The Final Fantasy VII LTD Thread (Round 4)

[Dashell]

So now the discussion is about if Aerith fell in love with Cloud after she died and he was restored? I know for a fact we've wanked this at least twice already in past incarnations of the thread.

What's your point Drake?

 

[Madame Mayor]

If the line doesn't make sense, maybe you're not looking at the right information.

I believe what she meant is that the line needs to take everything into account to be understood properly. We can't just cherrypick the line and expect it to make sense in the compilation.

 

[null]

The lines you posted are exactly what I'm saying. She realized Cloud wasn't Cloud, and still has great affection for him.

Obviously Cloud wasn't entirely Zack, so some of his own personality did show through. That's not what I meant, so let me just fix that right there.

Aerith admits that she wants to get to know the real Cloud. That's sweet, and it sounds like she's interested in him and wants to love him for him and she did harbor some feelings for him. I have never denied that. But if she realizes Cloud isn't Cloud, how can she still love him? How do you still love a man when you don't know who he is.

So then she died. She never got to know the real Cloud. So when did she fall in love with the real Cloud? After the Lifestream sequence?

When did Tifa fall in love with the real Cloud? Why aren't we ruling out Tifa being able to love the real Cloud within the OG?

 

[DrakeClawfang]

What's your point Drake?

Since when is one required to have a point when posting in this thread?

 

[Dashell]

Since when is one required to have a point when posting in this thread?

ROFL fair enough XD

I believe what she meant is that the line needs to take everything into account to be understood properly. We can't just cherrypick the line and expect it to make sense in the compilation.

But it makes sense to me

and I'm not cherry picking

 

[Madame Mayor]

When did Tifa fall in love with the real Cloud?

They fell in love with each other as children. She knew enough about him to know that something was wrong from when she found him at the train station(?). There was a base she had to go off of that Aerith didn't.

 

[Tifabelle]

Let me try this a different way. I'm not denying her love for him, or anything like that. I'm not using this as "Cloti proofz" or anything like that. When I look at it, it's not black and white. So my genuine question is when/how can she love the real Cloud? Do her Cetra abilities allow her to know who Cloud is? That's not what I'm reading. I'm reading that her abilities tell her that Cloud isn't acting like himself, and that she recognizes the problem. Do parts of Cloud's own personality show through? Yes. But this isn't clarifying for me how she can truly love the real Cloud. That's what I'm asking. Was it during the Lifestream sequence?

CoLW doesn't explain shit. It's just Aerith saying that he is her beloved and that she had feelings she couldn't express. Fine. I want to know how. And when I look at everything else, it leaves me with more questions.

 

[null]

What has two thumbs and doesn't give a crap

 

[Splintered]

Cloud was in denial of his own self. Tifa thought that everything would work out by itself when arguably she knew it wouldn't, as a result in her overcautious approach to Cloud she waited too long to tell him the truth.

But here's the thing, Cloud and Tifa managed to struggle past these, identified the problem, and dealt with it.

If we are to really believe Aerith only thought she loved Cloud, then we would have to assume she only thought she loved Cloud up until CoLW, and never struggled past it like the other characters. And she never mentioned it later, so while Tifa can go "Yes, I lied about the past" and Cloud goes, "Yes, I was not who I thought I was" Aerith is still in denial, over all these ultimania's and narratives?

I'm not saying that she's not capable of denial. She definitely was. But if it were, then story wise it would make sense if she were later to overcome it and mention it. Instead we have word of god and her own admissions after she dies that she does love Cloud and she loved him outside of Zack, even if she never did start a relationship with the real him while she was alive.

 

[null]

They fell in love with each other as children. She knew enough about him to know that something was wrong from when she found him at the train station(?). There was a base she had to go off of that Aerith didn't.

She also says she didn't know him that well in their childhood. If she can fall in love with him, why can't Aerith, who didn't really know him and also knew something was wrong with him?

 

[Tifabelle]

When did Tifa fall in love with the real Cloud? Why aren't we ruling out Tifa being able to love the real Cloud within the OG?

However little, Tifa knew Cloud prior to all his issues. She had feelings for him before finding him in the train station. Love? I'm not sure, but she was a bit upset when he said he was leaving, they made a promise, she read about him in the papers everyday, etc. Then later, they learn all about each other during the LS sequence, and how each other feels, and so on. There's a before and after.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Well, Tifa fell in love with the real Cloud before the game. Even though she didn't know him well. If Aerith had a similar situation, whup de smeg, oh well. But she doesn't. She has the conflation issue. That makes shit a bit more complicated. If not for the 'I saw him again in you' angle, this wouldn't even be worth talking about.

Also, Not 3 hours ago I said to cut down on the sarcasm and petty backbiting and focus on the discussion. And I do mean that.

Also, Tifabelle, your Sig, way too large. You need to chop the vertical height about in half.

 

[null]

However little, Tifa knew Cloud prior to all his issues. She had feelings for him before finding him in the train station. Love? I'm not sure, but she was a bit upset when he said he was leaving, they made a promise, she read about him in the papers everyday, etc. Then later, they learn all about each other during the LS sequence, and how each other feels, and so on. There's a before and after.

Right, so Tifa knew a little about Cloud, and has like a day to really fall in love with the real him before the end of the game. That's the same thing people keep saying Aerith can't do.

I'm not saying Cloud is mutually in love with Aerith, I'm saying it's really biased to excuse shitty video game writing for Tifa being able to truly fall in love but not Aerith.

 

[Dashell]

She also says she didn't know him that well in their childhood. If she can fall in love with him, why can't Aerith, who didn't really know him and also knew something was wrong with him?

YES! Exactly, Tifa didn't know him that well either but she still loved him. If she can love Cloud and not know a lot about him, so can Aerith

If Aerith had a similar situation, whup de smeg, oh well. But she doesn't. She has the conflation issue. That makes shit a bit more complicated. If not for the 'I saw him again in you' angle, this wouldn't even be worth talking about.

The point still stands, if Tifa can love Cloud and not know him that well so can Aerith, Zack or not Zack.

EDIT
and im talking about after she realized Cloud wasn't Cloud.

 

[null]

Well, Tifa fell in love with the real Cloud before the game. Even though she didn't know him well. If Aerith had a similar situation, whup de smeg, oh well. But she doesn't. She has the conflation issue. That makes shit a bit more complicated. If not for the 'I saw him again in you' angle, this wouldn't even be worth talking about.

Tifa fell in love with a Cloud she didn't really know. Aerith fell in love with a Cloud she didn't really know. It's a similar situation. Either admit neither Tifa nor Aerith had time to truly fall in love with the real Cloud before the end of the game, or they both did.

 

[null]

It just seems like people are going out of their way to say CxT, ZxA, the end. If Crisis Core was supposed to show us that Aerith was always truly in love with Zack, then there's no reason for them to reinforce her loving Cloud in the next entry.

If Aerith loved Cloud, what difference does it make? It's over! She's dead! Cloud's doing Tifa!

 

[Dashell]

Tifa fell in love with a Cloud she didn't really know. Aerith fell in love with a Cloud she didn't really know. It's a similar situation. Either admit neither Tifa nor Aerith had time to truly fall in love with the real Cloud before the end of the game, or they both did.

I'd say before the lifestream event anyway. I think Tifa got to know Cloud a bit under the highwind, and it's possible Aerith had him figured out then too.

If Crisis Core was supposed to show us that Aerith was always truly in love with Zack, then there's no reason for them to reinforce her loving Cloud in the next entry.

Word

and honestly, if NOT for COLW, I would have dropped this Aerith loved Cloud thing by now.

 

[Zee]

They fell in love with each other as children.

>14 year old kids
>fell in love


whatthefuckamireading.jpg

 

[Dashell]

Didn't they say that Aerith and Zack were too young to fall in love? If they were too young then Cloud and Tifa couldn't have even been close.

And imma go ahead and post this one more time just because I love it so much:

If Crisis Core was supposed to show us that Aerith was always truly in love with Zack, then there's no reason for them to reinforce her loving Cloud in the next entry.

 

[Zee]

Yeah, there was a quote that said that the love was "platonic" (probably a rough translation, but idc). I cba to dig it up this late though, but I know it was in the CC Ultimania.

 

[Madame Mayor]

Platonic as in they didn't have sex.

14 year old kids

How old I was when I met and fell in love with my current boyfriend. *shrugs*

 

[Dashell]

Platonic as in they didn't have sex.

They died virgins?

There was another one that said it was love "if you can call it love" or something like that too. I don't wanna dig it up either, but yeah it's there

 

[Tifabelle]

It just seems like people are going out of their way to say CxT, ZxA, the end.

I wasn't aware this conversation had anything to do with CxT or ZxA or CxA. I'm looking at the story, and I have questions. Of course it doesn't change the bottom line, but can't I still question something that happened in the middle?

 

[Raidou]

Didn't they say that Aerith and Zack were too young to fall in love? If they were too young then Cloud and Tifa couldn't have even been close.:

Nooo, Garnet and Zidane!!

 

[Madame Mayor]

There was another one that said it was love "if you can call it love" or something like that too. I don't wanna dig it up either, but yeah it's there

I know that quote. It's the one that talks about them falling for each other right away, into a sudden crush. It's about the beginning of their relationship.

They died virgins?

Maybe/probably? Who knows. Bottom line is Aerith and Zack never got to get physical, so their relationship was platonic.