The First Epic LTD of TLS forums

[Max Payne]

Come on people, stay on topic please.

Tired of the whining about spam

 

[I Am Not Me]

I don't care if he doesn't like her, but I think it's lame that he apparently can't give much of a reason. :/

It's seems pretty shallow to say you hate a character when you can't provide a reason for such an intense dislike.

Yeah, but sometimes people just don't need a reason. I hate some things just because they are what they are... it's human nature. For example, I hate cockroaches; I don't need a reason, I just hate them. Keep in mind, that we gravitate towards those we like without much reason either. Demanding a reason for such feelings, or discriminating he or she who does not have any reason to hate is like asking their reason for even feeling.

Even if you give a reason for liking a person, it still isn't enough, is it. You just feel that you like this person. If that thing you like about the person changes, do you immediately dislike them for solely that reason? If you hate an insect and say you hate it because it's icky, does it sound like a valid reason? No, it doesn't, but that doesn't stop you from hating the worm.

Although I don't really like all this hate things, but we have to calm down about this. He or she feels something is off with Aerith; okay, we get it. Of course, the way he or she said it is pretty lame, but in the end, we can't just label anyone just because they hate for no reason.


I also know I did not make any sense. So I'll just shut up now.

 

[Kaine]

Even though I have no idea what this argument is about, the idea that "I'm older than you, therefore I'm right!" means that a certain pinkie mod has got us all beat for canon logic.

It was to being called Skippy, i'm 30 years old. However i am fine with being wrong about Cloti, i just don't like an attack on me. I said nothing against him and i don't know, it just felt personal. By the way I Am Not Me, you made sense and i'm a he, thank you, you worded it good.

 

[Masamune]

Aerith is far too Mary Sue for my tastes, and downright saccharine in CC.

 

[A]

How is Aerith a Mary Sue?

The only time she's perceived as a Mary Sue is when Clerri's try to make her look like a perfect goddess.

 

[Masamune]

Mary Sue -
She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing. She has an unusual and dramatic Back Story. The canon protagonists are all overwhelmed with admiration for her beauty, wit, courage and other virtues, and are quick to adopt her into their nakama, even characters who are usually antisocial and untrusting; if any character doesn't love her, that character gets an extremely unsympathetic portrayal. She has some sort of especially close relationship to the author's favorite canon character — their love interest, illegitimate child, never-before-mentioned sister, etc

^ Because of that.

 

[Kaine]

Thats why i don't like her Masamune, the reason i don't like her is because she doesn't seem too have many flaws and flaws make a character seem more real to me. She seems more like a robot than a human to me

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

Mary Sue -
She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing. She has an unusual and dramatic Back Story. The canon protagonists are all overwhelmed with admiration for her beauty, wit, courage and other virtues, and are quick to adopt her into their nakama, even characters who are usually antisocial and untrusting; if any character doesn't love her, that character gets an extremely unsympathetic portrayal. She has some sort of especially close relationship to the author's favorite canon character — their love interest, illegitimate child, never-before-mentioned sister, etc

Aerith is talented in magic, and that's about it. Otherwise, she's sort of lame. She also can be unsympathetic toward others and headstrong. Who in FF7 DOESN'T have a tragic backstory? I honestly cannot think of a single person who got to have a happy life. Furthermore, the one antisocial character, Vincent, can kick her head when she dies in some glitches. Personally, I don't see her as a character, as a Mary Sue, though the interbutts has skewed my view into seeing her as a bit of a perfect goddess.

 

[Tennyo]

Aerith has flaws, and not always endearing ones.

Remember how much she pissed off Barret at the Gold Saucer?

 

[Ryushikaze]

Mei, the reason I speak of needing a justification for hate is because hate is a powerful emotion, quite stronger than like or dislike or even fear. It, like love, should be articulable, something more than a 'just because' argument.

The examples you give are of much less strong or much more primal emotions, such as fear of the cockroach. Yes, essentially, emotions are different for each person, but I have seen hate of people based on such utter lies or nothing at all and it pisses me off.

And kaine, it's not an attack on you except for the fact that you said something that I disagreed with and refused to back up articulably.

You still haven't, by the by. What sort of person do you think Aerith is, and how is that fundamentally different from how you view yourself?

 

[Masamune]

You're forgetting she had esoteric Cetra abilities that let her commune with the dead, grow flowers in the middle of the slums, activate the white materia, manipulate the Lifestream etc.

Her noticeable shortcomings include mistaking Cloud for her lost love, which is certainly sympathetic where flaws are concerned.

She manages to win Cloud as her bodyguard, despite his aloof demeanour at the start of the game.

She was a martyr who died for the good of the planet, and when that didn't work she used her powers again to save mankind.

Even stoic characters like Vincent lament her death.

 

[Ryushikaze]

The flowers aren't her thing, they grow there just because, regardless of her intervention.

Though I think Cid feeling bad about her is more impressive. Vinnie's the type to lament folks. Cid's a grade A hardass.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

You're forgetting she had esoteric Cetra abilities that let her commune with the dead, grow flowers in the middle of the slums, activate the white materia, manipulate the Lifestream etc.

The first and last two are related to her Cetra-ness. The second was mostly because she was lucky enough to find the one place she could grow flowers.

Her noticeable shortcomings include mistaking Cloud for her lost love, which is certainly sympathetic where flaws are concerned.

She manages to win Cloud as her bodyguard, despite his aloof demeanour at the start of the game.

But we didn't know at the beginning that she was mistaking Cloud for her lost love, which makes most of her advances toward Cloud while he seems to be with Tifa rather insensitive and rude. She also manages to piss of Barret at the Golden Saucer, as Ten mentioned.

There's reason to believe the only reason why he cooperated with her at the beginning was due to the Jenova cells messing with his head.

Even stoic characters like Vincent lament her death.

Should... he have just been like "Well drat, that girl I've been traveling with was slaughtered. Ho hum, I'll just go back to working on my doilies." Of course they lament her death, she was at the very least a team member who died for no real reason.

 

[Tennyo]

Even stoic characters like Vincent lament her death.

Vincent laments a lot of stuff; he just doesn't advertise it much. Or did you miss his obsession with Lucrecia and his "sins."

 

[Max Payne]

Vincent laments a lot of stuff; he just doesn't advertise it much. Or did you miss his obsession with Lucrecia and his "sins."

That's a joke right? xD

Did you play DoC? His constant brooding is a clear sign of his lamentation and regret.

 

[Tennyo]

I meant in like FFVII and AC. DoC is different in that it's all about him so his thoughts are more prevalent. But I guess DoC didn't occur to me before. Oops how'd I forget a whole game?

That said my point still stands, and in fact is probably now even more enforced. Vincent is obsessed with all the failings of his past. He's probably the only character with more torment than Cloud.

 

[Fighter]

I would call Aerith a Mary Sue because her flaws never have any real consequences or at least you have to strain to see them. I don't thinks it's such a horrible thing though.

 

[Max Payne]

I meant in like FFVII and AC. DoC is different in that it's all about him so his thoughts are more prevalent. But I guess DoC didn't occur to me before. Oops how'd I forget a whole game?

He did the same in FF7!

 

[Tennyo]

Didn't really seem that way to me. I mean he gives a brief synopsis of his life when you first meet him, and he's a bit broody when you go to meet Lucrecia, but for most of the game he didn't seem to advertise it much. At least to me...

 

[Kaine]

Ryushikaze i understand, i just took it the wrong way sorry, it seems you think of hate the same way i think of evil. Alright the type of person she comes off to me is the type who cares too much for others well being, why i'm quite different than her in that sense is i like to see people in pain, shes a healer mainly so yeah.

 

[Masamune]

The flowers aren't her thing, they grow there just because, regardless of her intervention.

Ah, I always thought it was because of her Cetra influence - since they were attuned to the Planet and cultivated the land. Must have been coincidence.

 

[Max Payne]

Didn't really seem that way to me. I mean he gives a brief synopsis of his life when you first meet him, and he's a bit broody when you go to meet Lucrecia, but for most of the game he didn't seem to advertise it much. At least to me...

But all he did was brood. The entire game was just him going "......"

 

[Tennyo]

Ah, I always thought it was because of her Cetra influence - since they were attuned to the Planet and cultivated the land. Must have been coincidence.

Nah, the flowers were growing in the church because the Lifestream flows close to the surface there, or something. Aerith discovered them and decided to hang out there because the voics of the planet seemed clearer. I mean, if the flowers were there because of her how come they didn't die off in the two years since she was gone. She just took care of them for fun, not because they needed it.

The flowers at Elmyra's house were her doing, though. I think she says that somewhere. She took the flowers from the church and transplanted them.

But all he did was brood. The entire game was just him going "......"

I don't really view the "....." as brooding. It's not like he did that because he was all like, "Well I'm going to beat myself about past sins now, better be quiet."

He just didn't have anything to say. Or maybe he didn't want to say anything.

 

[Max Payne]

I don't really view the "....." as brooding. It's not like he did that because he was all like, "Well I'm going to beat myself about past sins now, better be quiet."

I don't think vincent beats himself

He just didn't have anything to say. Or maybe he didn't want to say anything.

Or he was off in his own little world in his mind, thinking about how he could have stopped all this shit before it started.

 

[Tennyo]

I meant mentally beat himself.

And just because Vincent is quiet means he's not paying attention to what's happening around him? Um... don't want someone like that in MY part. :/