Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)

[Highwind]

Not to mention Dyne also survives a steep drop down a cliff.

But only once.

 

[Kain424]

So far.

But seriously. No one seems to die from falling.

It'll be interesting to see what sort of creatures these beings turn out to be in the Remake.

 

[Vyzzuvazzadth]

Tell that to wedge

Since he was still able to talk after that, I believe he stayed alive until the plate fell on their heads. The sector 7 plate man, that's about the deadliest object in FF history.

Also, Aerith didn't die from the sword wound but rather by suffocation while being drowned by Cloud. Sephiroth didnu nuffin (somebody please get that reference).

 

[Kain424]

Are you referencing the Game Theory video?

It still operates on the assumption of Earth physics and Earth logic.

 

[Vyzzuvazzadth]

Yes, and I'm not being serious, of course. Stories not based in our reality can come up with any new laws of physics and chemistry and whatnot and get away with it as long as the internal logic remains consistent.

 

[leadmyskeptic]

I'm rather fascinated by the whole (and for simplicity, I'm thinking of just the FF series),sFN "Yes, they resemble 'Earthlings', and yes, there are many similarities, in some cases architectural/etc references to locations on Earth...but despite all of that, they are NOT the Earth-based humanoids of our world, nor are they identical to them" thing. It's one of those things that seems obvious once you really think about it, but a majority of players just sort of subconsciously take this for granted, so unless there's some antennae sticking out, or a tail flapping around, they automatically mentally file those characters away as a 1:1 representation of our species. Oddly, the first time I ended up really considering it was when I ended on the "Humans" entry on the FF Wiki under races, where even just the language used makes the distinction clear...although also very confusing, lol.

 

[Kain424]

I've thought about it since about 2000, when someone told me how it would be impossible to swing a buster sword around. I began wondering how he could know that. It's not Earth, so what is the gravity? What is the weight? What is the sword even made from? What sort of strength does Cloud have?

Just yesterday I saw people talking (might have been on Reddit) about the amount of sun Cloud and Zack got after they escaped Nibelheim and why Cloud shouldn't be all that pale by the time he got to Midgar. But all of that assumes a great deal about the Planet's atmosphere, sun, and the nature of his skin tissue.

It is a fascinating topic, though I am not sure one could run too far with it.

 

[Cthulhu]

Oh lord. Just fucking accept the suspension of disbelief already.

I mean Sephiroth destroys the solar system a few times in the final battle and an asteroid is stopped by love and rainbows, why are people wondering about the weight of a sword?

 

[Kain424]

Because nerds will be nerds. That what we do.

 

[Cthulhu]

Fair enough, carry on

 

[XxREUNIONxX]

With all the potential new/expanded content, I hope they'll add some lore for the summons. In the og summons were just sort of there. For being such a formidable force, it felt odd that not much was said about them.

 

[ForceStealer]

I wouldn't complain per se, but it's not all that important to me that the summons be a crucial part of the story in every FF game.

 

[Claymore]

I read a fanfic once about Summons being the original WEAPONS, ancient creatures which had forged a pact with the Planet, which enabled the total recall of their spirits for short periods via Materia. I've gone with that headcanon for years.

 

[XxREUNIONxX]

I dig that headcanon. I don't expect summons to have any major role in the plot but some sort of explanation as to what they are and where they come from would be nice. Perhaps, not an explanation per se but at least some dialogue from the party discussing and acknowledging thier existence. It'd be fine to have them described as some sort of mysterious and unknown force without necessarily adding big plot elements around them. Cloud and co. should at least mention the absolute destructive force that is KOTR!

 

[ChipNoir]

I dig that headcanon. I don't expect summons to have any major role in the plot but some sort of explanation as to what they are and where they come from would be nice. Perhaps, not an explanation per se but at least some dialogue from the party discussing and acknowledging thier existence. It'd be fine to have them described as some sort of mysterious and unknown force without necessarily adding big plot elements around them. Cloud and co. should at least mention the absolute destructive force that is KOTR!

Oh man. What if instead of just being a means to get the ultimate summon, you defeat the WEAPONS and they BECOME summon materia themselves as well?

 

[Ite]

I’ve read fics (and adopted the headcanon) that since materia is just crystallized memory and life energy, the summons are deities that the departed civilizations of the world believed in. Whether these gods were real or not before doesn’t matter, because it was the belief that created the materia.

 

[ForceStealer]

That's very FFXIV primal

 

[Jairus]

Was thinking about the play at the Gold Saucer date since I just got their on my current replaythrough of the OG (anyone else started another playthrough of FF7 since last month's trailer came out?) and wondering how they'll implement that in the remake. It would be fun to get more interesting ways to play it out and mess it up and have the chance to give Aerith/Tifa an actual kiss when they're being held by the EDK instead of just a peck on the hand like in the OG.

 

[Cannon_Fodder]

Was thinking about the play at the Gold Saucer date since I just got their on my current replaythrough of the OG (anyone else started another playthrough of FF7 since last month's trailer came out?) and wondering how they'll implement that in the remake. It would be fun to get more interesting ways to play it out and mess it up and have the chance to give Aerith/Tifa an actual kiss when they're being held by the EDK instead of just a peck on the hand like in the OG.

Yup, just finished a replay last night! As for the play, I'm looking forward to the voice acting of the EDK. If they nail that role, I think the whole scene will be a lot funnier. I'm also curious if the cast is still gonna spin off the stage or...?

 

[Makoeyes987]

It'd be rather strange for a summon to be able to be fought before acquiring it's materia in FFVII but then again, it happened in Crisis Core at least three different times, so the precedent is set for it to be able to happen. Summon materia inexplicably activating and attacking those who trespass close to it isn't impossible.

Honestly, between the Compilation expanding Summons beyond just being materia you find laying around, and the dummied explanation of summons being creatures created by the planet from FFVII, it'd kinda make sense for them to expand their role here. If they were guardian creatures during the time of the Cetra as originally intended, that'd fit their role and expansion perfectly.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I dig that headcanon. I don't expect summons to have any major role in the plot but some sort of explanation as to what they are and where they come from would be nice. Perhaps, not an explanation per se but at least some dialogue from the party discussing and acknowledging thier existence. It'd be fine to have them described as some sort of mysterious and unknown force without necessarily adding big plot elements around them. Cloud and co. should at least mention the absolute destructive force that is KOTR!

You may find this dialogue buried in the game code interesting then --

Sephiroth:
During the time when the Ancients prospered, there existed beings that were brought up bathed in the light of abundant Mako.
They were pure creatures of natural shape. Several types remain even now.
Some of these beings sealed their life energy within materia, altering their lives forever.

Aerith:
The summon materia...

Sephiroth:
Correct. Such a clever girl.
The creatures who protect this temple have lived long, relics from the age of the Ancients.
They belong to this planet even more than you do.
Heh heh heh...
Keep that in mind.

 

[Ite]

You may find this dialogue buried in the game code interesting then --

Sephiroth:
During the time when the Ancients prospered, there existed beings that were brought up bathed in the light of abundant Mako.
They were pure creatures of natural shape. Several types remain even now.
Some of these beings sealed their life energy within materia, altering their lives forever.

Aerith:
The summon materia...

Sephiroth:
Correct. Such a clever girl.
The creatures who protect this temple have lived long, relics from the age of the Ancients.
They belong to this planet even more than you do.
Heh heh heh...
Keep that in mind.

Fascinating!! Thanks for that trivia. I wonder if they’ll include something like that...

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

What the hell is a 'pure creature of natural shape'? A baby otter? A raindrop? A hydrogen atom?
In what way exactly are summons either pure or natural? KOTR is a 'natural shape'?
I'm not arguing with Sephiroth, it's just... I feel something got lost in translation there.

On a related tangent, I wonder what Zack meant exactly when he told Genesis "Summons aren't supposed to be used like this!" That you shouldn't unleash them on your friends? That you shouldn't use them to cover your own hasty retreat?

Don't we have an article on materia somewhere?

 

[Shademp]

What the hell is a 'pure creature of natural shape'? A baby otter? A raindrop? A hydrogen atom?
In what way exactly are summons either pure or natural? KOTR is a 'natural shape'?
I'm not arguing with Sephiroth, it's just... I feel something got lost in translation there.

This is precisely why I am always hesitant to bring up that unused text in discussions. Sure, it specifies that the summons had some form of existence before they sealed their life energy inside materia which is more confirmation than we had previously. But the whole "pure creature of natural shape" is frustratingly vague and after consulting multiple translators the conclusion seems to be that the Japanese passage simply IS vague.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I just gave it a look. Can't remember if you asked me back in the day and I couldn't make heads or tails of it at the time, but looking at it now, it seems clear to me he's saying that these were "innocent monsters" formed by nature.

He's creating a deliberate contrast between them and something else -- either a) the unnatural monsters brought about by Shin-Ra's experiments and mako leaks; or b) perhaps humankind; or c) both. Probably both given his comment about the summons belonging to the planet "more than you do."