The Love Triangle Debate: Another Turn in the Cycle

[The Twilight Mexican]

Also damn that old Sephiroth design... I'm glad he turned out the way he did but the old one looks pretty cool

That's Vincent, isn't it? Maybe his design was almost used for Sephiroth.

Oh wow thanks ... I feel like I was a bitch sometimes though. Honestly I just believe in giving people the benefit of the doubt. That can bite me in the ass sometimes though

Well, I told you a long time ago I'd only bite you there if you want me to.

I'm kinda interested in that "The three lost beings" thing too... what is that all about?

i wish there were more things about this particular early concept. like who are the lost beings, or the guardians? did they eventually morph into something different in the final game? what secrets are you hiding

Hm, missing old comrades of Sephiroth, who also mysteriously disappeared? They probably became Genesis and Angeal in CC.

We know Angeal's design was recycled from an early design for Cloud, so why not this early plot concept too?

 

[Chaoticgumbo]

To add more from the official translations..

https://imgur.com/NdGKpWY

Not many care much for the LTD anymore, but I remember how intense it was back in the heyday. It’s a good thing that people have moved on, but i do admit to feeling a bit smug, not only because it supports CloudxTifa so much, but also because of how the translations were so trashed by a certain group. In fact, thelifestream was too conservative with some of the translations as to not offend a certain shipping group, especially the “faint” love part (it was such a big issue back, some even proposed the translation really meant Cloud’s weakening love for her). The official English version is straight up explicit in talking about Cloud’s love for Tifa, without any ambiguity or “faintness”.

 

[TooManyFandoms]

In all honesty, I can never decide between them. On my most recent play through I was thinking that maybe Aeris was the better love interest for Cloud during Midgar and beyond, but after her death, towards the end, I was thinking Tifa. They both meant so much to him, so I don't think there can ever be a "right" answer. He loved both of them. Maybe his love for one or another was more poignant during certain moments, but neither can be written off as "just a friend".

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

That was genuinely beautifully put. Thanks.

 

[CrashOuch]

Yeah, that's the way I always thought it was. He likes them both and then one dies and makes his choice for him.

 

[Shadowfox]

If Aerith and Tifa are the same person....

...then everybody wins. ​

View attachment 2211

YOUR SHIP IS CANON. YOUR SHIP IS CANON.

EVERYBODY’S SHIP IS CANON
View attachment 2212

... Except for primarily Aerti shippers like me. WTF? #notmyultimania

 

[fancy]

But that’s the ultimate aerti cuz they’re so canon that they’re one. They’re so in each other that they are each other. EVERYONE WINS!

*inhales breath*

....everyone

 

[Theozilla]

i wish there were more things about this particular early concept. like who are the lost beings, or the guardians? did they eventually morph into something different in the final game? what secrets are you hiding

I wonder if the Guardians thing may have morphed into/got saved for the idea of the party in FFX being Yuna's guardians on her pilgrimage?

 

[Chaoticgumbo]

Yeah, that's the way I always thought it was. He likes them both and then one dies and makes his choice for him.

Looking at the LTD from an unbiased lens, it is a unique case in the FF series where the protagonist loves both of the heroines, and by love I mean in a romantic way. FFVII breaks the mold in a lot of ways, and one of them is the romance aspect of the story. It makes some people uncomfortable because it is not a traditional monogamous love story which is what people are normally used to in media.

 

[Dashell]

Just for the record, the fact that we are happy about these translations from this obviously biased Ultimania shows how desperate we really are.

 

[Nandemoyasan]

Look...

HERE.

 

[Chaoticgumbo]

Just for the record, the fact that we are happy about these translations from this obviously biased Ultimania shows how desperate we really are.

These translations are obviously forged. Clotis are so desperate that they are even infiltrating mainstream media to showcase their bias. Obviously.

 

[Strangelove]

Just for the record, the fact that we are happy about these translations from this obviously biased Ultimania shows how desperate we really are.

i could not resist peaking at the tag on tumblr when i saw it cross my timeline, and i came across this post

https://theycallmeeljefe.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F181256042273
to avoid going further down this rabbit hole, what is the problem with english version supposed to be?

edit; i scrolled down a bit and i guess this is the problem?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

That was kind of a bizarre choice of translation for the OtWtaS passage, though.

 

[Chaoticgumbo]

Hm, but don’t these English translations run through an approval process by SE? Ever since the original FFVII Japanese to English translation debacle, I thought Squaresoft/SE ran a tighter ship in the translation process. And considering the Ultimania is the mother of FF guidebooks, I can’t imagine the scrutiny to be any less. I don’t know Japanese so I can’t comment much more on this.

 

[Strangelove]

all i know is

i still have l'amant double on my movie watch list and that's what i'm taking from this discussion

 

[Dashell]

Hm, but don’t these English translations run through an approval process by SE? Ever since the original FFVII Japanese to English translation debacle, I thought Squaresoft/SE ran a tighter ship in the translation process..

More than likely not. However I can point out some posts in this very same thread where the argument was made that we can't prove that Square doesn't go over these things so they more than likely do. But that only applies to the FRENCH OTWTAS.... None of any other translations count.... Just the French Otwtas

 

[Edley]

Had to see if the ole thread was still around after picking up the Ultimania archive.

all i know is

i still have l'amant double on my movie watch list and that's what i'm taking from this discussion

That film is ... well, just read the review I've linked

Like a steamy alternate-universe Frasier fanfic

 

[Dashell]

Man now I wanna see the movie

EDIT:
Also

to avoid going further down this rabbit hole, what is the problem with english version supposed to be?

It's Cloti. That's it, that's the only reason. It's Cloti.

 

[Nandemoyasan]

The Final Fantasy VII Love Triangle Debate: Missing The Point Of FFVII's Story Since 1995

 

[Strangelove]

Like a steamy alternate-universe Frasier fanfic

as if frasier wasn't sexy enough already!

 

[T@ctic]

Just for the record, the fact that we are happy about these translations from this obviously biased Ultimania shows how desperate we really are.

well i have seen on twitter that (of course) not everything in the book is precise, and that includes the cloti parts. for example the part of "awakening of their love" bit was again translated from the same japanese of faint and young love. i still agree with hawkeye's translation of "starting to fall in love with" than faint since it sounds rather vague. in english at least. maybe "faint" really does mean "starting to fall in love with" over there.

it makes sense that his crush was developing into genuine love, but wasn't complete love by the time he promised tifa, since they were in their early teens. by the time he worked at shinra and came back, i believe it was solidified. ironically, the distance in cloud and tifa's relationship make their bond/feelings that much stronger

 

[Dashell]

Yeah I know it's not perfect. The Reunion Files had issues too. But these people saying that Clotis are desperate to cling to these translations and such were the ones way back in the day claiming that a French translation showed the ONE TRUE pairing of FFVII and that we had to go off that because we had nothing in English.

There also used to be mudslinging about fan translations and how they can't be trusted so we had to wait for official translations... and here they are and now, ofc, those same people are saying the official translations are no good so... lol?

 

[Chaoticgumbo]

well i have seen on twitter that (of course) not everything in the book is precise, and that includes the cloti parts. for example the part of "awakening of their love" bit was again translated from the same japanese of faint and young love. i still agree with hawkeye's translation of "starting to fall in love with" than faint since it sounds rather vague. in english at least. maybe "faint" really does mean "starting to fall in love with" over there.

it makes sense that his crush was developing into genuine love, but wasn't complete love by the time he promised tifa, since they were in their early teens. by the time he worked at shinra and came back, i believe it was solidified. ironically, the distance in cloud and tifa's relationship make their bond/feelings that much stronger

Yeah, that’s probably a more accurate translation, that their love was awakened here and grew into something bigger with its full depths realized at the end of disc 2, “without words”. But regardless, no matter which way you slice it, it’s still love. And I think that’s how the official English translations saw it.

 

[Dashell]

Oh lol... This faint young love bit was when I didn't acknowledge the ku and all my translations were invalid and not accurate. i guess the official translation didn't either...


No wonder they say it's biased... Square didn't acknowledge the divine light of ku