eleamaya
Pro Adventurer
I think the fact that it's Brianna White who responded to Cody's tweet is pretty telling.
SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
- Start date
Biscuit
Rookie Adventurer
- AKA
- Bikit
Hmm? Have you guys already brought up the reunion flower brooch that aerith wanted cloud to give to her by her subconscious (merchant)? She even asks for it herself? And cloud who knows she knows what it means is completely confused and kind of offended. Saying "are you serious?" With a sigh. Then she hold his hand like I would assume what lovers do in FF world because the interlocking doesn't seem to be taken like that in their world. Could have also learned it from madam m the masseur, cloud is clueless but if he really wanted to he could have hugged her tighty instead but he did not (like he did with tifa), he settled for something he considered comforting but neutral. Tbh, the whole thing could mean something like, it looks romantic but it's not actually, because in our world interlocking hands is a romantic gesture.
So when she held his hand like that, which I think she's actually trying to recreate zack here but can't get it from cloud because he too doesn't consent to this because he's in love with tifa, not her. It just makes cloud go along with her because he thinks she's acting really weird. He's worried, he's being a friend.
That by itself already shows you that seeing aerith as a romantic option has not entered his mind at all. To see it is to entertain it, and to ponder it. But it really looks like he gets caught of guard with her a lot because he treats her as a friend, but she's flirting with him and wanting more. Hence why her confession, because ngl that is a confession one way or around. Makes cloud only uncomfortable.
If you take tifa's date in mind, you'll know cloud isn't dense at all. And doesn't want to entertain aerith because he's setting up a boundary that why he changed the subject instead. He actually did the same during her gsd, when she told him that she wants to find the real him. He brought up tifa to change the subject. The opposite goes for tifa, whom he only brought up aerith because he got caught looking at her. He even slides closer to tifa before asking lol. He isn't as oblivious as everyone thinks. It's just that he's pov isn't the same as everyone else's including the audience. When he was with aerith and yuffie, the way he spoke of jessie could be seen in a different light. We only saw her flirting with cloud, yet he looked fondly at her and said that he's still waiting for that pizza. He even gazes a bit more as you walk. If that was any other girl, people would think that's a confirmation of a possibility. Much like how others think a lot to do with aerith is the same. Yet why show us that? Only to confuse us? Because it's not. It's meant to show us that cloud would still be grateful and still think of them as comrades because there is nothing that he doesn't cherish. Emphasize on that. Because this is his character development from a kid who couldn't even get in tifa's circle of friends because he was too immature and proud. This is an opportunity given to him by Tifa, the very moment she saved him that day. New people he can meet and befriend with. But I still believe that the only one he loves is Tifa, otherwise what's the point of nojima emphasizing yet again his main motivation in life (2k hero)? Their new character chart description also only highlights tifa to have a heart in her new description. Showing that cloud specifically cares for her romantically, while aerith's is left as being there for planet earth.
Tbh, there's only negatives from what I see if they pursue a romance for c/a canon or even just the idea it was ever there. CT would not have a satisfying conclusion no matter how you put it. I've read enough harems go know when a super loyal girl gets ntr'd one way or another. It's really fcked up. Plus this is tifa, a very well known and beloved female character. Even her popularity is only ever increasing right now. Also, maybe not a big deal overseas, in japan it seems it's not very wise to give spirit to sakurai's infidelity scandal. That is not how you write a FF character that represents your franchise. The same goes for ZA. Dude is crying and died to get back to her, only go be settled as second best is also fcked up. I already didn't like what happened with aerith and tifa, this whole things isn't going to help.
Anyway.. I don't think I will engage in this debate anymore and neither to this site. But I will say some things. Do take all the optional things for all characters. Not just those two. See how cloud reacts, what kind of person is he? During the rosa play, the way he twirls the three girls are all different. And I assume cloud is the type to be aggressive as a lover, at least this is what he wants to, heck we even get him being called a perv by yuffie for fantasizing tifa being cloned. Maybe this is the real him and jenova is just his liquid courage. But....
Does he do the same for aerith?
1) No, her worst dress indicates something else. Much like her red dress is edited very interestingly yo show an illusion (sigh.. too tired to explain, just take all options into account and see the real context). Same goes for her performance, it's not really her, it's technology.
2) doesn't hug her tight in her dream. That's why she can get out of it very easily. And that's why it's also easy for him to hug her back because unlike tifa whom he needs courage, he only thinks of aerith in a platonic light.
3) also doesn't kiss her. Because why? The thought never entered his mind.
4) did not hug her in her gsd to comfort her, instead he took her arms away skin to skin so what he would do is that she comes in contact with his gloves instead. Something he can settle with. As he comforts her as she misses Zack. Cloud knows that.
5) man, I'm too tired. To write all of them down. But there's just so much counterpoints that tell me at least that he doesn't think of her that way at all. It is YOU the player who thinks so. Not without the fault of SE anyway. Like that thing at the end where she leans on way too closely to his face and he laughs. It's really weird. Doesn't help sena gave them a "promise" line when in jp it doesn't exist at all. That's only for CT and ZA. But even that scene has a counterpoint. During CT's almost kiss in gongaga, cloud actually goes forward with his eyes looking down to her lips. The one with aerith, has cloud lean a bit back due to the shock and then laugh. He never looks at her lips, no, not at all. Neither does he ever want to touch her without any reason to (like to comfort), unlike with how touchy he is with Tifa.
Like does cloud treat aerith differently compared to his other friends? Or do you think he wouldn't do the same for anybody dying in his party who was told he was supposed to protect? Because to fail that, is to fail being a hero, and therefore cannot be special to tifa (2k hero).
Like go look at them. See the difference. See how he reacts to everyone. Cloud loves his friends very much but it's obvious he treats the woman he loves differently. I'm sure aerith spending too much time (all those "dates") and even be given like at least 4 farewells. Should at least spark interest from cloud by then, but just like jessie who's also very forward. He doesn't actually waver now does he? Add to that fact that Toriyama says real cloud shows up only when he is with Tifa.
Cloud strife is a character whose actions speak louder than words and this goes well for Tifa's iconic line in the HW.
There will be no world where all three become canon pairings because nojima says they go back to where they belong. CT and ZA. In advent children. This theory about cloud saving aerith is also pointless because not only will that fail, it is also a huge waste of storyline for part 3. And that should be bigger than Rebirth's portion. Because also, why else would he ask for forgiveness in ACC if he succeeded. In any case, ACC is heavily misinterpreted as well but I'm too tired to talk about that. All I can say is, adding an element that c/ a is romantic no matter how small, does nothing but muddy up the coherency of the story.
Sigh, SE even goes out of their way to post a picture about friends supporting friends with c/ a highfive (familiar right? Hand related platonic stuff). The framing of her death is very close with sonon and melphie, two siblings. That pose they do at the end is an AC reference , that also references Zack's position. With a handhold, that is done platonic in her gsd (as ive mentioned before).
The only thing I hate about SE is that they tell us that they are friends but give us shots that look like baits. It's simple really, just as how they're chill with SENA being unprofessional. They want to have their cake and eat it too. That's it. But all it does is make me feel uncomfortable with that dynamic and make those two look like assholes. Especially to those who won't look too much further with the details like the stuff I just shared.
Anyway, this is a long post. Couldn't say everything. I'm only referring to everything in the compilation and game. I'm not referring to real life experiences. Just trying to observe what I see. Like wow, at least fullmetal panic's author is concerned for their work as well as Macross franchise (retcon movies).... can't say about SE. Sigh..
I didn't recheck this. So if my grammar etc is weird sorry. I'm just frustrated because I can taste a storm brewing and I hate that a lot. But I don't want to panic myself for years till part 3 arrives. All I know is that whatever that is given to us. Is given to us to see that he is not in love in any way with aerith. She is the female counterpart of Zack in his story. That's all I'm saying. So anybody who doesn't agree with that you do you. I know of cody's quote, it could mean very very many things and not just what you guys have interpreted it to be.
Bye! Enjoy your stay in the LTD.
So when she held his hand like that, which I think she's actually trying to recreate zack here but can't get it from cloud because he too doesn't consent to this because he's in love with tifa, not her. It just makes cloud go along with her because he thinks she's acting really weird. He's worried, he's being a friend.
That by itself already shows you that seeing aerith as a romantic option has not entered his mind at all. To see it is to entertain it, and to ponder it. But it really looks like he gets caught of guard with her a lot because he treats her as a friend, but she's flirting with him and wanting more. Hence why her confession, because ngl that is a confession one way or around. Makes cloud only uncomfortable.
If you take tifa's date in mind, you'll know cloud isn't dense at all. And doesn't want to entertain aerith because he's setting up a boundary that why he changed the subject instead. He actually did the same during her gsd, when she told him that she wants to find the real him. He brought up tifa to change the subject. The opposite goes for tifa, whom he only brought up aerith because he got caught looking at her. He even slides closer to tifa before asking lol. He isn't as oblivious as everyone thinks. It's just that he's pov isn't the same as everyone else's including the audience. When he was with aerith and yuffie, the way he spoke of jessie could be seen in a different light. We only saw her flirting with cloud, yet he looked fondly at her and said that he's still waiting for that pizza. He even gazes a bit more as you walk. If that was any other girl, people would think that's a confirmation of a possibility. Much like how others think a lot to do with aerith is the same. Yet why show us that? Only to confuse us? Because it's not. It's meant to show us that cloud would still be grateful and still think of them as comrades because there is nothing that he doesn't cherish. Emphasize on that. Because this is his character development from a kid who couldn't even get in tifa's circle of friends because he was too immature and proud. This is an opportunity given to him by Tifa, the very moment she saved him that day. New people he can meet and befriend with. But I still believe that the only one he loves is Tifa, otherwise what's the point of nojima emphasizing yet again his main motivation in life (2k hero)? Their new character chart description also only highlights tifa to have a heart in her new description. Showing that cloud specifically cares for her romantically, while aerith's is left as being there for planet earth.
Tbh, there's only negatives from what I see if they pursue a romance for c/a canon or even just the idea it was ever there. CT would not have a satisfying conclusion no matter how you put it. I've read enough harems go know when a super loyal girl gets ntr'd one way or another. It's really fcked up. Plus this is tifa, a very well known and beloved female character. Even her popularity is only ever increasing right now. Also, maybe not a big deal overseas, in japan it seems it's not very wise to give spirit to sakurai's infidelity scandal. That is not how you write a FF character that represents your franchise. The same goes for ZA. Dude is crying and died to get back to her, only go be settled as second best is also fcked up. I already didn't like what happened with aerith and tifa, this whole things isn't going to help.
Anyway.. I don't think I will engage in this debate anymore and neither to this site. But I will say some things. Do take all the optional things for all characters. Not just those two. See how cloud reacts, what kind of person is he? During the rosa play, the way he twirls the three girls are all different. And I assume cloud is the type to be aggressive as a lover, at least this is what he wants to, heck we even get him being called a perv by yuffie for fantasizing tifa being cloned. Maybe this is the real him and jenova is just his liquid courage. But....
Does he do the same for aerith?
1) No, her worst dress indicates something else. Much like her red dress is edited very interestingly yo show an illusion (sigh.. too tired to explain, just take all options into account and see the real context). Same goes for her performance, it's not really her, it's technology.
2) doesn't hug her tight in her dream. That's why she can get out of it very easily. And that's why it's also easy for him to hug her back because unlike tifa whom he needs courage, he only thinks of aerith in a platonic light.
3) also doesn't kiss her. Because why? The thought never entered his mind.
4) did not hug her in her gsd to comfort her, instead he took her arms away skin to skin so what he would do is that she comes in contact with his gloves instead. Something he can settle with. As he comforts her as she misses Zack. Cloud knows that.
5) man, I'm too tired. To write all of them down. But there's just so much counterpoints that tell me at least that he doesn't think of her that way at all. It is YOU the player who thinks so. Not without the fault of SE anyway. Like that thing at the end where she leans on way too closely to his face and he laughs. It's really weird. Doesn't help sena gave them a "promise" line when in jp it doesn't exist at all. That's only for CT and ZA. But even that scene has a counterpoint. During CT's almost kiss in gongaga, cloud actually goes forward with his eyes looking down to her lips. The one with aerith, has cloud lean a bit back due to the shock and then laugh. He never looks at her lips, no, not at all. Neither does he ever want to touch her without any reason to (like to comfort), unlike with how touchy he is with Tifa.
Like does cloud treat aerith differently compared to his other friends? Or do you think he wouldn't do the same for anybody dying in his party who was told he was supposed to protect? Because to fail that, is to fail being a hero, and therefore cannot be special to tifa (2k hero).
Like go look at them. See the difference. See how he reacts to everyone. Cloud loves his friends very much but it's obvious he treats the woman he loves differently. I'm sure aerith spending too much time (all those "dates") and even be given like at least 4 farewells. Should at least spark interest from cloud by then, but just like jessie who's also very forward. He doesn't actually waver now does he? Add to that fact that Toriyama says real cloud shows up only when he is with Tifa.
Cloud strife is a character whose actions speak louder than words and this goes well for Tifa's iconic line in the HW.
There will be no world where all three become canon pairings because nojima says they go back to where they belong. CT and ZA. In advent children. This theory about cloud saving aerith is also pointless because not only will that fail, it is also a huge waste of storyline for part 3. And that should be bigger than Rebirth's portion. Because also, why else would he ask for forgiveness in ACC if he succeeded. In any case, ACC is heavily misinterpreted as well but I'm too tired to talk about that. All I can say is, adding an element that c/ a is romantic no matter how small, does nothing but muddy up the coherency of the story.
Sigh, SE even goes out of their way to post a picture about friends supporting friends with c/ a highfive (familiar right? Hand related platonic stuff). The framing of her death is very close with sonon and melphie, two siblings. That pose they do at the end is an AC reference , that also references Zack's position. With a handhold, that is done platonic in her gsd (as ive mentioned before).
The only thing I hate about SE is that they tell us that they are friends but give us shots that look like baits. It's simple really, just as how they're chill with SENA being unprofessional. They want to have their cake and eat it too. That's it. But all it does is make me feel uncomfortable with that dynamic and make those two look like assholes. Especially to those who won't look too much further with the details like the stuff I just shared.
Anyway, this is a long post. Couldn't say everything. I'm only referring to everything in the compilation and game. I'm not referring to real life experiences. Just trying to observe what I see. Like wow, at least fullmetal panic's author is concerned for their work as well as Macross franchise (retcon movies).... can't say about SE. Sigh..
I didn't recheck this. So if my grammar etc is weird sorry. I'm just frustrated because I can taste a storm brewing and I hate that a lot. But I don't want to panic myself for years till part 3 arrives. All I know is that whatever that is given to us. Is given to us to see that he is not in love in any way with aerith. She is the female counterpart of Zack in his story. That's all I'm saying. So anybody who doesn't agree with that you do you. I know of cody's quote, it could mean very very many things and not just what you guys have interpreted it to be.
Bye! Enjoy your stay in the LTD.
AncientGrimoire
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Grim
To read and interpret things as romantic, if that makes the scenes and story of Cloud and Aerith in Rebirth meaningful to you, then that’s something nobody should have the right to dispel for you. Regardless of whether you do or don’t, there story is beautiful, it’s nuanced, and is very important.
You have to feel something for Aerith, so when she goes, her absence is felt.
But! I can already tell the conversations that are going to be had between now and Part 3 are potentially going to be more fraught than they were waiting between Remake and Rebirth.
Because while interpreting the story as it now exists in Rebirth is one thing, trying to convince yourself and others that Rebirth confirms that Part 3 is going to have Aerith be brought back and together with Cloud is wilfully wanting the story to do the biggest disservice to Cloud himself, but especially to Tifa and Zack. Not to mention the story and themes.
There is no way Cloud and Aerith being together as is so strongly campaigned for by some, ends with Tifa and Zack’s storylines being concluded. Zack’s more than Tifa’s really, because acknowledging that in the five years where he wasn’t there Aerith was able to develop feelings for someone else, even that someone else being Cloud, that’s all one fine and doesn’t do anything to fail Zack or even Aerith as characters, but there is no way Zack’s story ends with him either dying again, or seeing Cloud and Aerith walk off into the sunset together. He wouldn’t accept death again, when he died in the first place trying to get back to Aerith. And it’s not him letting Cloud being his living legacy as that line and the motivation behind it (and how Cloud himself acts on it) has nothing to do with Aerith.
Honestly it would just be so bad to Zack, it would ruin and make his story and in the worse possible way, and take all the impact and sorrow that was felt from his original last stand. And sadly it would just serve to make Aerith look like an awful person, for choosing to be with Cloud when Zack (either alive, or in the Lifestream) did all he did and more trying to get back to her, and then taking care of her when he found her.
So to want Cloud and Aerith as endgame, is to want all of the above for the story.
Interpret things how you want, but don’t actively seek for the grander story to be completely derailed for your ship.
Because at the end of the day, Cloud and Tifa being together at the end doesn’t have any of the sorts of character and story problems that Cloud and Aerith being together would have, and that isn’t open to interpretation. That’s the story of Final Fantasy VII, and despite Remake and Rebirth’s endings exploring new ideas and concepts, they all end at the same point they did in the original. Exactly the same.
Yes, I believe Part 3’s ending will be significantly different given it has to conclude the story, but also all the new narrative threads they’ve introduced. But I believe the characters will have the same endings they did in the original, just hopefully more fleshed out.
Zack is here now for one, so the story isn’t going to just end with Cloud remembering who he is and we get the flashback to his last stand. I do believe Zack will die again in the end, because I believe his story does and should end in the Lifestream, and yes with Aerith. Because if Advent Children is still where we are leading to, then Aerith and Zack being in the Lifestream together is essential for that to take place, and for Cloud’s characterisation to be what it is in that film. If either Aerith or Zack are left alive at Part 3’s end, what is there for him to resolve guilt wise?
Really, them saying repeatedly about Advent Children linking up to the Remake trilogy, and then even having screenings of the film before Rebirth, should have been the biggest indication of the fact (that they also have repeatedly said) that the trilogy will not veer off course in a way that doesn’t see us where we end up in Advent Children.
And to accept that as fact, you accept that any reunion of sorts between Cloud and Aerith will be one of a similar kind to how it was presented in Advent Children
You have to feel something for Aerith, so when she goes, her absence is felt.
But! I can already tell the conversations that are going to be had between now and Part 3 are potentially going to be more fraught than they were waiting between Remake and Rebirth.
Because while interpreting the story as it now exists in Rebirth is one thing, trying to convince yourself and others that Rebirth confirms that Part 3 is going to have Aerith be brought back and together with Cloud is wilfully wanting the story to do the biggest disservice to Cloud himself, but especially to Tifa and Zack. Not to mention the story and themes.
There is no way Cloud and Aerith being together as is so strongly campaigned for by some, ends with Tifa and Zack’s storylines being concluded. Zack’s more than Tifa’s really, because acknowledging that in the five years where he wasn’t there Aerith was able to develop feelings for someone else, even that someone else being Cloud, that’s all one fine and doesn’t do anything to fail Zack or even Aerith as characters, but there is no way Zack’s story ends with him either dying again, or seeing Cloud and Aerith walk off into the sunset together. He wouldn’t accept death again, when he died in the first place trying to get back to Aerith. And it’s not him letting Cloud being his living legacy as that line and the motivation behind it (and how Cloud himself acts on it) has nothing to do with Aerith.
Honestly it would just be so bad to Zack, it would ruin and make his story and in the worse possible way, and take all the impact and sorrow that was felt from his original last stand. And sadly it would just serve to make Aerith look like an awful person, for choosing to be with Cloud when Zack (either alive, or in the Lifestream) did all he did and more trying to get back to her, and then taking care of her when he found her.
So to want Cloud and Aerith as endgame, is to want all of the above for the story.
Interpret things how you want, but don’t actively seek for the grander story to be completely derailed for your ship.
Because at the end of the day, Cloud and Tifa being together at the end doesn’t have any of the sorts of character and story problems that Cloud and Aerith being together would have, and that isn’t open to interpretation. That’s the story of Final Fantasy VII, and despite Remake and Rebirth’s endings exploring new ideas and concepts, they all end at the same point they did in the original. Exactly the same.
In Remake, like in the original, Cloud and the party resolve to leave Midgar and pursue Sephiroth. And in Rebirth, Cloud and the party resolve to continue their pursuit of Sephiroth as he heads north, and they are seeing having left the Forgotten Capital to do just that.
Yes, I believe Part 3’s ending will be significantly different given it has to conclude the story, but also all the new narrative threads they’ve introduced. But I believe the characters will have the same endings they did in the original, just hopefully more fleshed out.
Zack is here now for one, so the story isn’t going to just end with Cloud remembering who he is and we get the flashback to his last stand. I do believe Zack will die again in the end, because I believe his story does and should end in the Lifestream, and yes with Aerith. Because if Advent Children is still where we are leading to, then Aerith and Zack being in the Lifestream together is essential for that to take place, and for Cloud’s characterisation to be what it is in that film. If either Aerith or Zack are left alive at Part 3’s end, what is there for him to resolve guilt wise?
Really, them saying repeatedly about Advent Children linking up to the Remake trilogy, and then even having screenings of the film before Rebirth, should have been the biggest indication of the fact (that they also have repeatedly said) that the trilogy will not veer off course in a way that doesn’t see us where we end up in Advent Children.
And to accept that as fact, you accept that any reunion of sorts between Cloud and Aerith will be one of a similar kind to how it was presented in Advent Children
Despite ALL of what I’ve just said, the fact in Rebirth, we get like FOUR farewells between Cloud and Aerith, including one very heavily inspired by Advent Children, makes me question just how much Aerith is going to be in Part 3, even in a spiritual capacity.
Some of it they could have saved for Part 3, because it was honestly kind of disruptive to have Cloud and Aerith go back and forth between parting just for Aerith to pop back again and them go through the whole song and dance again like another five times.
Like she Lifestream fades away, then she’s back and then doesn’t fade away, but she says goodbye at the end, it didn’t have very good pacing.
This more than her death and the scene itself minimised a lot of the impact for me. I get a lot of the why, as it’s Cloud’s point of view and it’s in keeping with how traumatic Zack’s death was for him. So it serves Cloud’s character at a disservice to Aerith unfortunately, given this was her most important scene.
Some of it they could have saved for Part 3, because it was honestly kind of disruptive to have Cloud and Aerith go back and forth between parting just for Aerith to pop back again and them go through the whole song and dance again like another five times.
Like she Lifestream fades away, then she’s back and then doesn’t fade away, but she says goodbye at the end, it didn’t have very good pacing.
This more than her death and the scene itself minimised a lot of the impact for me. I get a lot of the why, as it’s Cloud’s point of view and it’s in keeping with how traumatic Zack’s death was for him. So it serves Cloud’s character at a disservice to Aerith unfortunately, given this was her most important scene.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
For me, in any fandom I only do serious shipping for canon pair or semi canon like when one character is genuinely feeling for another character. Well for me there is difference between serious shipping and not anyway.
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
I always find these songs sooo hard to interpret and connect with the actual story
People extensively discussed "Hollow" in the past, debating whether it was about Zack, Aerith, or Cloud losing himself, only for it to be connected to Zack in Rebirth (whihc, imo, doesn't disprove the notion that the song can be about all that I mentioned above or about loss in general). The same applies to NPTK. If I analyzed the lyrics alone, with no knowledge of where it plays in the game, I would never connect it to Cloud, as the church is, in reality, Zack and Aerith's spot, and the person she made a promise to meet up with again was, well, Zack too. However, the song is (written and) played in the GS and Sector 5 date, so it's a fair interpretation that it also connects to Cloud. Once again, It's very unclear to me if we should take the song in as per lyrics (Zack), where it plays (Cloud), or see it more as a homage to both of them?
Anyways, I find it super hard to understand these songs, so usually turn my brain off when it comes to analysing it, lol
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- thetriplerhyme
Question! I'm still yet to play rebirth a week from now. ( I dont mind spoilers)
I'm gonna post it here since it concerns Cloud and Aerith.
I appreciate if someone will answer i'm just really curious
I'm gonna post it here since it concerns Cloud and Aerith.
I saw Cait Sith predictions on Cloud fate
"Seek and you will sure to find but alas you shall forever lose what you cherish most"
But the Cloud and Aerith prediction in OG where Aerith herself ask it to Cait Sith
- i wish SE remove this actually this is one of main reasons i dislike OG Aerith its a bit insensitive
"Seek and you will sure to find but alas you shall forever lose what you cherish most"
But the Cloud and Aerith prediction in OG where Aerith herself ask it to Cait Sith
- i wish SE remove this actually this is one of main reasons i dislike OG Aerith its a bit insensitive
I appreciate if someone will answer i'm just really curious
AncientGrimoire
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Grim
Question! I'm still yet to play rebirth a week from now. ( I dont mind spoilers)
I'm gonna post it here since it concerns Cloud and Aerith.
I saw Cait Sith predictions on Cloud fate
"Seek and you will sure to find but alas you shall forever lose what you cherish most"
But the Cloud and Aerith prediction in OG where Aerith herself ask it to Cait Sith
- i wish SE remove this actually this is one of main reasons i dislike OG Aerith its a bit insensitive
I appreciate if someone will answer i'm just really curious
Another reference to Advent Children
I haven’t seen the Cait Sith prediction yet, but the line about Cloud losing what he cherishes most is a reference to this exchange between Cloud and Sephiroth in Advent Children
Sephiroth: “Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away.”
Cloud: “I pity you. You just don't get it at all. There's not a thing I don't cherish!”
Of course I don’t need to be a fortune telling robotic cat toy to be able to predict which subset of the fandom is going to take the Cait Sith prediction in Rebirth as evidence Cloud and Aerith are canon/Cloud loves Aerith and she is what he cherishes most
Sephiroth: “Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away.”
Cloud: “I pity you. You just don't get it at all. There's not a thing I don't cherish!”
Of course I don’t need to be a fortune telling robotic cat toy to be able to predict which subset of the fandom is going to take the Cait Sith prediction in Rebirth as evidence Cloud and Aerith are canon/Cloud loves Aerith and she is what he cherishes most
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- thetriplerhyme
Another reference to Advent Children
I haven’t seen the Cait Sith prediction yet, but the line about Cloud losing what he cherishes most is a reference to this exchange between Cloud and Sephiroth in Advent Children
Sephiroth: “Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away.”
Cloud: “I pity you. You just don't get it at all. There's not a thing I don't cherish!”
Of course I don’t need to be a fortune telling robotic cat toy to be able to predict which subset of the fandom is going to take the Cait Sith prediction in Rebirth as evidence Cloud and Aerith are canon/Cloud loves Aerith and she is what he cherishes most
I can argue ( for a while ) on any claim by CA as hardcore cloti but not cait sith prediction as evidence
COME ON~ a shinra spy and literal fraud - if this confirmed remove ( the CA PREDICTION)
THAAAANK YOU!
I dont wanna look Aerith horrible hearing briana say those words
Btw Cait Sith predictions in OG is CA has bright future and perfect for each other - if you didn't feel how ominous that is an obvious lie by a robotic cat / shinra spy
- because two days after that Aerith literally dies.
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AncientGrimoire
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Saw this bit in Costa del Sol
Aerith “You’re no fun at all today. Well, for the record, I am treating this as a date!”
Cloud “I wish you wouldn’t…”
Kind of sad that the only one going on dates is Aerith. Cloud just isn’t dating her.
And this is early in the game, before all the Sector 5 stuff.
Maybe the devs saw all the copium from a lot of very extreme Cloud and Aerith shippers and thought let’s make Aerith huff the most copium of all jk
Not sure how I feel about them having leaned so hard into this for Aerith. I know she lost her memories so she’s essentially reverted back to OG Aerith. But even OG Aerith didn’t act quite like how Rebirth Aerith is. It’ll be interesting to see how the general audience reacts to it all and what the overall consensus on it is.
Aerith “You’re no fun at all today. Well, for the record, I am treating this as a date!”
Cloud “I wish you wouldn’t…”
Kind of sad that the only one going on dates is Aerith. Cloud just isn’t dating her.
And this is early in the game, before all the Sector 5 stuff.
Maybe the devs saw all the copium from a lot of very extreme Cloud and Aerith shippers and thought let’s make Aerith huff the most copium of all jk
Not sure how I feel about them having leaned so hard into this for Aerith. I know she lost her memories so she’s essentially reverted back to OG Aerith. But even OG Aerith didn’t act quite like how Rebirth Aerith is. It’ll be interesting to see how the general audience reacts to it all and what the overall consensus on it is.
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Personally, I always interpret these moments as cute banter between them.
Aerith is just obnoxiously flirtatious at times, it's part of her character. She even calls her and Tifa's quest a 'date,' so it's pretty much her just being herself. Honestly, that makes the Sector 5 dream date even more bittersweet because even though Cloud is fairly used to her dragging him around for 'dates,' he was able to notice that something was off in that particular one.
Ruri
Pro Adventurer
I enjoy this for the health of the argument that states "He would have picked Aerith if she was alive!" well, according to Rebirth, Aerith has handed Cloud multiple dates for him to get struck by lightning over this and I don't think Cloud held up his end of that argument and I'm so glad for it to die now. The cherry on top is the Tifa date where she backs off in contrast, as she is akin to do with Cloud, and as someone so eloquently stated in this thread, quite far back, "simp jumps her"
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AncientGrimoire
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Yeah Aerith does nearly all the pushing, and just doesn’t get anything back from Cloud. Nothing anyway that expresses interest or intent. Concern maybe, more over her emotional state regarding Zack. But Aerith is always the one to grab Cloud by the arm to drag him along for stuff. Contrast that with Tifa’s first Gold Saucer date where she takes Cloud’s hand. They both just seem more on the same page, respectively.
And yes aside from that one small moment I mentioned with Tifa, the other times where she very tentatively pushes things with Cloud, even though true to her name of Lockhart she nearly always retreats back, Cloud will step forward, very boldly in this case. He pushes things forward too.
He just doesn’t do that with Aerith.
They have that emotional connectivity. There is very real care and concern. But there just isn’t that physical connection or closeness, not from Cloud anyway. I believe the one time he initiates anything, is to remove Aerith’s hand from his arm to instead hold her hand.
He removes the whole “shoulder to lean on” aspect, to instead convey an expression that while yes can be read romantically, to me suggest more Cloud is trying to say that he is there for Aerith. Holding her hand here, and repeated again later on when Aerith takes his hand in a way that finally shows they’re on the same page about where they stand conveys the development of their relationship really beautifully.
Hix
Pro Adventurer
Personally, I always interpret these moments as cute banter between them.
Yeah that was my take from this too, just Aerith doing Aerith things, I think she's mostly teasing.
I'd suggest it's more overt than OG this time round because they are emphasizing the differences between Cloud/Aerith's relationship and Zack/Aerith's.
In Crisis Core you see Zack and Aerith flirting and teasing continuously, back and forward, throughout the game. It starts within a few minutes of them meeting and becomes the spark of their relationship, from which blossoms love and support for each other.
On the other hand we have Cloud who isn't really interested in flirting - note that his "beautiful" remark to Tifa in Remake stands out all the moreso for this reason - or teasing or dates etc. It's just not the same.
I think that the Devs did this intentionally as part of the build up to the Sector 5 date when Aerith gets closure on her feelings, as discussed before.
Looks like the JP version of Aerith’s line to Cloud about liking and liking someone is more ambiguous. She says: この好きは どの好さなんだろう
Which translates to “I wonder what kind of like/love this is?“ So the intention of the original line is left more ambiguous as to whether or not Aerith likes Cloud romantically.
I was wrong to base my interpretation on SENA’s translation. I still think this is a solid conclusion to satiate both Zerith/Clerith shippers since people who favor Cloud and Aerith can argue that they could have gotten together if they had more time while Zack and Aerith shippers can say that Aerith couldn’t replace Zack with Cloud.
Which translates to “I wonder what kind of like/love this is?“ So the intention of the original line is left more ambiguous as to whether or not Aerith likes Cloud romantically.
I was wrong to base my interpretation on SENA’s translation. I still think this is a solid conclusion to satiate both Zerith/Clerith shippers since people who favor Cloud and Aerith can argue that they could have gotten together if they had more time while Zack and Aerith shippers can say that Aerith couldn’t replace Zack with Cloud.
So the lines for Aerith and Cloud’s church scene for HA are as follows in JP (tried my best to translate but I’m not a native speaker so please correct me if theres another interpretation):
A: 思い出 少ないからね (We don’t have many memories [together])
C: これから 作ればいい (From now on, we can make more)
A: それ 本心? (Is that true?)
C: ああ もちろん (Yea, of course)
A: クラウドの気持ち 聞けてよかった (I’m glad to hear about Cloud’s feelings)
A: わたしは クラウドが好き (I like Cloud)
A: でも 好きにも 色々あるよね (But, “like” can mean a lot of things)
A: この好きは どの好さなんだろう (I wonder what kind of like this is)
C: エアリス 変だそ (Aerith, you’re being weird)
C: これから 作ればいい (From now on, we can make more)
A: それ 本心? (Is that true?)
C: ああ もちろん (Yea, of course)
A: クラウドの気持ち 聞けてよかった (I’m glad to hear about Cloud’s feelings)
A: わたしは クラウドが好き (I like Cloud)
A: でも 好きにも 色々あるよね (But, “like” can mean a lot of things)
A: この好きは どの好さなんだろう (I wonder what kind of like this is)
C: エアリス 変だそ (Aerith, you’re being weird)
starcape91
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Sounds like Cloud is clueless and Aerith is confused.
Also: I’m finally getting to play and I’m still in Chapter 2. Even if Aerith isn’t in my party she did 90% of the talking at the Chocobo Ranch. Is this true for every location you visit? Is she the only one who gets special outings at each location? It’s a bit jarring because she isn’t in my party and then when I talk to someone BAM she just appears.
I believe that, for every character, if you start a side quest that’s related to them, they appear next to you and talk with the Clients. It’s the same for all the other side quests. Like if Red XIII isn’t in my party but I start a side quest that has him as the main companio, he appears next to me in the cutscenes. Every character has side questions or side convos related to them at each location.
AncientGrimoire
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Has the whole high or low affinity for that scene actually been shown or proven yet because everywhere it’s been shown it’s the exact same dialogue each time.
starcape91
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Gotcha. Thanks!
It has been. I’m not sure of the exact mechanics but when Aerith asks to clarify what he means by “next time,” Cloud either says in English “Yea, why not” or “Yeah. Next time” depending on your affinity with Aerith. Depending in the line, Aerith either becomes immediately dejected or momentarily happy then dejected.
In JP the lines are either: “Yea because we are Nakama” vs “Yea of course.”
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
I’ll be honest, Zack’s return throws a huge wrench into Clerith… despite what Marlene says.
From an out of game, meta perspective, bringing Zack back and making it obvious how much he wants to reunite with Aerith is going to have a payoff. The writers would not go through this trouble only to make his fans be disappointed.
It would be like doing a Final Fantasy X-3 game but not having Tidus and Yuna interact at all.
From an out of game, meta perspective, bringing Zack back and making it obvious how much he wants to reunite with Aerith is going to have a payoff. The writers would not go through this trouble only to make his fans be disappointed.
It would be like doing a Final Fantasy X-3 game but not having Tidus and Yuna interact at all.
Agreed. Like I wrote,
I really hope the Cloud and Aerith church scene serves as a bookend to their relationship since it satiates both Zerith/Clerith shippers. If Zack and Aerith have a romantic reunion in Part 3, people who favor Cloud and Aerith can argue that they could have fallen in love if they had more time while Zack and Aerith shippers can say that Aerith could never replace Zack with Cloud since her “confession” to Cloud, even with MAX Affection, is her telling him that she’s confused about her feelings.
Empyrea
Pro Adventurer
That would indeed be a nice way to appease both sides. It should be fine as long as it all makes sense, imo.
That said, it continues to confuse me why some people need their ships to be canon. Fanon exists, and barring that, AUs aren't that wild of a concept, either.
Just write your fanfic or look for someone who did xP I know I've done both before, but maybe that's just me.
Edit: Some elaborations.
That said, it continues to confuse me why some people need their ships to be canon. Fanon exists, and barring that, AUs aren't that wild of a concept, either.
Just write your fanfic or look for someone who did xP I know I've done both before, but maybe that's just me.
Edit: Some elaborations.
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Maidenofwar
They/Them
About that ...