The Love Triangle Debate thread of KNEEL BEFORE ZOD OR SUFFER HIS WRATH (ignore the opening posts at your peril) (Round 6)

[Kermitu Kleric Katie]

Can you please stop posting shit like this? It's extremely annoying. This is not the bash what you think Cleritths are thread. If you have nothing to add, don't reply

Note how I said many cleriths, not all cleriths. Only the ones who actually fall under the hypocritical category are the ones who are subject to insult. And I'm sorry, but hypocrisy is a terrible thing and if you're a hypocrite you deserve to have it pointed out. Hypocrisy is a huge pet peeve of mine.


Also, how is trying to save someone from falling inherently romantic? There are people who seriously think that?

EDIT: Also, Quex, I've noticed that when Ryu or Tres points out the hypocrisy of cleriths, you don't even bat an eyelash, but when I do it, all of a sudden it's clerith bashing. I'm sensing a double standard here.

 

[OneWingedDemon]

Aren't each of Cloud and Aerith's hand holding scenes life-and-death situations? (End of the original game where Cloud is brought back to reality, and in AC where she helps him in the same way everyone else has helped him to defeat Bahamut Shin.)

I was going to ask: where the fuck do Aeris and Cloud hold hands?

Hand holding may be sweet and all, but Cloud and Aeris never held hands in this manner. Actually, they never physically hold hands at all because both times it happens she’s a motherfucking ghost and she dissolves.
Kadaj also reaches for her in the same way Cloud did at the end of the game.

Also, how is trying to save someone from falling inherently romantic? There are people who seriously think that?

There are people who seriously think dry mouth, shock and grief over watching YOUR FRIEND GET MURDERED IN FRONT OF YOU is inherently romantic too. I imagine they are the same ones.

 

[Dashell]

Note how I said many cleriths, not all cleriths. Only the ones who actually fall under the hypocritical category are the ones who are subject to insult. And I'm sorry, but hypocrisy is a terrible thing and if you're a hypocrite you deserve to have it pointed out. Hypocrisy is a huge pet peeve of mine.


Also, how is trying to save someone from falling inherently romantic? There are people who seriously think that?

EDIT: Also, Quex, I've noticed that when Ryu or Tres points out the hypocrisy of cleriths, you don't even bat an eyelash, but when I do it, all of a sudden it's clerith bashing. I'm sensing a double standard here.

The difference being they point out the arguments that are hypocritical. Its different than just coming in this thread and bashing "many" Cleriths. Sure point it out, but at least say why. You've repeatedly come in here and added absolutely nothing but, "Cleriths do this!" and "Cleriths say that!" and it's annoying.

At least make an attempt to debate the points at hand and explain WHY they're hypocritical.

 

[BlankBeat]

Thanks Quexinos for calling a spade a spade.

Been very sidetracked with Easter and such, but should have my response ready within the next couple of days -- working on it now.

 

[Kermitu Kleric Katie]

I would actually debate but most of the cleriths poasts here are tl;dr and I'm lazy and know someone else will point out what's wrong with the cleriths arguments. So I only respond to the short poasts or the poasts that are long but rehashing the same bullshit over and over.

 

[Dashell]

I would actually debate but most of the cleriths poasts here are tl;dr and I'm lazy and know someone else will point out what's wrong with the cleriths arguments. So I only respond to the short poasts or the poasts that are long but rehashing the same bullshit over and over.

really?

Dude most debates are tl;dr no matter what they are. It's not JUST the LTD, and it's not JUST the Cleriths. What the hell?... If you really are just going to insult someone, then don't respond. It's that simple.

 

[Kermitu Kleric Katie]

But I like making fun of cleriths. You're a bigger buzzkill than Buzz Killington.

And yes I'm aware that most LTD poasts in general are tl;dr. Mainly because a person will make a tl;dr and a person from the opposing side has to make a tl;dr response, and it goes on and on, back and forth.

 

[Dashell]

But I like making fun of cleriths.

I don't care


and I'm done arguing about it...

 

[Lex]

Matt, if you're not going to post anything relevant/civil, you should stop posting in the thread. Anywhere else people might take it with humour or just brush it off, but the rules are different in this thread and you need to stop posting rude comments. If you haven't already read the opening post which labours the point that the rules are different in this thread, go do so, then stop posting in the thread unless you have anything mature/ relevant to share.

I'm not a moderator, I'm just giving you some advice. But you should probably follow it if you want to avoid an actual moderator whooping your ass.

 

[BlankBeat]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1qhVKAHVlI

You guys will love this video

*still working on my response*

 

[null]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1qhVKAHVlI

You guys will love this video

*still working on my response*

"Commander Shepard and the entire Normandy crew"

 

[Dashell]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1qhVKAHVlI

You guys will love this video

*still working on my response*

You know when I think of romance in video games, Mario and Peach is just... not at the top of my list...

 

[null]

It was a shit list tbh

But they got the one that counts

Edit:

OMG Angelalex242 in da house!!!!!!!

 

[Danseru-kun]

It's not order, it's number of frames...

"Tell me what you cherish most... Give me the pleasure of taking it away..."

4 frames - Aerith
4 frames - Aerith flying in (a cut-in real time to show she is on her way to help?)
4 frames - Tifa
4 frames - Marlene
4 frames - Denzel
12 frames - Zack

Cloud loves Zack times 12 - and he saved the best for last

My gawd I realized in Crisis Core when Zack was dying all Cloud thought about was ZACK. There is a whole montage of his moments with Zack in the song and that was the most number of flashes in FFVII!

Then look at the last battle of Crisis Core:

First to be shown is Cissnei, Tseng and Sephiroth, then Cloud and Angeal then Aerith!

We all know Zack loves Aerith! You always love the last!

To further prove my point remember the ending of FFX:

Yuna says "the people and FRIENDS we have lost... and dreams that faded" and the people who flashed are in this order: Kimahri, Rikku, Lulu, Wakka, Auron, and HER KISS with SEYMOUR, then Tidus has the longest.


But nevertheless Zack is in the same place at Tidus, the last spot AND the longest flash. If we use the last is the best logic, then her kiss with Seymour is more important than her guardians!

I actually have more examples from anime, where the most important person is always reserved at the last place with the longest frames.

Clack is canon

-------

To change my topic a little, Cloud and Tifa actually shared way more smiles than Clerith.

He lifts a collapsed Tifa up in his arms, and upon seeing her aware of him, he smiles gently.
-Cloud Strife 10thAU profile
​

As Tifa looked away from the sky towards the ground, she was fearful of the future. However, Cloud beside her chose to smile gently. It was a smile that she hadn’t seen before during their journey. Cloud noticed her gaze and asked, “What’s wrong?”
“Cloud, you’re smiling.”

“Because I have you this time.”
“You’ve always had me.”
“What I mean is kind of different,” Cloud answered with another smile.

“Aerith brought Denzel to our home.”
Cloud gazed at Tifa and finally smiled.

It's false thatCloud only ever laughed with Aerith, it's true that it's theonly instance in the game, but his profile made it sure to mention "while he's under Jenova's control."

Cloud laughed with Barret and Tifa here:

Tifa and Cloud sipped their alcohol slowly. Barret was drinking so much that you could probably bathe in the amount he drank. He looked like he was enjoying it and talked about his memories of peaceful times. Drunk, he fell into a well and spoke nonsense about proposing to his dead wife. It had been a long time since Tifa and Cloud burst out laughing.

In Advent Children Cloud smiled to Tifa twice, and when he smiled it was only to her and her alone.

Bahamut hand reach scene, the only one he smiled for.

And the ending scene in AC, where personally I find it that he looked for her so he could smile to her.

At his last smile Zack is always ignored, Cloud was smiling at Aerith AND Zack. Geez.

 

[Selphie Tilmitt]

I really don't buy the LOL Jenovas made him do it sorry!

More like it's impressive he could smile/laugh with someone at the time despite being messed up at that time.

Also I got this!-

「がまんがまん。こんな苦労話、笑つて話せる時がくるよ」
―古代種の神殷:弱音を吐くクラウドを励まし
どんなツラい目に遮つても、エアリスはつね に希望を捨てす-、前向きに生きてきた。迷路の ような造中で「帰りたい』ともらしたクラウドに る、明るくこう呼ぴかける。

Apparently Aerith manages to bring out happiness/cheer Cloud up in the Temple of the Ancients as well!

 

[Danseru-kun]

I really don't buy the LOL Jenovas made him do it sorry!

Nah I don't think Jenova forced him laugh with Aerith, but they made it clear he wasn't exactly in his real personality.

Doesn't make Aerith less important to him or diminish her impact in his life.

Edit: @ Maidenofwar- Messed up Cloud isn't unhappy, he's actually living in his fantasy that he's an ex-SOLDIER.

Ang my gawd Cloud laughed with Zack too! At their first meeting

 

[null]

“Because I have you this time.”
“You’ve always had me.”
“What I mean is kind of different,” Cloud answered with another smile.

Yeah quite frankly I think this curbstomps a hand reach. If anything romantic ever came out of this dude's mouth, this would be it.

 

[Danseru-kun]

Yeah quite frankly I think this curbstomps a hand reach. If anything romantic ever came out of this dude's mouth, this would be it.

No it could always mean,"before we're friends, but now... we're best friends."

 

[null]

Sure, and a hand reach could mean "You've got yourself a deal! Put 'er there!!"

 

[Danseru-kun]

Also I got this!-

「がまんがまん。こんな苦労話、笑つて話せる時がくるよ」
―古代種の神殷:弱音を吐くクラウドを励まし
どんなツラい目に遮つても、エアリスはつね に希望を捨てす-、前向きに生きてきた。迷路の ような造中で「帰りたい』ともらしたクラウドに る、明るくこう呼ぴかける。

Apparently Aerith manages to bring out happiness/cheer Cloud up in the Temple of the Ancients as well!

Yeah she can of course :> Don't worry I'm not saying she can't or she didn't cheer him up. But if you saw some Clerith posts in tumblr they were claiming Aerith is the only one who makes Cloud happy, makes him feel peace, the only one that could not make him feel alone.

and Zack doesn't exist

 

[Junko Enoshima]

You know when I think of romance in video games, Mario and Peach is just... not at the top of my list...

I laughed harder than I should have at this. I liked everything on this list until it got to Mario and Peach... lol. I will make a response post later, out of time for tonight. But this post made it a good conclusion. xD

edited in: I also wanted to post a thank you for defending people that ship Clerith against bashing. Sure the LTD can get pretty heated but there's a difference between heated and just being ignorant and blatantly and purposefully rude. I'm tired of people acting like ships actually DEFINE people. We have different opinions that's why it's a debate. We don't have to hate each other.

 

[Danseru-kun]

People involved in video game features in TV or sites like IGN or anything are fans just like us, sometimes they're not even fans of the games they're talking about. I doubt they would know half the stuff in the FAQs in Gamefaqs, or know the Ultimanias and Japanese, interviews. and the arguments in this debate. They're as "neutral" and reliable as any cracked article or listverse writer. The fact that they work on different games prove that they can't focus their time on a few ones.

 

[Strangelove]

I really don't buy the LOL Jenovas made him do it sorry!

More like it's impressive he could smile/laugh with someone at the time despite being messed up at that time.

Also I got this!-

「がまんがまん。こんな苦労話、笑つて話せる時がくるよ」
―古代種の神殷:弱音を吐くクラウドを励まし
どんなツラい目に遮つても、エアリスはつね に希望を捨てす-、前向きに生きてきた。迷路の ような造中で「帰りたい』ともらしたクラウドに る、明るくこう呼ぴかける。

Apparently Aerith manages to bring out happiness/cheer Cloud up in the Temple of the Ancients as well!

It's Aerith who's being cheerful there. It's more about her positive nature than Cloud.

"[put up with it, someday you'll look back on this and laugh]"
-- Temple of the Ancients: encouraging Cloud who is whinging
No matter how hard things got, Aerith never lost hope and lived her life looking forward. She cheerfully says this to Cloud, who expressed a desire to go home and away from the labyrinth-esque Temple.

 

[OneWingedDemon]

I really don't buy the LOL Jenovas made him do it sorry!

More like it's impressive he could smile/laugh with someone at the time despite being messed up at that time.

It's not that Cloud could never smile or laugh at anything until Aeris showed up and showed him the light, ok? But the joking around/teasing women is not typical Cloud behaviour, it's Jenova making him react in a way Aeris expects. It's, like, her specialty.

I'm far more impressed by the alien parasite.

 

[Kermitu Kleric Katie]

Cleriths, take note that when I do my "clerith bashing", I' not saying I dislike you, just that I dislike your clerith argument. The only clerith here I actually dislike is BlankBeat, and that's only because all I have to base my opinion of him on is the LTD. If he poasted in other threads and I found out that he's a pretty cool person clerithness aside, my opinion would change. Junko and Maiden at least poast in non-LTD related threads. Junko seems to be a pretty cool person clerithness aside, at least from what I gather in her poasts outside this thread, though one thing I notice is she seems to put personal feelings before logic and reason, at least in this thread. That's a flaw that I've noticed several LTDers, both clerith and cloti alike, seem to have. MaidenofWar is a pretty cool gal, and an excellent example of what cleriths should be like, as she ships clerith but still accepts that cloti is a canon couple.
tl;dr I don't dislike cleriths, just clerith arguments, and BlankBeat needs to poast in other threads.

And also, people complaining about me not actually debating, I've decided to start actually debating, so I intend to debate once a clerith gives me a poast to debate against. BlankBeat, I'm looking forward to this essay of yours you mentioned. I'm going to debunk the shit out of it.