SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

Eerie

Eerie

Fire and Blood
I think it will be resolved by itself by the end of the game. As I said, we have several possibilities, but them opening possibilities *might be* for Zerith actually. Because they love that ship too, and they love Zack, so it could be a possibility - but I really don't know about that because it would have no bearing on the story itself, so the intersections would be very few, maybe only at the last battle against Sephiroth; it would also reassure Cloud that somewhere his friends are safe and happy so I don't know how that would work. But that wouldn't be an actual "possibility" for Cloud. Also ignoring that in that flower field Cloud is organising a picnic for Tifa & the kids and their friends is a little bit...

But well there are a lot of "ifs" there. Maybe we'll have a better grasp of what they want to do later on.

OH BTW, I took Aerith's line "we'll meet again" when she gets KO'ed as a call back to Cloud's "we'll meet her again" at the end of the OG, not necessarily a line to Zack? But I didn't play CC so?? I'm confused :D
 
Final_Heaven

Final_Heaven

Pro Adventurer
Eerie said:
I think it will be resolved by itself by the end of the game. As I said, we have several possibilities, but them opening possibilities *might be* for Zerith actually. Because they love that ship too, and they love Zack, so it could be a possibility - but I really don't know about that because it would have no bearing on the story itself, so the intersections would be very few, maybe only at the last battle against Sephiroth; it would also reassure Cloud that somewhere his friends are safe and happy so I don't know how that would work. But that wouldn't be an actual "possibility" for Cloud. Also ignoring that in that flower field Cloud is organising a picnic for Tifa & the kids and their friends is a little bit...

But well there are a lot of "ifs" there. Maybe we'll have a better grasp of what they want to do later on.

OH BTW, I took Aerith's line "we'll meet again" when she gets KO'ed as a call back to Cloud's "we'll meet her again" at the end of the OG, not necessarily a line to Zack? But I didn't play CC so?? I'm confused :D
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odekopeko

odekopeko

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Peko
Sorry for going OT but so that really is Nojima's account!?!! I responded to a tweet from that account regarding Anne of Green Gables yesterday, and he liked my tweet.
 
Final_Heaven

Final_Heaven

Pro Adventurer
Yumelinh

Yumelinh

Pro Adventurer
@Eerie the line we think may be referred to Zack isn't this one but the one she says "The voice calling to me... I know you!" (or something like that). It exists in the English version, but @Strangelove hasn't found it yet in the jap one. ^^

On a side note, I posted this on the CloTI FC, but I thought it may be relevant here as well: Midgar Blues has huge Cloud>Tifa vibes for some reason lol

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1264028129217019906
 
ForceStealer

ForceStealer

Double Growth
looneymoon said:
I can't even say, in good conscience, that "Cloud searching for Aerith in the flower fields at the end of Advent Children" is a completely baseless interpretation of the long-form storytelling anymore. Because its kind of... not. At least, at the point of the narrative we are now at. I hate it, and it's stupid, but I can't say that SE is completely ruling out that type of engagement in the story. I don't think thats their intention by any means, but imo they're egging it on more than they're ruling it out.
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For what it's worth, in the Complete version of AC they seemed to remove that element.
 
Eerie

Eerie

Fire and Blood
It's really hard to say, but yes it sounds like some latin sound has been mixed with something else. I can't put my finger on this though, I'm too bad at these kind of games :wacky:
 
Graymouse

Graymouse

Pro Adventurer
I think that after the Final Fantasy 7 Remake Project is completed and all games are out in the wild, perhaps we will have an end to this 23 year debate of LTD. It would be nice just to have it concluded. No matter which way it goes.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/869844517943431168

The really sad part about all this is that even if we have a conclusion, there are a lot of toxic people on both sides of the debate that wouldn't accept that conclusion.
 
M

minami758

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Miiwoo
Enka is a genre of Japanese music with traditional roots. It bears some similarities to blues, and the songs also sometimes include elements of pop. Common topics are love, loss, longing/yearning, etc. It's pretty obvious "Midgar Blues" is a direct reference to Cloud and Tifa's promise, especially given the little 7 years tidbit from the singer.

Fun fact, after the Hell House fight, the singer (named Akila) sends you one of those huge flower bouquets that's displayed in the Underground Colosseum.
 
null

null

Mr. Thou
AKA
null
looneymoon said:
I've mentioned this before in a more coy manner, but I'm gonna mention it again, more explicitly.

S-E opening the door to all this AU/timeline fuckery is breeding ground for more dumb shipper shit. The only thing is that this time it's done by design.

I can't even say, in good conscience, that "Cloud searching for Aerith in the flower fields at the end of Advent Children" is a completely baseless interpretation of the long-form storytelling anymore. Because its kind of... not. At least, at the point of the narrative we are now at. I hate it, and it's stupid, but I can't say that SE is completely ruling out that type of engagement in the story. I don't think thats their intention by any means, but imo they're egging it on more than they're ruling it out.
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I'm surprised there isn't more discussion about the Chrono Cross parallels (like AU timelines and literally killing Fate). If that gets out we'll REALLY start to hear about star crossed lovers searching through time and space.
 
Master Bates

Master Bates

Do you enjoy your life?
AKA
Mr. Koiwai
MasterMoogle said:
Technically, so did Zack and Aerith, except they did it through a phone call while Zack was standing next to that same water tower. Maybe I'm grasping at straws, but they could have had that phone call anywhere in Nibelheim.
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Not that I disagree with your statement specifically, but are you implying "Midgar Blues" is also a reference to Zerith? Because if so, I'll have to disagree. Like minami above said, it's pretty obvious it refers to Cloud and Tifa. Literally everything in the lyrics screams Cloti: leaving his hometown for Midgar without having said his goodbye to the person with whom he watched the starry sky of their hometown (when Zack left Gongaga to come to Midgar, he hasn't even met Aerith yet). Furthermore, the 'starry sky' is more a motif for Cloti than Zerith. And the pretty telling "unshrinking distance between my heart and yours" wouldn't be applicable to Zerith.

I know the in-universe singer-songwriter of Midgar Blues isn't Cloud, but given that this is a pretty blatant reference to the Cloti relationship, this is further proof of how important the promise is to Cloud, perhaps arguably even more so to him than Tifa. He wasn't forced into it as some others claim; he truly wanted to be needed by Tifa and he kept their promise very close to his heart.

I'm glad that the developers included this song in the remake. It's fun that there are 'clues' to be found in this song. So, Midgar Blues Clues?
 
Graymouse

Graymouse

Pro Adventurer
Reading the lyrics and watching that video, It is defiantly have a strong Cloud X Tifa vibe.
 
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Strangelove

Strangelove

AI Researcher
AKA
hitoshura
also here's one called 'flower blues' just because i think the shot of the guy handing the viewer a flower is funny


looneymoon said:
I've mentioned this before in a more coy manner, but I'm gonna mention it again, more explicitly.
I can't even say, in good conscience, that "Cloud searching for Aerith in the flower fields at the end of Advent Children" is a completely baseless interpretation of the long-form storytelling anymore. Because its kind of... not. At least, at the point of the narrative we are now at. I hate it, and it's stupid, but I can't say that SE is completely ruling out that type of engagement in the story. I don't think thats their intention by any means, but imo they're egging it on more than they're ruling it out.
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i think it's pretty easy to put together what's going on with cloud's call to tifa about closing the shop

but none of that dialogue is in either version of the film. it's at the end of a digest video of the original game that's a bonus feature on the dvd. like, not even an explicit 'extra scene/epilogue' or something, you don't know this dialogue is there unless you watch it or are told beforehand it's there. in fact you'd think a rundown of the original story would be something you'd want people to watch first, but none of the voiced dialogue makes sense without watching the film because it's set after the film's story.

in one sense, i think it's an interesting concept to encourage people to actually explore the dvd contents and get something more. but on the other hand you're relying on stuff outside the main text to tell your story.

idk man but did you see the scene where cloud fights sephiroth, that was fuckin sick
 
M

minami758

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Miiwoo
They pretty much slap you in the face with “the promise is extremely important to Cloud!!!!” in the Remake.

Tifa kind of nudges it during their conversation at the bar, but Cloud remembers it all on his own and during a really random time. I know some people thought the placement of the Promise scene was weird but it made sense that the vent fan triggered it, and honestly kind of makes the memory stronger, in a sense. That Cloud remembers it during a time that has nothing to do with Tifa means she’s on his mind a lot.:mon:

Edit: I think Tifa actually appears in every single chapter aside from Chapter 2.
 
Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
looneymoon said:
I've mentioned this before in a more coy manner, but I'm gonna mention it again, more explicitly.

S-E opening the door to all this AU/timeline fuckery is breeding ground for more dumb shipper shit. The only thing is that this time it's done by design.

I can't even say, in good conscience, that "Cloud searching for Aerith in the flower fields at the end of Advent Children" is a completely baseless interpretation of the long-form storytelling anymore. Because its kind of... not. At least, at the point of the narrative we are now at. I hate it, and it's stupid, but I can't say that SE is completely ruling out that type of engagement in the story. I don't think thats their intention by any means, but imo they're egging it on more than they're ruling it out.
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It's no different than when people said Cloud was searching for Aerith in Kingdom Hearts (even though we know from the Final Mix version he was looking for Sephiroth) and the ending of said game teased Cloud and Aerith's reunion.

The AU shipper shit has always been around, hovering over FFVII. However, I suppose it'll have gained more currency than it did before, thanks to the Remake. But even then, I'd say the burden of proof in tying anything to a hitherto undefined AU, is on the claimant. We have absolutely no idea how this ending impacts things.

For all we know, the world Zack's in at this point could be a hellish Bizarro universe like The Upside Down, with Zack trying to tie reality back together and make it right because it simply shouldn't exist and everyone there is now dead. Or it could be a universe of anthropomorphic dogs waging war with Heaven's Dark Harbinger, Sephiruff.

We don't know.
No one should be leaping to conclusions yet, not when Kingdom Hearts is a perfectly fertile soil for dumb AU shipper shit :monster:
 
looneymoon

looneymoon

they/them
AKA
Rishi
The only difference now is that this is the canon depictions of the characters, in the universe of the game from which they came from :monster:

I get what you're saying about the AU/timeline stuff being undefined, and that some theorycrafting is more legitimate than others... but to be fair... at a certain point, that's on the storytelling for not defining the rules by which these things operate, and not really on the audience for arriving at faulty conclusions. I would argue that introducing AU/timelines inherently gives more credibility to ideas like the Kingdom Hearts versions of the characters being the same people :monster:

I'm not convinced that's their intention, but I don't think it's... not not their intention :monster:

All I am saying is that it's difficult to be dismissive of shipper nonsense anymore when there is pretty equivalent nonsense that's been presented in the narrative+creators themselves, as it stands right now. Cloud having adulterous rendezvous with Aerith in a field of flowers isn't any less silly than the suggestion of there being two Buster Swords roaming around, or that a potato chip bag is the key to understanding all the universe's questions :monster:

Whatever it all means, we don't know of course, but it's concretely there in the story now. Moreso than when it was simply characters making cameo appearances in other games.
 
Yumelinh

Yumelinh

Pro Adventurer
I definitely believe anything can happen in the romance subplot in the Remake, for both sides really ( devs keep saying they will not change much but part 1 ending kinda hints otherwise lol).

However, what I normally question myself is why would they? why now actually? For some time now they have been consistently cementing the OG pairings throughout the compilation, both in games and Ultimanias. It's not like they needed to do that, It was a choice. So, turning around now seems such a waste of time lol ( both ours and theirs). But who knows.

That said, While Zack's appearance opens a possibility for different timelines/different endings maybe? Which is a good thing for CxA ofc,
It kinda makes things more complicated in the LTD too, which Zack was never a part of due to the fact that he was dead, but if he's not anymore why does it means? At the end of the day, he was Aerith's lover and died trying to reach her, so we know his feelings for her were there. The same thing goes to Aerith, part 1 made sure to show that she's still not truly over him? So, if he's somewhat alive.. what would that mean to the LTD? Will it become a love square debate ( or LSD? ...okkk )?


no conclusion here, I'm just throwing my drunk thoughts o /
 
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