New year, New LTD thread. (Round 5)

[Zee]

It's not a contest. Barret is actually her adopted father. Cloud's more like her uncle. He takes care of her when her father is away. I do not understand what's hard about this.

He teaches her words, puts food on her table and bangs her motherfigure. How is that not a fatherfigure.

That paragraph is really more Denzel focused. In fact, most of that section in CoT is how close Cloud and Denzel are, and how Tifa wants to be closer to Denzel as well.

Marlene can only accept Cloud as Aerith's boyfriend, obviously.

That doesn't even make sense.

 

[Tir McDohl]

Okay, uncle or stand-in father figure. Tomato, tomahto, I guess.

 

[Roger]

That doesn't even make sense.

I was being sarcastic about the Clorith thing. I was under the impression that we do that around here, every now and then.

 

[Zee]

I was being sarcastic about the Clorith thing. I was under the impression that we do that around here, every now and then.

I know. But.

It still doesn't make sense.



or maybe my clorith brain just can't understand it

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

GET BAK TO YER PINK FLOWER FIELDS AND LIFESTREAM FLAVORED VAG JOOCE U CLERITHSH

 

[Celes Chere]

Clorith sounds weird. =|

 

[Tifabelle]

I don't see how the concept is hard to understand. Barret is her adopted father. Cloud being a father figure doesn't take that away. Sometimes kids find father figures elsewhere cause their own dads are shit (not saying that Barret is shit ofc). I mean...kids have fathers and stepfathers. Why can't Marlene?

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

I don't see how the concept is hard to understand. Barret is her adopted father. Cloud being a father figure doesn't take that away. Sometimes kids find father figures elsewhere cause their own dads are shit (not saying that Barret is shit ofc). I mean...kids have fathers and stepfathers. Why can't Marlene?

uh.

technically cloud has not married barret or anything, and tifa isn't barret's ex-wife

so i am not getting the stepfather+father thing at all here.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

I think it was said that it could be similar in nature, not that Cloud was literally a step-father to Marlene in any real or legally binding way.

 

[Tifabelle]

technically cloud has not married barret or anything

oh dear. lol.

so i am not getting the stepfather+father thing at all here.

I didn't mean it literally. I mean just as an example of a kid having two fathers or father figures. I don't see why Barret and Cloud can't both be fathers to Marlene...just in a different way.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

I think it was said that it could be similar in nature, not that Cloud was literally a step-father to Marlene in any real or legally binding way.

See, I can understand him being an uncle/big brother figure like Tifa would be like an aunt/big sister figure type thing. Why he HAS to be a father figure and Tifa HAS to be a mother figure, I don't know. Marlene has been generally fine without a mother figure before, why she suddenly needs one now, I don't know.

It's like single parents aren't valid or some shit, and non-parental figures never really take care of kids unless the kids see them as their parents. In which case I guess you'd have to go to my grandma and tell her she did a terrible job cause I didn't see her as my mom.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

Dis is why Clerith is better really.

Cloud doesn't top anyone, so it should be Clerith. Because Aerith tops everyone, doesn't matter who it is.

u mean aeroud

 

[Zee]

GET BAK TO YER PINK FLOWER FIELDS AND LIFESTREAM FLAVORED VAG JOOCE U CLERITHSH

I didn't mean it literally. I mean just as an example of a kid having two fathers or father figures. I don't see why Barret and Cloud can't both be fathers to Marlene...just in a different way.

The thing is, Cloud isn't presented as a father figure to Marlene. He is like an older brother or uncle figure, but not a father. You can tell the difference in the behavior and the relationship just by looking at his relationship with Denzel. The way he acts around Denzel and the way Denzel responds to him does speak of a father-son relationship. Marlene is there, yes, but she isn't the focus. Even in the excerpt posted above, his interaction with Marlene is more of a byproduct of his relationship with Denzel.


And I don't mean that like he doesn't care about Marlene, but there's a clear difference.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

JESUS CHRIST PUT THAT THING AWAY I CAN'T STOP LAUGHING AHAHAHA

 

[OneWingedDemon]

He's Marlene's father, yes. Not the family father figure, which is where all this nonsense typically winds up.

Precisely. I don't see why people try to shoehorn Barret into a family unit he was never a part of (I mean, other than the obvious reason).

Barret leaves Marlene in the care of another family, more suited to raising her since he's on the road. In doing so he separates himself from it. The parental figures of that family? Cloud and Tifa. Not Barret. She becomes part of a family of 4 and thinks of Denzel as a sibling.

It doesn't mean Barret has been replaced by Cloud as her daddy.

 

[Zee]

Spoiler: gif image to spare your computers

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

vriska you bitch

go back to being gay for kanaya

 

[Zee]

i need more homestuck gifs/reaction images

then life will be grand

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

YOU CAN DO IT

 

[looneymoon]

I maintain that it's fucktarded characterization that Barret left Marlene post-FF7 at all.

Sorry Square Enix but no.

 

[Splintered]

nd Tifa HAS to be a mother figure, I don't know. Marlene has been generally fine without a mother figure before, why she suddenly needs one now, I don't know.

Isn't there a part of CoT in which Tifa says that she calls Marlene her daughter?

IDK, I always considered that Cloud had a father figure dynamic as well to his relationship with Marlene. He just fulfills it poorly, or at least awkwardly. There are moments in which it felt like it was definitely not just a cool big bro type of character.

The example I give isn't necessarily a positive one. When Tifa and Cloud start having problems, Marlene tells Barret that they are fighting. To me, this sounded like a daughter caught between two parents in a bad spot, and how parental figures can affect the children around them. I don't think that this kind of impact would have on just someone from the extended family.

That said, Barret is always her father (even if other characters fill part of that role, Barret is her dad).

In fact, a part of me always hates this part of the argument because Cloti's (like me on occasion), completely try to play down his role. And it's kind of bullshit. I remember being pissed when I heard that Barret isn't with Marlene, being a dad is just who he is.

I also completely disagree with he's just like an extended part of the family. Like an uncle that comes to visit. He's more than just the other members of Avalanche, and it's not just because of Marlene. IMO, he knows Tifa best, and he's probably the closest to Cloud after Tifa. He's the one that started the family, and he's the one that if he wanted to come back in, they would welcome him with open arms.

I think there is a core dynamic that's just Tifa-Cloud-Marlene-Denzel. Besides it being the center of Tifa's story, and it develops just as much as any character we see. It also gets visual representation as well, that's why in the end of AC/C with the photographs, we get a separate picture of just those four. They obvious mean something as a unit themselves.

But that doesn't mean there isn't a Tifa-Cloud-Marlene-Denzel-Barret dynamic as well. It's not that he's not part of the family.

It just means it's... complicated. It doesn't fit the stereotype of a family, and it's awkward as shit. But it doesn't matter if it is awkward, what matters it that they love each other *shrugs*

 

[OneWingedDemon]

I maintain that it's fucktarded characterization that Barret left Marlene post-FF7 at all.

I agree to some extent. He saved the world and fought for Marlene. He was already being kept away from her and Marlene was in the care of someone else in FFVII all the time. So I'd have expected him to sit down and make her pancakes for the rest of his life instead of handing her over to Tifa...again.

On the other hand, he feels guilty and needs to atone for his seeeeens. I get it.
Still, it does come across as selfish.

SE just wanted to emphasize C/T being parents, but they could have easily just done that with Denzel.

 

[Frostwave]

Barret got so drunk you could prolly bathe in all the alcohol he drank. Cloud and Tifa hadn't burst out laughing so hard in a LONG time.

Hee hee.

 

[looneymoon]

Isn't there a part of CoT in which Tifa says that she calls Marlene her daughter?

IDK, I always considered that Cloud had a father figure dynamic as well to his relationship with Marlene. He just fulfills it poorly, or at least awkwardly. There are moments in which it felt like it was definitely not just a cool big bro type of character.

The example I give isn't necessarily a positive one. When Tifa and Cloud start having problems, Marlene tells Barret that they are fighting. To me, this sounded like a daughter caught between two parents in a bad spot, and how parental figures can affect the children around them. I don't think that this kind of impact would have on just someone from the extended family.

That said, Barret is always her father (even if other characters fill part of that role, Barret is her dad).

In fact, a part of me always hates this part of the argument because Cloti's (like me on occasion), completely try to play down his role. And it's kind of bullshit. I remember being pissed when I heard that Barret isn't with Marlene, being a dad is just who he is.

I also completely disagree with he's just like an extended part of the family. Like an uncle that comes to visit. He's more than just the other members of Avalanche, and it's not just because of Marlene. IMO, he knows Tifa best, and he's probably the closest to Cloud after Tifa. He's the one that started the family, and he's the one that if he wanted to come back in, they would welcome him with open arms.

I think there is a core dynamic that's just Tifa-Cloud-Marlene-Denzel. Besides it being the center of Tifa's story, and it develops just as much as any character we see. It also gets visual representation as well, that's why in the end of AC/C with the photographs, we get a separate picture of just those four. They obvious mean something as a unit themselves.

But that doesn't mean there isn't a Tifa-Cloud-Marlene-Denzel-Barret dynamic as well. It's not that he's not part of the family.

It just means it's... complicated. It doesn't fit the stereotype of a family, and it's awkward as shit. But it doesn't matter if it is awkward, what matters it that they love each other *shrugs*

 

[Splintered]

I maintain that it's fucktarded characterization that Barret left Marlene post-FF7 at all.

Sorry Square Enix but no.

I agree with this so hard.

And I liked Barret in Case of Barret, I thought it was very him.

Except without Marlene. But that exception isn't like a small mix up, it's like a punch in the face. Barret saved the world for his daughter why leave now?

OMG BARRET/AERITH EVIDENCE lolno. I like the idea of Sailor Barret/Girl!Cloud better