The Legend of Zelda (General)

[Ryushikaze]

Wait link's adventure
loz 2? Where they kiss at the end? The manga adaptation makes them siblings?

Link and zelda are not jamie and cersei lannister pls no

The first one came out before LOZ2. I'm pretty sure 2 was being made before the writer knew about how Adventure ended, and there's no trace of romance between them in those manga, anyways.

 

[ForceStealer]

I presume everyone has seen this purportedly official Zelda timeline from Nintendo in some Zelda artbook that's out in Asia?

Most theories seemed to have a split timeline after Ocarina, but the 3 is interesting. Apparently the first split is Link failing to defeat Ganon as a child...so Ocarina without Time Travel, I guess.
The second split is him defeating Ganon and then living out his childhood once Zelda sends him back.
The third is him defeating Ganon and continuing on as an adult for...some reason.

I wonder how many times Nintendo is going to make a Zelda game that's the "first" in the series? I admit I was kinda hoping Twilight Princess would end with GT's suggestion of Hyrule being flooded to lead to Wind Waker. But I know they never connect that directly.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

Why does there have to be a timeline?

And wouldn't Ocarina of Time make the most sense being first because it explains why he had his green tunic?

I mean I haven't played Skyward Sword yet, but like.... seriously.....


But if there had to be a timeline, I liked the idea of Twilight Princess being after Phantom Hourglass or something like that. And I hated Spirit tracks so that doesn't exist in my mind.

 

[ForceStealer]

But Minish cap explains the hat

 

[Alexia Ashford]

But OoT Link's outfit has nothing to do with any previous Link's.
Unless the Great Deku Tree just randomly said SMALL CHILD! WEAR THIS LEAF ON YOUR HEAD. IT'S IMPORTANT AND SYMBOLIC EVEN THOUGH WE NEVER MENTION IT EVER EVEN ONCE IN THIS GAME!

Also, why would Minish Cap explain the hat when Skyward Sword came before it and already had the hat?
That doesn't make any sense.

 

[ForceStealer]

That's why I asked how many times is Nintendo going to make the "first" game.

 

[Tennyo]

I don't know about that but I played Twilight Princess while babystting someone's dog and it was love

I thought that half the games were reincarnations of Link that were also named Link, though?

 

[Zee]

And wouldn't Ocarina of Time make the most sense being first because it explains why he had his green tunic?

how could a story including the master sword predate the actual creation of the master sword??

 

[Ryushikaze]

I presume everyone has scene this purportedly official Zelda timeline from Nintendo in some Zelda artbook that's out in Asia?

Most theories seemed to have a split timeline after Ocarina, but the 3 is interesting. Apparently the first split is Link failing to defeat Ganon as a child...so Ocarina without Time Travel, I guess.
The second split is him defeating Ganon and then living out his childhood once Zelda sends him back.
The third is him defeating Ganon and continuing on as an adult for...some reason.

I wonder how many times Nintendo is going to make a Zelda game that's the "first" in the series? I admit I was kinda hoping Twilight Princess would end with GT's suggestion of Hyrule being flooded to lead to Wind Waker. But I know they never connect that directly.

Wait, why is Skyward 'first' now? Was it ever actually called First?

Minish still has every reason to be 'first,' it doesn't even have the Master Sword in it.

And where's this third split coming from?

The Ocarina split coms from the 7 years later timeline continuing on WITHOUT LINK, and the newly created timeline that occurs after he gets sent back in time and prevents all that nonsense from ever happening.

 

[Zee]

Wait, why is Skyward 'first' now? Was it ever actually called First?

I do remember it being called first in the timeline, but I'd have to dig through Zelda Universe to find quotage and...........


I'm just not strong enough for that yet.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

Lots of the games don't involve Link using the Master Sword though.

And I didn't know it was actually created in one.


But seriously. I mean, why do they ALL have to be connected? I think it's kinda silly.

And I don't see how the split time line thing would actually work because Link defeats him 7 years in the future and then goes back in time and wanders away while Hyrule falls into ruin because of Ganon. And then 7 years after that Link appears, meaning he'd be in two places at once, defeats Ganon, and then goes away again.

The split timeline makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Lots of the games don't involve Link using the Master Sword though.

And I didn't know it was actually created in one.


But seriously. I mean, why do they ALL have to be connected? I think it's kinda silly.

And I don't see how the split time line thing would actually work because Link defeats him 7 years in the future and then goes back in time and wanders away while Hyrule falls into ruin because of Ganon. And then 7 years after that Link appears, meaning he'd be in two places at once, defeats Ganon, and then goes away again.

The split timeline makes absolutely no sense to me.

So, here's the reasoning behind the bitemporal split timeline

Link defeats Ganon- Hyrule is a bit wrecked, but can rebuild. Link and the Triforce blip out of this world. This world continues, Shit gets weird.

Link arrives back in his own childhood, and then prevents Ganondorf from ever taking over. The country is never ruined, Ganondorf is executed, escapes death due to the cruel joke of the gods.

Not sure how the tritemporal works, though.

 

[Tetsujin]

How is it that Link gets to prevent Ganondorf from taking over though? Why didn't that work before when he was timetravelling already? Was San Dimas time in effect? Why wasn't it afterwards?

 

[Ryushikaze]

How is it that Link gets to prevent Ganondorf from taking over though? Why didn't that work before when he was timetravelling already? Was San Dimas time in effect? Why wasn't it afterwards?

Because Link couldn't move to prevent Ganon's actions the first time around.

He was sent back before it all went down at the end of the 7 years later time. Previously, he'd been stuck in a rigid 7 forward 7 back skip, but Zelda pushed him even further.

San Dimas time was not in effect, in fact, it was Pratchettian Time Trousers going on.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

So wait.... Zelda pushes him back so far that Ganon hasn't started his evil devices and Link does what exactly? Breaks into the even more heavily guarded throne room and kills Ganon or somehow convinces the king that he's evil when his own daughter could not?
The whole point of sending him into the future was because he wasn't strong enough as a kid to do anything against Ganon.

Also, according to Wind Waker the triforce cannot leave Hyrule. When Link leaves Hyrule to go to Termina, the Triforce of Courage breaks apart and scatters across the world. The more you know

 

[ForceStealer]

So wait.... Zelda pushes him back so far that Ganon hasn't started his evil devices and Link does what exactly? Breaks into the even more heavily guarded throne room and kills Ganon or somehow convinces the king that he's evil when his own daughter could not?

The second one. He must have some sort of proof. Or the story is just that crazy taht king believes it. The story he tells the king then becomes a legend passed down to become the backstory for stuff like A Link to the Past that talks of Ganon when he never actually came to power [yet].

Or, so the theory goes, anyway.

@Ryu: Apparently, the tritemporal comes from the normal two-split as well as a parallel universe in the "without link" category. One is actually without him, the other is without Zelda sending him back and he just continues on as an adult.
I mean, whatever I guess, but what I find silly about that is doesn't that mean there's a parallel Zelda universe for literally every decision Link and Zelda had ever made?

I thought that half the games were reincarnations of Link that were also named Link, though?

Not necessarily reincarnations, but definitely other people named Zelda and Link.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

I just think that the split timeline thing is a tad silly. But what proof could Link have possibly had to make the King believe a little 8-10 year old boy who came out of the forest and allegedly knows nothing of the world? And why would he even hear him out?
It just doesn't do it for me.

 

[ForceStealer]

Well knowledge of the Triforce and everything about the King and Zelda I guess? (Does the king know about the triforce? I dunno.)

 

[Alexia Ashford]

But if he didn't believe his own daughter why would he believe some random kid no matter what he knew? And it would also mean he'd punish a man who had yet to do wrong based on hearsay or the like.

 

[ForceStealer]

Well he wouldn't have to punish him, just not listen to him.

 

[Ryushikaze]

So wait.... Zelda pushes him back so far that Ganon hasn't started his evil devices and Link does what exactly? Breaks into the even more heavily guarded throne room and kills Ganon or somehow convinces the king that he's evil when his own daughter could not?
The whole point of sending him into the future was because he wasn't strong enough as a kid to do anything against Ganon.

Convinces the King, given that in the TP flashback, he's being tried for Treason. Probably by letting the King know- with Zelda's aid to get into the King's audience- he is the emissary of the Deku Tree- he does have one of the three treasures of the land- and giving enough info for the king to no longer trust Ganondorf.

Also, according to Wind Waker the triforce cannot leave Hyrule. When Link leaves Hyrule to go to Termina, the Triforce of Courage breaks apart and scatters across the world. The more you know

I recall it being his being sent 'back' that removed him from their world, and thus scattered Courage.

The second one. He must have some sort of proof. Or the story is just that crazy taht king believes it. The story he tells the king then becomes a legend passed down to become the backstory for stuff like A Link to the Past that talks of Ganon when he never actually came to power [yet].

Or, so the theory goes, anyway.

IIRC, It speaks of Ganondorf coming across the dark realm and getting the Triforce there, thus reshaping it to his whim, which sounds similar to what actually happens to the Twilight realm.
Also, if needed, one can affix FSA between TP and LttP as there's a reborn ganondorf in the mix there somewhere.

@Ryu: Apparently, the tritemporal comes from the normal two-split as well as a parallel universe in the "without link" category. One is actually without him, the other is without Zelda sending him back and he just continues on as an adult.

But we never saw that happen. So why'd it become a basis for a third temporal pantleg?

I mean, whatever I guess, but what I find silly about that is doesn't that mean there's a parallel Zelda universe for literally every decision Link and Zelda had ever made?

That is the extreme end of this, yes.

Not necessarily reincarnations, but definitely other people named Zelda and Link.

I think it's sometimes reincarnations, but stuff like TP it isn't.

I just think that the split timeline thing is a tad silly. But what proof could Link have possibly had to make the King believe a little 8-10 year old boy who came out of the forest and allegedly knows nothing of the world? And why would he even hear him out?
It just doesn't do it for me.

"I am the emissary of one of the primal forces of our land, and I have one of our lands three treasures as proof of my status" in not so many words.

Well knowledge of the Triforce and everything about the King and Zelda I guess? (Does the king know about the triforce? I dunno.)

I presume he would.

But if he didn't believe his own daughter why would he believe some random kid no matter what he knew? And it would also mean he'd punish a man who had yet to do wrong based on hearsay or the like.

Evidence of Ganon's bid for power would probably already exist.

Well he wouldn't have to punish him, just not listen to him.

Or simply toss him out on his ear rather than keep him close by. Ganon's COUp began from inside the castle town, recall.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

I just played WW. They said in it that the triforce split with Link's departure.

But still, what would be the point of all that?
If Zelda thought that that was a good option she should have done it in the first place. I know she may not have thought of it as a child but why couldn't Sheik have suggested it? I'm sure she could have firgured it out.
And I always thought that Ganon's stabity cutscene was sometime way after. Otherwise the sages not being Impa and Saria and such doesn't make sense to me.
But Zelda sent Link back so he could regain his childhood, didn't she? Not so that he could deal with Ganon all over again.




Oh I just had a random thought of the non-split timeline. What if Link had been helping himself in all the dungeons without Link seeing? XD Ha. that'd be silly.

 

[Ryushikaze]

I just played WW. They said in it that the triforce split with Link's departure.

Yeah, I don't disagree. I just think they meant him being sent back, not his visiting Termina. Because Link Visits Termina as part of a search for Navi, and that's in the pantleg of time that supposedly leads to TP.

But still, what would be the point of all that?
If Zelda thought that that was a good option she should have done it in the first place. I know she may not have thought of it as a child but why couldn't Sheik have suggested it? I'm sure she could have firgured it out.

By the time Sheik could have suggested it, it was too late.

And I always thought that Ganon's stabity cutscene was sometime way after. Otherwise the sages not being Impa and Saria and such doesn't make sense to me.

I don't think the masky folks were supposed to be the Spirit Sages. I do agree that I think the Dorfstabbing takes place some time after OoT's kid period, since he looks notable older in it. I propose after being tossed out on his ear and his COUp failing, Dorf tries things the traditional way with War. This ends poorly for him.

But Zelda sent Link back so he could regain his childhood, didn't she? Not so that he could deal with Ganon all over again.

By preventing Link from having to grow into the hero of time, she gives him back the time he lost, I thought.

Oh I just had a random thought of the non-split timeline. What if Link had been helping himself in all the dungeons without Link seeing? XD Ha. that'd be silly.

"Right, the Bow was HERE and I picked up a key THERE..."


Though speaking of OoT and timeline fuckery, I have a fanfic idea, the basis of which is- well, what if Link never arrived to be the hero of time, and someone else decided to take up the mantle for him?

Back on the timeline, the more I think, the more it feels 'right' that FSA and at least one additional Dorf reincarnation occurs between TP and LttP.

 

[Alexia Ashford]

Myeh. I still don't like the split timeline thing. But to each their own. Also it would mean that Link had to be the one to think of presenting the stone to the king.
But those sages in TP held the sage emblems. The one who died had his staff with his symbol destroyed as well. So I think they'd have to be the evolved forms of the original sages.



And I think if anyone but Link tried to do all that stuff they'd probably either end up corrupted or they'd die because they wouldn't be chosen to hold the Mastersword of the Triforce of Courage


But seriously, Zelda is supposed to be extremely wise, hence the Triforce of Wisdom, but I never really see her doing anything that's that smart.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Myeh. I still don't like the split timeline thing. But to each their own. Also it would mean that Link had to be the one to think of presenting the stone to the king.
But those sages in TP held the sage emblems. The one who died had his staff with his symbol destroyed as well. So I think they'd have to be the evolved forms of the original sages.

Or maybe just the sages before the replacement sages? Ya never know.

And I think if anyone but Link tried to do all that stuff they'd probably either end up corrupted or they'd die because they wouldn't be chosen to hold the Mastersword of the Triforce of Courage

Yeah, OC's not using either of those things. He sort of gets the job because he manages to be lucky enough to not die when Dorfy blasts him out of the castle and into the chamber of Sages... somehow. No one's exactly sure how that one works.

But seriously, Zelda is supposed to be extremely wise, hence the Triforce of Wisdom, but I never really see her doing anything that's that smart.

Dorf's not that powerful, IMO.
In any case, my explanation for the split timeline involves Link's extra future knowledge giving him and Zelda enough ammo- along with his status as emissary- to actually damn dorf.
Zelda only had a premonition. She sent Link to find proof. Link and Zelda cheat with time travel, bob's your uncle.