SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[The Twilight Mexican]

I am going to remove that attachment later anyway once Tres and Purple have seen it, as it's probably unfair to krudears to have it out here, it seemed like a special experience to them.

I appreciate you posting that for clarification. I'll have to agree with @minami758 about Hamaguchi's response, though.

I'll also add that what the fan told him wasn't an obviously shippy statement. They didn't say クラエアが大好きです ("I love Clerith"). They said クラウドとエアリスが大好きです ("I love Cloud and Aerith") -- which, to his ears, may have just meant the characters? And for all we know, that may have been all that krudears meant it as when they said it?

Of course krudears is a major Clerith fan, if the rest of their twitter is any indication. I'm simply saying it just seems like an awful lot of unverifiable stuff is being read into both the intent of their comment and Hamaguchi's understanding of it. That's before even getting into that Hamaguchi didn't say anything about an "answer."

 

[Ruri]

https://imgur.com/a/moVCVFA

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1264541687059288065

Let's just call it here guys and go out for a beer with each other or something.

 

[rkss]

So we misquote devs on twitter now. This is the new age of LTD? Hoo-boy...

I'm on the "just end it" camp. I don't care who wins, as long as it's a definitive conclusion I'll gladly accept it . But knowing SE, it probably won't happen.
Even Eva's writer is ending the life long "love affairs" question (also took them that long to remake). So there's hope.
But maybe that' because the relationships in original TV series were a real mess.

 

[minami758]

I have a feeling they're going for a "end this shit" ending this time, but there's always the possibility that they don't. I personally feel like ambiguity is a cop out and never satisfies anyone, least of all shippers. The best love triangles across various media always end with a definitive answer.

Also Kitase's answer is basically "play the game and you'll know."

 

[Maidenofwar]

Sorry if I came across as too gungho or anything! my intention wasn't to ruin the Nojima with Cloud and Tifa, etc art or anything for people, I mainly agree with what Purple, Ruri, etc said.

Here's the Hamaguchi and Kitase in church-

If people want to or do take enjoyment from stuffs like the Nojima stuffs or this or similar I think it's ok, for people to have fun with things like these just the element of they do love all the characters, see what they give to people, all the different ways people enjoy things, etc

 

[MasterMoogle]

I think it just goes to show the creators love all the game’s characters. And they definitely love seeing all the discussion online

They shouldn't. The fandom has frequently become toxic as a result of this triangle.

 

[Yumelinh]

https://imgur.com/a/moVCVFA

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1264541687059288065

Let's just call it here guys and go out for a beer with each other or something.

Exiciting??? How dare they???? I'm going back to my wine that's it!!

jokes aside, I find it amazing how they still manage to keep slithering out of giving a straight answer to this question every single time. It's a skill indeed.

I have a feeling they're going for a "end this shit" ending this time, but there's always the possibility that they don't. I personally feel like ambiguity is a cop out and never satisfies anyone, least of all shippers. The best love triangles across various media always end with a definitive answer.

Also Kitase's answer is basically "play the game and you'll know."

I agree! I mean, we're still on part 1 of a "possible" 3 parts games, so ofc he wouldn't be giving away the ending of the LTD though an interview. It's the good and old wait and sees I guess lol

 

[Graymouse]

For some reason deep down in my heart, I just know that they will never end the LTD. Not because they don't want to, but because SE doesn't want to make one group of their fans feel bad. That is not the way the Japanese think. They want everybody to be happy and satisfied with their game.

I am pretty sure if SE does choose a side, (choose the form of the destructor) or makes their game where it leaves no doubt, it will get really toxic online.

Although, in my opinion and in all honestly, I am still confused about how the LTD is still around all these years because one of the character is dead. I guess love beyond the grave is beyond my understanding. But oh well. Each their own.

 

[MasterMoogle]

For some reason deep down in my heart, I just know that they will never end the LTD. Not because they don't want to, but because SE doesn't want to make one group of their fans feel bad. That is not the way the Japanese think. They want everybody to be happy and satisfied with their game.

I am pretty sure if SE does choose a side, (choose the form of the destructor) or makes their game were it leaves no doubt, it will get really toxic online.

Although, in my opinion and in all honestly, I am still confused about how the LTD is still around all these years because one of the character is dead. I guess love beyond the grave is beyond my understanding. But oh well. Each their own.

But that's the thing, it's already toxic. SE is making people unhappy by not settling it.

 

[Final_Heaven]

For some reason deep down in my heart, I just know that they will never end the LTD. Not because they don't want to, but because SE doesn't want to make one group of their fans feel bad. That is not the way the Japanese think. They want everybody to be happy and satisfied with their game.

I am pretty sure if SE does choose a side, (choose the form of the destructor) or makes their game were it leaves no doubt, it will get really toxic online.

Although, in my opinion and in all honestly, I am still confused about how the LTD is still around all these years because one of the character is dead. I guess love beyond the grave is beyond my understanding. But oh well. Each their own.

Even if Cloud were in true love with Aerith, it wouldn't the fit the story for him to pine for her until he dies 60 years later.

He knew Aertih for two months and Aerith was in a relationship with Zack for over a year. She moved on in 5 years.

Cloud's going to move on sooner rather than later eventually with Tifa if you don't think he already has.

Also can you imagine Cloud living with Tifa and finding a different gf or Tifa living with Cloud and finding a different boyfriend? The story has presented them as two people that are going to live with each other for the rest of their lives with the trappings of a marriage.

 

[Purple]

I find it amazing how they still manage to keep slithering out of giving a straight answer to this question every single time. It's a skill indeed.

They wouldn’t answer it in an interview but maybe, just maybe, show it in the later installments. Who knows.

Like Kitase is implying, people should play the game to get their answers. And I think the answer is fairly obvious as to who.

 

[Yumelinh]

For some reason deep down in my heart, I just know that they will never end the LTD. Not because they don't want to, but because SE doesn't want to make one group of their fans feel bad. That is not the way the Japanese think. They want everybody to be happy and satisfied with their game.

While I agree with your statement about their point of view due to their own culture, at the end of the day this is a creative work, and no matter what you do people be disappointed either way. And I'm sure they know that bc when it comes to OG, they did choose a side. Even if, to my personal dislike, the answer is more of a written one that throughout the games/movies, who tend to keep things more in an ambiguous side.

So, I personally always view it as a subtle approach when it comes to the visual works (such as games/movies) while being more obvious in their complementary works.

However, I've seen a huge swift in that 'subtleness' when it comes to the Remake, but It's still too early to know if it will mean something in the long run ( and I'm not the most hopeful person when it comes to the end of the LTD so there's that as well ^^)

But in all, I agree w/ @MasterMoogle. Things have been getting way toxic when it comes to this topic. But we just don't know if they aware of that (or if they even care lol it generates buzz at the end of the day.)

Things are so mellow here that It's always a shock when I lurk outside and realized that this shipwar is kicking and strong as ever. For the record, it seems that Tifa was just trending on twitter today for being defended for some massive hate she was getting due to ships, and I saw the same thing happening to Zack as well.

So for the fans, and even for the characters itself, it would be beneficial if they just...ended it. Whatever side they decide to go, it would be fine.

Although, in my opinion and in all honestly, I am still confused about how the LTD is still around all these years because one of the character is dead. I guess love beyond the grave is beyond my understanding. But oh well. Each their own.

Aerith dying doesn't really solve anything, it just complicated things more tbh. Since because of that, they never had the opportunity to get closure for whatever they were feeling when she was alive.

I think the LTD was never really about who Clouds ends up with (that's clear as day in the end) but more about who he truly loves, so Aerith being alive or not doesn't matter to many people imo.

Also, I always personally dislike this very argument. It makes whatever Cloud and Tifa feel for each other irrelevant if the LTD could be easily solved by killing one part of said triangle.

 

[LNK]

But that's the thing, it's already toxic. SE is making people unhappy by not settling it.

I think, in the end, that's on the fans though. They've let themselves become toxic about it. I thought the OG and compilation already showed Cloud and Tifa ended up together? I mean, what are fans wanting of the creators?

 

[Master Bates]

I think the LTD was never really about who Clouds ends up with

Surprise, surprise! The first iteration of the LTD is exactly this because people back then legitimately believed and made the argument that Cloud was going to follow and meet Aerith in the Promised Land, thus, they end up together. I shit you not. Granted it didn't last long for the contention to shift, but still.

 

[RhinoKart]

For some reason deep down in my heart, I just know that they will never end the LTD. Not because they don't want to, but because SE doesn't want to make one group of their fans feel bad. That is not the way the Japanese think. They want everybody to be happy and satisfied with their game.

I am pretty sure if SE does choose a side, (choose the form of the destructor) or makes their game where it leaves no doubt, it will get really toxic online.

Although, in my opinion and in all honestly, I am still confused about how the LTD is still around all these years because one of the character is dead. I guess love beyond the grave is beyond my understanding. But oh well. Each their own.

I am always torn between them giving an answer and them keeping it ambiguous. On the one hand, if this is truly going to be the final instalment in FFVII then I can see them ending it finally. Closing out all the story arcs.

If they want to keep the door open for future compilation material, I can see them NOT ending it because unfortunately the love triangle is a big part of what keeps discussion going online between instalments.

What I don't think will happen is having it solved before Aerith's death, which is basically not solving it at all because everyone who was on the "he still loves her from beyond the grave" or "if she lived he'd have been with her" teams are still going to be there. So no matter what happens with Cloud and Tifa afterwards it won't be "solved" in some people's eyes.

Conclusion: It's all hopeless but we're never going to stop arguing it.

 

[Purple]

For the record, it seems that Tifa was just trending on twitter today for being defended for some massive hate she was getting due to ships,

Damn. That’s a facepalm inducing moment right there. The Tifa hate on twitter is ridiculous. Glad I don’t dwell there much. And for it to trend might mean it’s worse than I thought. I’m sure PR staff of SE is aware of these things.

 

[LNK]

because people back then legitimately believed and made the argument that Cloud was going to follow and meet Aerith in the Promised Land, thus, they end up together.

That could've been a good ending. Makes me think of

Spoiler: 2 games where the protagonist sacrificed themselves

FF15 and Tales of Berseria

 

[Eerie]

But you see, we here agree that they end up together, and that whatever clerith has it doesn't diminish cloti. However, this is not true for.. a LOT of people, even people who are not shippers. A lot will argue that Cloud and Tifa do NOT end together, not even in AC:C. And you have to wonder what they truly think of Cloud because they don't seem to care that it makes him one of the shittier characters ever created, but hey, they totally live together, raise a kid together, while Tifa loves him, but he doesn't and goes mop for Aerith on any given day.

I'm like "... mmh, no"?

 

[Master Bates]

That could've been a good ending. Makes me think of

Spoiler: 2 games where the protagonist sacrificed themselves

FF15 and Tales of Berseria

Not a fan of those kind of endings personally, but whatever floats anyone's boat. But that wasn't my point though. What I was saying was that at one point of this LTD's history, the contention was exactly that: "Who did Cloud end up with"? Then it became to "What was the intended pairing?", until this last iteration of "Who does Cloud love?" or "Who is Cloud more romantically interested in?"

The LTD has evolved over the years, and so did the question that is to be answered.

 

[Yumelinh]

Surprise, surprise! The first iteration of the LTD is exactly this because people back then legitimately believed and made the argument that Cloud was going to follow and meet Aerith in the Promised Land, thus, they end up together. I shit you not. Granted it didn't last long for the contention to shift, but still.

Wait so people expected him to die and meet her or something like this..? Somewhat, It makes me happy I wasn't an active fan back then

Damn. That’s a facepalm inducing moment right there. The Tifa hate on twitter is ridiculous. Glad I don’t dwell there much. And for it to trend might mean it’s worse than I thought. I’m sure PR staff of SE is aware of these things.

She's been getting a lot of hate indeed, but I was taking it with a grant of salt as I do follow a lot of ppl who are very protective of her. But her name trending is Spain ( it seems so) definitely 'ring the alarm' to me that some people are going to far with the hate. Thankfully, she seems to be the one getting much love for the fandom as well if we go the general fan reaction and things like figures sales. The baby is loved!


Edit to add a source to the twitter claim above:

Spoiler

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1264584007137800192

 

[LNK]

However, this is not true for.. a LOT of people, even people who are not shippers. A lot will argue that Cloud and Tifa do NOT end together, not even in AC:C. And you have to wonder what they truly think of Cloud because they don't seem to care that it makes him one of the shittier characters ever created, but hey, they totally live together, raise a kid together, while Tifa loves him, but he doesn't and goes mop for Aerith on any given day.

That's a problem for those fans then. It just comes down to them needing to get over it. Cloud and Tifa ended up together (while having a very complicated relationship) whether they like it or not

 

[LNK]

Not a fan of those kind of endings personally, but whatever floats anyone's boat. But that wasn't my point though

Oh, I know it wasn't your point. I had just never heard what you said, before. I was just commenting on that.

 

[Graymouse]

Aerith dying doesn't really solve anything, it just complicated things more tbh. Since because of that, they never had the opportunity to get closure for whatever they were feeling when she was alive.

I think the LTD was never really about who Clouds ends up with (that's clear as day in the end) but more about who he truly loves, so Aerith being alive or not doesn't matter to many people imo.

Also, I always personally dislike this very argument. It makes whatever Cloud and Tifa feel for each other irrelevant since if the LTD could be easily solved by killing one part of said triangle.

I slightly disagree with you on this, Just because the other character dies, I don't see it as a negative towards a Tifa and Cloud relationship. There is enough history to have them push through and I feel that is enough it wouldn't diminish their love for each at all. It is still believable.

Now, if the shoe was on the other foot. (lets keep the time spent with both Aerith and Tifa the same) Lets reverse the roles, Lets say Tifa dies and Aerith lives on, then that argument could be made. It would make Aerith and Cloud relationship feel irrelevant because there just isn't enough history to push through. So, Aerith "won" by default.

TLDR: I understand where you are coming from but I feel there is just too much history between Tifa and Cloud to make the argument that Tifa won by default.

Edited to add: I don't necessary support the "other character died" so it is obvious who won argument but I don't discourage it either. If that makes any sense.

 

[Yumelinh]

I slightly disagree with you on this, Just because the other character dies, I don't see it as a negative towards a Tifa and Cloud relationship. There is enough history to have them push through and I feel that is enough it wouldn't diminish their love for each at all. It is still believable.

Now, if the shoe was on the other foot. (lets keep the time spent with both Aerith and Tifa the same) Lets reverse the roles, Lets say Tifa dies and Aerith lives on, then that argument could be made. It would make Aerith and Cloud relationship feel irrelevant because there just isn't enough history to push through. So, Aerith "won" by default.

TLDR: I understand where you are coming from but I feel there is just too much history between Tifa and Cloud to make the argument that Tifa won by default.

I think you misunderstood me here My point was exactly yours here. Aerith dying doesn't magically solve anything because it implies that whatever Cloud and Tifa felt for each other wasn't the reason why they got together but the fact that she was the only one alive in the end. That's very detrimental to Tifa's character imo.

 

[MasterMoogle]

I am always torn between them giving an answer and them keeping it ambiguous. On the one hand, if this is truly going to be the final instalment in FFVII then I can see them ending it finally. Closing out all the story arcs.

If they want to keep the door open for future compilation material, I can see them NOT ending it because unfortunately the love triangle is a big part of what keeps discussion going online between instalments.

What I don't think will happen is having it solved before Aerith's death, which is basically not solving it at all because everyone who was on the "he still loves her from beyond the grave" or "if she lived he'd have been with her" teams are still going to be there. So no matter what happens with Cloud and Tifa afterwards it won't be "solved" in some people's eyes.

Conclusion: It's all hopeless but we're never going to stop arguing it.

This stupid triangle could easily be solved if one of the ladies, most likely Aerith, came to their damn senses and realized Cloud just isn't worth their time. Zack, on the other hand, is.