FFVII REMAKE CONFIRMED

[Lex]

Got it, preserved for eternity

 

[Odysseus]

Okay so all those concerns that Square was "tricking people" by not mentioning it was only part 1 were wrong, because it says so on the back of the box?

 

[Lex]

I'm not sure I would say that. I can see why they're not publicising it quite so heavily, but I can also see the point that people picking this up for the first time aren't necessarily going to be aware that it's not the full thing. That said, it's quite clearly a full game in its own right, so I'm not sure how much is actually owed to people in that regard.

I think I've flipped my thinking on this. Take something like Mass Effect for example - you go into that knowing or not knowing it's more than the first title, but it's just called "Mass Effect", even though the creators intention was always a larger story over a trilogy. Nobody really comes out of that experience feeling cheated even though the larger plot is definitely not resolved by the end of it.

I think we can apply the same logic to FFVII, if we get over the fact that the big difference here is that the media it's based on is one full title from a previous generation. But there are other pockets of media based on past stories that also don't indicate they're part of a larger story even though they clearly are - The Witcher is an example. Mass Effect isn't called "Mass Effect 1" or "Mass Effect Part One", and "The Witcher" isn't called "The Witcher 1", so I am starting to wonder why we all want to hold FFVII remake to a higher standard (myself included).

The more logical reason for them not making it "obvious" is that it's awkward branding (which they are no stranger to, hello duodecim 358/2 012 final remix prelude something) that would probably impact sales, even if only a little. But I think putting a small message on the back of the box is decent, and it's actually more than what I would expect them to have to do.

Also of interest is that I don't see it supporting a 4K resolution on there, but other boxes for games I have also say the same thing (HD 1080p, 1080i etc) even though they support 4K. So that doesn't really tell us much.

 

[Odysseus]

I was thinking similarly. The problem is that media outlets early on claimed that the remake would be "episodic" like Life is Strange or tell tale games, and that idea stuck. In reality its that the remake is a proper video game series in it's own right, like your Mass Effect analogy implies. Of course, when I thought of a similar analogy, it was in terms of Sonic 1, 2 &3&K, because I'm a degenerate. So now there are mobs of misinformed people thinking that the remake will be like six hours long and that square is deceiving everyone. I think the reason it's messing with people is that this approach to a remake is fairly unprecedented, so people are stuck in the mind set of "Square's selling the beginning of the game for $60!"

 

[Lex]

I think the reason it's messing with people is that this approach to a remake is fairly unprecedented, so people are stuck in the mind set of "Square's selling the beginning of the game for $60!"

I mean, there's no denying that this is what they're doing. It's just that they're selling a full game that's the beginning of the story, the same way other franchises do. I think as long as it's fleshed out enough to warrant its place in the narrative we're golden.

I'm still a little bit salty it's just Midgar. I know a lot of people had guessed that would be the case, but I was really hoping for that Cargo Ship cutoff point a lot of us theorised on. Now I can't reconcile how they're going to manage the story of the next one in a way that allows them to develop environments to the same standard. No matter what way you slice it, the party travels all over the world. Nowhere is as big as Midgar, but there are still big locations and they all look stylistically distinct from one another.

Look out for FFVII Part Two: Kalm and Chocobo Farm. Final boss is a conversation with the Turks at the end of the Mythril Mines :/

 

[Odysseus]

I guess what I meant by that is "Square is selling us 5 to 10 hours of a video game" rather than "Square is selling us the beginning of FF7 but blown up to a full length title in its own right."

I don't think any location is going to be as expanded on as Midgar, there's just no reason for it. The only place that might even come close is Junon, but other than that most places in FF7 are just small villages. I might be over optimistic, but I really think part 2 will go all the way to North Crater. Midgar has its own three act narrative, so it makes sense to be its own entry. Ending part 2 at any point before Aerith's death would be completely arbitrary, there would be no pay-off to anything. In 7's larger 3-act structure, act 1 is Midgar, act 2 is "the hunt for the man in the black cape," and act 3 is "The Meteor Crisis." that's why I think part 2 will end at North Crater.

 

[Jairus]

But Ody, look at the scale of the badlands around Midgar in the opening scene of FF7R. How far do you think you can go in a world at that huge a scale in one game? Midgar, even though it was shrouded in smog, was still small compared to the surrounding lands. And that's just the immediate area. Imagine how big the entire continent will be at that same scale.

 

[Lex]

I don't think any location is going to be as expanded on as Midgar, there's just no reason for it. The only place that might even come close is Junon, but other than that most places in FF7 are just small villages. I might be over optimistic, but I really think part 2 will go all the way to North Crater. Midgar has its own three act narrative, so it makes sense to be its own entry. Ending part 2 at any point before Aerith's death would be completely arbitrary, there would be no pay-off to anything. In 7's larger 3-act structure, act 1 is Midgar, act 2 is "the hunt for the man in the black cape," and act 3 is "The Meteor Crisis." that's why I think part 2 will end at North Crater.

I completely agree with what you're saying about narrative structure, and I hope part two goes up to North Crater aswell. That would be my ideal cutoff point.

However, I think in terms of asset building and environments it might be asking for too much. They can expand Midgar because it has the same architecture - it looks nice and varied based on what we've seen, but there's a huge difference between cloning a wall texture and creating something new from scratch, which - no matter how small the areas are - they're going to have to do for the entire world. They visit every single location in that suggested narrative stretch bar Mideel and - if they want to cut it for the next part - Wutai.

 

[Odysseus]

Yeah I might be asking too much there. Just can't think of another good cut-off point. Guess we'll see.

 

[Theozilla]

I was also one of those who were hoping/speculating on the first installment’s cutoff point being the Cargo Ship, before Midgar only was confirmed.

Additionally, I don’t think the new opening’s expanse of the wasteland around Midgar should be relied on for giving us hints of how the second installment will be depicting/structuring things, since the opening is likely pre-rendered and done with cinematic in mind, I doubt it’s meant to be indicative of the assets that will be used in the second part.

However, I think the very fact that first installment is only Midgar is what can/will allow them to make the second installment go all the way to Meteor Summoning (presuming the Remake will be a trilogy). Since the first part is only Midgar, there is no established expectation for how the overworld sections and locations will be handled and how the matter of illusion of scale will be handled. Because the second part will be introducing the overworld, it has the privilege of being able to establish a distinctly different style of depicting its non-Midgar world (from how part 1 does Midgar). Therefore, I think it’s feasible to be confident that the second installment can get up to the Northern Crater for Meteor summon.

 

[clowd]

 

[Tetsujin]

I'm not sure I would say that. I can see why they're not publicising it quite so heavily, but I can also see the point that people picking this up for the first time aren't necessarily going to be aware that it's not the full thing. That said, it's quite clearly a full game in its own right, so I'm not sure how much is actually owed to people in that regard.

I think I've flipped my thinking on this. Take something like Mass Effect for example - you go into that knowing or not knowing it's more than the first title, but it's just called "Mass Effect", even though the creators intention was always a larger story over a trilogy. Nobody really comes out of that experience feeling cheated even though the larger plot is definitely not resolved by the end of it.

I think we can apply the same logic to FFVII, if we get over the fact that the big difference here is that the media it's based on is one full title from a previous generation. But there are other pockets of media based on past stories that also don't indicate they're part of a larger story even though they clearly are - The Witcher is an example. Mass Effect isn't called "Mass Effect 1" or "Mass Effect Part One", and "The Witcher" isn't called "The Witcher 1", so I am starting to wonder why we all want to hold FFVII remake to a higher standard (myself included).

To be fair though, this is an adaptation of an existing work. The title "Final Fantasy VII Remake" sets an expectation. It claims to be the remake of Final Fantasy VII and there is already precedent to what that title means because it's a full story which we know the end of and everything. And the fact is, this is not a remake of FFVII, it's only a partial remake. So I think the criticism is fair because the title of the game is in fact wrong.
That's why it bothers me when other series are used as examples because I feel it's different when it was meant to be multiple parts from the beginning. Even worse is when people bring up FFXIII as an example because XIII is a standalone story to begin with.
I think better examples would be other stories that have been split up that were previously single parts i.e. a lot of book to movie adaptations. Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, The Hobbit etc. which actually did use "Part 1" or a subtitle to signify that you're getting only a part of the story that is being retold.

 

[Kain424]

I agree with the argument about branding. I was always hoping the actual intro would say Final Fantasy VII - Midgar, or something to that effect. As it stands, the next one will likely have a very awkward naming scheme.

...Or worse, they could just veer off into an entirely new story from here.

 

[Cannon_Fodder]

Each part is just going to be called FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE with no subtitle, so we'll have to add the year so other people know what game we're talking about. Kinda like God of War (2018).

I'm mostly joking.

 

[Kain424]

I would be strangely ok with that.

 

[Odysseus]

I get the feeling their line of thinking was that "Final Fantasy VII Remake" is more striking by itself than with a subtitle. Though it may be misleading, I can't help but agree.

 

[Claymore]

Which all becomes mute when they are forced to put a Part II (or some convoluted sub title) onto the second installment to show that it is a continuation of the Remake of VII.

 

[FFShinra]

I dunno about that. I feel like they will give each section after it's own subtitle, so that its akin to the naming of MMORPG expansions.

 

[Kain424]

Final Fantasy VII Remake: The Eastern Continent. Bleh. Don't care for that.

 

[Erotic Materia]

FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE SEARCH FOR SEPHIROTH
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE PROMISED LAND
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: BUGGIES AND BUGENHAGENS
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: HOLD ME CLOSER, TINY BRONCO
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE PLANET'S ABOUT TO GET DESTROYED BY A GIANT METEOR, SO LET'S BREED CHOCOBOS

 

[ForceStealer]

FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: HOLD ME CLOSER, TINY BRONCO

Dammit.

 

[Lex]

FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE SEARCH FOR SEPHIROTH
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE PROMISED LAND
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: BUGGIES AND BUGENHAGENS
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: HOLD ME CLOSER, TINY BRONCO
FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE: THE PLANET'S ABOUT TO GET DESTROYED BY A GIANT METEOR, SO LET'S BREED CHOCOBOS

I would legitimately prefer any of these to the random latin they like to hit out with tbh

 

[Ite]

Final Fantasy VII Remake: in itinere ad nigrum
Final Fantasy VII Remake: media navi iter
Final Fantasy VII Remake: post maris
Final Fantasy VII Remake: memori maris

 

[Jairus]

Final Fantasy VII Remake: Estuans interius
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Ira vehementi
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Sors immanis
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Et inanis
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Veni, veni, venias
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Ne me mori facias
Final Fantasy VII Remake: Gloriosa generosa

 

[Saven]

Cloud Returns: Final Fantasy VII Remake