The First Epic LTD of TLS forums

[Ⓐaron]

Because without it we wouldn't have much of a plot

Seriously, I assumed that either she was scared to discuss it or just assumed that it was too painful to Cloud to talk about.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

Agreed. As a whole I wonder why Tifa didn't confront Cloud about the Nibelheim incident before the Northern Crater. If she's sat down to have a chat with him and said "Cloud, we need to talk about about some things", it may have possibly averted Sephiroth taking over Cloud's mind.

I think it's because Tifa would have rather assumed she was misremembering than tell Cloud "No, I think you're wrong." That sort of thing makes her nervous.

 

[Fighter]

Agreed. As a whole I wonder why Tifa didn't confront Cloud about the Nibelheim incident before the Northern Crater. If she's sat down to have a chat with him and said "Cloud, we need to talk about about some things", it may have possibly averted Sephiroth taking over Cloud's mind.

When she pushed him to remember he fell on his knees grabbing his head in pain. She was afraid of what would happen.

Not all of them. Tifa didn't wake up, which is the KEY reason why I never know what to say about LO. Tifa waking up and seeing that Cloud was there is a HUGE difference, considering the fact that Tifa was the only character with the power to keep the events of the first trip to the Northern Crater in the original game from happening if she just had the right info. If she could have definitively said, "Yes Cloud you were there, so Sephiroth can stfu," the story would have probably turned out a lot different.

I mean in relation to LTD. Awake or no, Cloud still gropes her face.

 

[Strangelove]

She thought Cloud wasn't there, but Cloud knew what happened in Nibelheim. And she says herself (didn't she?) that she was scared something bad would happen if she did talk about. So her being scared and confused would be my reasoning

 

[A]

This still needs to be done ftlulz. Someone who's better with descriptions than I am can do it

I agree, this must be done for great justice. Someone do it.

EDIT: Maybe Ryu can.

 

[Ⓐaron]

Whatever you come up with would be fine as a description I'm sure, I just have fuck-all for ideas

 

[A]

Am I even allowed to make a club like that?

 

[Ryushikaze]

But the whole thing was done by Madhouse so I just assumed that it was an outside interpretation?

While it was done by Madhouse, Nomura was watching the entire time.

Not all of them. Tifa didn't wake up, which is the KEY reason why I never know what to say about LO. Tifa waking up and seeing that Cloud was there is a HUGE difference, considering the fact that Tifa was the only character with the power to keep the events of the first trip to the Northern Crater in the original game from happening if she just had the right info. If she could have definitively said, "Yes Cloud you were there, so Sephiroth can stfu," the story would have probably turned out a lot different.

And some people have said, "Well Tifa was severely injured so maybe she just doesn't remember." That may be the case but it's not a very strong case. Not strong enough to stand up in a debate, in my opinion.

The 10 Ani Ultimania speaks of LO as 'memories not remembered until the lifestream' or however it words that, so yeah.

Agreed. As a whole I wonder why Tifa didn't confront Cloud about the Nibelheim incident before the Northern Crater. If she's sat down to have a chat with him and said "Cloud, we need to talk about about some things", it may have possibly averted Sephiroth taking over Cloud's mind.

Or shattered it entirely. He was having the migraines even when inconseuential stuff got questioned, so he might have gone Ugaa even sooner if she pressed him on a story that was 90% correct.

 

[Ⓐaron]

Am I even allowed to make a club like that?

Why wouldn't you be?

 

[A]

Wait, so let me get this right: LO isn't canon, but it's official? Because LO does appear in their character profiles.

Why wouldn't you be?

Because it's a club dedicated to him. I don't even know what he thinks about it yet. Probably cba, but nevertheless, aren't clubs supposed to be FFVII related?

Also, Ryu. Answer.

 

[Tennyo]

While it was done by Madhouse, Nomura was watching the entire time.

You make him sound like a creeper.

The 10 Ani Ultimania speaks of LO as 'memories not remembered until the lifestream' or however it words that, so yeah.

Somehow I missed that. I mean if Tifa really was severely injured to the point where she lost part of her memory then it works just fine. But if that's what the Ultimania said then I guess it works.

Or shattered it entirely. He was having the migraines even when inconseuential stuff got questioned, so he might have gone Ugaa even sooner if she pressed him on a story that was 90% correct.

Yeah this. Tifa didn't confront Cloud sooner because she was afraid of what would happen. If she had known he really was in Nibelheim she probably could have, but she didn't know anything, so what good would she have done?

 

[Ⓐaron]

Wait, so let me get this right: LO isn't canon, but it's official? Because LO does appear in their character profiles.


Because it's a club dedicated to him. I don't even know what he thinks about it yet. Probably cba, but nevertheless, aren't clubs supposed to be FFVII related?

Also, Ryu. Answer.

FF-related I guess. Though you could just make a social group instead, since those can be based on anything

 

[Tennyo]

Yes but who actually ever uses the Social Groups? XD

 

[Ⓐaron]

Not many people apparently, though presumably the more that get made the more they'll get used

 

[A]

Shouldn't I be given the approval from the guy himself first?

 

[Celes Chere]

That's Aerith's single goal, to stop Cloud destroying himself - her reasons are utterly altruistic - which is why people suggest a maternal symbolism; she's not trying to bring Cloud to her (she could just let him die by that logic, a sure fire more likely way to see him again), but trying to push him forward.

Hm, I've always wondered... if Cleriths believe that Aerith can move on from Zack, then why is it impossible for Cloud to move on from Aerith? Especially when someone like Tifa, his childhood crush, someone who as always been there for him (as stated by Cloud), and understands him to the fullest, is there supporting him? Why is it so unbelievable that Cloud dare be interested in Tifa, considering all that they have been through together, past and present? Drake, since you're a Clerith, would you mind explaining this to me? I mean, I'd like to know when Cloud moves on from Tifa, and where the hint of this is. I believe Aerith definitely takes a Motherly role in AC. She's helping Cloud as you said, GC, and even jokes about him being 'Too big to adopt'.

Am I even allowed to make a club like that?

Since I'm the biggest fangirl, I should make it. But I'm not going to. Once you make it, Ali, make sure the entire Forum joins. XD

 

[Tetsujin]

And some people have said, "Well Tifa was severely injured so maybe she just doesn't remember." That may be the case but it's not a very strong case. Not strong enough to stand up in a debate, in my opinion.

It's not that she didn't remember. I mean, the exact same dialogue from LO DOES appear in FFVII, but it's when Cloud and Tifa are in the Lifestream/within Cloud's consciousness watching that scene where Cloud carries Tifa to the side. So the dialogue doesn't actually occur in the reactor but in the lifestream.

 

[A]

Since I'm the biggest fangirl, I should make it. But I'm not going to. =D

You would be.

I'd make it, but I need approval.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

Hm, I've always wondered... if Cleriths believe that Aerith can move on from Zack, then why is it impossible for Cloud to move on from Aerith? Especially when someone like Tifa, his childhood crush, someone who as always been there for him (as stated by Cloud), and understands him to the fullest, is there supporting him? Why is it so unbelievable that Cloud dare be interested in Tifa, considering all that they have been through together, past and present? Drake, since you're a Clerith, would you mind explaining this to me? I mean, I'd like to know when Cloud moves on from Tifa, and where the hint of this is. I believe Aerith definitely takes a Motherly role in AC. She's helping Cloud as you said, GC, and even jokes about him being 'Too big to adopt'

Well you answer your own question really. What's to say it's Aerith that Cloud has moved on from? She was his childhood friend that he didn't see for many years: why can't he move on from Tifa? Maybe he already has by the time of FF7? Hell, maybe he's over both of them and is gunning for Yuffie now. She did call Cloud "a pain in the ass", maybe that was meant to be innuendo. :p Also, regardless of who Cloud has moved on from, "moving on" carries the implication that before he "moved on", he was "on" them, no pun intended. It's like breaking up with someone, to break up with someone you usually have to be together first.

As for Tifa understanding him, I dunno. Considering they say the exact opposite in the Reunion Files, I chalk that up to another in a long list of FF7 inconsistencies, interpret it either way as you like. Sometimes I wonder if even the developers have their stories straight anymore. And it's not unbelievable Cloud would be interested in her. For me, it's not a matter of "why can't he he love Tifa", it's "does he love Tifa?" And while I think he certainly cares for her, I don't quite think he loves her.

 

[A]

As for Tifa understanding him, I dunno. Considering they say the exact opposite in the Reunion Files, I chalk that up to another in a long list of FF7 inconsistencies, interpret it either way as you like. Sometimes I wonder if even the developers have their stories straight anymore.

That's Tifa not understanding SOME complexities of his heart. No one can understand anyone perfectly, but it is stated that Tifa understands him more than anyone else. That doesn't mean that one can't understand someone well - what she can't understand are issues that Cloud won't let himself bring up to anyone, to the point where he can't even say anything to Tifa. He's closed himself off to everyone, even Tifa, who understands him more than anyone else.

 

[Celes Chere]

Well you answer your own question really. What's to say it's Aerith that Cloud has moved on from? She was his childhood friend that he didn't see for many years: why can't he move on from Tifa? Maybe he already has by the time of FF7? Hell, maybe he's over both of them and is gunning for Yuffie now. She did call Cloud "a pain in the ass", maybe that was meant to be innuendo. :p Also, regardless of who Cloud has moved on from, "moving on" carries the implication that before he "moved on", he was "on" them, no pun intended. It's like breaking up with someone, to break up with someone you usually have to be together first.

As for Tifa understanding him, I dunno. Considering they say the exact opposite in the Reunion Files, I chalk that up to another in a long list of FF7 inconsistencies, interpret it either way as you like. Sometimes I wonder if even the developers have their stories straight anymore.

I'm trying to figure out when Cloud moved on from Tifa from a Clerith viewpoint, though. Sure, he hadn't seen her in many years, but that's because he was stuck floating in a tube, and also, getting mind-fucked. He did see her in Nibelheim, and if you ask me, he still seemed to be pretty into her, and she into him. Are you saying that Cloud and Tifa aren't together by the time FFVII rolls around? Interesting- but please tell me when it faded, because I really don't see why he would move on, or where it's being shown. In the game, or in any other piece of the compilation.

Actually, they say that Tifa still doesn't understand some complexities of Cloud's heart. That actually doesn't contradict that she's still the woman that knows Cloud all too well, and is the only woman Cloud opened his heart to.

 

[Fighter]

The 10th Ultimania pretty much tells you Cloud hasn't moved on from Tifa. If you really haven't figured that out.

 

[Vendel]

why can't he move on from Tifa? Maybe he already has by the time of FF7?

Well that would negate the entire point of the lifestream event.

For me, it's not a matter of "why can't he he love Tifa", it's "does he love Tifa?" And while I think he certainly cares for her, I don't quite think he loves her.

No I think the question is "why can't some see that Cloud loves Tifa".

 

[DrakeClawfang]

I'm trying to figure out when Cloud moved on from Tifa from a Clerith viewpoint, though. Sure, he hadn't seen her in many years, but that's because he was stuck floating in a tube, and also, getting mind-fucked. He did see her in Nibelheim, and if you ask me, he still seemed to be pretty into her, and she into him. Are you saying that Cloud and Tifa aren't together by the time FFVII rolls around? Interesting- but please tell me when it faded, because I really don't see why he would move on, or where it's being shown. In the game, or in any other piece of the compilation.

I'm quite fuzzy on the exact timeline of FF7's games, but I know Cloud leaves Nibelheim as a kid, and spends a few years in Midgar or wherever working for Shinra. Along comes the Nibelheim Incident with all its 673 variations, during some 214 of which Cloud and Tifa speak to each other, and and you said Cloud spends the rest of the time leading up to FF7 floating in Hojo's mako tubes.

I'm not exactly sure if I believe the following myself, but I've seen several Cleriths make a good point: Tifa herself says she didn't know Cloud all that well as kids and was surprised when he called her out to the well. He leaves, she spends a few years wondering what happened, Nibelheim burns, Cloud floats in the tube for a few years, then goes to Midgar and is hired by Tifa to help AVALANCHE. What I've seen several Cleriths say is - exactly when, between him leaving the village and floating in his mako tube, did Tifa and Cloud fall in love?

EDIT - No need to be hostile gents, come now, we're all mature and reasonable here.

 

[Isabella]

Cloud moved on from Tifa while floating in the goo. Though his mind was jello, he had enough presence of mind to think to himself, "you know, I'm really not all that into her anymore."

exactly when, between him leaving the village and floating in his mako tube, did Tifa and Cloud fall in love?

I don't think anyone's saying they fell in love and had a relationship in the conventional sense. But Cloud was obsessed with Tifa up to the point he took his mako dip. CC shows us this. Come FF7, he's forgotten all those feelings, because remembering them would trigger "real" Cloud and his motivations, which his mind can't allow to happen. So you could say real Cloud was absent from Nibelheim to Lifestream scene, though his real personality was buried under there somewhere.