The First Epic LTD of TLS forums

[Celes Chere]

"Aerith would be able to handle Cloud emotionally better than Tifa"

"I'm looking for you."... "So you won't have a breakdown."
^For some reason, this quote seems to have inspired the 'Aerith understands Cloud more than Tifa' idea. That combined with Cloud and Aerith developing their own world, and having a special bond.

At least, that's what I've seen in debates. ^^;

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

"So you won't have a breakdown".

How did this line show that Aerith has any special insight into Cloud? The party has just been to the Temple of the Ancients, and what did Cloud do there?

Spoiler

Sephiroth: Behold the mural. The Ultimate Destructive Magic... Meteor.

Cloud: That'll never happen!

???: Wake up!

While Cloud's group search for Sephiroth...

Aerith: Cloud!!

Cid: What the hell is going on!

Cloud: Ha ha ha... Black Materia. Ha ha ha... Call Meteor.

Aerith: Cloud!! Get a hold of yourself!

Cloud: Cloud... I'm... Cloud... How should I? ...I remember! I remember my way.

Aerith: ...Cloud.

Cloud: (back to his sense) Mm? What's wrong? Is something wrong?

Aerith: ...It's nothing so don't worry about it. Right, Cloud! It's nothing.
Sephiroth got away.

He laughed like a mental patient and mumbled weird things in the mural room.

Spoiler

Sephiroth: ...Ah, but I have. I'm far superior to the Ancients. I became a
traveler of the Lifestream and gained the knowledge and wisdom of the Ancients.
And soon, I will create the future.

Aerith: I won't let you do it! The future is not only yours!

Sephiroth: Ha, ha, ha... I wonder? Wake up!

Cloud: Shut up!

Cloud's controlled soul appeared.

Sephiroth: There, Cloud... good boy.

Cloud: The... Noise... Wa...... aaaa...... aa...

Cloud's controlled by Sephiroth and gave the Black Materia to him.

Sephiroth: ......Well done.

Sephiroth disappeared. Later....

Aerith: Cloud, are you all right?

Cloud: ...I gave the Black Materia to Sephiroth...? Wha... what did I do...
tell me, Aeris.

Aerith: Cloud... be strong, OK?

Cloud: Urrrrrrgh... What have I done!?

Aerith: Cloud... you haven't done anything. It's not your fault.

Cloud begins to attack Aerith.

Cloud: I...! I'm-----!

Cid: Hey, EY!!

Cait Sith: Oops! This looks like I came at a bad time! I'm Cait Sith No. 2
Right pleased to meet you all!

Cid: Cloud! What the hell are you doing!?

And this. Add two messed up things Cloud does in about two minutes.

Aerith has some major hints here that Cloud is truly messed up. So, her telling Cloud to let her handle things so that he'll stay away from Sephiroth and be safe from stuff like what happened above doesn't require any real understanding from her.

 

[Tennyo]

@ Rinali: You can have Tifa in your party as well there, can't you? But she doesn't have the ability to project herself into peoples' dreams like Aerith can. lol

Cloud: Ha ha ha... Black Materia. Ha ha ha... Call Meteor.

I remember being seriously creeped out by this when I first played the game. I was like, "WTF Cloud's gone mental!" D:

Is there anything that actually backs up the "Aerith would be able to handle Cloud emotionally better than Tifa" thing? Like examples from the games/books/film?

Oh you mean like the fact that Aerith seems to lack tact in the department of nurturing peoples' feelings? First trip to Gold Saucer comes to mind. Go Aerith, way to make Barret even more pissed off and way to be a real bitch about the entire situation.

OMG you have no idea how much this just made me laugh.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

Oh you mean like the fact that Aerith seems to lack tact in the department of nurturing peoples' feelings? First trip to Gold Saucer comes to mind. Go Aerith, way to make Barret even more pissed off and way to be a real bitch about the entire situation.

Yeah, I know. Aerith can be very empathetic, but I don't know if she really knows how to handle situations where people are having serious issues. I mean, I could see why. She didn't seem to be able to get a lot of friends as a kid since everyone was trying to test-tube her. And that didn't stop when she got older, so you could see why she has trouble trying to deal with other people's problems.

 

[Tennyo]

http://z8.invisionfree.com/Cloud_x_Aerith/index.php?showtopic=9475&view=getnewpost

Some of what she said is true, though, and partly why I don't post in this thread as often as I used to.

Yeah, I know. Aerith can be very empathetic, but I don't know if she really knows how to handle situations where people are having serious issues. I mean, I could see why. She didn't seem to be able to get a lot of friends as a kid since everyone was trying to test-tube her. And that didn't stop when she got older, so you could see why she has trouble trying to deal with other people's problems.

I never thought about it that way but it does make sense. And I mean really I think it all just adds depth to her character. Her lack of tact is probably what gives her the ability to be so brazen and spunky in the first place, which are both reasons as to why Aerith is one of my fave characters.

 

[Neutron Ronnie]

Yeah, I know. Aerith can be very empathetic, but I don't know if she really knows how to handle situations where people are having serious issues. I mean, I could see why. She didn't seem to be able to get a lot of friends as a kid since everyone was trying to test-tube her. And that didn't stop when she got older, so you could see why she has trouble trying to deal with other people's problems.

That may be true, but she seemed to know when to comfort Zack in Crisis Core... If anything, she should get more sensitive over the years, instead of less, right?

If I remember correctly, Barret had just finished telling them that he'd lost his family and friends... I always felt Aerith was being a bit out of character there...

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

That may be true, but she seemed to know when to comfort Zack in Crisis Core... If anything, she should get more sensitive over the years, instead of less, right?

Have not played CC, so IDK. Don't have a PSP.

If I remember correctly, Barret had just finished telling them that he'd lost his family and friends... I always felt Aerith was being a bit out of character there...

It was right after the whole Corel thing where everyone was like "IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT EVERYONE DIED".

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

Aerith's way of dealing with problems seems to be to ignore it and put a smile on your face(I haven't played Crisis Core yet, so I can't comment on it). Smile until you mean it, I guess...

When it's just yourself, it can be looked at as an admirable thing, but forcing it on other people like what she did with Barret can definitely be seen as insensitive.

 

[Makoeyes987]

I'm not sure what you mean, but Aerith has always been shown to be a good listener in terms of dealing with people with their own personal problems. I'm...not quite sure what the relevance is here in regards to the discussion.

And I'm not sure where the idea of Aerith not having any friends came from. In CC she was well known by the other people in the slums, and they were very protective of her. So she wasn't friendless or isolated at all.

 

[Celes Chere]

Spoiler

Aerith
"Wow! Let's have fun!"

(She turns to Barret, who is facing the wall.)

Aerith
"I know this isn't the right time to do this."

(She walks over to him)

Aerith
"Hey, Barret, cheer up!"

(He takes a step away from her.)

Barret
"I ain't in no cheery mood. So jes'
leave me alone."

(She goes over to him and looks at him.)

Aerith
"Really? That's too bad."

(She runs over to Cloud)

Aerith
"Let's go!"

(Tifa goes over to Aerith)

Tifa
"...whisper... whisper... (Wasn't that a little harsh, Aerith!?)"

Aerith
"...whisper... whisper... (Just act normal when this happens)"

Tifa
"...whisper... (You think so...?)"

Aerith
"Of course!"

(Aerith runs over to Barret again)

Aerith
"We're gonna go play..."

(Barret starts waving his arms)

Barret
"So PLAY! ...messin' round #@^%$!"
"Don't forget we're after Sephiroth!"

(He runs and jumps in the Wonder Square portal.)

Aerith
"...I think he's mad."

Tifa
"He'll be fine. He seems to be doing a little better now."

<- This is everything that happened between Aerith and Barret.

I believe that Aerith's intentions were good, but she came off as insensitive here. Especially to Barret, since he seemed to get pissed off. Tifa said she sounded a bit harsh, too.

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

We were just talking about the opinion that C/A shippers have that Aerith is better able to help Cloud than Tifa is on an emotional level.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

And I'm not sure where the idea of Aerith not having any friends came from. In CC she was well known by the other people in the slums, and they were very protective of her. So she wasn't friendless or isolated at all.

Again, haven't played CC. Don't have a PSP.

But people being protective of one of their own doesn't mean they actually talk to her on the level of being friends with her. Aerith seemed to have separated herself from other people in the fact that she was a Cetra, but no one else was, and she seemed to have thought herself alone in that way. (I could post the dialogue to this effect, but I'm feeling lazy. )

 

[Makoeyes987]

That's actually a very common Japanese sentiment and expression of comfort in regards to children who are sad or "pouting". By trying to make the person smile and act "happy", they believe that they'll feel better because they'll be acting happy and the action will change the thought. "If you want to be happy, smile." It's funny because Tifa's interprets it as somewhat incongruous and sees through how it won't work like...you all are, and its somewhat of a clashing of methods of cheering people up.

She's kinda treating Barret like a kid.

I think Aerith's expression "...I think he's mad" kind of shows that Barret's reaction wasn't quite what she was expecting.

And I don't think Aerith is "better" at comforting Cloud than Tifa, since Tifa knows Cloud more and longer. However, on the same token, I don't think Aerith would be bad at it either. If she needed to, I'm sure she'd be very effective.

And no...Aerith was on good terms with the people of the slums particularly one of the shopkeepers there. If she was comfortable to relate her dating woes in regards to searching for a boyfriend to him, I'm sure they were on a level of friendship of some kind. Then of course there were the younger kids of the slums who looked up to Aerith as a big sister who always protected them and helped them out when they needed her.

 

[Tennyo]

That may be true, but she seemed to know when to comfort Zack in Crisis Core... If anything, she should get more sensitive over the years, instead of less, right?

I know, it does seem a little bit on the odd side, right? But her relationship with Barret isn't quite like the relationship she had with Zack, so going and putting her arms around him might not have worked.

Of course maybe this is another retcon, or maybe Aerith was nicer in the pat than now. lol

Or maybe she just wanted an excuse to squeeze Zack?

 

[Neutron Ronnie]

If you really want to know what I meant about Aerith knowing when to comfort Zack, then here it is:

Spoiler

This video shows Zack and Aerith after Zack's mentor/friend has died (by his hand, no less). Though it is fan-subbed, it's roughly the same as the official English translation...

So maybe she'd know when to be like that with Cloud, too...? Though I thought that she was being pretty insensitive towards Barret.

My housemate has this to say: "If you feel inclined to stretch it a bit, you could convince yourself that Aerith knew what she was doing - Tifa says Barret is 'doing a bit better now'. She might've pissed him off on purpose to pull him out of his sulk."

Is what he had to say, just thought I'd add it.

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

And I don't think Aerith is "better" at comforting Cloud than Tifa, since Tifa knows Cloud more and longer. However, on the same token, I don't think Aerith would be bad at it either. If she needed to, I'm sure she'd be very effective.

I agree. I just wanted to point on something that could be taken as something other than Goddess!Aerith can solve any problem by just being in the same room with you.

Both Aerith and Tifa are very caring. Tifa is able to help Cloud because she knows him, and also because Cloud trusts her and seeks her help.

If Aerith and Cloud had been able to get to know each other, I have no doubt that Aerith would have done a good job with helping Cloud through difficulties. The ladies wouldn't do the same exact thing, but they'd most likely both be able to help.


EDIT: @Seta
So, it's a Japanese thing, the way Aerith dealt with Barret? Ok, I understand now. I always knew that Barret's reaction to her was supposed to be comedic, but I didn't know that Aerith was part of the joke.

 

[Neutron Ronnie]

I know, it does seem a little bit on the odd side, right? But her relationship with Barret isn't quite like the relationship she had with Zack, so going and putting her arms around him might not have worked.

Oh, yeah, sorry, I didn't mean she should go and hug Barret, exactly... That might've resulted in something like this: (except Barret wasn't smiling to start out with )

Anyway I meant she stopped talking about the flowers when she realized Zack was sad, and couldn't care less about them. I'd have thought she'd at least do the same for Barret...

Do you think we're thinking too much into this, and it might've just been a clumsy way the writers used to get Barret super-pissed off and leave the others?

Spoiler

(After all, they try to make you think he went berserk right after that and killed a bunch of people...)

 

[Makoeyes987]

The scene is only showcasing Aerith accidentally trying to cheer up Barret like he was a child, and failing miserably.

It's supposed to be sardonically funny. You know, her trying to cheer him up in the most inappropriate way possible even though it was meant with the best of intentions yet exploded back into her fast and made him mad?

It's nothing too deep.

 

[Tennyo]

Oh, yeah, sorry, I didn't mean she should go and hug Barret, exactly... That might've resulted in something like this: (except Barret wasn't smiling to start out with )

lol That put a funny image into my head.

Anyway I meant she stopped talking about the flowers when she realized Zack was sad, and couldn't care less about them. I'd have thought she'd at least do the same for Barret...

Different problems call for different solutions? Zack was crying, but not angry. Barret was angry, but not crying. If this even makes sense.

Do you think we're thinking too much into this, and it might've just been a clumsy way the writers used to get Barret super-pissed off and leave the others?

Spoiler

(After all, they try to make you think he went berserk right after that and killed a bunch of people...)

Most likely. The point of the whole thing was to get the party thrown into Corel Prison for the Dyne story arc, nothing more, really.

 

[Eerie]

I don't think Aerith would feel close enough to Cloud to hug him like she did with Zack - yes, she was close, but she also knew that it wasn't the real him, which made her cautious, in a way.

That and the compilation says that it's Tifa who supports the mentally weak side of Cloud I'm not sure that she would have the patience Tifa had during CoT - if anything, Aerith didn't strike me as a patient person during the game XD

But I think that in the end, it's all because of Cloud himself: during the game, he seeks Tifa's approval - even during Disc One, hence the 'only your actions mattered' to Tifa when he was about to become a veggie. I think, because it's Tifa that he loves, he's being cheered up best by her, simply because her words count more than any others'. In AC/C, it was important that he had a talk with Aerith and Zack, because they were the only ones able to free him of the guilt he felt. It's as simple as that - it's not about who can cheer him up the best, it's about whose words he needs.

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

Okay, then.

Now that I fully get it, that's adorable. I think I'm gonna ship BarretxAerith now.

Barrith? Aeritt?

Ooops. I don't wanna get carried away.

 

[Cthulhu]

Say, random thought: Shouldn't this be the Love Quadrilateral Well Reasoned Argument Thread / Discussion? You know, 'cause Zack's joined the orgy and shit, .

 

[Tennyo]

You know that might not be a bad idea. lol

 

[Dashell]

What's the drama this time? Seriously, I have no f-ing clue what the drama monster emblem is up for.

...
Because dude, I'm here

Say, random thought: Shouldn't this be the Love Quadrilateral Well Reasoned Argument Thread / Discussion? You know, 'cause Zack's joined the orgy and shit,

Well if we're gonna do that I've added Sephiroth to the mix several times and I just saw Barret get mentioned so...

 

[Tennyo]

How about the FFVII orgy debate thread? Who'd boink who and who would top in each?

Actually no, no that's highly inappropriate. lol