SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[GamerSkull]

Tifa only liking Fake Cloud is a super old talking point. Nojima took that idea to the back of the woodshed with Trace of Two Pasts.

She does have a habit of putting him on a pedestal though, which drives some of the conflict in their relationship (which to be honest is good writing in my opinion.)

It doesn’t quite track though. Because she expressly states her is scaring her in Sector 7 and when he asks her to elaborate she specifically mentions a SOLDIER characteristic. The same characteristic, mind you, that Aerith describes as beautiful.

It’s pretty clear that the SOLDIER aspect forms the initial basis for Aerith’s attraction to him… whereas Tifa seems more interested in finding the kid she grew up with even as early as Sector 7 since she questions him about the things he did when he left the village. Multiple times actually, she tries to probe him…

 

[MissMDusk]

Like I said, for a ship that's truly "winning" they sure can't shut up about Tifa nor Cloud and Tifa's relationship.

I guess I'm comforted in knowing that the more they recycle their arguments, the more likely Nojima and the devs will see/be told about them. The devs recently said that they watch what the fans say, right? So they'll see how much people hate on Tifa and hopefully understand that this shouldn't be the audience they should cater to.

I mean lol, even Nomura is done with the weird interpretations. I heard that he basically said "If we see someone get some sort of (wrong) interpretation, we just laugh and say 'well that's how it is!'" or something like that?

 

[Eerie]

Yeah I mean, Hamaguchi follows a CA streamer at least plus recently some really big CT accounts, so they're definitely following what's happening on the shipping side of the fandom.

 

[Sacky]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/comments/1elya37 Seeing this on reddit always confuses me, So what is True Did Cloud have some of Zacks memories? I found this
quote that implies he did
FFVII Rebirth Director Hamaguchi says that when it comes to Cloud in the Nibelheim Flashback, it’s not just Cloud alone; it’s a blend of Cloud’s memories and Zack’s memories. (kakuchopurei, 10/26/2023)

The rain that falls at the end of Crisis Core: FF7 when Zack is dying stops by the time Cloud says "Thank you." This sequence not only indicates the passage of time but also implies how Zack's memories have imprinted onto Cloud. (Continuity Director Toshiyuki Momose; CCU, 2007

But I was always confused on the memory thing and also if Jenova Cells in Cloud are Jenovas will,
or just the ability of the cells? I feel he has to have some memories of Zack since he can recall word for word the exact conversation Zack had with Sephiroth while he was outside with Tifa everything even turning the valve except for the Genesis talk?

 

[Eerie]

It's Jenova who imprints Zack's memories onto Cloud IIRC, so her using Zack's memories at her advantage are her will to transform Cloud into a puppet.

 

[pxl_pushr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/comments/1elya37 Seeing this on reddit always confuses me, So what is True Did Cloud have some of Zacks memories? I found this
quote that implies he did
FFVII Rebirth Director Hamaguchi says that when it comes to Cloud in the Nibelheim Flashback, it’s not just Cloud alone; it’s a blend of Cloud’s memories and Zack’s memories. (kakuchopurei, 10/26/2023)

The rain that falls at the end of Crisis Core: FF7 when Zack is dying stops by the time Cloud says "Thank you." This sequence not only indicates the passage of time but also implies how Zack's memories have imprinted onto Cloud. (Continuity Director Toshiyuki Momose; CCU, 2007

But I was always confused on the memory thing and also if Jenova Cells in Cloud are Jenovas will,
or just the ability of the cells? I feel he has to have some memories of Zack since he can recall word for word the exact conversation Zack had with Sephiroth while he was outside with Tifa everything even turning the valve except for the Genesis talk?

Well, it’s not just Zack in his head, we know that, and if Jenova is ultimately marching to Sephiroth’s tune, perhaps Sephiroth had Jenova filter the memories of the Genesis conversation?

The Kalm flashback is an interesting oddity with this new approach, because you can see Cloud’s mind actively fight off memories/delusions of his mom ( anytime she speaks and you can’t see her face ) but stuff from CC is also missing that Zack would know.

Could it all be the version of the story SOLDIERCloud thinks is most digestible to Tifa? Dunno. The LS scene is going to be interesting when it’s time to tackle Nibelheim.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Well, it’s not just Zack in his head, we know that, and if Jenova is ultimately marching to Sephiroth’s tune, perhaps Sephiroth had Jenova filter the memories of the Genesis conversation?

The Kalm flashback is an interesting oddity with this new approach, because you can see Cloud’s mind actively fight off memories/delusions of his mom ( anytime she speaks and you can’t see her face ) but stuff from CC is also missing that Zack would know.

Could it all be the version of the story SOLDIERCloud thinks is most digestible to Tifa? Dunno. The LS scene is going to be interesting when it’s time to tackle Nibelheim.

Speaking of Tifa, some of her memories of Cloud are used to create the Facade persona, along with those of Zack, and Cloud's own idea of an ideal SOLDIER type. I don't recall off the top of my head which Ulti dropped that information, but I seem to recall it was by a picture of the moment where Tifa finds him at the station.

 

[Eerie]

Speaking of Tifa, some of her memories of Cloud are used to create the Facade persona, along with those of Zack, and Cloud's own idea of an ideal SOLDIER type. I don't recall off the top of my head which Ulti dropped that information, but I seem to recall it was by a picture of the moment where Tifa finds him at the station.

It was the Ultimania Omega that dropped that special bit of info (or at least, it was said again there).

 

[pxl_pushr]

He’s such kitbashed personality, it’s no wonder Cloud’s so creepy when he’s under mind control, or when he almost reverts to someone way more childlike. Feels like you see layers of it peeled back.

 

[Ryushikaze]

View attachment 17147
It was the Ultimania Omega that dropped that special bit of info (or at least, it was said again there).

I think it was another one, describing the various sources of his new personality. His memories, Hers, Zack's, and an ideal image of a SOLDIER were the components, IIRC.

 

[Shadowfox]

I think it was from here: LTD, round 3: This time, we settle it with Jello Wrestling

In the early parts of the story, Cloud was unconsciously playing out the persona of "ex-SOLDIER Cloud", contrary to his true character, due to the effects of the experiments he underwent 5 years previously. This persona was created from a mix of the memories of a SOLDIER named Zack, Cloud's close friend, and his own nature of wanting to avoid other people. Cloud was not originally the cool hero, but shy, lacking in self-confidence, and awkward around people.

 

[Ryushikaze]

That's definitely talking about the subject, thanks. There's tons of little notes Jenova's influence on the fake Persona all over the ultimanias, so it's possible I'm mixing up a few snippets without realizing it.

 

[Fakewings_]

what do u think about C& A firework date in EC? Seem like SE is raising the LTD again. C almost confesses his feeling when saying: ‘when i’m with you, you bring out a part of me that i didn’t know existed, IMO.

 

[Sacky]

what do u think about C& A firework date in EC? Seem like SE is raising the LTD again. C almost confesses his feeling when saying: ‘when i’m with you, you bring out a part of me that i didn’t know existed, IMO.

If they keep baiting the LTD they are just stoking a fire to then Reveal in part 3 the same ending as OG FF7 in which if they don't explicitly confirm one way or another no one is happy. So they can self sabotage if they want but people are tired at this point. If they fuck up part 3 no one is gonna care about what Square does after making people wait this long and baiting them for literal years. For them to then wonder why people are so angry. So keep baiting make no one happy then you just made a massive angry fan base.

 

[billy22]

C almost confesses his feeling when saying: ‘when i’m with you, you bring out a part of me that i didn’t know existed, IMO.

That's quite the leap in logic.

 

[Xombii]

It's a really sweet scene, with Aerith, but I'm not sure how you can jump to it being romantic. It could be, if it had the right context, but these firework scenes feel more like.... The GS dates reversed. With Tifa it's as if he wants to confess for sure, but instead of Tifa being too nervous about them being childhood friends, it's him that's too shy to say anything. With Aerith it's HIM that says there's a part of him he didn't know existed, instead of her suggesting he's not himself... I dunno, I feel like people really do stare too hard with shipping goggles to see what's in front of them.

Also to add. There was a Yuffie option, it was pretty cute too and yet nobody (I hope) Is taking up that fight. istg.

Edit again cause I'm more adhd than human. I don't think EC can do anything to state that actually Cloud just likes Tifa actually, because they haven't got to the lifestream yet and sorted out his pickled brain, they gotta keep it kind of subtle ya know. I hope they don't drag it out till Part 3 but on the same lines, they might. They could literally drag the EC story out till part 3 says the whole thing out loud.

 

[Eerie]

The illusion subtext is so strong in the CA date that I thought it was kind of obvious he was talking about his Zack/SOLDIER persona lol.

 

[pxl_pushr]

It’s a phrase that’s certainly a sweet thing to say to someone, so I’d hope CA fans would enjoy it. It’s typically used as a reason why someone may have feelings for the other person, but like most things concerning Cloud, his mental state should be considered.

I certainly don’t think he means that Aerith brings out the RealCloud. The phrase you’d want to see would be closer to “you make me feel like I can be me/myself/more myself.” Vs what’s said.

Imo it implies that she… well, brings out new sides to him. Himself or not, Cloud would’ve never guessed he’d be willing to crossdress for anything, or have an interest in fields and flowers ( botany in general? ), or photography ( even if that one makes so much sense it hurts ). Like any close relationship, be it friendly or romantic, they change you in little and not so little ways.

Through Aerith, Cloud learns how to treat others gently, and ultimately she teaches Cloud the power of compassion. This isn’t to say Tifa herself isn’t a shining example of compassion, but I’d say Aerith shows how even a simple flower girl can have a massive impact through compassion and acting for the sake of those you love.

So yeah, she brings out parts of him he didn’t know existed, probably because he hyper focused on the parts of himself he lacked instead.

 

[aeriths]

what do u think about C& A firework date in EC? Seem like SE is raising the LTD again. C almost confesses his feeling when saying: ‘when i’m with you, you bring out a part of me that i didn’t know existed, IMO.

I think that’s a huge leap to make? It seemed more like he wanted to confess to Tifa during theirs.

That being said, the C&A one was cuter to me but my thoughts are really nothing since it’s an EC event which means it’s ultimately fanservice behind gacha Hell that has no bearing to the main story. Not sure if an unpopular opinion, but the events in EC outside of the main story and skins really don’t mean much to me.

 

[pxl_pushr]

I think that’s a huge leap to make? It seemed more like he wanted to confess to Tifa during theirs.

That being said, the C&A one was cuter to me but my thoughts are really nothing since it’s an EC event which means it’s ultimately fanservice behind gacha Hell that has no bearing to the main story. Not sure if an unpopular opinion, but the events in EC outside of the main story and skins really don’t mean much to me.

And this is perhaps the better way to look at all this. None of them will change the course of the story or offer crucial new insight. The MSQ is where eyes should focus. What changes, what doesn’t, etc…

 

[aeriths]

I think that’s a huge leap to make? It seemed more like he wanted to confess to Tifa during theirs.

That being said, the C&A one was cuter to me but my thoughts are really nothing since it’s an EC event which means it’s ultimately fanservice behind gacha Hell that has no bearing to the main story. Not sure if an unpopular opinion, but the events in EC outside of the main story and skins really don’t mean much to me.

Clarifying after re-reading the last part and realizing I worded it weird: the skins also mean nothing to me along with the events outside of main story lol. So I don’t see the need to dissect them either

 

[Maidenofwar]

It’s a phrase that’s certainly a sweet thing to say to someone, so I’d hope CA fans would enjoy it. It’s typically used as a reason why someone may have feelings for the other person, but like most things concerning Cloud, his mental state should be considered.

I certainly don’t think he means that Aerith brings out the RealCloud. The phrase you’d want to see would be closer to “you make me feel like I can be me/myself/more myself.” Vs what’s said.

Imo it implies that she… well, brings out new sides to him. Himself or not, Cloud would’ve never guessed he’d be willing to crossdress for anything, or have an interest in fields and flowers ( botany in general? ), or photography ( even if that one makes so much sense it hurts ). Like any close relationship, be it friendly or romantic, they change you in little and not so little ways.

Through Aerith, Cloud learns how to treat others gently, and ultimately she teaches Cloud the power of compassion. This isn’t to say Tifa herself isn’t a shining example of compassion, but I’d say Aerith shows how even a simple flower girl can have a massive impact through compassion and acting for the sake of those you love.

So yeah, she brings out parts of him he didn’t know existed, probably because he hyper focused on the parts of himself he lacked instead.

Yeah, I agree

It's a nice parallel to the EC church scene where Aerith says Cloud taught her so much, about her getting to experience so many new things thanks to him I think

 

[Ryeleigh]

So this is secondhand from people who play the Bleach gacha game but apparently that game has a lot of "IchiRuki" moments and storylines. And well, we all know that IchiHime was/is canon in the manga. So I think these gacha games should be taken as they are: as cute fanservice for everyone. .....that probably doesn't drastically contradict the source material?

As an aside, I really wish people would learn to stop looking at every moment and detail and statement as "will this prove my ship's canonicity" and instead just enjoy what they get/have, lol.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Aww, I don't really follow fan art and stuff like that. But I hope the streamer will feel better soon.

Thank you

I was asking if they knew about the high/low split rather than the people you can get.

Oh, then yeah. Also they beat the game, wanted to see Tifa's date so went back and did it, but it was the standard version, I let them know affection wasn't high enough. Some in chat thought it would work because you can select Intimate in extra options. The streamer said they might try and work on the affection values off stream.

Late reply but yeah if you have a favourite piece of family/AC art I'm sure they'd appreciate it, thanks Ryu.

 

[Shadowstorm]

I haven't gotten the Aerith and Yuffie dates yet since I'm still catching up and they're underpowered atm, but I was kinda surprised at how hard the Tifa one went. It's hard to do anything more than we already got in Rebirth but Cloud being the one to almost confess but lose his nerve really is something.

I agree though, that it's the fanservice phone game and shouldn't be taken as gospel. I don't believe the main games are built around feeding the LTD at all, but something like this does have a vested interest in pandering to both sides to keep them playing. Hell, should it keeping going after part 3 is out I wouldn't be surprised if they keep baiting Clerith even after Cloti is locked in. Hope Zerith can start getting some crumbs in these events too though.