make it worse. Connecting it to writing (fanfic),

Spoiler

I wish I'd explored the Lhusu family in Ally more because I really wanted to say something about 'rich kids' with this story (with Claire in particular, but also Balthier). People tend to wish Archades City would just burn because 'the NPC's are so petty' but they're just people like everyone else.

 

[Keveh Kins]

Eh, apologies for butting in here but the notion that being privileged invalidates emotions or perspectives or what have you is, if I'm using me polite words, highly reductionist at best, and if I'm using me own words, a load o' shite.

I'm by no means guiltless in this in that I often make joking fun of the privileged people I know for being privileged. Partly due to County rivalries. The saying up home is that you can tell a privileged Dub from a poor Dub because the privileged one'll be walking funny from having their head up their arse all the time. But even still I would never in serious conversation assume their feelings to be invalid because of their wealth. Truth be told most of the folks I know who were born into privileged families go out of their way not to define themselves by their wealth, and the few that do and flaunt it and look down on others, sure who'd waste their time on them? Ye'd get more stimulating people in a morgue.

I think the stigma around wealth and invalidity arises from people like that, who are so up themselves about being privileged that they have the emotional understanding of a plank and folks being folks, we just lump all privileged people into that stereotype.

 

[Octo]

It depends on the circumstances. Are we talking about specific characters here? Being rich in and of itself doesnt solve everyones problems, nor does it make someone happy by default. However wealth does mean that you dont have the same concerns on a daily basis that ordinary folk do.

Depending on what the characters attitude to ordinary people makes all the difference to me, if someone is rich and sneers upon/seeks to control ordinary people then that makes them unsympathetic in my eyes. I find them unlikeable and hard to care about.


The flip side is that poor/average people fetishize wealth somewhat - they themselves believe that it is a magic wand - so they find it impossible to concieve how someone who could jet off to Barbados on a whim could possibly be unhappy.

 

[Clement Rage]

Okay save for a couple of points I'll answer all of these now.


Everything including heterosexual romance. Nothing brings me that feeling of 'I've seen this story 10,000,000 times before' like when trying to come up a story within the genre of het romance. Trying to make it original is hard as fuck - and making it realistic can end up making it dull. What I think makes it hard is that as humans, we don't really like to look at other couples smooching. There's a very fine line between self insert and distancing yourself from the characters, while still making it an interesting enough story - because as Clement Rage wrote in the Fandom thread: There's nothing really interesting about romance (or shipping) than can add anything to a character - or is there? I think there is (usually not enough to carry a story in itself, though, but that's a whole different rant) but it has to be tightly knitted with character and psychology while still subverting most of the common tropes.

Rule of thumb regarding privilege: Never laugh at anyone's problems immediately. Maybe it seems stupid to you, but it hurts them. That should be enough to at least take it seriously, you never know how fragile someone is


Typically:

Reading: 1
Writing: 4
Writing about writing: 10

Yeah I suck


I sorta feel like cheating as this is snipped from Tumblr:

Interests: Genders, discrimination, money vs value (are rich people really so privileged none of their emotional issues are valid? hard to write without going 90210 trope-style), parent (mommy) issues, self worth, bullying, loss of control (and fears related), group thinking/ politics, innocence, hindsight is 20-20, scenes with a lot of action, mind vs body, oppression, disaster, sickness, romance, birth, death, all in the mindset of &#8216;this is so important but so incredibly dull, how do I make it original/ interesting&#8217;.

Attractions: Forgetting about plot and smarts and just being in the mindset of a character and just typing them out, wherever that leads. Usually leads to writing about lessons learned, loneliness, sacrifices, spite, anger, jealousy, but also friendship (&#8216;regular&#8217;, family and romantic, &#8216;connection&#8217; is a better word).

'Porn' used to be first on this list (because of the comfort) and although I still occasionally feel like typing up a feel-good hnngmf scene, it doesn't attract me as much as it used to. But I know that it's a thing where both the reader and I can find comfort, and so I should write one once in a while, because after all, escapism is a wonderful thing.


I'll make this short, and this is going to sound weird for all the smut I've written: Sex. That is, honest, realistic, first-time we finally had each other sex. Or: Realistic, first-time we finally had each other kiss. Or even a touch. Intimacy between two characters I know well, rather. Oh dear lord how I struggled - I must have written 15,000 words, deleting them all in queue ending up with 150.

Storywise I struggle with anything that's supposed to sound intelligent, or that demands research. I feel like a complete klutz. Intricate plotlines takes me forever to develop (which is why you rarely see them) - it's something I want to get better at, though.


I'm typing up a separate rant on this, so leaving it for later.


I'm gonna leave this for later as I'd like to rant on it, but the short version is - used to be scared of criticism, now I wish people would pepper me harder, almost to the point of bleeding and crying. I honestly don't believe my writing to be that good, which I think might end up with me insulting people when they say they think it's good. But honest to God and whatnot, I think I have a few good things going, but seriously - seriously! Yeah. See this isn't even about feedback. I need to gather my thoughts for this.


I do if I'm completely constipated and really, really want to take a crap Not that I find all drabbles shait, no, not at all; they can be brilliant little pieces of writing. (Not mine though, they tend to be hideous which is why I've only posted one on AO3.) What I mean to say is, they're really good for just getting started if you really have no place to start.


I'll just throw in a link to this post.


I have none. I did start a Basch Gen story, but it halted in the drafting stage when I realized the character I intended for a vital scene isn't present at that point in the story Also there was some Vossler/Penelo, but that didn't get part bullet point stage. Also there was some Balthier&Fran friends only adventure story thing, but I want to make it action and mystery plot driven and that is still only in its thinking stage so all I have is a page of bullet points and random notes tossed in there. Generally, I tend to be very monogamous with my stories - I start them and work on them until they're posted. Somehow I find it hard changing between stories, but that's because I'm easily distracted and have a poor short-term memory.

That reminds me, I had a Claire '20 years later' one-shot I was thinking of drafting... it was inspired by a woman at work who is part of the family that used to run the business - her take on her role in the company is interesting and I thought I could use it for one of my OC's. It would be writing to get something off my chest though, and I'd rather write a *clever* story, but hey... I should just admit already my stories are character driven first and foremost, and that I might never get past that stage.

Not quite what I said, (or what I meant to say, at least.) I have nothing against romance generally, there are innumerable brilliant romances. But, when a character dynamic already exists that's not romantic in the specific fandom, throwing in a romance may take away from that relationship rather than enhance it, or at least subordinate it when its already established to be other than a romantic relationship. But lots of close friendships end up as romances when they work ultimately better as they are.

Rule of thumb: If someone has a problem, take it seriously until you have a reason not to.

 

[CameoAmalthea]

If you&#8217;re interested in writing about privileged people, I really recommend the documentary &#8220;Born Rich&#8221;.

It&#8217;s made by the heir to the Johnson and Johnson fortune who did the project interviewing his super rich friends about their experiences as heirs and heiresses to vast fortunes, basically using his access to the world of the rich to document it. He&#8217;s also made a follow up documentary called &#8220;The One Percent&#8221; which I had not seen.

I watched &#8220;Born Rich&#8221; as research since my favorite characters, Nunchaku (Turk) and Rufus Shinra, are both from very wealthy families and I thought I could get some insight into their mindset. It was really helpful to me in writing Nunchaku, who is a very interesting character since he&#8217;s very wealthy and privileged without being the &#8220;evil rich boy&#8221; stereotype (he&#8217;s a sweet heart, and a Turk, it&#8217;s weird).

As for my take on socio-economic privilege, hereafter referred to as simply privilege, is perhaps the most easy to see form of privilege but can still be invisible because if you have privilege you may take it for granted. As Licorice points out, people who by other&#8217;s standards are well off thinking themselves poor. We are unaware of our possession and what other people lack.

Full disclosure, I have a back ground in social justice studies as part of my pre-law thematic major. I originally went to law school with an eye towards becoming a social justice or civil rights attorney. This desire stemmed from growing up the daughter of mentally ill disabled junkie single mother in the projects and being exposed to injustice and inequality. I wanted to fight it, and so I worked my whole life to get into law school. (I&#8217;m currently hoping to do copy right because human right law breaks my heart; I&#8217;m a bit too empathetic it turns out). But I just want to be clear with this back ground, that my take on privilege is shaped by my own experiences growing up poor and often being around very wealthy people in my adult life (and sometimes feeling like the odd one out because of it) and from academic understanding of privilege.

Spoiler: My take on Privilege as a concept

When I explain privilege to people, I do it in terms of DnD because I&#8217;m huge nerd and it&#8217;s easy to conceptualize. In DnD you roll dice to determine if your character can do a given action. Privilege is getting an extra dice to roll that add to your score. So you&#8217;re applying for a job, roll a D20, if you&#8217;re a man you get an extra dice, if you&#8217;re white you get an extra dice, if you&#8217;re wealthy you get an extra dice, etc. Privilege means you&#8217;re better off than you would be otherwise, but it doesn&#8217;t mean rolls will be easy or that you&#8217;ll always get your target, or that it&#8217;s your fault (you didn&#8217;t ask for extra dice, and some people earn extra dice by moving up in the world financially).

Does privilege mean your feelings are invalid?

No.

If you&#8217;re poor and your mom dies, that hurts. If you&#8217;re rich and your mom dies, that hurts. Feelings are equally valid.

However, the poor person may be worse off.

A rich girl&#8217;s mother dies. She mourns the death, but continues with her life looked after by her father or other relatives or the butler (if she&#8217;s Batman). She can afford tutors for school and college entrance exams; she gets into college, and can afford to pay for it. Because she&#8217;s rich, she&#8217;s grown up in social circles with professionals and knows how to network, make contacts, and land a good job.

Her mother&#8217;s death hurt. It was the loss of a parent. Her pain is real.

A poor girl&#8217;s mother dies. Her father left the family long before that and there&#8217;s no one there to take her in. She&#8217;s placed in a group home. She does poorly in school because of grief, losing her home and the conditions in the group home that are rife with bullying. She runs away. While on the streets she&#8217;s picked up by a pimp who offers her money and place to stay, and many of the female victims of sex trafficking start out as runaways and you see where this goes.

I know because I did a research paper in a upper level criminal justice class on sex trafficking. This story happens. I&#8217;m not saying every poor girl will end up a bad situation, but that the loss of a parent for a poor girl could have greater negative effects because she starts out in a worse place.

Her mother&#8217;s death hurt. It was the loss of parent. Her pain is real. The lasting consequences of the loss may be greater, but her pain is no more valid.

Everyone&#8217;s pain is valid.

Spoiler: personal anecdote which involves suicidal thoughts and terminal illness

A couple years ago a friend publically on facebook said she was &#8220;sick of my drama&#8221; and didn&#8217;t want anything to do with me, after I got upset that I hadn&#8217;t heard from her and asked around if it was because she&#8217;d started dating my ex-girlfriend. This hurt a lot because I&#8217;m terrified of being abandoned/not being liked because my birth mother abandoned me at age 12 and no one wanted to adopt me. So I had this fear that something is wrong with me, everyone will leave me, I&#8217;m a bad person.

So I feeling almost suicidal, and did the same thing and went to a relative&#8217;s house and talked about everything with my aunt. And I&#8217;m breaking down over lost friendships and relationship drama with my ex and crying on her shoulder. And the thing is, at the time, she&#8217;s recently been diagnosed with end stage liver disease.

This occurred to me, and I said. I must sound so selfish to be thinking about killing myself over this. To be going on about my problems, which are nothing compared to being told you have a terminal disease.

My aunt told me &#8220;No, your pain is just as real to you and important to you, as mine is to me. No ones pain is worse.&#8221;

I think the issues some people have with privileged people is that because they are privileged they may take certain things for granted and come off as entitled.

Rich kids who say &#8220;My parents didn&#8217;t buy me a car when I turned 16, they&#8217;re totally abusive and don&#8217;t care about me.&#8221; (And I&#8217;ve heard from college students, not just teenagers being self absorbed because they&#8217;re teenagers).

I had a roommate who cussed out her father for not changing all the tires on her car sooner because now she had a flat (which her father paid for, so I don&#8217;t know why she was so upset). And I think I did resent her to some extent, because she did not understand how much she had and would have to worry about what I did, if I got a flat tire it would be devastating, because I can&#8217;t call anyone to lend me the money to fix it. The fact she was ungrateful bothered me.

Getting stabbed in the leg is terrible for everyone. Getting stabbed in the leg without health care and getting a $6,000 bill is worse.

I don&#8217;t think privileged people&#8217;s feelings are invalid, but that their problems are not as bad as they would be otherwise.

Aside from the four years I lived with guardians, I&#8217;ve never been anything more than poor, though I live well enough thanks to student loans which I&#8217;ll spend the rest of my repaying. I&#8217;ve probably had to worry about things other people haven&#8217;t, I could never take basic necessities for granted. I&#8217;ve had run the same race when it feels like other people have a running start. That doesn&#8217;t mean the well off kids whose parents paid for their schooling didn&#8217;t work hard or that their problems aren&#8217;t real.

The only time I&#8217;ll ever get annoyed at the privileged is when they don&#8217;t realize how fortunate they are.

Spoiler: example

I had a friend who owed me money because we put a hotel room at a con on my credit card (I have a credit card because I&#8217;ve been on my own since 18 and I&#8217;ve built my own credit my spending and paying it off each month, since her parents pay for everything, she never needed a credit card).

She didn&#8217;t have enough money to pay me back because her parents gave a monthly stipend to live off of so she was waiting for her monthly check. Then she said, &#8220;so guess what, my dad&#8217;s getting me the complete sailor moon collection, and then I get 500 dollars from my mom.&#8221; And I said that&#8217;s great and said, hey since you have some extra money now, can I have the money you owe me (I live on a tight budget since I live off student loans). She said &#8220;How dare you ask me for my birthday money. It&#8217;s a gift for me to use on what I want. You can&#8217;t take someone&#8217;s birthday gift! You just don&#8217;t understand because you don&#8217;t have parents and don&#8217;t get birthday gifts.&#8221;

Yes, I don&#8217;t, or Christmas gifts, and if I do get a gift any extra money goes into my account to be budgeted, and things I want I get when I have enough extra. Her parents wound up getting her a WiiU and she continued to complain about not being able to afford a PS4. I couldn&#8217;t emphasize with her pain, because I come from a place where new clothes are a luxury.

When write wealthy characters, I like to write the interacting with less well off characters and playing with how they inadvertently come off privileged in terms of taking things for granted that would be out of reach for others. I also like to explore the feelings and problems that people have even if they have everything. Like my Nunchaku is extremely rich, and comes from a very functional, loving and supportive family and could have done absolutely anything he wanted in life and had anything. He struggles to find a purpose and meaning in a world where everything has been handed to him, and it&#8217;s an interesting and valid story to tell. Just as much as the story of someone like Knives who suffered a lot more given her background.

My point is everyone has their own problems. They are all valid. I have no issues with the privileged people, though I do wish people would recognize how lucky they are and not take their wealth, or parents for granted.

 

[Fangu]

When write wealthy characters, I like to write the interacting with less well off characters and playing with how they inadvertently come off privileged in terms of taking things for granted that would be out of reach for others. I also like to explore the feelings and problems that people have even if they have everything.

Nobody has everything. Even Nunchaku's parents looked at him as a baby and went 'aww maybe he'll become a financial analyst, he's so smart'.

Rich kids who say &#8220;My parents didn&#8217;t buy me a car when I turned 16, they&#8217;re totally abusive and don&#8217;t care about me.&#8221; (And I&#8217;ve heard from college students, not just teenagers being self absorbed because they&#8217;re teenagers).

That's what they're saying, and it might sound bizarre. But what they're really saying is 'the other kids' parents, who are ~ as wealthy as us, are giving their children something that mine choose not to give me.' It doesn't matter if this is a pair of jeans, a car, or a yacht.

Let me try to explain my thoughts behind this.

I had a roommate who cussed out her father for not changing all the tires on her car sooner because now she had a flat (which her father paid for, so I don&#8217;t know why she was so upset). And I think I did resent her to some extent, because she did not understand how much she had and would have to worry about what I did, if I got a flat tire it would be devastating, because I can&#8217;t call anyone to lend me the money to fix it. The fact she was ungrateful bothered me.

I've seen you respond to posts on Tumblr when people complaining over their parents restricting their Internet access or something minor like that with 'but at least you have parents. You should stop being ungrateful and instead embrace your privilege.' Let me try to explain how I see this situation from both our ends.


The thing is - we can both agree on that if there's one thing money will give you, it's security. And I can understand how you might see kids with access to this security as ungrateful when they get upset over a flat tire when she had access to financial aid in the form of a family member.

Another thing I assume you might think money provides you with, is unlimited choice. You have access to various opportunities people without money don't: Schools, where to live, where to go on holiday, or, of course, even if you can go at all.

The thing is, choice is a tricky concept. I can understand why someone who grew up without access to money in the form of a family member can have issues believing that a person with money can have limited choices.

And here's the thing. Money, even from family members, doesn't come without ties. It doesn't come without expectations. It doesn't come without involving feelings like guilt, worry, stress. It's not a matter of 'oh son, you had a flat tire again? No worries, here, have some cash, buy a new one!' No, it's 'you had a flat tire again? Aren't you being careful enough? You are not getting more money!' which, I assume, to you is a way of a parent showing they care (and something you would, perhaps, choose over your own situation) which is part of it but in a very complex way, but for the child, it's stress. Parents expect us to do well, to work, to be successful, to have grandchildren. Even a loving, understanding parent has expectations that can become a burden. People with access to doing everything aren't free to do whatever, because there is a price. Nobody wants to be the black sheep, that one child that is neither of their parent's favourite.

So let me make the bold statement that what's at play here is not just having a separate take on money, you have a separate take of what family represents. Don't underestimate the problems that comes with parental expectations. There's a reason it's a huge topic in all kinds of literature, films and TV shows, plus a huge topic within psychology. Our relationship to our parents, if we have them, or not, if we don't, play a huge part of our personality.

Yes, money through family gives you security, but it is not without a price.
Yes, money through family gives you choices, but they are limited.

Should you choose to see these as less stressing or likely to cause 'pain' than a person with a lack of access to these resources, that is fair enough. But I still say this is from a lack of understanding from your end.

Let me use your own example as an example.

The only time I&#8217;ll ever get annoyed at the privileged is when they don&#8217;t realize how fortunate they are.

Spoiler: example

I had a friend who owed me money because we put a hotel room at a con on my credit card (I have a credit card because I&#8217;ve been on my own since 18 and I&#8217;ve built my own credit my spending and paying it off each month, since her parents pay for everything, she never needed a credit card).

She didn&#8217;t have enough money to pay me back because her parents gave a monthly stipend to live off of so she was waiting for her monthly check. Then she said, &#8220;so guess what, my dad&#8217;s getting me the complete sailor moon collection, and then I get 500 dollars from my mom.&#8221; And I said that&#8217;s great and said, hey since you have some extra money now, can I have the money you owe me (I live on a tight budget since I live off student loans). She said &#8220;How dare you ask me for my birthday money. It&#8217;s a gift for me to use on what I want. You can&#8217;t take someone&#8217;s birthday gift! You just don&#8217;t understand because you don&#8217;t have parents and don&#8217;t get birthday gifts.&#8221;

Yes, I don&#8217;t, or Christmas gifts, and if I do get a gift any extra money goes into my account to be budgeted, and things I want I get when I have enough extra. Her parents wound up getting her a WiiU and she continued to complain about not being able to afford a PS4. I couldn&#8217;t emphasize with her pain, because I come from a place where new clothes are a luxury.

Money, to you, represents a breather. It represents a feeling of safety for the next few days. It represents a meal on the table, one less bill to worry about. A gift consisting of money helps out meeting this needs that in the end of the day keeps you alive.

To your friend, however, a gift of money doesn't represent the same thing. It represents a freedom of choice. It represents 'hey daughter, take this money, and for once, we won't tell you what you should do with it. You don't have to spend it on rent or food. We might not even ask you what you did with it. This money is yours, to do whatever you want, guilt free, no expectations.'

That money represents two very different things to the both of you. Is your opinion of that money really more valid than hers?

Her parents might pay school for her, but there are rich kids who choose to get mortgages instead of accepting their parents' pay. I put myself in debt instead of taking money from my mother for reasons like this. I could not handle the emotional tie that came with that money.

It might sound bizarre suggesting you own a freedom she could never have, and it might be a bold thing to say. But consider it for a second. There's an uniqueness to you, to your story. You represent a strength rich kids from money will never be able to claim. There's an integrity and a strong will behind everything you have done and do, you have done and are doing really well for someone who didn't have access to aid. Everything you do is believable because what you choose to do with your life, you have chosen for yourself. You'll make a lawyer with an integrity no money could buy.

I'm not suggesting that's a privilege in any way. Just, as I said, making a bold statement, and I'm really sorry if this post offended you in any way.

 

[Ghost X]

Should you choose to see these as less stressing or likely to cause 'pain' than a person with a lack of access to these resources, that is fair enough. But I still say this is from a lack of understanding from your end.

That money represents two very different things to the both of you. Is your opinion of that money really more valid than hers?

Not sure if I'm interpreting you correctly (this is my disclaimer, if so ), and I really hope I am missing the point. Seeing these two paragraphs above makes me suspect I am not though.

Both pains are valid by mere definition, but for the sake of argument, even if the pain of the #firstworldproblems vs #thirdworldproblems we're talking about are equal on a psychological level, it doesn't mean I should sympathise with the former equally as I would the latter. That is just absurd.

There is one person who uses money for survival, and the other who uses it for luxury. The former uses money to survive, and on top of that wants a repayment of their loan (as it is the only moral thing to do)... yes, I'd find her opinion of that money more valid.

 

[Fangu]

If you want to get into argumentation (let's do that instead of start calling each other's arguments absurd): A situation where a 'survivalist' lends money to someone 'in privilege' would have never occurred if the 'survivalist' was in dire need of that money. If that was the case, the 'survivalist' should have said no and asked the 'privileged' person to find money somewhere else. They had a payback plan that hadn't been broken - everything was according to plan. That's why I'm having problems with your line of argumentation.

I was merely offering an explanation into the minds of privileged kids, anyway. I'm not defending anyone's behaviour. I don't want to put in a 'I would have done it differently' in there because that's not the point.

 

[Ghost X]

If you want to get into argumentation (let's do that instead of start calling each other's arguments absurd)

But... but... you asked only a couple of posts ago to be peppered harder :p.

Survivalists are allowed to have short-term surpluses and still be deemed survivalists. They can also give said surpluses away to perceived friends in need in the form of a loan. From my admittedly anecdotal experiences, this seems to be common amongst wage slaves . To borrow a little from your argument too, rich people can be tight on liquid cash, and may lack choice on who they can borrow from .

I see no mention of this payback plan you talk of, unless you have more information than I. The way I see this social contract panning out is: "Hey, I have some money you can borrow, but as soon as you can pay it back, do so as I'll be needing it." It is certainly not ethical to be parading around luxuries to your buddy when you have a loan to pay to said buddy.

Anyways, I suspect we're getting off topic. Someone ask more questions .

 

[Octo]

I have one. Basically its regarding pairings and my not so secret belief that interest in a pairing is down to having an attraction for one or both characters and/or an identfication for one or both characters.

Basically do you find it harder to write about characters youre not attracted to? This probably only applies to fanfic ofc.

 

[CameoAmalthea]

It depends on the pairing. For me, I tend to pair based on dynamic and interest in the character. Rufus Shinra isn&#8217;t exactly my type (he&#8217;s attractive, they&#8217;re all attractive) but he interests me as a character. I like Rufus/Tseng because I like how Licorice wrote it, the dynamic, personalities, histories, how they interact. Basically, shipping is about the relationship. I don&#8217;t usually think of character A is attractive, and character B is attractive, let&#8217;s put them together because it&#8217;s pretty. The exception is Reno/Cissnei, because I feel like if you bred them you&#8217;d get Axel from KH but at that point I&#8217;m just treating them like chocobos and pairing by color.

I mean, there are pairings I ship that I don't write about because I wouldn't want to see it. Like Jamba and Pleakly from Lilo and Stitch are a very interesting couple, but they're aliens so no appeal there. As for non-physical attraction, attraction to their personality, I don't know, I write about characters I like, who I find interesting, but that's the same for shipping and non shipping.

Spoiler: in response to Fangu

Oh honey, don&#8217;t worry. I&#8217;m not offended. (I don&#8217;t get offended easily). I really appreciate you taking the time to share your perspective. I realize that my perspective limited to my experiences and that I can be biased against people who have parents because I can&#8217;t relate to their problems and had to form a different set of values.

I think no one is right or wrong, everyone just has their own needs and we should endeavor to understand where other people are coming from. Sometimes it&#8217;s hard when you&#8217;re in the moment, because we see the world through what we know, the lens of our feelings and needs. Hearing your perspective allows me to step away from myself and better understand others.

And I&#8217;ve heard before that I&#8217;m lucky not to have parents. My best friend&#8217;s parents do not accept xe&#8217;s sexuality or gender presentation, and always seem critical of everything xe does/do not accept or respect xer ability to make xer own decisions as an adult. &#8220;why are you wasting time getting two master degrees if you don&#8217;t know you can get a job&#8221; and at the same time hold xer up to make xer little sister feel inadequate &#8220;your sister has two master&#8217;s degrees in forensics and you don&#8217;t even want to start college, what&#8217;s wrong with you?&#8221; Which sort of pits them against each other and makes everyone unhappy. At least for me, I can make my own choices and my own mistakes.

I was getting my hair done today and chatting about perspectives after law school and I said, well if I can&#8217;t find a job in this market, I could join the military as a military lawyer but I&#8217;d have to go through boot camp and might be stationed abroad. And she said, &#8220;Yes, and your parents might not like that&#8221; and I said &#8220;oh I don&#8217;t have parents, so it&#8217;s just me&#8221; and she said &#8220;oh that&#8217;s lucky, I wish I could do that&#8221;. I have freedom because I&#8217;m in charge of my own life and honestly, I like the &#8220;that&#8217;s lucky&#8221; more than &#8220;oh I&#8217;m so sorry&#8221;. It&#8217;s a different way to be rather than something lacking. I have my own troubles and my own benefits. I&#8217;ve had to police myself and I&#8217;m strict with myself, guilty with myself, pushing myself (I&#8217;ve always been you must do well in school, if you don&#8217;t get into college, get into law school, get a job you&#8217;ll end up in a terrible situation, work harder) but I feel like sometimes I&#8217;m trying to prove to the world that I&#8217;m worthwhile because I don&#8217;t have parents whose approval I need to meet, it&#8217;s what can I do to be respectable all the time. But at the end of the day, everything is my choice and even the consequences are mine to manage. No one will be disappointed in me but me, and I&#8217;m more likely to be sympathetic because I understand my reasons.

I also think that in terms of lending money, I should learn not to lend money unless I don&#8217;t care when it&#8217;s paid back. I&#8217;m very generous to an unhealthy degree. I spend every bit of discretionary funds I have on other people, be it lending money that may not be repaid right away or at all or buying lavish presents for other people because I want to make them happy. I need to stop, because I spend more than I can afford and I have this mind set where I look after other people before my own priorities. I need to stop and step one is acknowledging that if I lend someone money I can&#8217;t resent them if they don&#8217;t pay me back at the expense of what they want to do. If I couldn&#8217;t afford not to have the money in my account, then I shouldn&#8217;t have lent it. Learning to not put others first has been difficult me, but I&#8217;m working on it.

And too be clear, I feel like no one chooses what they have, my boyfriend has very wealthy parents, he travels all over the world, and they support him (he&#8217;s an artist and lives at home with them while he tries to figure out what he can do to earn a living from what he loves). It comes at a price. His family doesn&#8217;t know about us, because if they disapprove of it and cut him off, he&#8217;s screwed, also his father is an extremely prominent and powerful lawyer in the area I want to go into, so I have reservations about him finding out about us in case he disapproved. I&#8217;m out about him online, but not on facebook or anywhere IRL people might know. I wouldn&#8217;t have this issue if his parents weren&#8217;t wealthy, powerful people.

I guess what I love about my boyfriend though (aside from everything, he&#8217;s basically Nunchaku personality wise, totally sweet heart), is that the way he looks at things is &#8220;I&#8217;m really lucky, because without my parents I don&#8217;t know if I could make it. My parents are rich, I&#8217;m a bum living on their kindness and I appreciate it&#8221;. It&#8217;s when children seem to act like it&#8217;s their parent&#8217;s job to take care of everything and give them everything that I get annoyed. It&#8217;s not that my friend with the flat tire was upset she got a flat that upset me so much that she was cussing her father out for not replacing all her tires sooner.

 

[Octo]

Going to rant a bit here.

Whats the deal with excessive tagging on Ao3? Seriously. Like ok, I get that you should tag the main characters or pairings, and if there is going to be violence or sex. And I suppose there should be flags for particular kinks (So I can avoid Mpreg like the fucking plague!)

But people seem to get totally carried away to the point where they've more or less told the entire fucking plot in the tags and then I find I don't even need to read it. I have to admit that in the past I have disregarded a fic because of how it was tagged, and then gone back to it later to find that it was actually quite good but the tags made it look fucking shit. I cant be the only one.

And while we're on the subject, it pisses me off how specific people are on the 'trigger warnings' Like just say: 'contains sexual violence' - that is good enough for the BBC, you don't have to specify what kind of sexual violence - it makes me suspect its catering to kinks rather than concern for peoples well being.

Yeah, with tags - less is more IMO - anything else people can just put a note at the start of the fic.

/rant

 

[Fangu]

^

fuckyeahfanficflamingo

 

[Cabaret]

I think people who write fanfiction, largely do it because they want comments and over tagging is a way to attract a wider reader audience.

I don't think it's a bad thing to want comments, who doesn't love recognition for their work? Fanfiction is a platform with a lot of comment traffic because people share their interpretation of an established story/characters and readers who feel just as passionately about the story/characters are great for giving comments. It's a win win situation imo, but it will always lead to over tagging too!

 

[Dawnbreaker]

While I can agree that it's nice to get comments and I get a little boost to the self-esteem everytime I get one I find if you overtag you get the wrong kind of comments. Comments to me should be about developing your skill with the craft, not simply an ego boost. I probably look at fanfiction differently than many people so that might explain my abnormal mindset but I just find it distasteful when people say stuff like 'won't poast another chappy w/o X # o' comments' or they have a huge introduction paragraph about the story but the story itself isn't very long. Let the story speak for itself, imo!

 

[Cabaret]

I completely agree with you thar! It's the same with amateur musicians, I get really annoyed watching someone explain why the song they're about to play might be shit - if it is the gtfo and practice!

I've got a lot of great feedback in comments over the years, I'm not much of a reader and I remember some of my first fan fics were just horrendous! I salute the poor buggers who stuck with them long enough to write comments! I do find it hard to go from fan fic to original fic though because I think you can be very lazy in fan fic as you can assume your reader knows a lot of what is going on. This is why I'm writing original fic atm because I don;t want to get locked into fan fic without a key to get out!

(BTW I also know fan fic can be equally taxing to break the assumptions of the reader - I'm not saying fan fic writers are lazy at all, just that I probably am when I write fan fic!!)