SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[nars305]

I think part of where the discourse comes from is people who played the Aerith route for the game. I've seen many interpretations that the NPTK performance with Aerith looking at Cloud and him holding the flower petal was a confirmation of their romantic love for each other. As well as the GS date (with cloud holding her hand in "lovers" way.

So during the dream date, when Aerith and Cloud reach the church and Cloud either says "next time" or "why not," these groups of people claim that this is further evidence that Cloud romantically likes Aerith and wants to be with her.

Which on one hand is fine to let people have a play through where they do have an Aerith romance. However it does make all the Tifa parts strange. Like her seeming jealous in the bomb shelter in Kala, nearly kissing Cloud, saying she needs him in the LS, is odd if you are doing an “Aerith Playthrough”.

I’m glad that Nojima acknowledged that disjointedness in the story telling. I think it was him, can’t remember entirely.

 

[Hellenic]

I think part of where the discourse comes from is people who played the Aerith route for the game. I've seen many interpretations that the NPTK performance with Aerith looking at Cloud and him holding the flower petal was a confirmation of their romantic love for each other. As well as the GS date (with cloud holding her hand in "lovers" way.

So during the dream date, when Aerith and Cloud reach the church and Cloud either says "next time" or "why not," these groups of people claim that this is further evidence that Cloud romantically likes Aerith and wants to be with her.

Yeah, people basically tunnel themselves into their chosen routes and they can't see anything past it really. Everything then comes across very differently to them. You can't really change peoples mindset, especially not if they are deeply invested in it already.

 

[imach0c0]

Which on one hand is fine to let people have a play through where they do have an Aerith romance. However it does make all the Tifa parts strange. Like her seeming jealous in the bomb shelter in Kala, nearly kissing Cloud, saying she needs him in the LS, is odd if you are doing an “Aerith Playthrough”.

I’m glad that Nojima acknowledged that disjointedness in the story telling. I think it was him, can’t remember entirely.

Which makes the whole LTD confusing.

In the main story, I did not detect any romantic tension between Cloud and Aerith. Aerith seems to be aware of Cloud and Tifa's relationship and seems to support it (teasing Cloud about looking at her at the water tower or encouraging Cloud to make up with her in the Calm clocktower, for example). The main story seems to push Tifa and Cloud romantically however (gongaga almost kiss, their conversation in Junon)

And if you exclude the Aerith and Tifa GS date, the dream date kinda feels out of nowhere. One could argue there is romantic feelings, however, it felt one-sided (from Aerith). I get multiple people can have feelings for the same person but something felt off. It kinda makes Aerith look out of character or selfish in a way because throughout the story she was close to Tifa and supporting her relationship with Cloud.

 

[Hellenic]

Predictions on what the new thing could be?

They iirc implied it was something they think people would really like to see. So maybe it could just be some kinda proper final talk scene for Cloud to have with Aerith and Zack perhaps?

Or just be some big reunion for Zack and Aerith as technically that would count as something that they didn't depict in OG.

Or just bring the chocobo stable implied scene back for Cloud and Tifa .

 

[Purple]

I reckon it’ll be a playable AC set piece

A Zerith reunion would be amazing but I really feel like they fumbled the set-up here. There needed to be more. Curious to see how they’d pull it off in a satisfying way. I had high expectations going in and I was just like “that’s it for Zerith the whole game?” We can chalk it up to it being part of a trilogy but waiting 3-4 years for a pay off just isn’t at all palatable.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

This.

That's the main reason why this scene bothers me. It goes against her character in my opinion. Basing everything on Cloud at that moment annoys me. Even more so if it's a bridge to Zack in the last game. As long as it wasn't something romantic but just a goodbye, turning everything into a date was a bad idea.

So you understand. Because I'm again an Aerith fan, first shipper second. I don't like seeing a female character doing everything and thinking so much about a man to the point before she DIES she is still thinking about just saving him but in the end he won't give her the same thoughts. He will also love someone else. While antis that don't like her pretend she is the biggest burden on him and use this scene to rejoice at how he rejects her.

What kind of memorial is this.

Also just her character is so independent and here is an entire segment about her love life and how conflicted she is over two men as if that's all she thinks about. As if that's all she is about.

As a shipper I should be happy with the fanservice I guess. But as her fan? I still need some explanation here I'm trying to give them benefit of the doubt. But yeah.

You tell me, you're the CA fan. I wanted a farewell with the whole team, especially since we didn't see her spend that much time with them, honestly. It nearly all happens offscreen, it's really one of my "please don't do that" comment to the devs.

I have no clue. I am a purist in that sense. I would have been so happy with OG in HD and then we all go home. I don't know what they think I and other Aerith fans wanted or if it's fanservice or just meta commentary. I'm unimpressed however.

Also with all the Zack stuff is this even there for Clerith fanservice? I'm not sure. Maybe on the surface. But yeah I am a Clerith and an Aerith fan but apparently not the intended audience for whatever they are doing with this section.

I too would have liked to see her interact with the party more. In her farewell or anywhere really.

Also I think when LunarTarotGirl says "disrespectful" it's more in the service of Aerith and the character overall as opposed to the specific niceties and manners of that moment and hurting Aerith's feelings in that moment.

Exactly this. Not Cloud really. But if the intention of that scene is for Cloud to turn down romance. Then I'd say yes it's (hypothetically speaking) disrespectful of the devs for potentially thinking
"hey you know what would be good to include in a scene before this character dies after we baited fans into thinking she wouldn't? The guy she has feelings for and is going all out to protect looking disgusted at the flower she gave him. And turning down her feelings as she desperately tries to get him to accept. Yes this is the perfect moment for that."

Because he shouldn't be giving a pin to Aerith that represents reunions when he knows she's not going to get one with Zack. He's trying not to give false hope or dig the knife in deeper. He doesn't know it's not Beagle Aerith.

Plus, he had gotten chewed out for re-gifting the flower earlier. He might not want that brought up again.

Hm. It could be because of Zack not getting a reunion.

Also I don't know about anyone else but to me that flower looked like an omen of death. Because you wouldn't need reunion if you aren't getting seperated. I saw it as commentary of the player not wanting to accept Aerith's death? I don't know. It was my first thought.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

@Stiggie: Don't let the stupid kill FF7 for you. The games aren't the source of the stupid, they're the victim of it.

I don't think she'll sit still long enough for me to write in there, so I'll scratch the ear and call it a day.

Serendipity is a typo that sets up a joke

Johnny's response. "I'm aware! Awesome!"

Say what you will, at least Johnny has a positive outlook.

Oh, most likely. And I do recommend watching the Johnny sidequests. Johnny takes care of Johnny, you know. You just have to help the Johnnys.

I do need to look into tidbits like this that I've missed thus far.

Definitely no pressure, man.

Of course You're chill man.

Mine was while watching Poultrygeist: Night of the Chicken Dead

One of mine was during a rousing game of Monster Prom.

Agreed

We didn't always agree this much did we? Well whatevs, we have an accord.

And you know as a rule, I don't use the emojis.

I would (jokingly) say this is insufficient reason to absolve your shame but...

Besides, we all know Death wouldn't understand emoji for the longest time, then somehow at the end of the book he'd speak the picture of the emoji... somehow.

That logic absolves all Especially since I was Death in one of our old forum wide name themes, and I essentially did speak the emoji in my playful accusation. It all works out.

I mean, trolley problem is asking if consequences of actions verse consequences of inaction are worse, so...

Exactly.

You should. Mike Nelson and another writer from Rifftrax (Not Bill or Kevin) reading books they don't expect to like, starting with Ready Player 1.

Mike is my favorite host on the ol' Satellite of Love. I love the concept. Sounds worthy of attention.

I remember a lot of jokes about suddenly shouting every time someone said SOLDIER. Now I'm wondering if making a backronym for it might be funnier.

Backronyms are always worth consideration.

Hope springs eternal.

Don't it just.

I mean, the internet universe is overall the more peaceful one, even if it literally built the internet atop another dimension.

Man, Mega Man lore gets dark and screwy.

Sometimes the lies people tell convince only themselves.

It's better this way. Though embracing the truth would of course be superior still, it's a big ask for some of the sunk cost fallacy riddled fools out there right now.

I've been told I have a way with words.

You and me both. That line in particular reminded me of a time I threatened some drunk on the job fucknut with being divided into equal parts for the grill, fryer, and oven. Wish I could remember the exact humorous phrasing that made it less psychotic.

Climbing Mt. Kilimanjaro. Amazing setup and punchline.

Such a full meal of comedy, you should turn down the water thin mint

It was fascinating to compare it to my own childhood because I devoured tons of media from before my birth as well, so I have references nobody else in my generation gets.

I get that. I still recall my teachers surprise upon learning I'd already read Moby Dick way back.

Fluffy/ Maru is a good cat. I hope they wind up adopting some of her kittens for the new 7th heaven.

That cat is a survivor. And adorable. Yes please.

We need to hear the most emotion from Cloud in the trilogy so far at that point.

Luckily it's a quieter kind of grief/apology, I think the VAs might Sabat their vocal cords up trying to top the Gongaga reactor yell.

Culuffies, obviously. Complete the trifecta.

Culuffies are obviously upper tear demons, like a step behind Mariliths, right?

A Chocobo gives a knowing "kweh."

I'll also accept a traumatized "wark!" If only because I miss Chocobos saying wark.

I guess it must operate on the rule of "Aerith touched the tower last therefore it's HER ICON NOW"

It's got pink germs on it so it's mine her's now! --some CAltist probably.

Nevermind it's a recreation of the actual watertower the promise was made on and not the original article.

Damn you and your logic!

Nevermind that getting the most affection up there requires admitting Cloud longed for Tifa and that Aerith is jealous of Cloud up there getting to grow up with a childhood friend, not Tifa having cloud look in on her.

See what we mean about how embracing truth makes things simpler and happier people? Of course you do, you're good folks.

They're just trying to claim everything for C/A because it can't be allowed to stay on the C/T side.

Exact percentages vary, but above 50% CAltist arguments seem motivated more by taking from Cloti than by giving to Clerith. It's sad.

 

[imach0c0]

QUESTION for everyone. Interested to see where this discussion goes due to the discourse surrounding this topic.

Throughout Remake, Rebirth or even the FF7 compilation:
1. Has Cloud ever shown romantic feelings to Aerith? If so, how?
2. If Cloud had romantic feelings for Aerith, did he ever act on them? If so, how?

The scenes below are where I've seen discourse regarding the interpretation of Cloud's feelings towards Aerith:

A. Remake - Chapter 14 Resolution
When Aerith tells Cloud to not fall in love with her and places her hand on Cloud's cheek, Cloud reaches for her hand but it disappears. Cloud says that's "one sided and he is coming for her," (paraphrasing)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud is coming for Aerith because he loves her romantically OR he is just trying to save her? How do you interpret Cloud trying to grab Aerith's hand and saying its one sided?

B. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
During the "Aerith Version" of NPTK, Aerith looks at cloud and smiles before singing. A reunion flower petals falls in his hand and Cloud holds onto it and smiles.
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction?

C. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
In the HA GS "Aerith" date, when Aerith holds onto Cloud's arm, he interlocks his hand with hers and the camera pans on his face. (hard to tell what Cloud's expression indicates)
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction OR is it him just being a friend to Aerith and giving her support?

D. Rebirth - Chapter 14 - Dream Date
When Aerith grabs Cloud's hand as they stroll Sector 6, Cloud does not let go and seems to go along with it. Cloud smiles and points when he spots the photographer stall. At the church, (JP version) when Aerith says next time regarding making more memories, Cloud either says: "yes of course" (LA) or "yes, because we are comrades" (HA)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud wants to be with Aerith romantically? Or is he ok with making memories as just friends?

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Honestly thank you for showing folk what a sane Clerith looks like, you and Maiden are lovely to have in this tired old thread.

Thank you so much! I hope I'm not coming across as a Rebirth hating purist with my criticisms however. I'm kind of in a way a purist on like lore stuff (Hated Remake ending with Sepiroth fight lol) but overall very open to changes and I don't hate this game at all. I hope I didn't sound like I was bashing it. Usually when I like something I get extra critical of it. And while there are things I don't like I think overall the final product is great. No matter how I feel or fandom annoys me I'm still so lucky to live in this timeline where we get HD FF7.

I am a very opinionated person by nature though lol. Hopefully not too opinionated.

I don't like how any shippers bash characters that go against what they want to see. Especially female characters so I hate seeing people dunk on Tifa or Aerith myself. And I see a lot of bad faith on social media so I try never to argue in bad faith myself and to check my biases as much as I can. As a result I mostly stick to my corner in fandoms though I have mutuals on opposing sides. I try not to get into discourse anymore. I was deep in for like a few months in the past but didn't like how toxic it made me (the back and forth and negativity all the time can really drag one in). Now I just retweet fanart and talk about lore. I don't blame anyone who avoids LTD like the plague honestly. And I'm sad it's come to this point..

It's lovely here in this thread though. I'm active on Twitter (but mostly for other fandoms) and I see the infighting because I do follow the ff7 fandom through my mutuals. So this is my refuge.

 

[billy22]

QUESTION for everyone. Interested to see where this discussion goes due to the discourse surrounding this topic.

Throughout Remake, Rebirth or even the FF7 compilation:
1. Has Cloud ever shown romantic feelings to Aerith? If so, how?
2. If Cloud had romantic feelings for Aerith, did he ever act on them? If so, how?

These are basically the same question.

The closest thing to him showing romantic interest in Aerith is after she dies. First there was her touching his cheek, while he holds her corpse and cries. Then the hand holding, after they fought Sephiroth, which I thought was sweet.

Neither is really a confirmation of love, but it does show how important she was to him.

Ultimately if he did love her, he never acts on it. He doesn't kiss her, want to kiss her, confess to her, nor want to confess to her. Despite having ample opportunity to do so throughout the game. Maybe that'll change in part 3, but I'm not optimisitic about that. Rebirth was the perfect opportunity for it, if it was ever going to happen.

From everything I've seen, nobody wants it to be a choice. Cloti fans want theirs to be the only choice, and Clerith fans want theirs to be the only the choice. It still feels like bullshit. CA fans only want it to be a "choice" because they can see the writing on the wall even subconsciously. Regardless of whether or not they think hand-holding is more romantic than a kiss (which is ridiculous by the way and they know it), the fact that one girl got a kiss and the other didn't is worthy of notice. They want it to be "optional", but they don't actually want that. They want it because deep down they feel they might lose. If it were truly up to them, they'd have Clerith 100% be canon. But if it's at least optional, they can "half-win".

Well I'm not really a shipper but I'll respond to this anyway. I like games with romance "options," because it gives me agency to shape an aspect of the narrative, and I think it's cute to see how the player-character's love life influences his narrative and the life of others in a romantic sense. So I have no issue with it being a choice.

The problem is the developers have yet to give me the choice to romance Aerith. Which I have already highlighted.

Of course, I also like games that have canonical romances. As long as it is written well. And for what it's worth, while choice-based romances offer the player agency, canonical ones tend to be better written. So they both have something to offer me. Here's hoping part 3 sticks the landing.

 

[GamerSkull]

These are basically the same question.

The closest thing to him showing romantic interest in Aerith is after she dies. First there was her touching his cheek, while he holds her corpse and cries. Then the hand holding, after they fought Sephiroth, which I thought was sweet.

Neither is really a confirmation of love, but it does show how important she was to him.

Ultimately if he did love her, he never acts on it. He doesn't kiss her, want to kiss her, confess to her, nor want to confess to her. Despite having ample opportunity to do so throughout the game. Maybe that'll change in part 3, but I'm not optimisitic about that. Rebirth was the perfect opportunity for it, if it was ever going to happen.


Well I'm not really a shipper but I'll respond to this anyway. I like games with romance "options," because it gives me agency to shape an aspect of the narrative, and I think it's cute to see how the player-character's love life influences his narrative and the life of others in a romantic sense. So I have no issue with it being a choice.

The problem is the developers have yet to give me the choice to romance Aerith. Which I have already highlighted.

Of course, I also like games that have canonical romances. As long as it is written well. And for what it's worth, while choice-based romances offer the player agency, canonical ones tend to be better written. So they both have something to offer me. Here's hoping part 3 sticks the landing.

I understand where you're coming from. I enjoy having options as well but it largely depends. When it's a self-insert character (like Persona), I think it can be pretty cool or when it is a player-created character (like Mass Effect or Dragon Age) I find it cool. In both of those cases, you are either projecting yourself into the character OR you are headcanoning the type of personality the character has. In that sense, having options kinda adds to that overall experience.

When you have a set character (like Geralt for instance), it becomes a little bit harder for me to take the character seriously when everything I know about him screams for him to make a certain choice. Options in the Witcher series are cool, but they do cheapen some of Geralt's predetermined character traits. You might make the case that it's fine, in this circumstance, to make Geralt your version of him... but again, why not just allow us to create a brand new character if you're gonna go that route?

I don't find Cloud to be a self-insert character. He is very much a set character.

 

[nars305]

QUESTION for everyone. Interested to see where this discussion goes due to the discourse surrounding this topic.

Throughout Remake, Rebirth or even the FF7 compilation:
1. Has Cloud ever shown romantic feelings to Aerith? If so, how?
2. If Cloud had romantic feelings for Aerith, did he ever act on them? If so, how?

The scenes below are where I've seen discourse regarding the interpretation of Cloud's feelings towards Aerith:

A. Remake - Chapter 14 Resolution
When Aerith tells Cloud to not fall in love with her and places her hand on Cloud's cheek, Cloud reaches for her hand but it disappears. Cloud says that's "one sided and he is coming for her," (paraphrasing)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud is coming for Aerith because he loves her romantically OR he is just trying to save her? How do you interpret Cloud trying to grab Aerith's hand and saying its one sided?

B. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
During the "Aerith Version" of NPTK, Aerith looks at cloud and smiles before singing. A reunion flower petals falls in his hand and Cloud holds onto it and smiles.
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction?

C. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
In the HA GS "Aerith" date, when Aerith holds onto Cloud's arm, he interlocks his hand with hers and the camera pans on his face. (hard to tell what Cloud's expression indicates)
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction OR is it him just being a friend to Aerith and giving her support?

D. Rebirth - Chapter 14 - Dream Date
When Aerith grabs Cloud's hand as they stroll Sector 6, Cloud does not let go and seems to go along with it. Cloud smiles and points when he spots the photographer stall. At the church, (JP version) when Aerith says next time regarding making more memories, Cloud either says: "yes of course" (LA) or "yes, because we are comrades" (HA)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud wants to be with Aerith romantically? Or is he ok with making memories as just friends?

My opinion is nothing in the story leads me to believe Cloud would be swayed in his feelings for Tifa.

As far as the scenes, of course they have a romantic tone to them. It’s supposed to. That’s the players reward for favoring a character.

When it comes to the narrative though, no, Cloud does not make me feel like he is trying to become romantically involved with Aerith.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Exactly this. Not Cloud really. But if the intention of that scene is for Cloud to turn down romance. Then I'd say yes it's (hypothetically speaking) disrespectful of the devs for potentially thinking
"hey you know what would be good to include in a scene before this character dies after we baited fans into thinking she wouldn't? The guy she has feelings for and is going all out to protect looking disgusted at the flower she gave him. And turning down her feelings as she desperately tries to get him to accept. Yes this is the perfect moment for that."

I think the idea is more that CLoud is just entirely clueless. Not that he is rejecting her, he's just not even on the same page as her here. Like, she's talking theoretical physics in swahili to him.

Hm. It could be because of Zack not getting a reunion.

Keep in mind I mean from Cloud's perspective when I say "Won't be reunited with Zack" because he has very recently remembered Zack's death incorrectly and the fact that Zack was super into Aerith and it's weighing on him.

Also I don't know about anyone else but to me that flower looked like an omen of death. Because you wouldn't need reunion if you aren't getting seperated. I saw it as commentary of the player not wanting to accept Aerith's death? I don't know. It was my first thought.

On a meta level, I can see that. On a different meta level I could also see it being a promise that she will return, along with Zack, just not how folks might want. It's a representation of the flower, not the genuine article, and all that.

@Stiggie: Don't let the stupid kill FF7 for you. The games aren't the source of the stupid, they're the victim of it.

The best revenge is to live well. Same with enjoying a game in spite of shitheads.

Serendipity is a typo that sets up a joke

I couldn't leave that one blowing in the wind, unloved.

Say what you will, at least Johnny has a positive outlook.

It's what keeps him going.

I do need to look into tidbits like this that I've missed thus far.

All the Costa del Sol quests are great, and a lot of the greater corel ones too.

Of course You're chill man.

I always thought of myself more like Metal man or Shadow man, really.

One of mine was during a rousing game of Monster Prom.

I can see how the absurdities of that came could cause such violent laughter, yes.

We didn't always agree this much did we? Well whatevs, we have an accord.

We might have. I mean we could always start digging through 10+ years of forum records to find out.

I would (jokingly) say this is insufficient reason to absolve your shame but...



That logic absolves all Especially since I was Death in one of our old forum wide name themes, and I essentially did speak the emoji in my playful accusation. It all works out.

Did I ever link you to the short film where I played and voiced Death, come to think of it?

Mike is my favorite host on the ol' Satellite of Love. I love the concept. Sounds worthy of attention.

It's very funny. They are currently making their way through their fourth Ernest Cline book.

Backronyms are always worth consideration.

Scientific Operations and Logistics Directive Intervention and Executions Resource. SOLDIER.

Man, Mega Man lore gets dark and screwy.

That's the softer, gentler timeline, too.

It's better this way. Though embracing the truth would of course be superior still, it's a big ask for some of the sunk cost fallacy riddled fools out there right now.

Might still be too big an ask for some of them at any point. Those costs were sunk deeeeeeeep.

You and me both. That line in particular reminded me of a time I threatened some drunk on the job fucknut with being divided into equal parts for the grill, fryer, and oven. Wish I could remember the exact humorous phrasing that made it less psychotic.

It will come to you, I'm sure.

Such a full meal of comedy, you should turn down the water thin mint

If I'm going out like anyone in Meaning of Life it's the man being chased by all the naked ladies.

I get that. I still recall my teachers surprise upon learning I'd already read Moby Dick way back.

I once had to tell the teacher I wasn't sure where the class was in the book because I'd actually finished it the first night we were assigned it.
I was also once told by a teacher I didn't have to take a final exam for an elective because "I know you'd pass the exam and you're the only one in this class who isn't at risk of getting a failing grade for the semester"

That cat is a survivor. And adorable. Yes please.

Barcat escapades!

Luckily it's a quieter kind of grief/apology, I think the VAs might Sabat their vocal cords up trying to top the Gongaga reactor yell.

It happened to a few of them back in the day.

[/quote]Culuffies are obviously upper tear demons, like a step behind Mariliths, right?[/quote]
Sounds about right.

I'll also accept a traumatized "wark!" If only because I miss Chocobos saying wark.

I personally view it as the difference between a soft vocalization- kweh- and loud excited ones -wark.

It's got pink germs on it so it's mine her's now! --some CAltist probably.

That does

Damn you and your logic!

See what we mean about how embracing truth makes things simpler and happier people? Of course you do, you're good folks.

Aerith wanted to have had been a normal child with normal childhood friends. She always felt like an outsider. Ironically, a lot like Cloud did.
Maybe that's why they had Maaya voice Lady Cloud Lighting. She could relate.
Come to think of it she voiced Aya Brea in 3rd birthday too.
Rabbit holes...

Exact percentages vary, but above 50% CAltist arguments seem motivated more by taking from Cloti than by giving to Clerith. It's sad.

It does fit with the idea that Crisis Core takes away from Aerith because it makes a lot of her mannerisms and iconography be related to her first love instead of to Cloud alone.

QUESTION for everyone. Interested to see where this discussion goes due to the discourse surrounding this topic.

Throughout Remake, Rebirth or even the FF7 compilation:
1. Has Cloud ever shown romantic feelings to Aerith? If so, how?
2. If Cloud had romantic feelings for Aerith, did he ever act on them? If so, how?

The scenes below are where I've seen discourse regarding the interpretation of Cloud's feelings towards Aerith:

A. Remake - Chapter 14 Resolution
When Aerith tells Cloud to not fall in love with her and places her hand on Cloud's cheek, Cloud reaches for her hand but it disappears. Cloud says that's "one sided and he is coming for her," (paraphrasing)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud is coming for Aerith because he loves her romantically OR he is just trying to save her? How do you interpret Cloud trying to grab Aerith's hand and saying its one sided?

B. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
During the "Aerith Version" of NPTK, Aerith looks at cloud and smiles before singing. A reunion flower petals falls in his hand and Cloud holds onto it and smiles.
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction?

C. Rebirth - Chapter 12 Rosa Date Aerith Version
In the HA GS "Aerith" date, when Aerith holds onto Cloud's arm, he interlocks his hand with hers and the camera pans on his face. (hard to tell what Cloud's expression indicates)
Q: Does Cloud's actions indicate romantic attraction OR is it him just being a friend to Aerith and giving her support?

D. Rebirth - Chapter 14 - Dream Date
When Aerith grabs Cloud's hand as they stroll Sector 6, Cloud does not let go and seems to go along with it. Cloud smiles and points when he spots the photographer stall. At the church, (JP version) when Aerith says next time regarding making more memories, Cloud either says: "yes of course" (LA) or "yes, because we are comrades" (HA)
Q: Does this indicate that Cloud wants to be with Aerith romantically? Or is he ok with making memories as just friends?

I don't think any of these indicate romance. In the Remake resolution scene I think he's just protesting that she's having a one sided conversation and he's not comprehending her.
In the rebirth examples he's just remembered about Zack and he is almost certainly trying to comfort her in all of them, I think. He can't bring himself to say "Your boyfriend is dead" but he wants to be there for her because while he does not lover her romantically he does still care about her, same as he cares about Barret, Nanaki and Yuffie (Cait, Cid and Vincent less so)

Like not to be mean, but Cloud has had Tifa on the mind since before he went through puberty. Nojima has gone out of his way to reinforce this repeatedly, including in Rebirth and in the recent 2000 gil short story. Aerith just isn't on that radar.

Also by the way welcome to the forums. What brought you down around thisway?

 

[Stiggie]

Predictions on what the new thing could be?

I'm pretty convinced it's an Aerith Zack reunion, that is the most glaring omission in the compilation.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

The best revenge is to live well. Same with enjoying a game in spite of shitheads.

Yes indeed. When game related stupidity rears it's ugly head, don't turn from the game, turn away from the stupid. And maybe call over your shoulder "can't hear you, enjoying the actual plot!" if you feel saucy.

I couldn't leave that one blowing in the wind, unloved.

T'would have been tragic to leave it out in the cold.

It's what keeps him going.

Johnnies abide, it's what they do. Whether they're best friend is a literal plank of wood, or they're stuck with a toilet humor running gag, Johnny abides.

All the Costa del Sol quests are great, and a lot of the greater corel ones too.

Will remember some largely sleepless night.

I always thought of myself more like Metal man or Shadow man, really.

This reference is bringing me back to the Sonic/Mega Man crossover. Poor Quick Man.

I can see how the absurdities of that came could cause such violent laughter, yes.

Helped along by yours truly voice acting every line of dialogue. The sight/sound of a tall bearded man earnestly voicing Polly Geist tends to slay even when everyone is sober.

We might have. I mean we could always start digging through 10+ years of forum records to find out.

Nah I remember why I thought this. It was way back, with me mistakenly thinking you disliked my comments because you don't engage in smilies, or Thanks/Likes. We cleared it up with simple communication and that was that.

Did I ever link you to the short film where I played and voiced Death, come to think of it?

I wanna say yes. How long ago was that? I might be mixing memories of a different Discworld project but it's certainly familiar.

It's very funny. They are currently making their way through their fourth Ernest Cline book.

Funny thing, I was just on a Nelson era MST3K binge like two days ago. Nice to know he's still finding new ways to riff.

Scientific Operations and Logistics Directive Intervention and Executions Resource. SOLDIER.

That works.

That's the softer, gentler timeline, too.

Oh I know, I've seen what comes after X's time.

Might still be too big an ask for some of them at any point. Those costs were sunk deeeeeeeep.

As deep as Cloud under the Highwind, one might say.

It will come to you, I'm sure.

Probably not, honestly. Funny and witty as I know it was, it occurred during a bout of literal red-vision rage. Ergo, I didn't form a solid memory of it It'll have to remain a "you had to be there" moment.

If I'm going out like anyone in Meaning of Life it's the man being chased by all the naked ladies.

There are certainly worse ways to go.

I once had to tell the teacher I wasn't sure where the class was in the book because I'd actually finished it the first night we were assigned it.

I was regularly excused from classroom participation for similar reasons. Not just when reading fiction either. Especially in history I tended to be multiple chapters ahead of the class, on account of it being the same damn material as last year 95% of the time.

I was also once told by a teacher I didn't have to take a final exam for an elective because "I know you'd pass the exam and you're the only one in this class who isn't at risk of getting a failing grade for the semester"

Having permission to nap in class was nice, but they still made me take the tests.

Barcat escapades!

We need to add kittens twining around barstools, napping on the Shera's control console, batting at the handlebars of Fenrir, etc to the theoretical episode bumpers for that slice of life show.

It happened to a few of them back in the day.

No lie, but Sabat always comes to mind first for how much it affected his performance over the years. Vegeta now sounds like Piccolo then, for instance.

Ooo it happened again. Hi kitty!

Sounds about right.

Well if it's all the same to y'all, I vote we bypass this one and just fight the Balor demon.

I personally view it as the difference between a soft vocalization- kweh- and loud excited ones -wark.

Both work fine, I just miss hearing the wark itself. The REgames just use a louder kweh.

That does

Make the donuts?

Aerith wanted to have had been a normal child with normal childhood friends. She always felt like an outsider. Ironically, a lot like Cloud did.

It wouldn't surprise me to learn this is the main basis for their bond. Common ground goes a long way and all.

Maybe that's why they had Maaya voice Lady Cloud Lighting. She could relate.
Come to think of it she voiced Aya Brea in 3rd birthday too.
Rabbit holes...

Maaya be late for a very important date.

It does fit with the idea that Crisis Core takes away from Aerith because it makes a lot of her mannerisms and iconography be related to her first love instead of to Cloud alone.

It's almost like viewing the story as a whole gives a different picture than cherry picking tidbits to cling to, right? Ryu you know what it's like to be branded a heretic by CAltists, am I on the right track? It's been a minute since someone pointed at me and screamed "HERESY!". I kinda miss it.

He can't bring himself to say "Your boyfriend is dead" but he wants to be there for her because while he does not lover her romantically he does still care about her,

I'm isolating this bit here because to me, this is the whole if it.

 

[Eerie]

I'm pretty convinced it's an Aerith Zack reunion, that is the most glaring omission in the compilation.

I’m pretty sure it’s not that because the ZA reunion is already on the script! So maybe post DoC epilogue? Since he wants a happy ending.

 

[Pivi]

Heya! Just stumbled upon this on youtube. It's pure genius.

 

[Ryeleigh]

It was also a viking funeral both for the ship and omniAerith. What do we discover? Her mind is a literal Zack theme park, no other way to say it. Only thing missing was a statue of the dude in mid-squat. The fact she was still wearing the bow and the pink dress in her own dreamworld says it all.

So, you could say that Aerith's dream date is basically the equivalent of the Lifestream scene if someone other than Tifa did it?

 

[Sacky]

Honestly, just hoping for extended epilogues.

Same I really dislike ambiguous endings. For a movie that's 2 hours that fine but for a long ass game that you need to invest time into you better wrap up your story in a satisfying way and show me some happiness for these characters that suffer so much in the story. Especially when it's 3 games wait to see the conclusion

 

[Sacky]

I understand where you're coming from. I enjoy having options as well but it largely depends. When it's a self-insert character (like Persona), I think it can be pretty cool or when it is a player-created character (like Mass Effect or Dragon Age) I find it cool. In both of those cases, you are either projecting yourself into the character OR you are headcanoning the type of personality the character has. In that sense, having options kinda adds to that overall experience.

When you have a set character (like Geralt for instance), it becomes a little bit harder for me to take the character seriously when everything I know about him screams for him to make a certain choice. Options in the Witcher series are cool, but they do cheapen some of Geralt's predetermined character traits. You might make the case that it's fine, in this circumstance, to make Geralt your version of him... but again, why not just allow us to create a brand new character if you're gonna go that route?

I don't find Cloud to be a self-insert character. He is very much a set character.

This is my opinion aswell if it's a player created or avatar character I like having choice. If it's a story based character with motivation and history then I want no choice I want the story to build it up naturally and for the writing to support whichever person the character loves. Which is why when First playing remake with the promise scene and the way Jessie mentioned are Cloud and Tifa close at the beginning of the game, Cloud giving the flower. Then the subtle flirting and non subtle flirting in the bar and doing the odd jobs. The 2 bedroom talks in stargazer I couldn't see it any other way than Tifa honestly it was built up so well. Even the Cloud your scaring me scene talking about his eyes, hopefully something that comes back in the lifestream sequence maybe commenting on them not being scary anymore. Point is after all that set up I couldn't not see these two as being the slow burn romance. Which I guess is why when i met Aerith I just saw her as flirty and confident but not serious about it. This was further confirmed when Aerith mentioned Aerith asking if Tifa was Clouds girlfriend and he couldn't describe what she was to him, that's storytelling 101 for there is something between them that will have to be explained later. Then Aerith herself kept pushing Cloud and Tifa together mentioning the flower who he gave it too, saying save her from a life without this handsome guy. I didn't see wall market as a Clerith section because the task of saving Tifa was always on the back of my mind. Then the real thing that ended me seeing Cloud and Aerith, when the plate fall is happening and Aerith says go follow your heart and we get a slow motion hand grab cinematic scene of them. Then without the resolution scene which I obviously got Tifa there wasn't anymore Cloud and Aerith interactions really? There was still another scene though of Tifa saving Cloud with another hand grab scene after she stayed behind. Then the end of the game showed Zack and Aerith walking past eachother with Aerith having a sadness on her face but Zack smiling. At the time I didn't know who Zack was then remembered the playground conversation and was like Ohhhhhhh this is her first love. So from there on I went to play OG which does have a different feeling depending on the choices. Since you can just not have people in your party. Then crisis core and from there on I felt the pairings were obvious. Then watching AC I wondered how in the world we could get to this characterization it felt so different than remake. Though Turks side story showed me the happy post AC ,and on the way to a smile made that make the movie make sense.

 

[Yoru]

Predictions on what the new thing could be?

I really don't know.

But there is one thing I'm sure about. Nomura's quote "It will make everyone happy" won't age well. That's for sure.

 

[Maidenofwar]

@Gym Leader Devil Aaww, thank you, what a nice think to wake up to. There's now an important thing I must do for everyone-

Spoiler

 

[Sacky]

I really don't know.

But there is one thing I'm sure about. Nomura's quote "It will make everyone happy" won't age well. That's for sure.

whenever someone tries to please the entire fanbase it never ends well so i hope not

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Hmm. If it will "make everyone happy" then it's probably not LTD related?
That would make one of different sides happy.

It's probably not theory related either.

Maybe it's more lore related? Like an Advent Children epilogue or DOC epilogue or something from those stories included in the game?

 

[Yoru]

Hmm. If it will "make everyone happy" then it's probably not LTD related?
That would make one of different sides happy.

It's probably not theory related either.

Maybe it's more lore related? Like an Advent Children epilogue or DOC epilogue or something from those stories included in the game?

Thing is... even an AC/DOC epilogue can piss a certain part of the fandom.

I really think it's impossible to please everyone.