SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[Hellenic]

Have people ever questioned Squal x Rinoa? As Rinoa was into Seifer before. Because I always had the impression that it's just CT that gets over overanalysed.

Because CT is the only ship in this series that gets this treatment, even though they undoubtedly have the biggest and strongest foundation for a couple in the series now too with all this material around it.

I don't think anyone bothers to argue about the Seifer or Squall stuff couse it pretty quickly shows that Seifer wasn't exactly important in the equation. Rinoa talked about having a fling with him one summer or something and then Seifer goes off his rocker and joins the Sorceress already. Didn't seem like he cared much about Rinoa in the first place anyway and it was all just one sided from Rinoa.

Problem is that FF7 pushes the idea of a love triangle way harder than any other game in the series so all this amount of obvious confirmation about the end pairing gets swept under the bus like it doesn't matter.

I will forever think the love triangle was a mistake and genuinely hope Square never does one again.

 

[Hellenic]

I don't actually know what the general stance towards Squall and Rinoa is, lol. I am vaguely aware that Snow/Serah is hated and apparently Serah had "more chemistry" with that guy from the second game, I guess?

I did personally like Serah more with Noel too over Snow, but ofc i understood that that was never gonna happen as Noel already had another person he loved too.

 

[pxl_pushr]

Because CT is the only ship in this series that gets this treatment, even though they undoubtedly have the biggest and strongest foundation for a couple in the series now too with all this material around it.

I don't think anyone bothers to argue about the Seifer or Squall stuff couse it pretty quickly shows that Seifer wasn't exactly important in the equation. Rinoa talked about having a fling with him one summer or something and then Seifer goes off his rocker and joins the Sorceress already. Didn't seem like he cared much about Rinoa in the first place anyway and it was all just one sided from Rinoa.

Problem is that FF7 pushes the idea of a love triangle way harder than any other game in the series so all this amount of obvious confirmation about the end pairing gets swept under the bus like it doesn't matter.

I will forever think the love triangle was a mistake and genuinely hope Square never does one again.

One of the reasons I want part 3 to finally close the book on this whole love triangle thing ( at least from the perspective of overall players ) is because I think what spawned it is academically interesting.

FF4 has a love triangle, but nobody really brings it up ( probably because it solves itself and isn’t a huge part of the story… but you could say the same about FF7 )

FF8 goes nuts with its romantic entanglements, but it gets overlooked and it’s arguably more complicated on that front than FF7.

It’s odd and worth exploring but it’s hard to do so because the discourse is still so loud about what the real story is.

 

[ChaosandConfusion]

One of the reasons I want part 3 to finally close the book on this whole love triangle thing ( at least from the perspective of overall players ) is because I think what spawned it is academically interesting.

Isn't it already declared over with articles being written about CT. Well, if/when they end it in a way that can't be denied, I hope Nojima makes his x account private because it's definitely gonna be a shit show.
I signed up for a summer psychology class to see if I can figure out the extremists in fandoms.

 

[Xannis]

Dunno. I'd say any debate about FF8 shipping doesn't happen because the end is fairly conclusive / straightforward. It just doesn't matter that there seems to be some kind of sexual tension between Quistis and Squall early in the story because the ending isn't very open ended.

If FF7 OG had ended with Cloud walking up behind Tifa as she gazed into the sky from the Highwind's deck and wrapping his arms around her while she smiled contentedly I highly doubt we'd be here today.

I feel the need to speak up for "normies" here who play this game (usually just once without a replay) without putting the thought into the writing afterwards, didn't look at Ultimanias etc..., and didn't watch AC. This is anecdotal (of course) but out of a small peer group I played OG with this was a basic breakdown. If it matters, we're talking about 10 people here. 9 guys (including myself) and 1 girl (who I ended up later marrying ).

• Everyone except myself did a single playthrough.
• Because of the "Love Point" system we ALL got Aerith on the GS Date. Note that of course we weren't aware of a love point system when we played. I was the only one that did a second play through exploring other dialog options.
• We all got the Low Affection Version of the Highwind Scene.
• About half of the group didn't stick around through the credits to get the Red XIII scene and were fairly sure initially that the whole party died on the Highwind escape pod. Once that got cleared up there was never a consensus on if humans survived. I was always of the mind that if Red survived the escape pod so did the others but that was pretty split.
• There was plenty of debate about which girl was better but these discussions were rarely centered around who Cloud would have preferred. It was almost always about which type girl the player preferred.
• Out of that group I'm the only one that kept up on the game afterwards. Some went on to play later installments of FF, others FF7 was their only entry. I'm also the only one that watched AC.
• Out of that group I was literally the only one to bring up the question of reframing Cloud's actions pre-LS sequence

Anyway, the general prevailing consensus among that group was simply that the ending wasn't clear and on the shipping front that the LA Highwind scene was ambigous enough for them to think nothing happened. I know the above isn't on point with the Remake/Rebirth theme of this thread but to bring it back to that I do hope they paint the end more clearly this time around.

 

[Ryushikaze]

S'all I been sayin'

I wonder if Cloud's susceptibility to Mako Poisoning might be related to his natural shitkicker-ness. He sucks up all the extra lifestream energy around him so readily, but that means when it's too abundant he is at risk faster.

Naturally, any other conclusion someone might draw is just silly.

I mean, they have had always just mysteriously died then. We're just making dumb jokes about it now.

It's a long way to go yet, but if they keep at it they gotta go up eventually.

I think being flash incinerated by the heat would stop things long before they passed the molten core.

Well now I wonder what sort of hats the rockets, pipe bombs and sticky bombs would like.

Jet pilot helmets, blast helmets, if we extend this beyond pure hats we can go with overalls for the pipe bombs and spider heads and feet for the stickies.

That sort of rage that I always think of as the "Oh shit Spidey shut up" kinda mad.

When Pete stops quipping, the fight is over. If he's still moving, that mean YOU are over.

All things in moderation, and in their proper time.

Finding the right moment to strike, and all.

Well he is the soul of Marvel after all. When things suck for all, he takes it the worst.

He's also often the sacrificial lamb. Though it did mean he got to sit out of Hero's Reborn after the Onslaught event.

I mean, barring the Spirit Sword/Sword of Hope Trunks needs a bigger blade but other than that it works nicely.

Like I said, no disputes.

Ahhh the good old Phoenix Force. Overcomplicating shut since it first appeared, but too awesome to ignore in spite of that.

Like Scarlet Witch in the modern era.

Pslocke finally got her body back I hear. Which is funny to me cause I'm pretty sure she was trapped in an Asian super-ninja body longer than she appeared in original form, real time. As you said, comics!

To clarify, Betsy Braddock who is now Captain Britain reformed her body and Kwannon who is now Psylocke also got her body back.
Also her first appearance was in '76 in her Brother's Captain Britain comic, and the appearance changeover happened in 1989, and she got her original body back in 2018. So yep, 13 years versus 39.

You're not wrong. The man likes his ladies to know their way around the inside of someone else's head.

He knows what he wants and he goes for it.

Which is saying something cause Wilkins was also consistent, amazing, and able to whiplash between comical and genuinely threatening at the drop of a hat. Plus he had the genuine evil loved ones thing with Faith. And Glorificus still owns.

Wilkins was I think the second best realized big bad of the show. And it was on another "this might be our last hurrah" season.

Madness, I know.

But how could such a thing be possibe? We need more epicycles!

This needs emphasis, and then QFFT everywhere.

I mean feel free to do so. I'm basically just repeating the sourcebook.

This has some mild Drakengard 3 vibes. If Zero shows up, we can all laugh as everyone including Sephiroth nopes the fuck out.

"I'm willing to do a lot of shit but I ain't fucking with those freaky space babies. I'm gone"

I’m hoping it’s his uncle. As unlikely as that is to be the answer, I’m hoping they take a left turn and it’s his uncle.

If Glenn has anything to do with Cloud, Uncle or Cousin should be as close as the relationship gets.

There’s likely 2 whales for Cloud and Tifa, one gets sliced by good old sushi chef Sephiroth, it spits the one out and the other swallows them so they end up in the same whale. Commence LS scene in haste.

If they do that, then Tifa's should be the one attacked, and Cloud should pull Tifa in, to echo the OG game.

 

[pxl_pushr]

I wonder if Cloud's susceptibility to Mako Poisoning might be related to his natural shitkicker-ness. He sucks up all the extra lifestream energy around him so readily, but that means when it's too abundant he is at risk faster.


I mean, they have had always just mysteriously died then. We're just making dumb jokes about it now.


I think being flash incinerated by the heat would stop things long before they passed the molten core.


Jet pilot helmets, blast helmets, if we extend this beyond pure hats we can go with overalls for the pipe bombs and spider heads and feet for the stickies.


When Pete stops quipping, the fight is over. If he's still moving, that mean YOU are over.


Finding the right moment to strike, and all.


He's also often the sacrificial lamb. Though it did mean he got to sit out of Hero's Reborn after the Onslaught event.


Like I said, no disputes.


Like Scarlet Witch in the modern era.


To clarify, Betsy Braddock who is now Captain Britain reformed her body and Kwannon who is now Psylocke also got her body back.
Also her first appearance was in '76 in her Brother's Captain Britain comic, and the appearance changeover happened in 1989, and she got her original body back in 2018. So yep, 13 years versus 39.


He knows what he wants and he goes for it.


Wilkins was I think the second best realized big bad of the show. And it was on another "this might be our last hurrah" season.


But how could such a thing be possibe? We need more epicycles!


I mean feel free to do so. I'm basically just repeating the sourcebook.


"I'm willing to do a lot of shit but I ain't fucking with those freaky space babies. I'm gone"


If Glenn has anything to do with Cloud, Uncle or Cousin should be as close as the relationship gets.


If they do that, then Tifa's should be the one attacked, and Cloud should pull Tifa in, to echo the OG game.

Does it count if the whales kiss, or do we award half points in that case

 

[abzy1200]

If Glenn has anything to do with Cloud, Uncle or Cousin should be as close as the relationship gets.

Uncle-in-law or third cousin, maybe.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Does it count if the whales kiss, or do we award half points in that case

If the whales kiss, all the better.

Uncle-in-law or third cousin, maybe.

Glenn will turn out to be Cloud's father’s brother’s nephew’s cousin’s former roommate

 

[abzy1200]

Glenn will turn out to be Cloud's father’s brother’s nephew’s cousin’s former roommate

He better.

 

[Hellenic]

Also most FF characters are designed to appeal to the players.

Every FF character looks hot basically. It's a staple of the series a this point .

 

[pxl_pushr]

If the whales kiss, all the better.


Glenn will turn out to be Cloud's father’s brother’s nephew’s cousin’s former roommate

Cloud, Rufus, and Glenn, all Sons of Liberty.

Hojo removes his mask to show Hideo Kojima.

 

[ViolaaFox]

Every FF character looks hot basically. It's a staple of the series a this point .

Anyone who isn't Hojo.

 

[Hellenic]

Anyone who isn't Hojo.

That's a fair point.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Yeah it's not that uncommon for some people to think nothing happened in OG, even streamers I watched that flavoured Tifa, always had her in their party when possible, etc said it was vague. I've also seen folk skip going back to Shinra Manor to see the optional Zack scenes, saying they didn't want him to be important.

 

[Yoru]

I don't know what people imagine when after the line "Words aren't the only way to tell someone how you feel" there's a fade to black, but I suppose the voice acting and motion capture in part 3 should help you see things more clearly.

 

[Eerie]

It's vague if you don't understand that the LS scene is basically a giant love confession. Which, it is. And it's 100% going to be mushier and have a kissing scene because people lack comprehension skills. Which is sad but hey. The LS scene is the resolve of the LT in the OG, it will still be the resolve of the LT in p3.

Talking about if they’ll incorporate Tifa’s past/ToTP-

In the Mideel part where she stays with Cloud, is there a lot of conversation they have there or is it just the place Tifa is left? Like do they hang out around with Cloud a lot or just the part where he is found?

In the OG they just leave her there and we find her back right before the LS scene begins.

What's interesting is that we can think that Tifa having the same core memories as Cloud means that no other memory will be explored, however... I would like to raise up everyone's attention on the Back Whispers flying above Cloud's memories of the Lifestream scene in the ending. What are they doing there? Are they corrupting Cloud's memories? Or something alike?

The Weapons tried to protect those memories but they were outnumbered and had to go in the end - so it means Sephiroth has another plan for the LS sequence to not happen me think. Which means that definitely the LS sequence will have those memories that will need to be restored, but also other memories talked about. So ToTP should be used heavily there, with Cloud's answers being the other side of Tifa's memories; and as I said it, the LS is made not only of memories, but also feelings and hopes, and this is what is going to make Sephiroth lose IMHO.

Yes, because we finally know that everything that is pink is Aerith. I think I have the links to some of these Tweets still on my phone it was wild.

To be very honest, those Weapons are young and pink and blue are Aerith and Zack's colours so I always wonder in the back of my head if he helps her summon them. That would be fcking wild to see tbh, how Weapons are created. It would be awesome if she had a moment of revelation "oh I must create those Weapons in the past so they can help Tifa in Gongaga!" Like I would dig that (not sure they're going there but I may like that theory only for that lol).

That would also imply that Sephiroth can maybe corrupt some Weapons.

Yeah not a fan of this idea either, but man he looks so much like Cloud it's insane.

He doesn't look like Cloud at all lmao? By any FF/VII standard, he's pretty ugly. His character also doesn't match Cloud's father. And in the EC Halloween event, he didn't recognise Nibelheim at all.

Reusing the ying/yang symbolism there would be a nice touch

Yeah I think it should be used after the LS scene, maybe when they find them on the shore? Once Cloud is himself.

 

[abzy1200]

On the topic of the LS. At the very end of the LS when Cloud and Tifa rise back up to the surface, do we think they holding hands, or atleast doing something like that? Because it seems like Tifa rises up faster but then she slows down and her speed matches with Cloud's and their hands are touching off one another's.

 

[Eerie]

I always thought they held hands there, not sure if this is confirmed anywhere though. I know she held hands with kid!Cloud in the LS and that is 100% confirmed.

 

[abzy1200]

I always thought they held hands there, not sure if this is confirmed anywhere though. I know she held hands with kid!Cloud in the LS and that is 100% confirmed.

Really? Could I get a source or is that asking for too much?

 

[pxl_pushr]

It's vague if you don't understand that the LS scene is basically a giant love confession. Which, it is. And it's 100% going to be mushier and have a kissing scene because people lack comprehension skills. Which is sad but hey. The LS scene is the resolve of the LT in the OG, it will still be the resolve of the LT in p3.


In the OG they just leave her there and we find her back right before the LS scene begins.

What's interesting is that we can think that Tifa having the same core memories as Cloud means that no other memory will be explored, however... I would like to raise up everyone's attention on the Back Whispers flying above Cloud's memories of the Lifestream scene in the ending. What are they doing there? Are they corrupting Cloud's memories? Or something alike?

The Weapons tried to protect those memories but they were outnumbered and had to go in the end - so it means Sephiroth has another plan for the LS sequence to not happen me think. Which means that definitely the LS sequence will have those memories that will need to be restored, but also other memories talked about. So ToTP should be used heavily there, with Cloud's answers being the other side of Tifa's memories; and as I said it, the LS is made not only of memories, but also feelings and hopes, and this is what is going to make Sephiroth lose IMHO.

To be very honest, those Weapons are young and pink and blue are Aerith and Zack's colours so I always wonder in the back of my head if he helps her summon them. That would be fcking wild to see tbh, how Weapons are created. It would be awesome if she had a moment of revelation "oh I must create those Weapons in the past so they can help Tifa in Gongaga!" Like I would dig that (not sure they're going there but I may like that theory only for that lol).

That would also imply that Sephiroth can maybe corrupt some Weapons.

He doesn't look like Cloud at all lmao? By any FF/VII standard, he's pretty ugly. His character also doesn't match Cloud's father. And in the EC Halloween event, he didn't recognise Nibelheim at all.

Yeah I think it should be used after the LS scene, maybe when they find them on the shore? Once Cloud is himself.

I have a feeling the LS scene is going to take up an entire chapter and be more than a long long detailed conversation between Tifa and multiple aspects of Cloud’s consciousness.

I’ll be ( pleasantly ) surprised if they can resist shoving in some enemy encounters and a boss.

 

[Edley]

On the topic of the LS. At the very end of the LS when Cloud and Tifa rise back up to the surface, do we think they holding hands, or atleast doing something like that? Because it seems like Tifa rises up faster but then she slows down and her speed matches with Cloud's and their hands are touching off one another's.

Yeah, the visual language of the entire arc in the OG is Tifa running and trying to catch up to Cloud and that's the moment she finally does.

 

[abzy1200]

Yeah, the visual language of the entire arc in the OG is Tifa running and trying to catch up to Cloud and that's the moment she finally does.

I just feel like it doesn't match what comes immedialy after. Unless the party split them up off screen, it would be weird for Cloud and Tifa to wash up in different places if they were holding hands.

 

[Yoru]

They've said so many times that this is their favorite scene that I think we should expect something quite different from the rest of the game. It's probably the moment when they challenge themselves as developers and use this very ethereal area for some crazy, all-out staging.

 

[abzy1200]

It's probably the moment when they challenge themselves as developers

That doesn't inspire confidence in me, honestly. Seeing as they probably "challenged" themselves with Aerith's death aswell.