SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[Yoru]

I don't know how I can put this anymore than ... I don't care. He is not above me, a superior person to me, and I don't have to defer to him.

He has a preference, he's entitled to it and being honest about who he prefers, doesn't mean people have to put him on a pedestal for it, if people don't want to bother with him they don't have to.

But he's still the one putting words into my character's mouth, so... in the end, his opinion will always be more important than yours and mine. That's fine if you don't want to deal with him, but you can't say his words have no value when talking about a work he's involved in. As others have pointed out, he doesn't speak from nothing. He has scripts, guidelines, feedback from directors to get inside the character's head as best he can.

He didn't take to twitter just to make fun of people. He was just replying to someone. And I think he was extremely thoughtful, and just wanted to warn people. Because yes. He knows a lot more than the average person. And I think he just wants people to enjoy what the game has to offer.

So yes, you don't have to listen to him if you don't want to. 100% agree. But I think saying his opinion doesn't count is a bit like burying your head in the sand.

And again, yes it's easy for me because I'm on the "right side". I'm well aware of that and I want to be as clear and honest as possible.

 

[Sacky]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/comments/1cxgqsb/_/l55p4tl Reddit is so funny right now its gotta be nostalgic to see all these old arguments about AC come up again. This one
was always the funniest about Cloud wanting to die completely opposite Point of the whole movie. Most misunderstood movie
Thats not even good

 

[pxl_pushr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/comments/1cxgqsb/_/l55p4tl Reddit is so funny right now its gotta be nostalgic to see all these old arguments about AC come up again. This one
was always the funniest about Cloud wanting to die completely opposite Point of the whole movie. Most misunderstood movie
Thats not even good

Talk about glossing over two of the most in-your-face moments of the story to make a point.

I just love how the LS scene has entire sections of dialogue just deleted from memory in order to downplay it. It’s really bizarre, and I can’t think of anything else like it in the franchise.

 

[Sacky]

Talk about glossing over two of the most in-your-face moments of the story to make a point.

I just love how the LS scene has entire sections of dialogue just deleted from memory in order to downplay it. It’s really bizarre, and I can’t think of anything else like it in the franchise.

The fact they say you have to ignore massive portions to think they arent just friends. BUDDY they Almost KISS IN THE GAME XD and in fact Can Kiss in the game lol its so funny

 

[Ryushikaze]

Well it's like OG, some people will prefer AC credits and theme song to ACC's new ones.

This isn't about liking the credits and song, this is about reading into the sequence a motivation that does not exist, and is kiboshed by the shorts added into the making of video.

Hey! Dragon Quarter isn't that bad, I'll have you know!
I ended it with a Dragon Ratio of 1/4 (I'll add 1 and 2 to my eternal backlog, though, lol)

It's just very aggravating to play in a mechanical sense.

Oh boy, I can relate. I had a similar experience, with added insistence that since Cloud's feelings trumps all in FF7, he must've been in love with Aerith to feel that guilty. The friend who told me is no longer my friend (for more reasons than this, but that viewpoint is a bit of a red flag).

Zack of course being a nobody Cloud feels nothing for, ever.

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/comments/1cxgqsb/_/l55p4tl Reddit is so funny right now its gotta be nostalgic to see all these old arguments about AC come up again. This one
was always the funniest about Cloud wanting to die completely opposite Point of the whole movie. Most misunderstood movie
Thats not even good

It's amazing how even though Cloud states exactly what he wants from Aerith, how all the guidebooks say he's motivated by seeking redemption for a guilt he feels because of how happy being with Tifa made him, nobody actually pays attention to that.

 

[Maidenofwar]

I wanted to say the same goes for any of the VAs, Briana, etc, as well, people shouldn't harass them in their safe spaces, twitch, social media, but I'm always not going to take them as full gospel either and with a pinch of salt, and their preferences, what they like is ok, but it doesn't make others less than.

Especially since both dates, etc were confirmed as having romantic framing, so yeah annoying but it's his account so it's w/e.

 

[Empyrea]

The fact they say you have to ignore massive portions to think they arent just friends. BUDDY they Almost KISS IN THE GAME XD and in fact Can Kiss in the game lol its so funny

It's what got me into this mess xD My trainwreck syndrome eats really well from this, but at the same time, I can also feel it rebelling at the torture I put it through.

It's just very aggravating to play in a mechanical sense.

This I will 100% agree with. I hated how limited we are with using dragon form, among other things. I just so happened to play it when I was younger and much more stubborn about finishing games I play, regardless of the quality. I got 1/4 via cheesing the party xp and soft/hard save system, too.

 

[pxl_pushr]

It's what got me into this mess xD My trainwreck syndrome eats really well from this, but at the same time, I can also feel it rebelling at the torture I put it through.



This I will 100% agree with. I hated how limited we are with using dragon form, among other things. I just so happened to play it when I was younger and much more stubborn about finishing games I play, regardless of the quality. I got 1/4 via cheesing the party xp and soft/hard save system, too.

This is why I don’t actually use my Twitter account lol I just wait to see the greatest hits of hilarity that end up in places like here.

 

[eleamaya]

In another installment of the "Have we fallen back in time" series, saw on the Clerith subreddit people talking about the Credits for Advent Children and the Cleriths there were talking about Cloud searching for Aerith. You know, forget the running a delivery service and him actually going around to visit friends to pick up a "closed" sign so he goes and takes a day off with his family. Shipping goggles, man.

Well it's like OG, some people will prefer AC credits and theme song to ACC's new ones.

People forget or maybe shippers ignore that in the ACC credits, it's not just removing Aerith's visage, but adding clips from the movie with this order:

Verse 2:

• Remnants
• Sephiroth

Bridge:

• Allies: Vincent, Barret, Nanaki & Cait Sith, Yuffie, Cid, Reno, Rude
• Family: Marlene, Denzel, and Tifa
• Forgiven sins/Dear People: Zack & Aerith

This is not the order based on the timeframe of the movie like Remake & Rebirth credits, this is purposively arranged with that order by the director (Nomura). I think this is more meaningful to capture Cloud's journey and what is in his head as he's driving, as he said "there's nothing I dont cherish." If Cleriths really had shipping googles, they should be happy because Aerith smiling at the church door is the last shot of those clips. They can use argument like this: "the last shot means the one he holds dear the most just like when Zack is dying, Aerith is the last DMW" See I can give them idea

But yeah, preference is preference. And I admit I have this shipping google too:
The lyrics of "with the engines giving out" placement on the Himuro & Gerrard's MV and the credit is coincidentally like this XD

 

[Rin]

Honestly, we should avoid putting words in peoples mouths or replying to them in ways that make it sound like someone said something that they didn't actually say. We really don't need to make this place Twitter lol.

 

[Ryeleigh]

Zack turned the light on, but nobody was home. Tifa got his mind to occupy with the space with who he thought was an ideal version of himself.

Both are important to Cloud’s arc especially

I meant that if Zack hadn't broken Cloud out from the tank and lugged him around for a year(?), Cloud would've never made it to Midgar to meet Tifa. So in that respect that "unimportant NPC war criminal" is also important. And the thought that Zack was Cloud's idea of an ideal SOLDIER and Tifa is his ideal woman, and they both took care of him when he was at his lowest and mako poisoned, is just so cute to me, lol.

Hey! Dragon Quarter isn't that bad, I'll have you know!
I ended it with a Dragon Ratio of 1/4 (I'll add 1 and 2 to my eternal backlog, though, lol)

Hey, another person who likes Dragon Quarter! I thought I was alone in liking it, lol.

 

[Ryushikaze]

I meant that if Zack hadn't broken Cloud out from the tank and lugged him around for a year(?), Cloud would've never made it to Midgar to meet Tifa. So in that respect that "unimportant NPC war criminal" is also important. And the thought that Zack was Cloud's idea of an ideal SOLDIER and Tifa is his ideal woman, and they both took care of him when he was at his lowest and mako poisoned, is just so cute to me, lol.


Hey, another person who likes Dragon Quarter! I thought I was alone in liking it, lol.

I like the story and look of it, I just thought its combat not nearly as polished as it could be.

 

[Ryeleigh]

I like the story and look of it, I just thought its combat not nearly as polished as it could be.

That's true. I think for me the slowness of it was the most frustrating part. And having just three party members. I also thought it would've been nice to breeze through the game with the dragon form. In fact, when I first played it, I didn't get what the counter was and died before I reached the end, lmao. But on subsequent playthroughs, I kind of appreciate it even if it could've been better.

Edit: But that aside, the ending of that game still tears me up, lol.

 

[Yoru]

I wanted to say the same goes for any of the VAs, Briana, etc, as well, people shouldn't harass them in their safe spaces, twitch, social media, but I'm always not going to take them as full gospel either and with a pinch of salt, and their preferences, what they like is ok, but it doesn't make others less than.

Especially since both dates, etc were confirmed as having romantic framing, so yeah annoying but it's his account so it's w/e.

It's just that during the long debates around NPTK it seems to me that you were there to quote Lorren's statements and so I found it a bit hypocritical to say "Cody should just shut up."

As I was saying. It's easy for me to defend him when he's on my side (and again we don't know, he was just responding to a rather pushy shipper) so I don't want to impose anything on you in any way. I understand that this is your personal feeling. No problem at all.

I'm just asking everyone trying to be fair. Either we accept statements from all personalities. Or none at all.

I won't prolong this debate, I think we've all understood. I just wanted to be clear about my basic intentions.

 

[Sacky]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyVII/comments/1cy3jkr/_/l56xgl7 Now we are arguing Cloud didn't feel the same amount of Guilt as Zack as he did for Aerith
what on earth has brought the AC terrible takes back XD

 

[pxl_pushr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyVII/comments/1cy3jkr/_/l56xgl7 Now we are arguing Cloud didn't feel the same amount of Guilt as Zack as he did for Aerith
what on earth has brought the AC terrible takes back XD

I will be fair to that argument and say the display of Zack and Cloud’s friendship is a little lacking but mainly because I want more of it in general ( Cloud and Zack novela PLEASE )

Zack being the goodest dude for caring for Cloud so long isn’t to be forgotten though.

 

[Empyrea]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyVII/comments/1cy3jkr/_/l56xgl7 Now we are arguing Cloud didn't feel the same amount of Guilt as Zack as he did for Aerith
what on earth has brought the AC terrible takes back XD

More reasons that the movie should be rewritten, if it comes to down it. Gotta like that in the process, though, they admitted that CA's bond isn't romantic. Sure, it's more than friendship, but not romantic nonetheless, acc to them.

 

[Ryeleigh]

You know, it lowkey bothers me that it's still called a "love triangle" in Re-Trilogy since Zack's there, going through different worlds to reunite with Aerith.

 

[ViolaaFox]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyVII/comments/1cy3jkr/_/l56xgl7 Now we are arguing Cloud didn't feel the same amount of Guilt as Zack as he did for Aerith
what on earth has brought the AC terrible takes back XD

Well, AC was shown in cinemas in some countries. Maybe that's why the takes are coming back.

 

[Sacky]

More reasons that the movie should be rewritten, if it comes to down it. Gotta like that in the process, though, they admitted that CA's bond isn't romantic. Sure, it's more than friendship, but not romantic nonetheless, acc to them.

you should see the actual post they used AI to confirm the romance XD

 

[Ryushikaze]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyVII/comments/1cy3jkr/_/l56xgl7 Now we are arguing Cloud didn't feel the same amount of Guilt as Zack as he did for Aerith
what on earth has brought the AC terrible takes back XD

Speaking of terrible takes. "Cloud ghosted everyone for two years." Hooboy. That's an incredible level of wrong.

Also, the OP brings up Pete/ MJ/ Gwen as a love triangle involving a childhood friend, but that's not the case. Not in mainline contunity. Unless it's been retconned to hell and back, neither MJ nor Gwen were Pete's childhood friends, meeting him in late high school/ early college. Only Harry Osborn gets the childhood friend distinction in 616. In other timelines, they have decided to make MJ and Pete childhood friends and/or neighbors because it acts as a much more condensed narrative shorthand for "Yeah, he's into her."

The only recent-ish AU where there has been a serious MJ/ Gwen love triangle was Mary Jane loves Spider-Man (Other people may correct me if there is a more recent one) and that was a case where Pete started dating Gwen before MJ because complicated reasons but she realized the elephant in the room and backed off.
Even in the 616 where Gwen and Pete were explicitly an item and he loved her romantically and may have gotten with her when she died, he doesn't go back to her on the random occasions she comes back to life or hops in from another universe. Heck, he waffles more with Felicia around than Gwen, and even that's mostly over and done with.

Sorry, I have opinions about Spider-Man.

 

[Eerie]

If I must suffer those 20 years old debunked arguments, let me become younger by 20 years too. I'm sure Ryu will agree lmao. Not fair to get only the bad side of it all.

 

[Sacky]

If I must suffer those 20 years old debunked arguments, let me become younger by 20 years too. I'm sure Ryu will agree lmao. Not fair to get only the bad side of it all.

so this is what its like what you all experienced funny history repeats itself XD

 

[Stiggie]

you should see the actual post they used AI to confirm the romance XD

I once asked ChatGPT who it thought the main love interest was, it thought Aerith (shows you how deep the misinformation has spread). I then asked it to defend that position as strongly as possible while I would try to convince it that it was actually Tifa.
Reason I did this was because I yearned for a discussion with a logical opponent who I could force to actually argue in good faith. It was a cleansing experience.

You know, it lowkey bothers me that it's still called a "love triangle" in Re-Trilogy since Zack's there, going through different worlds to reunite with Aerith.

This has always annoyed the crap out of me, and I think WE are to blame. Of course Cleriths want to call it a love-triangle, it implicitly gets rid of one of their two biggest hurdles, but WE are playing into it by not consistently calling it "the love square debate". It's an insane concession to make.

 

[abzy1200]

Every single time you find somebody who claims Clerith to be endgame, or somebody who is neutral, they will ALWAYS, eventually, sooner or later, come out with completely uninformed takes that aren't even an 'interpretation', it's straight up countered by compilation material, very accessible compilation material. Hell, it's IN AC that Cloud brings Denzel home. Did people really, willingly, interpret that as Cloud finding a terminally ill child, actually dumping him on Tifa, and then going back to living in the Church without assuming ANY responsibility and no contact? For 2 years?

Cloud makes decisions that harm those around him in Advent Children, but that isn't how this went down.

I once asked ChatGPT who it thought the main love interest was, it thought Aerith (shows you how deep the misinformation has spread). I then asked it to defend that position as strongly as possible while I would try to convince it that it was actually Tifa.
Reason I did this was because I yearned for a discussion with a logical opponent who I could force to actually argue in good faith. It was a cleansing experience.

It's like...AI was trained on the internet, so it would be fed all this gaslighting from Cleriths and isn't sentient to realise they're full of shit. It's just picking and choosing things from a MASSIVE data library. AI can't even begin to interpret art because it isn't sentient in the first place.