Sephiroth: What the fuck happened?

[Makoeyes987]

All the disease did was turn them into monsters and kill everyone. That doesn't change anything at all.

 

[Dashell]

Point taken but was there something about her appearing friendly at first?

 

[BWAngel]

Just to toss this little theory out there, but what if Jenova was more than a killing machine? If she just killed before moving on, doesn't that mean that the Planet could eventually start the circle of life all over again, or with all the sudden influx of souls wouldn't Omega and Chaos awaken to take the Lifestream away? If she planned on taking the planet as a new vessel to travel, wouldn't she have to gain control of its own lifestream or somehow take the lifestream into herself?

 

[Dark and Divine]

Point taken but was there something about her appearing friendly at first?

More or less!

She scanned the minds of the Cetra and morphed her/its appearence to resemble their dead relatives.

 

[Dashell]

.... that's not nice.

Okay so... I guess what I wanted to try to say before was, yes Jenova is a killer. That's obvious. Why she does this, I don't know. BUT, I think there's a little bit of intelligence to her as well. I think she was smart enough to make a plan and it's something she's been doing for a long time.

And I also think Sephiroth's plan in AC is basically what Jenova wanted to do when she came to the planet.

I'M NOT SAYING SHE WANTED TO ABSORB THE LIFESTREAM. i'M SAYING HIS WORDS MIRRORED WHAT SHE DID!

 

[ForceStealer]

Sephiroth wanted to be a god a rule over every soul. He would make the world as he felt like. Since that didn't work, by AC he decides to find another planet on which to do that. "...create a shining future" and all that.

And I have a question, this discussion seems to have danced around this but I'm not quite sure. Is the point being made here that Sephiroth is a poorly written villain because he doesn't have a legitimate reason for doing what he's doing? Why would a villain need a legitimate reason? Some do, of course, but why would not having one make you a poorly written villain?
I'm not proposing that Sephiroth is a masterfully written character, I'm just asking. Dracula never had much of a reason, did he?

 

[Makoeyes987]

Just to toss this little theory out there, but what if Jenova was more than a killing machine? If she just killed before moving on, doesn't that mean that the Planet could eventually start the circle of life all over again, or with all the sudden influx of souls wouldn't Omega and Chaos awaken to take the Lifestream away? If she planned on taking the planet as a new vessel to travel, wouldn't she have to gain control of its own lifestream or somehow take the lifestream into herself?

...No. I just explained like for two pages how Jenova was not doing that. She isn't working for any higher purpose at all. She's just killing for the sake of destruction. Jenova never intended or wanted to absorb lifestream. At all. Stop confusing her ambition with Sephiroth. She never had any. And it'd take a lot more death..like..death on the scale of the very planet being destroyed, to awaken Omega. That's more than just the extinction of one race.

Seriously I like answered that now for the fifth time.

And I also think Sephiroth's plan in AC is basically what Jenova wanted to do.

...How many times does it have to be repeated that Jenova HAD no plan for it to stick? She never intended to do ANYTHING. Sephiroth was merely making an allusion to how Jenova came down from space on a meteor. However, Jenova never absorbed Lifestream or wanted to do anything. Do I need to quote the same description of her again?

Jenova = cunning, descructive killer.

Sephiroth = cunning, destructive killer with a higher purpose in mind.

That's all it comes down to.

 

[Dashell]

...How many times does it have to be repeated that Jenova HAD no plan for it to stick? She never intended to do ANYTHING.

I guess I'm just choosing my words poorly, I'll try again.
What Sephiroth said in AC was basically what Jenova wanted to do with the planet. Crash into it and kill everything thus creating a sorta new world. I never said anything about absorbing the lifestream or even hinted that that's what she wanted to do.

In fact you said it perfectly here:

Sephiroth was merely making an allusion to how Jenova came down from space on a meteor.

Thanks

Do I need to quote the same description of her again?

No you need to stop thinking everyone is arguing with you. This is like the second or third time I've said something in this thread that you've said "No you're wrong" and then what I said (or meant to say) worded it in another manner.

 

[IndianaoftheJones]

...How many times does it have to be repeated that Jenova HAD no plan for it to stick? She never intended to do ANYTHING. Sephiroth was merely making an allusion to how Jenova came down from space on a meteor.

That's what Quexinos was saying. Sephiroth's plan in AC mirrored what Jenova did in the past.

EDIT:
whoops, beaten to it.

 

[Makoeyes987]

I guess I'm just choosing my words poorly, I'll try again.
What Sephiroth said in AC was basically what Jenova wanted to do with the planet. Crash into it and kill everything thus creating a sorta new world. I never said anything about absorbing the lifestream or even hinted that that's what she wanted to do.

Nix the whole "creating a new world" stuff, and yeah, it is. Because Jenova didn't care about creating a new world. She just wanted to hurt people. And kill them. And hurt and kill people as much as possible with no thought of anything else but killing. And oh yeah, killing people too. With lots of hurt. And killing. Yeah, lots of killing people.

Am I emphasing the killing enough? Because that's the bullet point I'm trying to convey here. Jenova likes killing. She kills. For that reason alone. Killing and hurting people. Nothing else. Just killing. And hurting people...kill....hurt....killing..hurting...

She really doesn't care about creating anything. If you asked her she'd probably just bite your head and eat you. And then kill anyone next to you. And then anyone next to them. And so on and so forth.

Spoiler

KILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILLKILL

 

[BWAngel]

...No. I just explained like for two pages how Jenova was not doing that. She isn't working for any higher purpose at all. She's just killing for the sake of destruction. Jenova never intended or wanted to absorb lifestream. At all. Stop confusing her ambition with Sephiroth. She never had any. And it'd take a lot more death..like..death on the scale of the very planet being destroyed, to awaken Omega. That's more than just the extinction of one race.

Seriously I like answered that now for the fifth time.

I'm not trying to confuse her ambition with Sephiroth. I'm not even trying to make it sound like she is controlling him.

Jenova is a cunning, instinctual killing machine. We got that. Sure people have used lesser reasons to kill people. But Jenova is an alien. Only thing I have heard about her is she crashed into the Planet better than 2000 years ago, her origins, purpose, and motivation is unknown, and started killing people. We don't have a lot of information on her besides the fact she is a manipulative bitch killing for absolutely no reason. Why would she just target the Cetra, why not everybody? What would be the point of creating WEAPONs to destroy her if she's only going to kill off one race before moving on? The spirit energy would return to the Planet, Jenova would move on, then they would be reborn again, cycle continues. Why would the Planet view her as such a threat if she was only there to pull a "Rosso the Crimson" on the Cetra. The Planet didn't consider humanity a threat until Sephiroth summoned Meteor which was a direct threat to it. What threat did Jenova present to the life of the Planet that the Planet had to start taking action before the Cetra got to her?

 

[Makoeyes987]

The Cetra were killed first because they arrived first to the crash site to heal the planet. There's nothing else to it, and she probably would've killed everything. They never said she just killed Cetra. Only that the Cetra were nearly made extinct because of her.

Her killing every thing alive isn't enough to spawn Omega. The actual physical planet itself has to be at risk. Jenova was a treat to all living things on the planet, hence WEAPONs were released to kill her.

 

[Max Payne]

Dracula never had much of a reason, did he?

Dracula was a damned creature who needed blood to sustain himself, and females for companionship.

Seems as good a reason as any.

 

[IndianaoftheJones]

Jenova was a treat to all living things on the planet,

Let's just hope this planet never has a treat like that

 

[BWAngel]

The Cetra were killed first because they arrived first to the crash site to heal the planet. There's nothing else to it, and she probably would've killed everything. They never said she just killed Cetra. Only that the Cetra were nearly made extinct because of her.

Her killing every thing alive isn't enough to spawn Omega. The actual physical planet itself has to be at risk. Jenova was a treat to all living things on the planet, hence WEAPONs were released to kill her.

...Thus preventing Omega's creation and the immanent death of the Planet. Okay, point taken.

But Weiss (Hojo) was able to bring Omega to fruitation with only the pure human souls, so it doesn't take a massive, physical attack on the Planet in order for Omega to awaken.

EDIT: Another thought. I know Geostigma isn't the disease that Jenova originally spread amongst the Cetra years ago, but going off of the same concept, wouldn't the souls of the creatures who died from the original disease be tainted or take Jenova cells with them or somehow make them seperate from the Lifestream. Thus beginning the creation of the Negative lifestream, one she could control and thus making it a true threat to the Planet, causing the WEAPONs to awaken in order to stop the process?

 

[Dashell]

Nix the whole "creating a new world" stuff, and yeah, it is. Because Jenova didn't care about creating a new world. She just wanted to hurt people. And kill them. And hurt and kill people as much as possible with no thought of anything else but killing. And oh yeah, killing people too. With lots of hurt. And killing. Yeah, lots of killing people.

No U!

I mean, whether she meant to or not, destroying all life on a planet does kinda create a new one... a crappier one sure, but a newish one.

Jenova's kinda like the aliens in Independence Day. They kill for no reason and... well that's it I guess. All though I would like to know if there's more Jenova's out there... or if like Jenova was kicked out of her planet for killing or something.

 

[BWAngel]

No U!

I mean, whether she meant to or not, destroying all life on a planet does kinda create a new one... a crappier one sure, but a newish one.

Jenova's kinda like the aliens in Independence Day. They kill for no reason and... well that's it I guess. All though I would like to know if there's more Jenova's out there... or if like Jenova was kicked out of her planet for killing or something.

I just had another thought (yes fear me and my thinking ) Going off of that idea. How do we not know the monsters she created by spreading the virus where actually her memory of her kind from her world? Her cells mimic other beings memories, why not hers? She tried to create a new life/world for herself but, human bodies were too weak and the Reunion instinct in the cells were too strong that they ended up dying in the end.

EDIT: I thought the aliens in Independance day went from planet to planet absorbing what resources they could use and killing those who lived on said planet?

 

[ForceStealer]

Dracula was a damned creature who needed blood to sustain himself, and females for companionship.

Seems as good a reason as any.

I was being facetious, but I was referring to the fact that he wasn't made fun of in grade school or anything.

Although in that 90s movie they stuck in that whole revenge on the church thing.

 

[Max Payne]

I was being facetious, but I was referring to the fact that he wasn't made fun of in grade school or anything.

Although in that 90s movie they stuck in that whole revenge on the church thing.

Dracula is a monster whose very existence depends on preying upon others.

It's what he is, Sephiroth however, is very different. Dracula's very nature is enough of a reason for the things he does.

I'm not even going into the ridiculously sordid history of the character, but I am pretty sure that stuff about dracula's antagonism against the church came before the 90s movie.

 

[Masamune]

@Mako -

Magneto was actually a stock villain until Chris Claremont picked up his backstory. As I said, one person was responsible for that. Now if such a character can be created through a comic book, why not in an RPG? They are both mediums of narrative craft.

Yes, it's a strawman, because you're taking base examples from early FFs to excuse Sephiroth's lack of character development. Since FFVII was a character-driven story, you would expect Sephiroth to be a compelling villain. I appreciate that Sephiroth was cold and disconnected from society, but that isn't enough to base a hate complex over mankind...heck, life itself. The reasons for Sephiroth wanting to annihilate everything and become a god are still tenuous and ill-defined.

V also made the point that Kefka was supposed to be blindly psychotic. He's that type of villain. Similar to Jagi from Hokuto no Ken, except for the eccentricity. While Sephiroth is not supposed to be a tragic villain either (and if he is, it's a poor one), he's left floating somewhere in the middle. His experience in Nibelheim took him to the dark side, but his character flip-flops. First of all he hates humanity for betraying the Cetra, and wants to find the Promised Land for his "mother". Then in the game, he kills the Cetra, wants to destroy the world, and doesn't defer to Jenova again.

 

[Makoeyes987]

@BWAngel

Why the hell do you keep bringing up Dirge of Cerberus? That has nothing to do with Jenova or Sephiroth.

And the reason DG were able to invoke Omega was because of how they concentrated and refined the mako in Mako Reactor 0, tricking the planet that an overabundance of life had been taken away and joined to the lifestream. You forget that what is required for Omega to even invoke itself is the Protomateria. Which the planet sealed away in Chaos. With that concentrated mako, they were going to toss in the Protomateria which would summon Omega and thus it'd all begin. It couldn't have even happened in FFVII because the Protomateria was in Chaos.

And we know that virus shit wasn't that, because the creators again said she wasn't creating anything. They were just Jenova monsters. You do realize that they could just be detachments of herself created by her cellular matter. Why do you insist on ignoring what they say about her?

@Masamune

It's not the fact one person was responsible, it's the fact Magneto has been around for much longer and has had more narrative crafting over the decades that has made him a much more significant and characterized villain. You can't equate the two, regardless. The entire mediums are different. A comic book series has a helluva lot more opportunities for fleshing out than just a single video game. Magneto and Sephiroth aren't even the same type of villain. Magneto's villainous cause has depth and relatability. He's meant to be morally ambiguous in the cause of his crusade. A black hearted Sephiroth who is doing things for his own selfish, hateful cause is not in the same park as Magneto who is fighting for Mutant rights and a world where they will be free and safe. Not the same thing at all.

And yeah, FFVII is character driven but so were the others. He's still a villain from that story and he should be compared to his own series and genre, not something totally on a different scale. And again, hate complexes can be based on everything. It's his own personal distaste for humanity and the planet. If he hates humanity because he has an ego trip, and feels himself superior, then that's the intent. Are Lex Luthor's hate complex for Superman and the world ill defined? He wants to take over the world because he can and is a genius. He feels entitled. The same is said for Sephiroth. He feels entitled to the world after learning the truth of his birth and how he stands above all common people.

You don't seem to want to accept that Sephiroth, in his hateful insanity, was still under the false impression of the Gast reports which said he was a Cetra. His hate was misguided. When he found out the truth in the lifestream, cradling Jenova's head, all that changed was his focus and theme. His villainy never changed.

 

[BWAngel]

@BWAngel

Why the hell do you keep bringing up Dirge of Cerberus? That has nothing to do with Jenova or Sephiroth.

And the reason DG were able to invoke Omega was because of how they concentrated and refined the mako in Mako Reactor 0, tricking the planet that an overabundance of life had been taken away and joined to the lifestream. You forget that what is required for Omega to even invoke itself is the Protomateria. Which the planet sealed away in Chaos. With that concentrated mako, they were going to toss in the Protomateria which would summon Omega and thus it'd all begin. It couldn't have even happened in FFVII because the Protomateria was in Chaos.

And we know that virus shit wasn't that, because the creators again said she wasn't creating anything. They were just Jenova monsters. You do realize that they could just be detachments of herself created by her cellular matter. Why do you insist on ignoring what they say about her?

Hey, except from what you have said, I haven't seen much information about Jenova was aside from being a monster that came to the Planet from unknown area of space and just started killing. How do we know there isn't something more to her? If you could direct me to some proper material stating her back story, then I would be grateful.

 

[Makoeyes987]

***Jenova*** (Pages 210-213) (005.1)
An intelligent lifeform from somewhere in space. Approximately 2000 years ago,
it crashlanded at the North Pole ["Knowlespole" in the English localization of
the game] (the vicinity of Icicle Lodge's ["Icicle Inn" in the English
localization] present location), negatively affecting the Planet; it came to
be feared as "the Calamity from the Skies" by the Ancients, who still existed
in great numbers at that time.

Vicious, extremely aggressive and cunning. Having no thoughts of creating
anything following bringing destruction, it only follows its instincts to
incite ruin, utilizing its mimic ability (-->P.211) to infect other living
organisms with its virus. In addition, due to its abnormal resilence, even if
dismembered, its cells will call out to one another, seeking to reunite into
their original form (-->Reunion/P.211).

Bear in mind I posted this in the thread like a page or two ago.

 

[BWAngel]

Bear in mind I posted this in the thread like a page or two ago.

Okay, now I'm satisfied.

 

[Max Payne]

@BWAngel

Why the hell do you keep bringing up Dirge of Cerberus? That has nothing to do with Jenova or Sephiroth.

And the reason DG were able to invoke Omega was because of how they concentrated and refined the mako in Mako Reactor 0, tricking the planet that an overabundance of life had been taken away and joined to the lifestream. You forget that what is required for Omega to even invoke itself is the Protomateria. Which the planet sealed away in Chaos. With that concentrated mako, they were going to toss in the Protomateria which would summon Omega and thus it'd all begin. It couldn't have even happened in FFVII because the Protomateria was in Chaos.

And we know that virus shit wasn't that, because the creators again said she wasn't creating anything. They were just Jenova monsters. You do realize that they could just be detachments of herself created by her cellular matter. Why do you insist on ignoring what they say about her?

@Masamune

It's not the fact one person was responsible, it's the fact Magneto has been around for much longer and has had more narrative crafting over the decades that has made him a much more significant and characterized villain. You can't equate the two, regardless. The entire mediums are different. A comic book series has a helluva lot more opportunities for fleshing out than just a single video game. Magneto and Sephiroth aren't even the same type of villain. Magneto's villainous cause has depth and relatability. He's meant to be morally ambiguous in the cause of his crusade. A black hearted Sephiroth who is doing things for his own selfish, hateful cause is not in the same park as Magneto who is fighting for Mutant rights and a world where they will be free and safe. Not the same thing at all.

And yeah, FFVII is character driven but so were the others. He's still a villain from that story and he should be compared to his own series and genre, not something totally on a different scale. And again, hate complexes can be based on everything. It's his own personal distaste for humanity and the planet. If he hates humanity because he has an ego trip, and feels himself superior, then that's the intent. Are Lex Luthor's hate complex for Superman and the world ill defined? He wants to take over the world because he can and is a genius. He feels entitled. The same is said for Sephiroth. He feels entitled to the world after learning the truth of his birth and how he stands above all common people.

You don't seem to want to accept that Sephiroth, in his hateful insanity, was still under the false impression of the Gast reports which said he was a Cetra. His hate was misguided. When he found out the truth in the lifestream, cradling Jenova's head, all that changed was his focus and theme. His villainy never changed.

Lawl yeah, Magneto's not even a real villain, he's even helped save the world a few times.

Lex Luthor belongs in arkham too, he's done a lot of good, but his hate for Superman holds back any oppurtunity for achieving greatness. There's been glimpses into futures where Superman has died and Lex has cured all illnesses, come up with renewable energy sources, and decimated the crime rate.

But he's so fucking stupidly hung up on hating superman, that he can achieve none of that. He ruined his chances at helping the world when he was president to fuck with Superman FFS.

But Luthor doesn't hate the world, just Superman and the capes that get between them. Pretty sure he definitely hates Batman after he jumped him in his bedroom at night and beat the shit out of him.