SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
- Start date
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Why would it be about Aerith, when she is still living at this point in the game? It doesn't make sense. Also, what line in the song points to Aerith? I genuine would like to know.
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Yeah, it could be that. But after I got the meaning of the song could be a reference to Zack as well, I started to interpret it more as a reference to him there, too.
Sector 5 is the part of the game where these two people who are strongly connected to him interact. It's where his presence is more felt as Aerith goes on about her memories of him when she meets Cloud.
Btw, not important to this discussion but I personally felt Hollow has a strong CC/the price of freedom soundtrack vibes.
Sasseli
~*:Newbie:*~
A lot, in fact. At least they could. Ambiguity is everywhere!
There's lines that could point to her, lines that could point to Zack, to Tifa, to his real self... it's definitely not just one of those, but everything. That's how I read it.
Final_Heaven
Pro Adventurer
It sounds like a mix of things but it depends on whether it's about one person or several people. If it's about one person then it's Aerith as she fits the whole box. If it's about several people though, that's different.
There are parts where Zack and Tifa fit.
It feels very much like a song that's extremely suited for Advent Children! Cloud though rather than Remake! Cloud.
There are parts where Zack and Tifa fit.
It feels very much like a song that's extremely suited for Advent Children! Cloud though rather than Remake! Cloud.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
One thing is Cloud has already had a flashback (flashforward?) while in the church to Aerith's altar scene, Aerith hasn't died yet … or did she? 
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Alright, let me put it this way, if you take all ships and sink them. What do you have then?
Please don't get me wrong. I am actually neutral on this. I am not pushing any ship at all. I don't think it was designed to be a ship song at all. It is about the emotional roller coaster that Cloud is on and what he has been through up to this point in the Remake. That is all I am saying.
That is what is great about having different opinions about things. People can look at something in a different way than the others and that doesn't mean that the other way is wrong.
Please don't get me wrong. I am actually neutral on this. I am not pushing any ship at all. I don't think it was designed to be a ship song at all. It is about the emotional roller coaster that Cloud is on and what he has been through up to this point in the Remake. That is all I am saying.
That is what is great about having different opinions about things. People can look at something in a different way than the others and that doesn't mean that the other way is wrong.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
Honestly it feels like this too, Materwelonz noticed that it was a very nostalgic tune (she didn't know it was the game's main theme since she hadn't reached the end yet), and there are flashes of the future where Aerith dies and Cloud cries, sooooooo, to me it fits most Aerith. I'm not too fond of it because it indeed feels too much like AC:C!Cloud, and honestly I'm fed up with that image of Cloud, I want to play the Remake to get Cloud as he was in the OG, not as he was in AC:C
MasterMoogle
Pro Adventurer
Me pointing out that you continuously keep cherrypicking and oversimplifying my arguments is not deflecting.
This "three weeks" argument you keep relying on is the perfect example. Had you kept reading, you would have noticed that I actually qualified my statement, and I quote myself again from the link that YOU posted: "Their relationship in the OG ended on the "I want to meet the real you" note, which is hardly a love confession."
I didn't remember that part, and in a debate it's normal for someone to expect the other to post evidence along with their assertions.
I'm not shifting the goal post. I wasn't just responding to you. I was also responding(or reiterating my arguments towards) to @Master Bates, who I was also debating with at the time: https://thelifestream.net/forums/threads/ltd-remake-—-its-like-new-coke-except-no-its-exactly-like-new-coke.22509/page-82#post-864575
Probably because staying on point in this conversation would mean me giving into your uncharitable interpretations of my posts. Anyways, I wasn't insisting on anything. I was responding to a quote by Kitase(about the original) that YOU posted. Which you then accused me of derailing for.
You don't seem understand that I don't mind if people refer to external material, I simply believe that the actual product should be considered primary to any developer input.
I'm not going to claim to be innocent of posting off-topic things, but in that specific instance it was me following where your post led.
Which I later amended.
If it contradicts what's actually in the canon game/movie/etc, yah I think that should be considered above developer post-edits. Btw, I don't actually know if AC is canon anymore. I was hoping you could tell me.
Also, I do believe that I acknowledged in my conversation with @Cat on Mars that something may have been lost in translation when I read Kitase's quote, or Nojima's "koibito" line.
Insulting?
- You've accused me of arguing in bad faith, while you cherrypicked my arguments.
- You've accused me of deflecting for calling it out.
- You've accused me of having ulterior motives when I made it known that I wasn't comfortable arguing against personal anecdotes.
- You've accused me of shifting the goal post, when I was reiterating an argument to you that I had made to someone else making a similar point.
- You've accused me of derailing, when I was simply responding to your quote by Kitase.
- You've accused me of insisting on a "literary analysis based solely on the content of the original game" when all I was doing was stating my opinion.
- You've accused me of "disrespectfully throwing [external material] back in [your] face" simply because I either didn't agree or I misinterpreted something.
@The Twilight Mexican I'm done. I'm not playing the victim or anything, but if you're going to debate me in such a conspiratorial manner, then I'm not gonna continue this conversation while you blame me for everything. I tried being cordial, but even that was interpreted as malice. I can see when a situation is pointless.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
I just found this on YT. I was looking at Tifa's arm because it just looked really bent and out of place then I realized that she is actually hugging Cloud but stealing Aerith's and Barrets milkshake. The devious look on Tifa's face, and the innocent look on Aerith's! The look on Cloud's face is a get me out of here look, but Sephiroth is the best though, he seems to be on Cloud 9!
LNK
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Nate
Honestly it feels like this too, Materwelonz noticed that it was a very nostalgic tune (she didn't know it was the game's main theme since she hadn't reached the end yet), and there are flashes of the future where Aerith dies and Cloud cries, sooooooo, to me it fits most Aerith. I'm not too fond of it because it indeed feels too much like AC:C!Cloud, and honestly I'm fed up with that image of Cloud, I want to play the Remake to get Cloud as he was in the OG, not as he was in AC:C
Those flashes of the future that Cloud had aren't of Aerith's death though. They are just vague visions of the future. He had no vision of her being killed or being dead. All we've seen is her praying, the materia bouncing and him holding someone in a shallow pool of water.
Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Ok......... I'll keep it short to not being too much off-topic here but went to check a few songs for the CC soundtracks because of what I said earlier and.............................
This song sure is about Cloud, or many people, or Aerith, but there's definitely Zack there as well........ I'm making myself cry here!
This song sure is about Cloud, or many people, or Aerith, but there's definitely Zack there as well........ I'm making myself cry here!
looneymoon
they/them
- AKA
- Rishi
This so much. I think a lot of the way I engage with the series is that, the OG has a lot of narrative integrity that stands away from The Compilation. In fact, the main complaint I have with it is that it answers too much without offering any new questions that are nearly as profound or hard hitting.
To me, I see Cloud/Aeris as something that exists as possibility within the context of the original game's ambiguity. It also exists in the same way that Rufus doesn't have a redemption arc and is just a rich bitch. He still is, there's just compounded elements now. Just like the romantic angle to C/A is still there, but there are a lot of added elements that direct away from it being a long-term possibility in the story. It's a certain view of the characters that are only viable in that limited scope; that the story's 1997 conclusion is it. Those depictions don't really fall in line with the treatment of the characters as the story has continued, and not super possible to explore going forward. As someone who loves the story for the OG depiction, and is protective of its narrative integrity despite what The Compilation does, I can't help but feel the need to give validation to the way fans engage with the story as a standalone 1997 piece despite there being a larger whole. After all, it's the chief way I enjoy the story myself. I am not very fond of how a vocal part of the C/A shipping community views the characters sometimes, but I feel like I can meet them... there
I think the writers realize that too, but I kinda get the impression that they want to have their cake and eat it too, so to speak... which... I think this was just a long rambly ramble to say that even though the LTD is dead and has been for a while, I believe S-E is still gonna frame it in a way so that the arguments won't ever end
Big hot take, I know.
Purple
Charmed
@Purple for the highway scene it's after the team destroys the helicopter, Cloud and Aerith have a "You good?" "Somehow" exchange, similar to another moment from earlier in the game where Cloud asks "You okay" and Aerith replies with "All good! … I think"
Oh now I remember. I saw it as a general statement for the entire party with Aerith the one to reply.
Final_Heaven
Pro Adventurer
So one thing that I'm curious about.
If there's 4 parts, how are they gonna do the Affection System? In the original, it was all one game. The Remake is episodic. They're not gonna have affection carry over every game.
Provided that Aerith dies in part 2/3, what's the choice gonna be? Build up your affection with Tifa or do nothing?
If there's 4 parts, how are they gonna do the Affection System? In the original, it was all one game. The Remake is episodic. They're not gonna have affection carry over every game.
Provided that Aerith dies in part 2/3, what's the choice gonna be? Build up your affection with Tifa or do nothing?
I think this type of engagement has declined because the vast majority of FF7 fans who entered the fandom in the last decade or so, of which I am one, most likely entered through some Compilation installment. The most accessible is obviously AC/C (which is how I first came to FF7), and then people probably looked up the cutscenes of CC or watched/played the OG after that. So to these fans, the Compilation is inseparable from the OG in many ways because it's always been a part of their FF7 experience. At least, that's how it is to me.
But I totally get what you and @youffie are saying. This kind of separation of the OG with the rest of the Compilation doesn't really happen anymore, and it's kind of melancholic. I don't really know a time when the Compilation didn't exist, so I can only sympathize!
And now with the Remake, I can only assume many people will play the Remake, then check out the OG and the rest of the Compilation from there. So that also colors how they engage with the OG story. And others will play the Remake, think it's cool but not get too deep, then put it down and play something else until the next episode comes out.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
This is a good question, also how are they going to do the "levels" as well. I mean we are maxed at Lvl 50 by the end of part 1. Are they going to reset our stats when part 2 comes out? I think they could do something like a Mass Effect type of carry over for the Affection system but the character growth (stats, material, lvl, etc) will be interesting to see how they do it.
Edley
Pray for Sound
- AKA
- Issac Dian, Dudley, Chev Chelios
My hope is the Gold Saucer Date is non-optionally
But it's just as easy to create more "girlfriend quests" in part 2 or another mechanic and tie it to that if player choice is essential to them.
Re: the Affection mechanic, I think it's less of a "mechanic" this time and just more of a gimmicky nod to the OG's Affection system. Everything is equal, there are no points; it's just entirely based on side quests and one tiebreaker.
Gold Saucer date will probably be determined in a similar way. I don't think we'll get a singular GS date just because a lot of people still want to see the Barret date, lol. I'm one of them! If we're really hoping here, I just want Aerith and Tifa to date and Cloud can go off with Barret.
Post-GS I could see them getting rid of "Affection" altogether and just having a singular Highwind scene.
Gold Saucer date will probably be determined in a similar way. I don't think we'll get a singular GS date just because a lot of people still want to see the Barret date, lol. I'm one of them! If we're really hoping here, I just want Aerith and Tifa to date and Cloud can go off with Barret.
Post-GS I could see them getting rid of "Affection" altogether and just having a singular Highwind scene.
Final_Heaven
Pro Adventurer
That's a good exchange for me.
Make one mandatory romantic Highwind scene for the Tifa x Cloud fans and one mandatory romantic GC date Aerith scene for Aerith x Cloud fans.
Final_Heaven
Pro Adventurer
Does Max ship Tifa x Cloud? I thought he was was neutral but looks like he has a preference.
I think he’s pretty neutral overall and doesn’t actually “ship,” but he does have a preference. He also just genuinely really likes Tifa as a character. Which, who can blame him? She’s awesome.