Metal Gear Solid 5 (+ General Series Thread)

Cthulhu

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Yop
I liked 4 and the bit everyone kept going on about (NANOMACHINES!?) weren't actually as wtf as I thought they would be. It could've done with three times as much gameplay though, a speed run without can be done in under two hours.
 
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Jason Tandro, Doc Brown, Santa Christ, FearAddict, Thibault Stormrunner, RN: Micah Rodney
I liked 4 and the bit everyone kept going on about (NANOMACHINES!?) weren't actually as wtf as I thought they would be. It could've done with three times as much gameplay though, a speed run without can be done in under two hours.

I recently did a no alert, almost no-kill run (accidentally killed 2 people early on in Act I and I wasn't going to start over since what killed them was a tank exploding, not really me). My time was just over 7 hours. 7 hours. For a challenge run. That would be inexcusable for a regular game time let alone a challenge run.

 

Hisako

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Satsu, BRIAN BLESSED, MIGHTY AND WISE Junpei Iori: Ace Detective, Maccaffrickstonson von Lichtenstafford Frabenschnaben, Polite Krogan, Robert Baratheon
Konami's sales of Metal Gear Solid V indeed prove that vidya games ain't profitable enough for them by making a $100 million overhead on the opening day. Oh, wait.

Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain made $179 million globally on its opening day, according to Adobe Digital Index’s new report on gaming trends. Compare that to the blockbuster Avengers: Age of Ultron, which made $84 million globally on its opening day. Yes, The Phantom Pain made almost twice as much. So, the next time someone tells you that triple-A gaming is dying, you’re allowed to laugh in their face.

Are any video games necessary?

I know he thinks 4 was unnecessary because 2 was supposed to end the story (and I agree, insofar as 4's story became extremely convoluted as a result), but did he actually say that about Peace Walker, Ground Zeroes or 5?
Rhetorical questions aside (:monster:), it was his general stance on Peace Walker (iirc in his "anti-war games" video), mostly about how MGS3's ending perfectly summed up Big Boss' disillusion and downfall (which isn't entirely wrong)

There's an argument to be made for it, but I feel it's colored the majority of his perceptions on post-MGS3 games and issues which are mostly minor for some people could be more problematic for him because of it
 

Roger

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Minato
4 was convoluted as fuck but it was tying up 5 games worth of storyline. We all know that the games are very poorly written but that's part of the charm and for what we got (a 9 hour long movie with gameplay segments) I'm satisfied with the resolution we got in 4.
Well yeah, if you feel that it actually needed to be in equal parts a sequel to 1 and 3, as well as simply a direct sequel to 2 then 4 is for the most part perfectly understandable. But I don't think it did. Hell, I think V already spent too much time doing call forwards to 1 and 4.

Even with Zero being the primary antagonist, near the end he saw the error of his ways. Big Boss didn't figure this out until the end of MGS4.
Zero was remorseful about what happened between him and Big Boss, but still intent on placing mankind in the hands of the AIs. If not he could've still picked up a phone, called Sigint and tell him to pull the plug. Skullface didn't take over that part of Cipher.
 
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Jason Tandro, Doc Brown, Santa Christ, FearAddict, Thibault Stormrunner, RN: Micah Rodney
^
I don't know that I entirely agree because there was heavy implication that Zero was actually losing control of Cipher. I think even then he was beginning to see that shit was about to hit the fan. But again, just my interpretation.
 

Cthulhu

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Yop
My time was just over 7 hours. 7 hours. For a challenge run. That would be inexcusable for a regular game time let alone a challenge run.
Oh but it would, most FPS' singleplayer wossnames have that, and they often have little to no replay value. Of course, CoD should probably be seen more as a multiplayer game. Battlefield has had a singleplayer campaign, but I haven't bothered to finish those in the last few instances because whatever dude.

(also Ground Zeroes could be done in like half an hour or thereabouts. That's a pricey demo, oolo)
 
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Jason Tandro, Doc Brown, Santa Christ, FearAddict, Thibault Stormrunner, RN: Micah Rodney
My time was just over 7 hours. 7 hours. For a challenge run. That would be inexcusable for a regular game time let alone a challenge run.
Oh but it would, most FPS' singleplayer wossnames have that, and they often have little to no replay value. Of course, CoD should probably be seen more as a multiplayer game. Battlefield has had a singleplayer campaign, but I haven't bothered to finish those in the last few instances because whatever dude.

(also Ground Zeroes could be done in like half an hour or thereabouts. That's a pricey demo, oolo)
FPS games have to feed an attention span of about half an episode of Friends though. When I play Halo I want to go in, kill shit, and get out. With a game like Metal Gear Solid I like taking my time, strategizing, planning out stuff, seeing everything there is to see. And while I can breeze through Metal Gear Solid 3 (theoretically the longest game not counting 5) in about 8 hours or probably less, that's not the point of the game to me.

Back on topic, that's what I like about 5. It's not over quickly. It gives you plenty of time to chill and enjoy each mission. And most importantly it gives your right from the start all the tools you need to do the job well. Sure you unlock cool new weapons and abilities as you build the base up, but for straight OSP Stealth action, you have a plethora of options. While some see this as taking the challenge out of it (and I can certainly see that aspect) I also like to view it as a simple "no excuses" card. If you got caught, it's your own damn fault. You can't blame it on the limited view, the wonky radar, the sluggish controls. If you were seen by the enemy, you didn't plan carefully enough.

Or you didn't call in an airstrike, either way. :monster:

Edit: Oh and we're not counting Ground Zeroes. That was a technically proficient playable teaser.
 

Flintlock

Pro Adventurer
Except it wasn't - it was an integral part of the MGSV story (except for the parts that got retconned, obviously). I paid less than 10€ for it recently but it should never have retailed for three or four times that amount.

I saw a "Total Stealth" demo of Rise of the Tomb Raider and it made me realise something: one of the reasons I preferred the stealth in previous MGS games is because sneaking past guards was often the best strategy, whereas in V, with almost every mission being "extract the X", it made much more sense to neutralize them on the way in to make sure they weren't a threat on the way out, when you'd often be carrying a prisoner and be unable to do such basic things as crawling and climbing over knee-high ledges. It killed a lot of variety in the gameplay for me.
 

Flintlock

Pro Adventurer
The helicopter explosion. Specifically, Paz surviving. You might call it a twist instead of a retcon, but I would have to disagree - regardless of the writers' intentions, we were shown something that turned out not to have happened.
 

Roger

Triple Slash Enthusiast
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Minato
^
I don't know that I entirely agree because there was heavy implication that Zero was actually losing control of Cipher. I think even then he was beginning to see that shit was about to hit the fan. But again, just my interpretation.
He did, by the time Phantom Pain started. The truth tapes with Ocelot and Big Boss took place after the nine years, they tell of how the world has gotten all effed up by the AIs. The tapes with Ocelot and Zero were 9 years before that an told of Zero just recently delegating work to Donald Anderson. Two years after that was the tape with Zero and Skullface, in which he gave his sinister vision of the future that made into the trailer. The visit to Snake was very shortly after that according to the final ending's timeline. In which he didn't express any misgivings about his plans, outside of Skullface. That's the last we ever hear from Zero.
 
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Jason Tandro, Doc Brown, Santa Christ, FearAddict, Thibault Stormrunner, RN: Micah Rodney
Flint: An integral part of the story with all the value on the plot as the Tanker episode in MGS2- neat to know before hand but arguably the story could have been told better without it.

i.e. We know Solid Snake didn't blow up the tanker because we just played that part of the game. Therefore the big reveal that he DIDN'T isn't a reveal but is like "oh, no shit". Now loathe though I am to imagine an MGS2 with less Solid Snake, if it had begun at the Plant mission and we were given a bit of backstory about the Tanker incident (perhaps playing the Tanker incident as part of the big reveal of what happened) it would have been a much better build up and payoff.

We need to fan edit games. (And yes I know A LOT more goes on in the Tanker than just that, but these are also details that could have been revealed later in other ways. I can think of no better example than the way MGS and MGS3 dared to give players story content. En Medias Res, baby. )

But in all seriousness what is so essential about GZ that we can't get from a 5 minute cutscene or briefing tape?
Guess what Paz is alive and this guy name skullface is an asshole. We tried to save them and boom explosion.
. MGS4 had entire plot essential battles taking place in cutscene.

Not that I'm hating on GZ mind you. I actually really really liked it and I thought it got a little more hate than it deserved because people just brush off the other missions as side content. However if you play them all, you will have effectively completed the "VR Missions" for every major game mode you face in TPP with the exception of mechanics stuff such as riding horses, using buddies, and using the fulton.

It was fun, and the story was "essential" but it didn't need a separate game to tell that story.
 

Cthulhu

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Yop
The helicopter explosion. Specifically, Paz surviving. You might call it a twist instead of a retcon, but I would have to disagree - regardless of the writers' intentions, we were shown something that turned out not to have happened.
Yeah that was a pretty weird retcon imo, and (at least from what I know), they had to basically invent the Paz character after that. (unless she was in the previous game, idk). I've yet to find out what her role is in TPP tbf, besides short distractions (two so far). Also SOMEONE GIVE THAT WOMAN SOME CLOTHES FFS. Ahem.

Another retcon would be the fact that Snake gets a PRETTY FUCKING BIG PIECE OF SHRAPNEL IN THE FEISU. Blame shit graphics maybe, but all I saw was a bit of flame hitting him, not something worth nine years of coma. Unless I missed something.
 
The helicopter explosion. Specifically, Paz surviving. You might call it a twist instead of a retcon, but I would have to disagree - regardless of the writers' intentions, we were shown something that turned out not to have happened.
Finish out her side quest. I wont say more than that.
 

Flintlock

Pro Adventurer
I've been visiting her after every couple of missions, including no. 48, but she's always reading the same book. What more do I have to do to finish it?
 

Tetsujin

Ready for the mosh pit, shaka brah
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Tets
I've been visiting her after every couple of missions, including no. 48, but she's always reading the same book. What more do I have to do to finish it?
You get photos from the side ops with the Wandering Mother Base Soldiers that you need to give her. There are ten missions, after that the last photo will appear outside her room on the wall.
 

Hisako

消えないひさ&#
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Satsu, BRIAN BLESSED, MIGHTY AND WISE Junpei Iori: Ace Detective, Maccaffrickstonson von Lichtenstafford Frabenschnaben, Polite Krogan, Robert Baratheon
I see a lot of people missing out on plot elements in this discussion :monster:
 

Flintlock

Pro Adventurer
Well, maybe they shouldn't have buried them so much. :P I would have understood it if the main story was already heavy on, uh, story, but it makes no sense to me to leave it so bare and then hide lots of important stuff.

I think I've done half a dozen of the wandering mother base soldier retrievals but I've only found three photos. I don't think I would ever have made the connection myself without Tets' help.
 

Hisako

消えないひさ&#
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Satsu, BRIAN BLESSED, MIGHTY AND WISE Junpei Iori: Ace Detective, Maccaffrickstonson von Lichtenstafford Frabenschnaben, Polite Krogan, Robert Baratheon
The first scene triggers after you return to Mother Base upon the first retrieval (on the Medical Platform), and it specifically mentions a photo that was recovered from the soldier :monster:
 

Roger

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Minato
Complete all the Wandering Soldiers missions, then just use the E-cig to go through Paz' scenes, way faster that way.
 
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