SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
It uh... It keeps going past that unfortunately :doh: And gets dumb. Tidus blows himself to chunky salsa kicking an old mine he mistook for a blitzball dumb. Unless that got thrown out while I was gone? Please tell me it got thrown out.
Literally never been referenced since and 10-3 is never happening, so I would say their story currently ends at special mission.

To be fair, there is no second guy in that equation. Unless you count random suitors.
There is Brother.
Who is her cousin. And insane.
So yeah, no second guy!

Nojima had to be drunk when he wrote that.

That and the audio drama are like... the only misses from him (for me as I like most everything else he's written)

Although, I'm not sure how canon they are as they obviously exist to set up X-3 and we're not even sure if that will still happen now.
Yeah, it ended on a fucked up cliffhanger and then 10 was done with. I think it was setting up some new conflict for Yuna in a sequel that never manifested and has been quietly memory holed since I don't think it's ever referenced anywhere.
 

Hellenic

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Hellenic
Welcome to the Lifestream forums ChaosandConfusion!

**

I uhh ... really didn't like Rinoa way back when I first played ff8 she even made my "the worst" characters list, it was a very short list but yeah xD My favourite was Selphie, I even named Aerith Selphie.

I did think Rinoa was beautiful and Angelo was her saving grace as she grew on me over the years, OP in battle too.
I don't know if i would put Rinoa in a "worst" list of any kind myself, but i was more of a Selphie person myself too. I never really warmed up for the Squall and Rinoa relationship either.
 

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
Also don't think I forgot about this one.

To me she's straight up Shrodinger's Aerith until SE lets me observe her actual state.
Also entirely fair. I am guessing just as everyone else is. I'm just saying what I see and how it fits the evidence as I understand it.

Resist temptation to reference Blackface-Norris. Resist.
Go on, live a little.

Better insulation and an isolation bunker on the capacitors, gotcha.
With purifying flame on standby just in case.

Feels like it could get ugly even if they did.
Plus most places have a "we do not accept fan suggestions" as a general rule for liability/ royalty's sake.

I love how she can shift comedic stylings for each party member you pair her with and never feel OOC for it.
She's EVERYONE'S wacky kid sister.

Almost nothing, that's just a shame. Going back to our talk of twists, one of my favorites is the twist silly reference joke. Example, back when MTG was just Eldrazi the game and we got "We know, you can't even."
Specifically taking a common idea or catch phrase and making a one step further response and then letting the reader work back to the reference itself, you mean?

So they're chaotic in approach while lawfully devoted to their ship. Is Pink Hell a chamber of the Underdark? Cause this sounds Drow-ish.
Ah Lolth, the psycho goth cheerleader bitch queen herself. Also yes, very second edition drow, before the got their especially odd edges filed off.

I think that actually happened more than once. Their "arguments" weren't the only thing they tended to repeat after all. Was it Tres who compared it to Spira's whole Spiral of Death? Sounds like him but it could've been any number of folks. Hell I thought it, but someone beat me to the post.
I could see Tres making that reference, yeah.

I'm quoting you on that later. I will provide ni context. The people receiving said quotation will be all "who the fuck is Ryushikaze?" and I will laugh.
Except the one person, who will know, and stare you dead in the face and go "Dammit. If he says it. It must be so."

It'd be criminal not to take that deal
Not only is it mutually beneficial, the whole world wins.

Ah but I never claimed Jean perpetrated the incident, only that afterward she was but rarely allowed to be the firey redhead of old by the editors.
I was just saying that two redheads who are technically you destroy a galaxy and invite a hell dimension to Manhattan and you never get to have fun any more. It's criminal.

I think the readership let Kitty move further from her time with Logan than most. I seem to recall her straight up being Headmistress of Xavier's School for a bit? Jubes by comparison still has Wolverine's sidekick vibes much later. Plus Laura is Wolverine so she's the most primed to team up with the others in general.
Well, she's Logan's test tube baby daughter rather than explicit clone (she has her own actual Clone, too) but yes, very much her father's daughter in the teamup regard. I do wish they'd pick one to be Wolverine and let the other have a new name. Like with Pete and Miles. Ben Reilly got a new name (And though not as bad as OMD, that's another arc I wish had gone in an alternate direction I heard was the original plan)

A thought, would Kurt work for Nanaki as well or better than Cannonball? Scary looking, covered in fur, comes off as wise and genuinely is but is also a big old child with a fanboy mentality. Scales walls, backflips midnight as an offensive technique... I could go on.
Actually very deeply spiritual, has a long term love interest who barely shows up, no, Kurt fits very well for Nanaki. Let's get some blue dye and run with this.

Also, Mr. Sinister for Hojo?
Him or Hodge for sure. Like all the mad science of Sinister and the petty bullshit of Hodge.

I'm not aware of him scamming cash from what I've seen, just attention.

Well you can't take a swing at the blurnz ball if you stand outside the stadium :awesome:
Especially given the tether.

True rage tears down empires, frees slaves, and emboldens us to outlive our enemies. It's not some evil thing from outside, it serves an important function in nature and society. It exists for a reason. It's why I could never fully get behind the Jedi order. Idunno if they ever got this but Obi-Wan didn't beat Maul (first time) until he got mad. Luke beat Vader by getting mad. The trick is knowing when you've accomplished what you can with your rage and stopping... which is admittedly hard to do.
Yeah, a lot of fan media really wanted Luke to go down the balanced Gray Jedi route about mastering the self without denying the self.

But how's it's mileage? :awesomonster:
Hard to tell. Crazy Tank never seems to run out, so... infinite?

That could be good or I'll depending on how it goes. Looking at you 76, with your fully modern Deathclaws and Brotherhood chapters and other such shite. Also just fir being shite.
I've heard the gameplay has much improved since launch, but yes, the wanting to shoehorn the recognizable no matter how well or poorly they fit is still bleh.

Friends don't let friends debate fallaciously :monster:
Stopping them is the most ethical thing to do.

NGL, I loved this part of Aerith's character.
It's both very admirable and very relatable at the same time.

Burger Time type customer service mini-games, but with flowers!
Bouquet Building Action!

I insist that he be out cold just long enough for some bored slum kids to paint his face in candy skull patterns. Then we watch everyone lose their minds over "what does this mean?!" Beyond that, agreed.
I'm down for this.
 

Gym Leader Devil

True Master of the Dark-type (suck it Piers)
AKA
So many names
Also don't think I forgot about this one.

Ryu doesn't forget, though he may allow you to think he has until it's too late. It is known.

Also entirely fair. I am guessing just as everyone else is. I'm just saying what I see and how it fits the evidence as I understand it.

My main reason for not speculating is that my own reading of available evidence is all over the place. Once they show me where North is l might go sailing that sea, till then imma sit on the rocks and watch people try not to run aground.

Go on, live a little.

Unlike Another World Serge :awesome:

With purifying flame on standby just in case.

Now we're getting into CDC level precautions. Well people did always look at this thread as a disease.

Plus most places have a "we do not accept fan suggestions" as a general rule for liability/ royalty's sake.

Exactly the kind of ugly I was picturing. Fucking about with fan suggestions in a copyrighted IP is like juggling lit dynamite. Might be a damn good show, but you know the ending is gonna be messy.

She's EVERYONE'S wacky kid sister.

The wacky little sister they didn't know they needed. Especially Cloud, gimme more Cloud interacting with kids SE. Having a special on Toad King jobs today slayed me.

Specifically taking a common idea or catch phrase and making a one step further response and then letting the reader work back to the reference itself, you mean?

That exactly. No attention called to it, just one day you look at a chapter title, a character name, an item description, the reference clicks, laughter is had. Or more rarely other feels, but usually laughter.

Ah Lolth, the psycho goth cheerleader bitch queen herself. Also yes, very second edition drow, before the got their especially odd edges filed off.

Lolth you crazy bitch, you actually did it. You made it lawful to act chaotically. Chef's kiss from a long time chaotic neutral tiefling Gish for that. Still staying in my homebrew 2e setting where drow gave their odd edges filed down rather than off.[/I]

I could see Tres making that reference, yeah.

My memory of the event may be faulty, but my memory of the man is fine :monster: I kept the first thing he said to me in my sig forever for a reason.

Except the one person, who will know, and stare you dead in the face and go "Dammit. If he says it. It must be so."

There always must be that one person who gets the reference. Said person shall feel smug about it. And may be Clicky.

Not only is it mutually beneficial, the whole world wins.

Even though I despise a lot of the whole world, I'm willing to allow them a win on behalf of everyone else. I trust you all to keep that benevolence to yourselves.

I was just saying that two redheads who are technically you destroy a galaxy and invite a hell dimension to Manhattan and you never get to have fun any more. It's criminal.

So a typical day for Marvel editorial then? At least till they kicked Quesada upstairs where he could do no less harm.

Well, she's Logan's test tube baby daughter rather than explicit clone (she has her own actual Clone, too) but yes, very much her father's daughter in the teamup regard. I do wish they'd pick one to be Wolverine and let the other have a new name. Like with Pete and Miles. Ben Reilly got a new name (And though not as bad as OMD, that's another arc I wish had gone in an alternate direction I heard was the original plan)

Is Laura still using Wolverine as her own name? I've lost track of late. Though I admit I actually find Pete and Miles both using Spider-Man endearing. Peter feeling secure enough to share the name is sweet, and I love when they just casually call each other Spider-Man while bantering.

Agreed concerning Ben Riley and his whole deal. I can't believe it actually got worse when he came back. Jackal Riley really bugs me.


Actually very deeply spiritual, has a long term love interest who barely shows up, no, Kurt fits very well for Nanaki. Let's get some blue dye and run with this.

I'm a little ashamed for not thinking of Kurt sooner. I mean, it's Kurt! The Amazing Nightcrawler himself! Blue dye is a go.

I'm still racking my brain for Vincent. Any thoughts there? I'm afraid Deadpool keeps interfering on my "red and black and shoots people" thoughts and... obviously no. Just no.


Him or Hodge for sure. Like all the mad science of Sinister and the petty bullshit of Hodge.

I want no part of a Sinister/Hodge fusion or team up. Cease. I'll take God Carnage over that.

Especially given the tether.

You win, I got nowhere to go from here :awesome:

Yeah, a lot of fan media really wanted Luke to go down the balanced Gray Jedi route about mastering the self without denying the self.

S'what I wanted. Every Star Wars OC I've ever played ended up a more emotional than average Jedi or a more self-controlled than average Sith. Extremes are bad, mmkay?

Hard to tell. Crazy Tank never seems to run out, so... infinite?

Infinite is good unless you're playing Sonic Forces. Then Infinite sucks ass.

I've heard the gameplay has much improved since launch, but yes, the wanting to shoehorn the recognizable no matter how well or poorly they fit is still bleh.

There was nowhere to go but up, so that's damning with faint praise if ever I've heard it.

Speaking of shoehorning, one of the things that interested me about Fallout London was the complete absence of the usual Fallout critters. Hell even Ghouls seemed to have a different spin on them. I still want a peak at Fallout Australia, but I have to assume there are basically no humans left there.


Stopping them is the most ethical thing to do.

Indeed. I personally thank you for those times you've pulled me back from the brink of making a fallacious argument. One should not always fight fire with fire after all.

It's both very admirable and very relatable at the same time.

I quoted your whole post if course, but this bit in particular is FFT.

Bouquet Building Action!

Oh, I'm picturing this as a puzzle game. Or better yet, make it Surgeon Simulator with flowers.

I'm down for this.

This is why we're friends.
 
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nepheneethedestroyer

Lv. 25 Adventurer
I uhh ... really didn't like Rinoa way back when I first played ff8 she even made my "the worst" characters list, it was a very short list but yeah xD My favourite was Selphie, I even named Aerith Selphie.

I did think Rinoa was beautiful and Angelo was her saving grace as she grew on me over the years, OP in battle too.

I used to be a Seiftis shipper :huh::D Rinoa was never my favorite of the FF8 gang, though I agree I think she grows on you.

I mean by that logic how could you be wrong. But do we call the ship Rio or Dude?

Both of these are incredible ship names...I'm partial to Dude :D
 

Ryushikaze

Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
AKA
Tim, Ryu
d th
Ryu doesn't forget, though he may allow you to think he has until it's too late. It is known.
Inexorable Inevitability is the name of the game.

My main reason for not speculating is that my own reading of available evidence is all over the place. Once they show me where North is l might go sailing that sea, till then imma sit on the rocks and watch people try not to run aground.
Fair. Pay no attention to how I'm sailing uphill across dry land somehow.

Unlike Another World Serge :awesome:
Ba-dum-tish

Now we're getting into CDC level precautions. Well people did always look at this thread as a disease.
I mean, we were very much infested for a time.

Exactly the kind of ugly I was picturing. Fucking about with fan suggestions in a copyrighted IP is like juggling lit dynamite. Might be a damn good show, but you know the ending is gonna be messy.
A card game I love has said "We cannot for legal reasons ever admit to looking at fan created content and we HATE THAT FACT."

The wacky little sister they didn't know they needed. Especially Cloud, gimme more Cloud interacting with kids SE. Having a special on Toad King jobs today slayed me.
We need more of Cloud having to deal with Yuffie and Kyrie at the same time.

That exactly. No attention called to it, just one day you look at a chapter title, a character name, an item description, the reference clicks, laughter is had. Or more rarely other feels, but usually laughter.
Like the homage put into the test enemies they put into rebirth. Perfectly reasonable statement about "escaped due to developer oversight" in their bio, but for those in the know...

Lolth you crazy bitch, you actually did it. You made it lawful to act chaotically. Chef's kiss from a long time chaotic neutral tiefling Gish for that. Still staying in my homebrew 2e setting where drow gave their odd edges filed down rather than off.
Ahh, homebrew settings. The one I made where the entire planet was covered by a fog that allowed sea creatures to swim through sky as easily as water was a fun one.

There always must be that one person who gets the reference. Said person shall feel smug about it. And may be Clicky.
Most likely. In a previous job I had the unofficial duty of "getting the manager's reference" because no one else did.

Even though I despise a lot of the whole world, I'm willing to allow them a win on behalf of everyone else. I trust you all to keep that benevolence to yourselves.
I'll make sure the credit goes elsewhere.

So a typical day for Marvel editorial then? At least till they kicked Quesada upstairs where he could do no less harm.
Pretty much.

Is Laura still using Wolverine as her own name? I've lost track of late.
Yep. So's Logan. I'd be fine with him giving up the name and taking a new one, but editorial seems to want them sharing it.

Though I admit I actually find Pete and Miles both using Spider-Man endearing. Peter feeling secure enough to share the name is sweet, and I love when they just casually call each other Spider-Man while bantering.
It is odd he's the only member of the NY Spider-crew without a unique monicker.

Agreed concerning Ben Riley and his whole deal. I can't believe it actually got worse when he came back. Jackal Riley really bugs me.
I really wish they'd gone with the Ben was really a time-displaced Pete idea and had the Clone saga end with the Cosmic entity resposible (Might have been mephisto) picking Pete up, throwing him back in time, and "Ben" suddenly remembering everything.

I'm a little ashamed for not thinking of Kurt sooner. I mean, it's Kurt! The Amazing Nightcrawler himself! Blue dye is a go.

I'm still racking my brain for Vincent. Any thoughts there? I'm afraid Deadpool keeps interfering on my "red and black and shoots people" thoughts and... obviously no. Just no.
Cable, perhaps? Color scheme's different but themes are fairly on point.

I want no part of a Sinister/Hodge fusion or team up. Cease. I'll take God Carnage over that.
Not even a Sinister/Hodge fusion wants a Sinister/Hodge fusion to exist.

You win, I got nowhere to go from here :awesome:
You could always go to the ruins of Old New York, or the lost city of Atlanta.

S'what I wanted. Every Star Wars OC I've ever played ended up a more emotional than average Jedi or a more self-controlled than average Sith. Extremes are bad, mmkay?
Indeed. You'd think with the idea of Balance that eventually they'd realizing it was okay to be a little less of a pure goody two shoes.

Infinite is good unless you're playing Sonic Forces. Then Infinite sucks ass.
I'll believe it. Never played forces.

There was nowhere to go but up, so that's damning with faint praise if ever I've heard it.

Speaking of shoehorning, one of the things that interested me about Fallout London was the complete absence of the usual Fallout critters. Hell even Ghouls seemed to have a different spin on them. I still want a peak at Fallout Australia, but I have to assume there are basically no humans left there.
I always pretend the opposite. Area we have no information on are actually totally fine and dandy. Thriving, even. Because it's silly.
Or make absurd lore, like the singular Florida Man who is actually a beacon of wisdom, mercy, and compassion.

Indeed. I personally thank you for those times you've pulled me back from the brink of making a fallacious argument. One should not always fight fire with fire after all.
You are most welcome.

I quoted your whole post if course, but this bit in particular is FFT.
And thank you for the kind words.

Oh, I'm picturing this as a puzzle game. Or better yet, make it Surgeon Simulator with flowers.
I was thinking Trauma center, but Surgeon Sim works just as well. Maybe get both in there somehow.

This is why we're friends.
Now do you want to be on tripping duty or sharpie duty?
 

Gym Leader Devil

True Master of the Dark-type (suck it Piers)
AKA
So many names
Inexorable Inevitability is the name of the game.

Another excellent band name. I'm thinking something experimental, like industrial metal with a theremin added in and a really weird counterpoint baseline that's oddly low in the mix. Signature song: Pink Hell is on Fire (Who Brought the Marshmallows?)

Fair. Pay no attention to how I'm sailing uphill across dry land somehow.

We're this literal rather than metaphorical, I'd guess you put wheels under the ship :monster:

Ba-dum-tish

I took will be here all week and longer ladies, gents, and those of nonstandard gender identity. Try the squid guy pasta, and we'll be back for our next set in five.

I mean, we were very much infested for a time.

I'm picturing TLS as a tented apartment structure, with you in an exterminator's jumpsuit.

A card game I love has said "We cannot for legal reasons ever admit to looking at fan created content and we HATE THAT FACT."

That sounds lovable.

We need more of Cloud having to deal with Yuffie and Kyrie at the same time.

On the surface he looks cold and annoyed, inside he's melting and grinding ear to ear.

Like the homage put into the test enemies they put into rebirth. Perfectly reasonable statement about "escaped due to developer oversight" in their bio, but for those in the know...

Wonderful example. It's that kind of thing that makes folk what get it feel special, but does no real harm if it slips past you.

Ahh, homebrew settings. The one I made where the entire planet was covered by a fog that allowed sea creatures to swim through sky as easily as water was a fun one.

Oh that's good. Nothing like the thought of a Kraken attack 200 miles inland to keep people from sleeping soundly. Though I must ask, could gill breathing creatures survive in the sky as well? And how does this interact with player races with a swim speed?

Most likely. In a previous job I had the unofficial duty of "getting the manager's reference" because no one else did.

I'm jealous, I got the unofficial duty of "reminding the managers that making extremely sexual jokes at work is inviting an eventual sexual harassment suit" every friggin' day. They weren't even fun or witty.

I'll make sure the credit goes elsewhere.

See that you do, I like my kindness to surprise people and possibly make them suspicious.

Yep. So's Logan. I'd be fine with him giving up the name and taking a new one, but editorial seems to want them sharing it.

Weird. And yeah, Logan's been around so long he's had who knows how many names. You'd think he'd be chill to try out a new one.

It is odd he's the only member of the NY Spider-crew without a unique monicker.

True. At least he's not famous out of universe under a name he'd never use in universe. Poor "Spider-Gwen," she still using Ghost-Spider?

I really wish they'd gone with the Ben was really a time-displaced Pete idea and had the Clone saga end with the Cosmic entity resposible (Might have been mephisto) picking Pete up, throwing him back in time, and "Ben" suddenly remembering everything.

That does in fact sound loads better than the Clone Saga. I wonder if Peter and MJ got to keep the baby in that draft.

Cable, perhaps? Color scheme's different but themes are fairly on point.

Cable's not half bad. Even the techno-organic virus sorta fits as the dangerous monster that has to be kept under control ala Chaos.

You notice we're heavily drawing from X-books? Outside of Spidey and Shellhead, it's all X-characters up in here.

Not even a Sinister/Hodge fusion wants a Sinister/Hodge fusion to exist.

That would be a smoking pile of self-hatred.

You could always go to the ruins of Old New York, or the lost city of Atlanta.

Ooo rent free mobile apartments. Now we're back on track.

Indeed. You'd think with the idea of Balance that eventually they'd realizing it was okay to be a little less of a pure goody two shoes.

It always bothered me, you'd have books and comments mics clearly show that even legendary Jedi weren't as saintly and perfect as they wanted the Galaxy to see, but they'd never let them explore it.

The Sith creed is still superior though. Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to power, power leads to victory.

I'll believe it. Never played forces.

It's a rarity for me, a game that lets me create an in universe OC that has little to no interest from me. Infinite was the new super-powered Eggman minion that Sonic jobs to at the beginning of the game only to in turn do nothing but be cartoonishly evil and job to everyone for the rest of the game.

I always pretend the opposite. Area we have no information on are actually totally fine and dandy. Thriving, even. Because it's silly.

Unless it's not, as if national stereotypes are to be believed Australians would be just too damn tough and jolly to go extinct. Fallout deals heavily in deconstructing or lamp shading national stereotypes. Ergo it follows that Australians ended up being what The Master wanted Super Mutants to be just by being. Boom, thriving.

Or make absurd lore, like the singular Florida Man who is actually a beacon of wisdom, mercy, and compassion.

Good old Florida Man. I'm so glad I have a family agreement to never approach Florida.

I was thinking Trauma center, but Surgeon Sim works just as well. Maybe get both in there somehow.

I think that's a gap that could be bridged. Man I was bad at Trauma Center though.

Now do you want to be on tripping duty or sharpie duty?

I'll do the tripping, I have an excellent plan. I just need to shout "Hi Aerith" and wave at someone behind him and take the shot when he spins in that direction. Besides I trust your attention to detail to get us candy skull markings that really appear to be laden with symbolism. We're gonna need pink sharpies.
 

Maidenofwar

They/Them

Maybe some wanted to see Cloud crying with tears streaming down his face and some wanted the speech ... so they just kind of decided to try ... both?

Anyway I do still find things emotional personally, and even some streamers cry.
 

nepheneethedestroyer

Lv. 25 Adventurer
I think one of the things I'm most interested to see how they play out is the fact that compared while Cloud's primary issue in the OG heading into where we are now was one of self-identity and doubting if he was real vs. a created Sephiroth clone, now we have, seemingly, two separate issues to deal with. One being the self-identity/fractured sense of self issue, and the other being the Aerith is alive "delusion" (I honestly have some doubts as to whether it is Cloud's mind creating the delusion, or if it's Aerith "shielding" him somehow). I do think it would be weird to solve both issues in the Lifestream sequence, but having two fixing Cloud's head sequences also seems kind of excessive...I don't know.
 

GamerSkull

Pro Adventurer
I think one of the things I'm most interested to see how they play out is the fact that compared while Cloud's primary issue in the OG heading into where we are now was one of self-identity and doubting if he was real vs. a created Sephiroth clone, now we have, seemingly, two separate issues to deal with. One being the self-identity/fractured sense of self issue, and the other being the Aerith is alive "delusion" (I honestly have some doubts as to whether it is Cloud's mind creating the delusion, or if it's Aerith "shielding" him somehow). I do think it would be weird to solve both issues in the Lifestream sequence, but having two fixing Cloud's head sequences also seems kind of excessive...I don't know.
I think the Aerith “delusion” will be solved at the Northern Cave when Cloud has his breakdown. We’ll still get the same scene but this business with Aerith will also be dealt with there. At that point, Cloud will be at his lowest point.

Once that is taken care of, we’ll be dealing with his self-identity as normal in the Lifestream sequence.
 

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
I pretty much called what Cloud was mouthing at the end. It does mean that it on some level he is aware Aerith died.
For sure. My interpretation is he knows deep down she's dead, but his been gaslit so much by Sephiroth that he's unintentionally blocked it out
 

nars305

🎵 I am so, so bored 🎶
or if it's Aerith "shielding" him somehow).
I feel like if I had to pick a theory I want to pick this one. If Sephiroth can manipulate the lifestream and appear to Cloud, I like the idea of Aerith being able to do the same, as she seems to be able to do anyway.

The “lifestream magic” stuff floats around her when she tells Clouds it’s okay and makes him stop crying. I like to think that’s not Cloud’s delusion but Aerith TRYING to reach Cloud again and have him not blame himself.

As opposed to delusion, like I said, the lifestream wispies float around her, so I feel like some power was at play instead.
 

Sacky

Pro Adventurer
AKA
SackyBoy
I think the Aerith “delusion” will be solved at the Northern Cave when Cloud has his breakdown. We’ll still get the same scene but this business with Aerith will also be dealt with there. At that point, Cloud will be at his lowest point.

Once that is taken care of, we’ll be dealing with his self-identity as normal in the Lifestream sequence.
I think Sephiroth will use Aeriths death aswell as Nibelhiem obviously but also show the party and Cloud Gongaga with him attacking Tifa and all this will break him. The rest of the team don't know what happened at Gongaga fully
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
I feel like if I had to pick a theory I want to pick this one. If Sephiroth can manipulate the lifestream and appear to Cloud, I like the idea of Aerith being able to do the same, as she seems to be able to do anyway.

I don't know... Cloud see Sephiroth because he literally has his cells in him. It's not really a LS shenanigan. That's why Cloud is so important to Sephiroth. Bro is a Horcrux.
 

nars305

🎵 I am so, so bored 🎶
I don't know... Cloud see Sephiroth because he literally has his cells in him. It's not really a LS shenanigan. That's why Cloud is so important to Sephiroth. Bro is a Horcrux.
Even when Sephiroth seems to be able to go to the other worlds on his own? I can’t remember if they all were in connection to Cloud.

I was also thinking more along the lines of Advent Children, where Cloud could be around Aerith, unless that’s more of just a creation of his inner thoughts.
 

Stiggie

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Stiggie
I think the Aerith “delusion” will be solved at the Northern Cave when Cloud has his breakdown. We’ll still get the same scene but this business with Aerith will also be dealt with there. At that point, Cloud will be at his lowest point.

Once that is taken care of, we’ll be dealing with his self-identity as normal in the Lifestream sequence.
My take on this is as follows.
We have certain storybeats in the OG, and thematic concepts that apply to them.

There is the concrete plotpoint of Clouds psyche breaking
There is the concrete plotpoint of Clouds psyche being restored
We have inner story of Cloud no longer knowing who he is
We have the inner story of Cloud losing Tifas faith in him.

And if we simplify this we have a time of Clouds situation worsening, the moment of climax where things are at their worst and he breaks, a timespan where Cloud is broken, then a moment of healing and revelation that gives Cloud the power to deal with reality.

In general we should expect moments to fall into the area where they fit. For instance, post lifestream, when Cloud has the strength to deal with reality, he should no longer have to come to grips with Aeriths death. If a scene happens post lifestream where Cloud confronts Aerith it will be with him already in a state of acceptance of that fact.

That means that the realization of Aeriths death can essentially take 2 forms.
1: it is a moment of breaking where the realization of Aeriths death is the catalyst for Cloud breaking. In this version he sees what really happened prior to breaking, and post lifestream we'd see him accept Aeriths death.

2: It is a moment of accepting, where the mystery of what's going on with Aerith as well as Clouds identity issues cause Cloud to break, and it is through accepting the past and what really happened with Tifa in Nibelheim that he is able to honestly face what happened with Aerith. Which would probably place the scene where we see Aeriths death being a part of the lifestream sequence itself, with Tifa guiding him or something.

My gut feeling is that the first is more likely.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
I know it sounds sus' from a Cloti POV, but I really hope they don't use the LS sequence to give a bone to every sides of the fandom. If Aerith is really dead, I hope they don't push her to much into the OG story. That's what scares me the most about Part 3. That they don't really dare to go all the way and to keep everyone happy, keep bringing her in again and again.

That doesn't mean I hate Aerith and want to get rid of her. But if she's really gone, she needs to do things on her own and really start to help Zack.
 

GamerSkull

Pro Adventurer
My take on this is as follows.
We have certain storybeats in the OG, and thematic concepts that apply to them.

There is the concrete plotpoint of Clouds psyche breaking
There is the concrete plotpoint of Clouds psyche being restored
We have inner story of Cloud no longer knowing who he is
We have the inner story of Cloud losing Tifas faith in him.

And if we simplify this we have a time of Clouds situation worsening, the moment of climax where things are at their worst and he breaks, a timespan where Cloud is broken, then a moment of healing and revelation that gives Cloud the power to deal with reality.

In general we should expect moments to fall into the area where they fit. For instance, post lifestream, when Cloud has the strength to deal with reality, he should no longer have to come to grips with Aeriths death. If a scene happens post lifestream where Cloud confronts Aerith it will be with him already in a state of acceptance of that fact.

That means that the realization of Aeriths death can essentially take 2 forms.
1: it is a moment of breaking where the realization of Aeriths death is the catalyst for Cloud breaking. In this version he sees what really happened prior to breaking, and post lifestream we'd see him accept Aeriths death.

2: It is a moment of accepting, where the mystery of what's going on with Aerith as well as Clouds identity issues cause Cloud to break, and it is through accepting the past and what really happened with Tifa in Nibelheim that he is able to honestly face what happened with Aerith. Which would probably place the scene where we see Aeriths death being a part of the lifestream sequence itself, with Tifa guiding him or something.

My gut feeling is that the first is more likely.
Yeah, I think it will likely be the first of those too.

But it will be in addition to Tifa basically losing faith in him as well.

All the dominoes will begin to fall.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
That means that the realization of Aeriths death can essentially take 2 forms.
1: it is a moment of breaking where the realization of Aeriths death is the catalyst for Cloud breaking. In this version he sees what really happened prior to breaking, and post lifestream we'd see him accept Aeriths death.

2: It is a moment of accepting, where the mystery of what's going on with Aerith as well as Clouds identity issues cause Cloud to break, and it is through accepting the past and what really happened with Tifa in Nibelheim that he is able to honestly face what happened with Aerith. Which would probably place the scene where we see Aeriths death being a part of the lifestream sequence itself, with Tifa guiding him or something.

My gut feeling is that the first is more likely.
See, this is where my original worries came from, shoving Aerith into Cloud and Tifa moments will devalue said moments from an LTD perspective.

Therefore it adds ambiguity and only makes more fuel for Cleriths to use.

Fuck sake.
 

GamerSkull

Pro Adventurer
See, this is where my original worries came from, shoving Aerith into Cloud and Tifa moments will devalue said moments from an LTD perspective.

Therefore it adds ambiguity and only makes more fuel for Cleriths to use.

Fuck sake.
To be fair, Aerith showing up as a flashback in the LS sequence could still happen while still making it a Cloti moment. It’s not impossible. She’s not actually gonna show up to help.

However, I don’t think it should… nor do I think it will.

That’s why I expect the Aerith stuff to come to a head when Cloud loses it at the Northern Cave. And then Tifa can help him piece himself together later like normal.
 

abzy1200

Pro Adventurer
To be fair, Aerith showing up as a flashback in the LS sequence could still happen while still making it a Cloti moment. It’s not impossible. She’s not actually gonna show up to help.

However, I don’t think it should… nor do I think it will.

That’s why I expect the Aerith stuff to come to a head when Cloud loses it at the Northern Cave. And then Tifa can help him piece himself together later like normal.
But then it makes a Clerith argument of "Look! Cloud didn't want to accept her death and lost his mind when he realised she was gone, he didn't do that for Tifa in Gongaga"

So fucking annoying. I can practically smell the twitter posts about it already.
 

Yoru

Pro Adventurer
To be fair, Aerith showing up as a flashback in the LS sequence could still happen while still making it a Cloti moment. It’s not impossible. She’s not actually gonna show up to help.

However, I don’t think it should… nor do I think it will.

That’s why I expect the Aerith stuff to come to a head when Cloud loses it at the Northern Cave. And then Tifa can help him piece himself together later like normal.

Thing is... even a flashback has nothing to do here I think. Cloud knows about loss. He experienced it again and again. His mom is dead. Avalanche is dead. Sure he loved Aerith but I don't see it as a break point. I don't know. Maybe they'll make it look good and I'll experienced it in full and will agree to their vision, but for now... meh. Aerith death has never been the FF7 main plot. I just want to let it go now and see something else.

I just don't like it when you overdo it.
 
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