SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
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gulava
Lv. 25 Adventurer
while im fond of CA; the fans have a very polarizing interpretation of cloud’s dynamic with aerith and tifa.
they claim aerith deserves to move on from her dead lover, but cloud can never move on. And aerith is supposedly cloud’s true love whom he wants to reunite with in the afterlife, so he is only passing time smooshing her replacement, aka tifa (even tho aerith is the only woman in his heart).
And on top of that; the funniest of all, cloud kissed tifa in GS cause he felt sorry for her?? but not aerith his true love
I think it is hilarious when people using end credits to arguing about whether a scene is canon or not. It’s a RPg game, you can consider all scene canon, it just shows you different reaction Cloud will give to different people.
Some input after spending 70 hours doing side quests and beat the game, and planning to platinum the game: there is a trophy for Jonny’s inn, where you need to collect things in the game. Even though you brought Tifa to the date, you will also get the reward for Aerith. In a sense, Aerith’s date is the only date you don’t have to see if you want to be a completionist.
Some input after spending 70 hours doing side quests and beat the game, and planning to platinum the game: there is a trophy for Jonny’s inn, where you need to collect things in the game. Even though you brought Tifa to the date, you will also get the reward for Aerith. In a sense, Aerith’s date is the only date you don’t have to see if you want to be a completionist.
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
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- thetriplerhyme
- I'm disgusted on these claims too sorry if there's any CA here..
- Zerith fans can almost understand if Aerith moves on ( I get that ) but CA fans who wanted cloud to die or saying he's looking for promised land that never there seriously ~
Cloud's promise land is with his family in ACC
r_monk
Pro Adventurer
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- RM
I forget the exact wording, but Aerith just very recently said something along the lines of "cherish every moment" or "every moment matters." Live in the present, rather than wallow in the past. Appreciate every moment you share with the people you love rather than squander the gift of life in the shadow of grief.
This is what made/makes her death so affecting, and it's such a simple, wise lesson. Weird how some of the more extreme CAs refuse to take Aerith at her own word.
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Thanks a lot for your input @JaeKony
Good point! Even though "That's right" and "Maybe" are fairly different words, within the context of the scene and the overall plot of the game, the message still comes across the same i.e she's confused. This was probably the objective the localization team wanted to get across in the end.
Regarding the localization controversy, I mean, they could be pushing an agenda just to keep the topic alive (definitely not the first time it has happened, lol), but I like to believe there's no benefit in doing that. All these very different interpretations are probably them just trying to convey the message within the context of the whole game (as they did in the example above) and failing miserably at it sometimes
Regarding the localization controversy, I mean, they could be pushing an agenda just to keep the topic alive (definitely not the first time it has happened, lol), but I like to believe there's no benefit in doing that. All these very different interpretations are probably them just trying to convey the message within the context of the whole game (as they did in the example above) and failing miserably at it sometimes
gulava
Lv. 25 Adventurer
i learned my lesson from KH
I love rokunami so when they included them in 2.8 credits i was overjoyed but then kh3 happened lol
faefolk
Pro Adventurer
Eh, I don't think saying you don't particularly like her character is an attempt to prove your ship haha. I acknowledge Aerith has a special bond with Cloud - she still irritates me as a character outside of that. I would be equally annoyed by Yuffie if she wasn't sixteen.. but I give her a pass because she acts appropriately for a sixteen year old haha.
gulava
Lv. 25 Adventurer
character’s likeability is completely subjective and each to their own, but what i do not personally understand is fans who go out of their way to misinterpret her character and present her as a vile person, similarity to how tifa antis portray her as a manipulator liar
starcape91
Pro Adventurer
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- starcape91
Anyone run into Jenny in Costa del Sol? She’s sort of the embodiment of some of the more hardcore CA fans lol
shady
Pro Adventurer
I'm not sure how anyone can argue who Cloud does or doesn't love -- it's my understanding since the OG not one piece of media related to FF7 that is official has ever stated Cloud is in love with Aerith. Feel free to correct me if i'm wrong and i'm missing something here.
Aside from Maiden Who Travels the Planet (not even remotely canon i'm sorry) there may be tentative links to Aerith being in love with Cloud depending on who you ask, what's translated etc right? But again there's never been a true declaration of being in love has there?
shady
Pro Adventurer
There are the kind of arguments that get presented by the way, like this is how far people have fallen down this hole because they've never truly addressed this LTD situation properly, and seemingly refuse to. There was discourse again yesterday that Cloud in AC is just waiting to die to be with Aerith because Tifa says that "A memory or us" line.
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
The absolute cope.
If you’re gonna boil down Cloud’s relationship to Tifa as just lust, then I really don’t even know what to say. LOL
Like I can play this game too…. Cloud sees Aerith as a mother figure because he called her that at the end of ACC when he was on death’s door. /s
Also, let’s be real… Cloud forsaking his new family because he’s waiting to pass and be reunited with Aerith is an incredibly negative trait, There’s no way anyone on the writing team is okay with depicting that as a positive thing.
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gulava
Lv. 25 Adventurer
this is why i can not take LTD discussion seriously anymore, i have seen comments ranging from ones like this to “cloud sees tifa as a younger sister” or “tifa is cloud rebound”
reducing ff7 storyline to telenovela-esque soap opera is disingenuous and indicative of poor media literacy.
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
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- thetriplerhyme
- why i hate CA what kind of a person do they think CLOUD is?? This is not loving the character or the pair this is just to win the 'war' its a stretch on why devs deleted most of their moments.
faefolk
Pro Adventurer
Oh yeah that's fair. I've seen some extremely disturbing stuff written about both Tifa and Aerith. I definitely don't think of her as a vile person - just as someone who would irritate me if I knew her irl haha. I think she's a good person.
One thing I really hope CA fans can help me understand is what is the goal you are trying to get out of the LTD. I understand the beauty of tragic romance, but for most people for the characters they love, they will wish for a happy ending for them. Aerith ‘s fate will not change at this point, so what will Cloud get after after that? He is alive after all.
Do you wish him d*e to find Aerith in the livestream? Or just leave a lonely life without loving anyone else until his days come? Or he can love someone else but just not Tifa…?
I have been wondering about this for 2 decades, and it seems unable to get an answer out of it. And I was too tired to join the LTD or ship war or whatever it is called. Rebirth just make me to start wondering about this again.
Do you wish him d*e to find Aerith in the livestream? Or just leave a lonely life without loving anyone else until his days come? Or he can love someone else but just not Tifa…?
I have been wondering about this for 2 decades, and it seems unable to get an answer out of it. And I was too tired to join the LTD or ship war or whatever it is called. Rebirth just make me to start wondering about this again.
Someonesbunny
Lv. 25 Adventurer
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- Rabbit
So is the war over? Are we going to be home for Christmas?
The burning question of the Love Triangle Debate was "Who does Cloud Love?" and it isn't really a shipping question so much as a question of canonicity. It feels like with everything in Rebirth, we've gotten a pretty close to definitive answer, right? Because, sure, the most romantic scene between Cloud and Tifa was the "optional date," but who Cloud chooses to kiss isn't based on player choice. He only kisses Tifa, and he almost kisses her a few times besides.
Is the kiss not enough? Does he need a press conference to explain his feelings? I thought words weren't the only way...
There isn't any reason why a person who prefers the Cloud x Aerith pairing to stop shipping it, but it doesn't seem to be fair that the proof being provided as to why Cloud x Tifa isn't canon despite this and supplemental text proof is based largely on bad faith interpretations and arbitrary hand-waving.
The burning question of the Love Triangle Debate was "Who does Cloud Love?" and it isn't really a shipping question so much as a question of canonicity. It feels like with everything in Rebirth, we've gotten a pretty close to definitive answer, right? Because, sure, the most romantic scene between Cloud and Tifa was the "optional date," but who Cloud chooses to kiss isn't based on player choice. He only kisses Tifa, and he almost kisses her a few times besides.
Is the kiss not enough? Does he need a press conference to explain his feelings? I thought words weren't the only way...
There isn't any reason why a person who prefers the Cloud x Aerith pairing to stop shipping it, but it doesn't seem to be fair that the proof being provided as to why Cloud x Tifa isn't canon despite this and supplemental text proof is based largely on bad faith interpretations and arbitrary hand-waving.
GamerSkull
Pro Adventurer
A reunion in the Lifestream may be a nice idea to cling to but the problem is, they won’t be conscious in the same capacity anyway… at least not Cloud in particular so it’s kinda moot. I’ve always taken a reunion in the Lifestream to be a spiritual one separate from anything that might be tangible.
It's over for me. And I imagine many others.
If Cloud loves both girls, then Tifa wins. Tifa got a kiss.
"The kiss is optional" is cope. If you have to sit in front of a computer typing out why a kiss scene isnt canon in a jRPG where one of the major selling point is date mechanics, you've lost. Not just the shipping war, but at life in general.
luminous03
Lv. 25 Adventurer
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- Play
Can you tell us what she did or says?
thetriplerhyme
Pro Adventurer
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- thetriplerhyme
- SAME! What can you argue and besides do anyone think the devs will create a protagonist shifting from one to another? Cloud is Loyal and that's only to Tifa. Its obvious on how he treats them differently.
r_monk
Pro Adventurer
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- RM
Lmao she is just trashtalking and straight up negging Tifa to her face the whole time. Tifa, of course, is nice the entire time (too nice IMO).
Hix
Pro Adventurer
This has got to be satire, there is absolutely no way anyone has actually played or experienced even one hour of Final Fantasy VII, and/or it's supplementary media and come away with a take so utterly delusional as this.
The entire, literal story happens only because of Cloud's feelings for Tifa. Cloud's arc is shaped around it, from childhood, to adulthood, to the future and beyond. It's one of the few, enduring facets of his character - and 21 years of life - that is ever made explicit.
I have no doubt Cloud and Aerith share a very close bond, nakamas according to Cloud, but if anyone suggests it's "rare true love" after a relatively short space of time together then I'd suggest that individual doesn't actually know what love is.
You're asking too much of a CA fan I'm afraid, the ship largely sails on vibes rather than actual basis in the story or indeed anything beyond it.
I will say, the general opinion among "Cleriths" seems to be that Cloud is supposed to just be miserable now for the rest of his life (mercifully the end of ACC and Dirge show that doesn't happen) but yeah. See Aerith can be deeply in love with Zack, but she's allowed to move on - "can't live in the past" and all that - but Cloud? No Cloud has to die alone because he can't get over this girl who never even really got to know him. Don't worry, it's not supposed to make sense.
Jenny basically says she expected, after Johnny's bragging, Tifa to be something special, light up the room, be chic, but turns out she's just disappointing and bland/normal. It's all a bit more ridiculous than it sounds though cause she's literally female Johnny.