Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Most people who get hit head on by a fast-moving truck, die.
Awesome use of the word 'rife'. I think we should all use it more often. And I agree, I love a good debate.

 

[Ite]

That “mistranslation” about Tseng always confuses me. You can say, and believe, you’re “done for,” and then wake up in a hospital bed. It happens, especially when Sephiroth is involved. I thought he was dead because the slice through him that you see in the vision later is very dramatic, and that’s literally the last time he appears in the game.

On the whole, though, it changes the story little, although his absence during the Disc 2 finale coupled with his subordinates calling the shots, might have solidified the idea for a lot of folks going into AC. My grumpiness about Tseng’s survival was really just spillover from Rufus’s unbelievable recovery. Two years later and the guy looks like he’s never had so much as a sunburn. With Tseng there is at least a precedent of ppl surviving ol’ Masamune.

Palmer went straight into Shrodinger’s Box. He might be alive, you wanna look into it? Me neither.

 

[trash panda]

Ite, you bring up a valid point about Sephiroth not being especially deadly. How many people has he slashed or poked only to miss the vital organs? Dare I say he’s worse than a Storm Trooper?

Now I’m inclined to believe he only hits his target sometimes because his weapon is so massive that it accidentally makes contact with his opponents...?

 

[hleV]

Is he even going for the kill? Maybe he just likes slashing people and see them suffer

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

For a killing machine, he avoids killing as many named characters as he kills.

 

[ForceStealer]

Most people who get hit head on by a fast-moving truck, die.

But when it happens in such a cartoony, Wile E. Coyote way, the safer assumption is that they survived, irrespective of the physics involved. If the truck hit him and he rolled across the ground cracking his head open, I'd be much more inclined to think he was dead rather than him bouncing off in such a way you could almost hear the Mario jump sound effect.

That “mistranslation” about Tseng always confuses me. You can say, and believe, you’re “done for,” and then wake up in a hospital bed. It happens, especially when Sephiroth is involved. I thought he was dead because the slice through him that you see in the vision later is very dramatic, and that’s literally the last time he appears in the game.

I think he technically says "I've been had..." which SORT of implies it, but yeah I don't think that's really it. It's the drama of the slash, and Elena saying that she's gonna punish you "for doin' in my boss like that."
But yeah, it couldn't have been THAT much of localization issue, because Rude lampshades it in Advent Children Complete in both languages.

 

[Kain424]

For a killing machine, he avoids killing as many named characters as he kills.

Or perhaps they are named because they survived. What was Tifa's father's name?

 

[Odysseus]

As far as Palmer goes I think you're forgetting that he's involved in launching the rocket later on in the game, after he gets hit by the truck.

 

[FFShinra]

He also shows up in one of the Shinra Conference Room scenes after the truck hit as well.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Does he? Cool!

 

[Shademp]

I had honestly not put to memory that Palmer appears in one of the Shinra board meetings on disc 2. I really should replay FFVII one of these days.

 

[Ariga]

So... the truck didn't kill Palmer? What is he, a god?! First he survives being beaten up by the party, then he survives a truck to the backside. It wouldn't surprise me if he survived Meteorfall, with him standing on the highest intact floor of the Shinra HQ.

 

[Vyzzuvazzadth]

Palmer is a left-behind tentacle of Jenova confirmed!

 

[trash panda]

Plus he bounced. My dad says if you fall and hit your head on the floor, you'll be okay so long as your head bounces. So I'm applying that same logic here. If a truck hits you and you bounce into the next dimension, you're still alive for all intents and purposes.

I guess it's no longer a surprise to me that so many of our polygonal friends somehow narrowly avoided death in their entirely made-up, polygonal universe.

 

[Rydeen]

So... the truck didn't kill Palmer? What is he, a god?! First he survives being beaten up by the party, then he survives a truck to the backside. It wouldn't surprise me if he survived Meteorfall, with him standing on the highest intact floor of the Shinra HQ.

This is why he is obsessed with lard. It makes him stronger.

 

[leadmyskeptic]

It's not just that. The way Elena accuses you at Icicle Inn also makes implications as well that can easily confuse the player.

Thanks for the reminder, Chip, I actually not only forgot about that, but mixed up the "doin' my boss in" with what Tseng himself actually says. So I guess...while still having a better translation, have Elena's scene stay 'ambiguous' as well? Actually, on the subject, the whole "tries to punch you before rolling out of town" bit probably isn't going to fit very well with the aesthetic of the RM, is it? Wonder what they'll do with that.

Rufus4ever

That's cool that you prefer him being dead. I don't see why he can't be dead to you. It's like this: if they leave it ambiguous, then all the people (like me) who want to believe that Rufus and Tseng and Palmer survived, can happily go on believing it, and all the people who want to believe they bought the big one can believe that. If you insist on making them unambiguously dead, then half the fandom is disappointed. Is that fair? I don't see why we need to insist on these definitive answers. It's like the LTD. So many people demanding to know "but which one does he reeeaaallly love?" and totally ignoring all the other things these two pairings are telling us about relationships. We need to learn to tolerate uncertainty.

I didn't articulate this in my original post properly, but yes, I am ONE HUNDRED PERCENT for ambiguity...I suppose the "King Fish" (to quote a ridiculous translation from the og, lol) of this would be the game's actual ending, the 'does humanity survive?' bit. I guess what I was trying to get across was "I hope they maintain faithfulness to the original in terms of the way these things are presented"...by which I mean, I don't need definitive 'answers', but I felt that w/ both Rufus and Tseng, the implication towards death was pretty strong, which still leaves ambiguity without feeling like almost all of the major characters are 'death-nerfed'. You know what I mean? That feeling like shit is really going down by the end of the game, especially in terms of the original Big Bad (Shinra)'s crew getting tossed around like rag dolls. To have what (in my opinion) was strongly suggested, but not outright demonstrated, suddenly be definitive would be just as disappointing to me as the reverse.

As for Palmer, I could give a shit less about that goof, lol. His demise doesn't hold the "oh shit" factor that people like Tseng and Rufus has to begin with, so. Sure, have him show up in a full-body cast for those late game Shinra meetings. Oh! I would love to see his "Honey Bee Inn" scenes restored, tho!

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

As for Palmer, I could give a shit less about that goof, lol. His demise doesn't hold the "oh shit" factor that people like Tseng and Rufus has to begin with, so. Sure, have him show up in a full-body cast for those late game Shinra meetings. Oh! I would love to see his "Honey Bee Inn" scenes restored, tho!

I agree. But I guess he doesn't deserve that much character building.

 

[Rydeen]

That bit about ambiguity is so true. I've noticed a common theme in Japanese media wherein ambiguity is used as a rhetorical device, and creators are often irritated when fans want to be spoon fed definitive answers on metaphors and pairings. Hideaki Anno is a notable figure. They want the player/viewer to derive their own meaning from their work.

 

[ChipNoir]

All that lard in his tea (and everything else) saved Palmer's life by giving his internal organs so much extra cushioning.

 

[FFShinra]

I don't mind it being ambiguous (in the original game that worked wonderfully), it's more a reaction from me over how the compilation retconned it to perfect survival.

 

[Jairus]

If you read On the Way to a Smile: Episode Shinra, it tells how Rufus survived. He actually did get pretty banged up, and so the wheelchair wasn't just a facade, he really did need it somewhat. He wasn't crippled, but he did take a beating that took a while for him to recover from. I don't know if that still qualifies as perfect survival or not, I'm not sure what that term means, but I just thought I'd add that little tidbit for those who might not have known about it.

 

[FFShinra]

I'd expect burned skin, an actual loss of use of his legs, etc. Minimum.

 

[Ite]

He should look like Deadpool.

 

[Kain424]

Nah. Throw some cure spells, and do whatever is done for a couple years spent at the Healin Lodge, and you'll be somewhat ok. He's still banged up-looking in Advent Children. But there are a number of things that have helped him look as good as he does.

1. the aforementioned magic healing and medical treatment facility work
2. he's wealthy and could easily afford the best
3. he, like the rest of the characters, is not actually a human being. We don't really know enough about their physiology to truly infer what happens to them in the event of severe burns of whatever that WEAPON attack does.

 

[FFShinra]

Then a simple stab through the back shouldn't kill either and yet it does.

It also cheapens the entire fight between Midgar and Diamond.