Spoony versus FFX

[Ite]

"Every book, game or movie that is loved will be hated with equal amounts of retarditude" - Isaac Newton

I loved Final Fantasy II, the story was better than III's, the characters had, you know, personalities, and you only waste the same amount of time as you would any other game pushing buttons to up your stats. The same goes with VIII.

 

[Makoeyes987]

FFXII received pretty much nothing but praise from critics too.
Yet until I actually looked for it, I never found a single person who thought the game was good at all. For years everyone I talked to panned it as possibly the worst FF to date.

Have you ever been to gamefaqs, dude? The hate for it is strongest there. Yeah, its one of the best of the series, and is critically acclaimed up the ass but it has a very loud vocal group who just hate it cause its different.

FFX has a very prominent hatedom. If you haven't encountered it, fine. But my eight years of posting on video game forums and FF-specific forums tells me it definitely exists.

Vocal minority. Same with FFXII.

Spoony isn't the first one to talk about it. There's a reviewer who posts prominently on his forums who did a rant and review of how bad it was years before Spoony started this.

He's probably a tard too.

Then there's the Let's Play of it on SomethingAwful where posters were more than happy to join the morons playing it in talking about how terrible it is.
I used to think FFX was universallly beloved too but it most certainly is not.

The SA goons hate EVERYTHING FF. LOL.

As for VII's popularity....you're kidding, right? The Hype Backlash for that game is one of the fiercest forces on the internet. The Compilation has only served to fuel the flames of hatred many gamers have for it.

They mindlessly hate it because its popular. About half of them only know of it due to AC, and another half are just pissed off oldies who think any FF that's complimented that wasn't on a nintendo console is shit. They're abotu as relevant as the Tea Party. Anyone who looks at the Compilation while judging what the original game is like is a moron, tbqh.

Honestly, the most beloved FF game nowadays is probably VI and even it is getting a lot of hatred for its fanboys.

That, FFX, FFVII, FFIX, FFXII and probably FF1 are the most loved in the series. Their fans are truly the most loyal, and largest. Hell, I've never even met anyone who seriously hates on FF1. And if I did, I'd probably stab them in the neck.

 

[Gabranth]

I didn't say any of the hatred was credible. Most hate isn't justified. Just saying it exists.

Also FFIX's current beloved status came as a direct result of its under-appreciation in the mainstream. It took years of dedicated fans saying "this game is really good!" and eventually...everyone just agreed.

 

[ForceStealer]

Ah, but did everyone just eventually agree, or did people always agree and IX fanboys just couldn't accept it because VII got more attention?

 

[Gabranth]

I'd say a mix of both. I have heard more than my fair share of "Kuja looks like a fag. Sephy is the bestest".
Also "it's so childish and cartoony".

 

[ForceStealer]

Well Kuja DOES look that way. Of course using Sephiroth as a counterexample is pretty giggly.

 

[Lord Noctis]

http://spoonyexperiment.com/2010/08/29/final-fantasy-x-review-–-part-3/#disqus_thread

Part 3. Spoony makes some good points here, including some I never thought of. He also nitpicks a bit. Still this part is fairly entertaining.

 

[Makoeyes987]

This review is such a colossal failure in basic valid critic, I still can't believe it. And apparently with Spoony there's no such thing as raising a valid argument regarding the plot without it sounding like a pre-pubescent's attempt at being funny or edgy.

It's so mind numbingly negative its retarded.

@Dark and Divine

What the hell are you talking about? What valid criticism? He bounces between either missing the point purposefully (or being dense as fuck), or ranting about shit that's retarded and anyone with a modicum of experience in the Fantasy gaming drama would not be surprised at, at all. His opinion's as valid as pig spit.

 

[Lord Noctis]

This review is such a colossal failure in basic valid critic, I still can't believe it. And apparently with Spoony there's no such thing as raising a valid argument regarding the plot without it sounding like a pre-pubescent's attempt at being funny or edgy.

It's so mind numbingly negative its retarded.

@Dark and Divine

What the hell are you talking about? What valid criticism? He bounces between either missing the point purposefully (or being dense as fuck), or ranting about shit that's retarded and anyone with a modicum of experience in the Fantasy gaming drama would not be surprised at, at all. His opinion's as valid as pig spit.

So wondering why Tidus and the others go from an icy lake to a desert in a matter of seconds isn't valid? Nor is wondering why Yuna doesn't send Seymour even when she had the chance? Nor is pointing out the stupidity of a characters actions? Or how about the slow plot progression? Or how characters somehow manage to know things that is impossible for them to know by this point?

Fact is Spoony is right about a lot of this stuff. FFXhas a lot of short comings and it is perfectly valid to point them out. The fact that he does so while trying to make jokes and the like does not invalidate any of his complaints of critisisms. Indeed it is that style that makes him more fun to watch than your avergae critic.

Don't get me wrong, I like FFX. But that doesn't stop me from acknowledging the games many flaws.

Still I can't deny this is one of his weaker reviews. If you haven't alreayd you should go see his FFVIII review.

 

[Makoeyes987]

So wondering why Tidus and the others go from an icy lake to a desert in a matter of seconds isn't valid? Nor is wondering why Yuna doesn't send Seymour even when she had the chance? Nor is pointing out the stupidity of a characters actions? Or how about the slow plot progression? Or how characters somehow manage to know things that is impossible for them to know by this point?

Did you forget the game, or are you just running off on what Spoony says as fact? The fucker isn't even paying attention to the plot proper.

Sin was at Macalania Temple and when they fell through the ice, Sin carted them all through the ocean, they got lost in the current and were taken to Bikanel desert. They didn't just get there "in seconds."

Yuna tries several damn times to send Seymour, but considering the first time his attendants whisk his body away before she can start, and then the next time he hold her friends as bargaining chips, its kinda hard to do. You can't send someone in an instant.

FFX is clocked as one of the shortest FF's of the entire series. How much faster do you need its plot to progress? You can beat it in under 10 hours. The plot progresses fast. Are games meant to be experienced or just ran through like a DVD?

And again, you need to stop running on what Spoony says and pay attention to the actual game proper. Pick it up and play it again. I have no idea what you're even referring to because each of the characters know what they're supposed to.

Fact is Spoony is right about a lot of this stuff. FFXhas a lot of short comings and it is perfectly valid to point them out. The fact that he does so while trying to make jokes and the like does not invalidate any of his complaints of critisisms. Indeed it is that style that makes him more fun to watch than your avergae critic.

No. He is not. And aside from some half witty cracks his review is off base as hell. FFX's shortcomings due to its linearity, and shit are well defined. But bullshit about how Blitzball is out of place when the narrative clearly explains and validates its existence is stupid. There is no validity. He's running off at the mouth to be funny, making fun of shit that anyone with a fourth of a normal person's suspension of disbelief could understand. Either he's dense as fuck, or he's not funny. I dunno, but almost anyone who's played FFX doesn't treat Spira as an analog to the real world, and thus compare every single aspect of its culture or setting to the norms and expectations of reality. It's dumb.

Derp, he doesn't like the clothes. ITS VALID. CLEARLY FFX MAKES NO SENSE! I CAN'T BELIEVE IT!

The guy clearly hates FFX. To the point of asbsurdity. So expecting a minute amount of valid criticism or critique is laughable.

Don't get me wrong, I like FFX. But that doesn't stop me from acknowledging the games many flaws.

Still I can't deny this is one of his weaker reviews. If you haven't alreayd you should go see his FFVIII review.

Damn right it has flaws, but they certainly aren't Tidus looking like Meg Ryan or Spoony bitching about how he can't wrap his head around why Tidus is the protagonist or why people can play in fantasy water in a game that's clearly used to keep the masses in control and feed them false hope. Christ.

 

[Lord Noctis]

So that explains how they got to the desert. Fine. But how did the Al bhed know they were there so quickly? How the the guado discover the al bhed had Yuna so quickly? What kind of logic are the al bhed using to trade the lives of hundreds, possibly thousands of innocent people in exhcnage for the life of one summoner? Wakka is an insensitive dick for comparing the destruction of the city to fireworks. How did the Guado get Yuna back to Bevelle and set up the wedding so fast? Maybe this is explained ingame and I've only forgotten.

I also don't recall Blitzball being explained in the narrative. Its purpose as a distraction was explained sure. But how does it work? This isn't explained in the game proper that I can remember. I know its covered in the ultimania but not everyone is going to read that, or is even aware that it exists.

Still I agree that comparing Spira to the real world is stupid. They have different standards for fashion and the like. That doesn't make Seymour's design any less ridiculous.


I would not say Spoony isn't funny. Watch some of his other reviews. He's not really dense either. Just read some of his written reviews.

I like his FFX review but it is hardly his best work. Honestly its one of his weakest reviews in my opinion. Somehow I doubt you'll disagree with that.

 

[sheens]

I'll just say one thing while lurking and after watching Part 3.

Tidus = Lump of c**t discharge. Valid.

 

[Makoeyes987]

So that explains how they got to the desert. Fine. But how did the Al bhed know they were there so quickly? How the the guado discover the al bhed had Yuna so quickly? What kind of logic are the al bhed using to trade the lives of hundreds, possibly thousands of innocent people in exhcnage for the life of one summoner? Wakka is an insensitive dick for comparing the destruction of the city to fireworks. How did the Guado get Yuna back to Bevelle and set up the wedding so fast? Maybe this is explained ingame and I've only forgotten.

The Al Bhed were tracking and kidnapping summoners left and right. You fight the Al Bhed who tried to kidnap Yuna and take her off the pilgrimage at Macalania. Why would they not know?

And you don't think Bevelle and the Temples wouldn't start getting wise to the fact several of their summoners are disappearing off of pilgrimages and being taken away by their sworn enemy? The enemies of the church? Again, why would the Bevelle information network, which watches and manages all of the Temples of Spira not be aware of it? Especially when they have no trouble trailing you?

And you seriously must not remember the story now. Listen to what Rikku says:

The pilgrimages have to stop! If they don't, and they get to
Zanarkand... They might defeat Sin. Yunie could...but then she... Yunie will
die, you know? You know, don't you? Summoners journey to get the Final Aeon.
Yuna told you, didn't she? With the Final Aeon, she can beat Sin. But
then...but then... If she calls it, the Final Aeon's going to kill her! Even if
she defeats Sin, it will kill Yunie too, you know!

Why would they NOT stop the pilgrimages? What good does constantly marching people to their deaths equal, when it only brings peace for a month or two and then someone else has to die again? Why would the Al Bhed leave that twisted institution in place and not try to formulate a plan to put down Sin for good?

Wakka's socially awkward and naive. But he fucking grows out of it and learns. That's one of the main sub-plots of FFX in terms of its character interaction. How Wakka goes from an insensitive, closed minded bigot, to a man who thinks for himself and helps fight for everyone. Duh. The characters all have flaws and grow past them. They're not meant to be perfect. They're going to do questionable things.

How did they get Yuna back to Bevelle? Why would they be unable to?! They took the same method of transport that they used to get there. What type of question is that? Not every single minute detail of the plot needs to be explained in mind numbing detail. Do we need to know when and how they go to the bathroom?

I also don't recall Blitzball being explained in the narrative. Its purpose as a distraction was explained sure. But how does it work? This isn't explained in the game proper that I can remember. I know its covered in the ultimania but not everyone is going to read that, or is even aware that it exists.

You see the pyreflies and shit in the water when the game starts. The water is clearly not normal, and you see the players having to switch out to breathe. It's not that hard to understand.

Still I agree that comparing Spira to the real world is stupid. They have different standards for fashion and the like. That doesn't make Seymour's design any less ridiculous.

Derp, all of them look ridiculous.

ITS A PLOT HOLE OH GOD FFX IS SO STUPID A VILLAIN DOESN'T LOOK LIKE HOW I WANT. I'M GONNA SCREAM FOR 10 MINUTES HOW MUCH OF A FAILURE A FANTASY PERSON IS BECAUSE OF THEIR CLOTHES.

I would not say Spoony isn't funny. Watch some of his other reviews. He's not really dense either. Just read some of his written reviews.

I would. His shit gets old fast. The gobsmacking hate and bullshit he keeps yelling about is annoying and trite. How many more angry reviewers need to keep floating out in the world before it becomes cliche?

I like his FFX review but it is hardly his best work. Honestly its one of his weakest reviews in my opinion. Somehow I doubt you'll disagree with that.

It certainly is. His FFVIII review was annoying too, but I at least cracked a smile at some moments between annoyance. I think at this point he's just trolling, trying to say shit to be funny and jab at FFX. Without even trying to keep one ear open and pay attention to the game itself.

 

[Vendel]

Can't wait for part 4.

 

[Lord Noctis]

All good points I suppose. But I still say Spoony is funny. Spoony just isn't your cup of tea I guess. Doesn't mean th rest of us can't enjoy his reviews.

ThoughI have to point out having pyreflies in or around the water does NOT constitute as an explenation for how it works.

 

[Makoeyes987]

All good points I suppose. But I still say Spoony is funny. Spoony just isn't your cup of tea I guess. Doesn't mean th rest of us can't enjoy his reviews.

ThoughI have to point out having pyreflies in or around the water does NOT constitute as an explenation for how it works.

He'd be more my cup of tea if he actually reviewed the game, and not perform a self indugent hate-fest that makes Roger Ebert on video games look like a well reasoned and intelligent individual.

If he's gonna go into 1984-esque hatefest and treat FFX like Goldstein, the least he could do is just say so, and not hide it behind the word "review." There's no fucking review here. It's bullshit if this is supposed to be a review. It's not impossible to be entertaining AND valid in terms of a review. We get it, you don't like FFX. But if you're gonna fucking make a video of yourself playing the stupid game, and talk about it, why not talk actually pay the fuck attention to it? You've forced yourself to play it, so why not try to get something out of it?

And seeing that the water in Blitzball is clearly not ordinary water, should make it clear that its not a normal sport that works within the bounds of reality. Asking questions about how they're able to move and shit in it like they do, or hold their breath for so long is just taking the piss.

 

[Lord Noctis]

Fair enough. I guess we'll just agree to disagree then.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Yeah, if he's funny to you, that's great. But FFX is not the impenetrable, piece of shit story with no rhyme, reason or coherency that he makes it out to be.

And he only makes it painfully clear he's too busy trying to be funny instead of actually pay attention to the focus of his review. Which is supposed to be the game.

 

[Lord Noctis]

But FFX is not the impenetrable, piece of shit story with no rhyme, reason or coherency that he makes it out to be.

.

Now this I agree with.

 

[Alex]

ATTENTION IDIOTS. THIS IS FOR EVERYONE WHO IS ARGUING OVER THE MERITS OF SPOONY AS A CRITIC.

HE IS NOT BEING A SERIOUS CRITIC IN THESE REVIEWS.

HE IS A SELF-ACKNOWLEDGED ENTERTAINER. NOT A CRITIC OR SERIOUS REVIEWER. SO ARGUING OVER HIM IN THIS CONTEXT IS USELESS.

THAT IS ALL.

He's not always a very funny one, but there you go. He should judged in the right category at least.

EDIT: This would have been more poignant about half a page ago.

 

[Lord Noctis]

You're just a bit late Kerr. You're right though.

 

[Alex]

Inorite ;.;

Just pretend its the first post on the page and it will all be fine.

 

[Dark and Divine]

@Dark and Divine

What the hell are you talking about? What valid criticism?

Don't know, I haven't said anything in this thread yet.

 

[ForceStealer]

I like the soccer sound clips over the blitzball footage. His reaction to Wakka's failed attempt at cheering Rikku up was also funny. I find it weird how he makes sweeping criticisms of all the characters in the game at first and then proceeds to explain what makes Auron, and even Yuna, good characters.

So again, the episode has improved from the one before it, but its still far too contrived compared to his other reviews.

ATTENTION IDIOTS. THIS IS FOR EVERYONE WHO IS ARGUING OVER THE MERITS OF SPOONY AS A CRITIC.

HE IS NOT BEING A SERIOUS CRITIC IN THESE REVIEWS.

HE IS A SELF-ACKNOWLEDGED ENTERTAINER. NOT A CRITIC OR SERIOUS REVIEWER. SO ARGUING OVER HIM IN THIS CONTEXT IS USELESS.

THAT IS ALL.

So people can't call his complaints bullshit? He's not a serious reviewer but he's not just trolling for the lulz either. These are his legitimate complaints as they are in all his reviews. Therefore people have every right to criticize his criticisms.
The fact remains that he's flat-out wrong about a lot of stuff. I think this is because he's not actually playing through the game as he did with VIII but merely commenting on already-captured footage. Even as an entertainer, it comes off as lazy to be wrong on the stuff he's criticizing (and I don't mean wrong like "he didn't read the Ultimania" wrong. I mean stuff that is plainly in the game).

 

[Alex]

So people can't call his complaints bullshit? He's not a serious reviewer but he's not just trolling for the lulz either. These are his legitimate complaints as they are in all his reviews. Therefore people have every right to criticize his criticisms.
The fact remains that he's flat-out wrong about a lot of stuff. I think this is because he's not actually playing through the game as he did with VIII but merely commenting on already-captured footage.

Of course people have the right to criticise his criticisms, but I don't think its very productive since the guy has a mandate to entertain, rather than present a balanced argument, or a detailed and thorough list of his criticisms. He's trying to entertain the same way any entertainer does, he's exaggerating the bad and glossing over the details.

Even as an entertainer, it comes off as lazy to be wrong on the stuff he's criticizing (and I don't mean wrong like "he didn't read the Ultimania" wrong. I mean stuff that is plainly in the game).

Can't argue with this though, that shit does get annoying.