SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[tenabrus]

Well, tbh I did read CA as a pairing. Just one that stops after the halfway mark of the OG. And is a red herring.

So I think it’s a valid interpretation for Disc 1.

Agreed, and it's also some of the foundation for what makes the LTD so fraught to begin with. Disk 1 convinces you Aerith is the love interest and it very much wants you to care a lot about her so that you are devastated when she dies. So the transition to Tifa wasn't going to work for all the people who got as super attached to Aerith as they were meant to.

It's an interesting thought experiment to imagine what the state of the fandom/theories would have been if the OG game had been split into three parts the way the remake is. Because at this point, most people would be probably totally convinced Aerith was the love interest, she was coming back, and Tifa was just a love rival/fanservice character, since none of the payoffs they're setting up have happened yet.

Which, pointedly, is also where some people are at with Rebirth right now, if that tells us anything.

 

[GamerSkull]

Agreed, and it's also some of the foundation for what makes the LTD so fraught to begin with. Disk 1 convinces you Aerith is the love interest and it very much wants you to care a lot about her so that you are devastated when she dies. So the transition to Tifa wasn't going to work for all the people who got as super attached to Aerith as they were meant to.

It's an interesting thought experiment to imagine what the state of the fandom/theories would have been if the OG game had been split into three parts the way the remake is. Because at this point, most people would be probably totally convinced Aerith was the love interest, she was coming back, and Tifa was just a love rival/fanservice character, since none of the payoffs they're setting up have happened yet.

Which, pointedly, is also where some people are at with Rebirth right now, if that tells us anything.

I think Rebirth seems more explicit with what they are going for, but yeah, if the OG came out in parts, I suppose it would be interesting how that might affect the LTD.

Hell, sometimes I wonder about the hypothetical original game that might have come out with Tifa and Aerith still being one character.

 

[Yoru]

Which, pointedly, is also where some people are at with Rebirth right now, if that tells us anything.

I agree with Remake, but Rebirth is not very good at hiding the fact Tifa is endgame i'm sorry. The difference in treatment is quite impressive for each girl.

 

[null]

i think this is literally reading too much into a line. Hamaguchi said they balanced the screen time for both girl, it is not they balanced their relationship developments with Cloud or their screen time with Cloud etc…
I don’t understand why people’s expectations were set so high to “yah, both girl will have the same amount of lovey dovey moments with cloud” from there..

I don't even like the metric to begin with. In the OG, Disc 1 was The Aerith Show and Tifa wasn't exactly in the spotlight. Why do those two specifically need equal screen time? What creative purpose to the story does it serve? Why are we being told this out of band, and why is it being repeated for Rebirth?

It's hard not to be cynical about this, but it just screams focus grouping. Even the lore feels like a long winded excuse for Sephiroth, Aerith and Zack to have screen time when they shouldn't be there.

 

[Yoru]

I don't even like the metric to begin with. In the OG, Disc 1 was The Aerith Show and Tifa wasn't exactly in the spotlight. Why do those two specifically need equal screen time? What creative purpose to the story does it serve? Why are we being told this out of band, and why is it being repeated for Rebirth?

It's hard not to be cynical about this, but it just screams focus grouping. Even the lore feels like a long winded excuse for Sephiroth, Aerith and Zack to have screen time when they shouldn't be there.

Because we're not in 1997 anymore. All the world knows Aerith will die. You don't have to be hyper focused on her anymore. If CD1 is so Aerith dependent it's because they knew they will take her back from you and wanted to make you feel bad/sad/angry by gamedesign.

 

[GamerSkull]

Because we're not in 1997 anymore. All the world knows Aerith will die. You don't have to be hyper focused on her anymore. If CD1 is so Aerith dependent it's because they knew they will take her back from you and wanted to make you feel bad/sad/angry by gamedesign.

Funnily enough, I have a friend who is yet to play FF7 but plans to (although I expect he’ll do so with Remake since he doesn’t like the polygons of OG). He knows Sephiroth will kill someone but not who.

He is extremely lucky to not know after all this time.

 

[CldS7]

Off topic but during the Cloud and Tifa date where Cloud says Aerith must still love Zack and Tifa says “it’s a little more complicated then that”

She is implying that Aerith has feelings for Cloud right?

 

[null]

Because we're not in 1997 anymore. All the world knows Aerith will die. You don't have to be hyper focused on her anymore. If CD1 is so Aerith dependent it's because they knew they will take her back from you and wanted to make you feel bad/sad/angry by gamedesign.

Ok, then the all the world knows Tifa and Cloud will get together and we don't need to hyper focus on them in Part 3. Equal screen time for Tifa and Aerith makes total sense.

 

[Yoru]

Nojima literally went to war against all the takes made about the characters he created.

It's so automatic and targeted that it's almost disturbing.

He seems so pissed with the way the world has perceived his work that this Remake project looks like his final answer for the last 25+ years.

I really think choiced have been made from the devs. There is no big conspiracy or group catering. That's the story they want to tell, with the characters they decided.

 

[CldS7]

Nojima literally went to war against all the takes made about the characters he created.

It's so automatic and targeted that it's almost disturbing.

He seems so pissed with the way the world has perceived his work that this Remake project looks like his final answer for the last 25+ years.

I really think choiced have been made from the devs. There is no big conspiracy or group catering. That's the story they want to tell, with the characters they decided.

https://x.com/jedijenna/status/1775246681371783428?s=46&t=ivxjxhkAU4je_TiXey-g9A

This interview is fascinating tbh

 

[Yoru]

Off topic but during the Cloud and Tifa date where Cloud says Aerith must still love Zack and Tifa says “it’s a little more complicated then that”

She is implying that Aerith has feelings for Cloud right?

Not the way I see it.
Cloud : Have you told Aerith about Zack ?
Tifa : No (yes I told her you remember but your memories of it are wrong)
Cloud : Does she still have feelings for him ? (So that's why you didn't tell her. You are afraid to tell her he's dead?)
Tifa : It's more complicated than that (Babe, you're delulu, that's why I'm not telling you what we really said)

Ok, then the all the world knows Tifa and Cloud will get together and we don't need to hyper focus on them in Part 3. Equal screen time for Tifa and Aerith makes total sense.

Well i could tell you that seeing a certain part of the fandom, the world doesn't know and they're a doubling down on Tifa hardcore mode (and that's why we have seen her so much in Rebirth)

We will see what they do with DeadNotDead Aerith

 

[CldS7]

Not the way I see it.
Cloud : Have you told Aerith about Zack ?
Tifa : No (yes I told her you remember but your memories of it are wrong)
Cloud : Does she still have feelings ? (So that's why you are afraid to tell her he's dead?)
Tifa : It's more complicated than that (Babe, you're delulu, that's why I'm not telling what we really said)

Hmm never thought about in that sense but yeh that could be implication as well

 

[CldS7]

Ok, then the all the world knows Tifa and Cloud will get together and we don't need to hyper focus on them in Part 3. Equal screen time for Tifa and Aerith makes total sense.

I mean Cloud and Tifa and his memory are literally the most important thing that happens in the whole game

Ofc they’re going to get hyper focus on them????

 

[liuliuliu]

I don't even like the metric to begin with. In the OG, Disc 1 was The Aerith Show and Tifa wasn't exactly in the spotlight. Why do those two specifically need equal screen time? What creative purpose to the story does it serve? Why are we being told this out of band, and why is it being repeated for Rebirth?

It's hard not to be cynical about this, but it just screams focus grouping. Even the lore feels like a long winded excuse for Sephiroth, Aerith and Zack to have screen time when they shouldn't be there.

I think this is the dilemma of remake, you have the completely new fans who don’t care which character get the most of the time, and you have existing fans who already have their preferences. You will need to please the majority amount of them to be financially success for the game.
If they lose Tifa’s fan in the second game, it is hard to get them back for the third one. So they have to keep her screen time up even though it is not her time to shine yet

 

[liuliuliu]

my understanding is a lot of decisions are made for business impact. The author can wiggle around and do as much as they are allowed, but overall they have to build a game that will sell.

 

[null]

I mean Cloud and Tifa and his memory are literally the most important thing that happens in the whole game

Ofc they’re going to get hyper focus on them????

Right. So why do Aerith and Tifa need equal screentime?

 

[LNK]

The only piece of marketing I found egregiously baity was the TGA trailer.

It wasn't though. Within the last week I posted timestamps of every Aerith scene in the trailer. Out of at least 10 scenes, only two could possibly be looked at as romantic.

 

[GamerSkull]

Off topic but during the Cloud and Tifa date where Cloud says Aerith must still love Zack and Tifa says “it’s a little more complicated then that”

She is implying that Aerith has feelings for Cloud right?

I think it’s more that… Cloud doesn’t remember the actual events, and also that she sees Zack in Cloud. In short, it’s complicated lol.

 

[Yoru]

my understanding is a lot of decisions are made for business impact. The author can wiggle around and do as much as they are allowed, but overall they have to build a game that will sell.

I kinda disagree.

When Remake released, it was a VERY huge risk to go with this meta ending. With Rebirth, they made some decisions nobody could have predicted (CT kiss)

No, definitely I think they don't care that much about what people are saying. They made this big deal with Sony. Now they're telling what they want.

 

[CldS7]

Right. So why do Aerith and Tifa need equal screentime?

So both of their fans will buy the games

It doesn’t change anything the story is saying

Tifas story and plot is still the same as the OGs

Aeriths story and plot is the same as the OGs

They’re literally just adding more scenes. Not making new plotlines for them

 

[GamerSkull]

Right. So why do Aerith and Tifa need equal screentime?

I think the issue is that screentime isn’t referring to romance. The devs said both girls will get equal screentime in Rebirth, which for the most part seems to be true.

It’s not true of the OG since Tifa is mostly in the background during this part. But by technicality it is true for Rebirth.

But yes, at the end of the day… just seems to be PR so I agree there.

 

[Yoru]

Right. So why do Aerith and Tifa need equal screentime?

They ALL have screen time. Stop this nonsense.

Yuffie got a dungeon. Barret got a dungeon. Red got a dungeon. Tifa got a dungeon. Aerith got a dungeon. FREAKING Cait Sith got a dungeon.

They just wanna make you care for this team. Everyone will shine.

 

[GamerSkull]

By the way, I actually don’t have what they actually said.

Did they both girls will get equal screentime? Or did they say all the characters will? Or some permutation of that?

What was it that they actually said?

 

[GamerSkull]

They ALL have screen time. Stop this nonsense.

Yuffie got a dungeon. Barret got a dungeon. Red got a dungeon. Tifa got a dungeon. Aerith got a dungeon. FREAKING Cait Sith got a dungeon.

They just wanna make you care for this team. Everyone will shine.

Tbh I think @null understands this. I think they just don’t like the PR metric that the devs provided. Or the need to placate the fans with statements like this.

At least I think that’s what they’re saying.

 

[Yoru]

Tbh I think @null understands this. I think they just don’t like the PR metric that the devs provided. Or the need to placate the fans with statements like this.

At least I think that’s what they’re saying.

And all i'm saying is this is not a PR move.

That's just balance. They developped unique gameplay for each character and want you to use them all. And how you do this ? By making you care about them with equal side quest and screen time.

Don't forget you have an affection system. OF COURSE all the characters need the exact same quantity of stuff for it to be balanced. It's just simple as that guys.

Reminder : Zack has a huge fanbase. What did we see ? Bro has 10 min screentime in the entire game.

PR stuff is for PR. So marketing, trailer yadi yada. I think they don't care for the game and look only to people concerns about gameplay stuff (too linear, bad subquest etc etc..)