The Official "How many parts?" Thread

[Eerie]

Stepping on Legos barefooted is more fun than the LTD

Having already done that, I disagree. I nearly passed out, my husband freaked out - it was a tiny ski, my foot got injured, lost too much blood.

 

[Fiz]

Actually no, they mentioned in the first Ultimania that they were still considering how many parts they wanted to do for Remake, and in what fashion.

Right, but in practice, in the business world, this doesn’t mean it’s up in the air neither. It really means that they have options on the table. These options are likely already defined and often will be attached to conditions.

I don’t really understand this interpretation that they don’t know where this is heading or how many parts it’s likely to be; or that there isn’t a plan.

There are shareholders, investors, and management. In their world, “I don’t know when you’ll get your money back” isn’t a thing, that ends negotiations for funding almost immediately. I don’t have a plan also ends them immediately. Even having patchy or wishy washy plans end funding negotiations, especially when they’re playing with what will be hundreds of millions of dollars of other people’s money.

So; yeah, they will have a plan, or more likely; 2 or 3 well defined plans each with their own forecasts. What’s likely in the air is performance conditions for the creatives ideal plans, or feasibility conditions attached to unknowns that require feasibility study.


For example 3 parts in this form, or 4 parts in this form. If part 1 performs x then budget for 4 parts is given, if it performs y then budget for 3 parts.

Or often it can be attached to feasibility studies attached to unknowns at the time. Vision A which is 4 parts looks like this, but; how feasible is it to create on the next generation consoles that the majority of the series will be released on? 3 parts is the plan if vision A turns out to be impractical.

So, as has been mentioned before, there could well be a vision for the game to have a more sand-box style open world (or semi open), where player decision affects events and endings. This is going to be very attractive for a game like this, both as a creative team, to players and management/shareholders who care about money and the games own legacy/impact. But is it viable on next gen in this form. If yes, 4 parts, if no then 3 parts in another form.

 

[Fiz]

I’d also add to my above post with something else that was raised a while back. This uncertainty about parts could also be attached to some very high risk ideas that the creatives want to do, that affect length and could be controversial, and have made management very nervous. So want to scope reception to said ideas before committing.

If I were to take a punt on anything; it’s this. They know how long it’ll be if they do x and if they do y, and management want to know whether they can get away with x before committing hundreds of millions to it.

 

[Eerie]

Oh no I agree that them not knowing in how many parts the game would be doesn't mean they didn't know the plans. The question was about if it was a 3 parts game from memory (since so many games and movies are trilogies I guess) and they laughed and said they didn't know yet if they were to make big games that would be slower to develop ore tinier incrementations. Nojima also talked about implementing new places from the Compilation into the story. So they definitely knew what options they had and chose accordingly to those. But they surely didn't know how many parts there were going to be back in 2015 since in 2020 this was still not settled.

 

[frosty]

Right, but in practice, in the business world, this doesn’t mean it’s up in the air neither. It really means that they have options on the table. These options are likely already defined and often will be attached to conditions.

Yep, precisely.

There are shareholders, investors, and management. In their world, “I don’t know when you’ll get your money back” isn’t a thing, that ends negotiations for funding almost immediately. I don’t have a plan also ends them immediately. Even having patchy or wishy washy plans end funding negotiations, especially when they’re playing with what will be hundreds of millions of dollars of other people’s money.

Yep - which is why investor reports are super fun to practise crystal balling or tea leaf reading of future launches. But I've only been about as successful as Cait Sith in my predictions

 

[Sephiroth Crescent]

The question was about if it was a 3 parts game from memory (since so many games and movies are trilogies I guess) and they laughed and said they didn't know yet if they were to make big games that would be slower to develop ore tinier incrementations.

And now they are doing both. AFAIK, Creative Business Unit I (Kitase's unit) has the most freedom within the company.

As for the topic... we are all on the same 4-parts boat, right? I'd be surprised by anything else from SE, really.
Speaking about next REMAKE parts and Ever Crisis, I think they'll keep EC episodes bound by the release cadence set by REMAKE, interleaving some episodes from each compilation title up to certain story points and deploying more BC than EC->OG->chibi-REMAKE, for example.

 

[Eerie]

Yeah the more I think about it, the more 4 parts makes sense. It's not only about the workleg, at this point, for each part, but also a question of narrative; after the Northern Crater (so what would ideally be the last part of Remake), there is in fact very little left as part of the narrative (mainly the Lifestream scene, the return to Midgar). The rest is basically searching and grinding for limits and Weapons. So they will have to rework their story to add new things there, because it will be compared to the 3 previous entries which are heavy story-wise - and it has to deliver a new ending too!

If it was only a 3 parts game, it would mean the next game would be super heavy with story and the last part would feel empty, which is clearly not the goal. Four parts actually help to streamline that.

 

[KindOfBlue]

Having already done that, I disagree. I nearly passed out, my husband freaked out - it was a tiny ski, my foot got injured, lost too much blood.

I would hope that feeling was temporary and not dragged out for over 20 years, but I suppose some scars never truly go away lol

 

[Sephiroth Crescent]

and it has to deliver a new ending too!

Or not.

 

[Eerie]

I would hope that feeling was temporary and not dragged out for over 20 years, but I suppose some scars never truly go away lol

I am most wary of Legos and Playmobils now

Or not.

They have to, with the kind of ending that went in the first part. The fact that the final fight was so similar to the Cloud x Sephiroth showdown in the OG has escaped about nobody I guess, which means that they have other plans for the ending. I do think it's going to be very similar to the ending of the OG - Aerith and Zack will not make it alive, that's my guess - but it'll definitely be reworked, they won't want to redo the same thing for the ending that they already have done for Remake.

 

[Odysseus]

Embrace pizza. Eight parts.

 

[frosty]

The question was about if it was a 3 parts game from memory (since so many games and movies are trilogies I guess) and they laughed and said they didn't know yet if they were to make big games that would be slower to develop ore tinier incrementations. Nojima also talked about implementing new places from the Compilation into the story. So they definitely knew what options they had and chose accordingly to those. But they surely didn't know how many parts there were going to be back in 2015 since in 2020 this was still not settled.

They probably knew - but they're bound by confidentiality and can't put it in press and / or printed materials for reasons of not able to release certain info to the public yet.

Perhaps during the interview for the Ultimania (I assume this is the original Japanese FF7 Remake Ultimania released in April / May 2020....which means the interview was done months before hand for it to be able to be put into print by April)...they could not reveal that they're already working on Ever Crisis, i.e. the "Remake" with small incremental parts. And technically...if it's a gacha format like their other mobile games... they really don't know when it will end.

Hence the answer comes out as vague "we don't know how many parts". But secretly, we'd already signed off on another version of a Remake which PR told us not to tell you about, and also, cos we haven't secured the copyright for that yet hehe

Again, this just my hindsight speculation based on that line, but oft, the team working and saying things like "we don't know" or "we've not decided yet" is just "we cannot reveal our business plans"

 

[Eerie]

You can say they lied but not that it was about Ever Crisis, that’s bad faith. The question was about an AAA game, not a mobile game they are not developing themselves.

And again, if they are not sure about new places they want to include or not, then it makes sense that they are not sure about how many parts. This interview was probably done around December/January, they were still at the planning stage then. How they’d tackle part 2 literally change how many parts they’d release.

 

[frosty]

You can say they lied but not that it was about Ever Crisis, that’s bad faith. The question was about an AAA game, not a mobile game they are not developing themselves.

No no, I'm not saying they lied. I'm saying that at that time of the interview, there could be many things that were happening that resulted in them giving answers like that - using EC as an example. This was the actual quote, and it doesn't say "tinier incrementations"

“We have a general idea of how the story will play out, but we haven’t decided exactly [how many parts], nor can we confirm anything,. There’s speculation that it will be three parts, but we’re just doing things one step at a time.”

“If we divide the story into large parts, it’ll take longer to make. If we divide it into more detailed smaller sections, then developing it will be faster. I hope to release the next one ASAP.”

Clearly, what they cannot say because of confidentiality and business plans, is a statement like the below which would surely put everyone out of the misery (or fun) of guesswork (and make this thread redundant)

"We've done a business projection of 3 parts back in 2015 (or 20XX or whenever) when we had to secure funding, and we might break it into 4 - however that is contingent on Part 1 making 175% above and beyond projected first year sales, as well as Part 2 hitting checkpoint ABC, seeing no covid disruptions...hence securing us a resource uplift of another x million. In making a Part 3 or 4 is tricky as well, because we might have to rethink our initial bundling strategy for the final installment.

We initially played with the idea of multiple little parts given the huge content of the compilation, but in terms of execution for an AAA game that wasn't feasible and more risk than Finance would want to bear, and eventually that concept got pitched as Ever Crisis to a third party developer as it suits a periodic release format at a much lower cost, but we also kept the multiple part idea in a diminished scope in the form of DLCs

Now I've said everything PR told me not to, and my competitors will be combing my annual reports to try to make projections to either avoid or intercept my sales launches. lol"

 

[Makoeyes987]

Clearly, what they cannot say because of confidentiality and business plans, is a statement like the below which would surely put everyone out of the misery (or fun) of guesswork (and make this thread redundant)

This would also be terrible business sense for S-E. To be frank, if players knew exactly how many parts the FFVII Remake saga would be, audience members could talk themselves into waiting until it was "complete" and not spend to see the story unfold during the relevant fiscal quarters. Part of the hype and hook of this series is seeing what happens, when and for how long. And that's not even considering how competitors could develop around such a project as well.

The writers definitely have an idea of how long it'd be, where the story's going and what they want to show. But they certainly cannot spoil their work whatsoever. Nomura, Kitase, Nojima and Toriyama are well known to seed and construct plot elements far in advance, so I do not see this being something like Star Wars where they're literally writing by the seat of their pants.

 

[OWA-2]

This would also be terrible business sense for S-E. To be frank, if players knew exactly how many parts the FFVII Remake saga would be, audience members could talk themselves into waiting until it was "complete" and not spend to see the story unfold during the relevant fiscal quarters. Part of the hype and hook of this series is seeing what happens, when and for how long. And that's not even considering how competitors could develop around such a project as well.

The writers definitely have an idea of how long it'd be, where the story's going and what they want to show. But they certainly cannot spoil their work whatsoever. Nomura, Kitase, Nojima and Toriyama are well known to seed and construct plot elements far in advance, so I do not see this being something like Star Wars where they're literally writing by the seat of their pants.

But didn't they say that next time we hear more info on Part 2, they will reveal how many parts the project will have?

 

[Makoeyes987]

The writers definitely didn't say that, they said they would have a better idea of how many parts they'd like it to be.

 

[Ite]

It was expected that Part 1 would be Midgar. Every multi-part novelization including mine and S and G’s expands Midgar in some way because of the clear dileneation between that act and the rest of the story.

The end of Part 2 is going to allow us to actually make informed guesses as to how many parts it’s going to be. If its Junon and the Cargo Ship (as it is in my novelization) we’re looking at 5 parts. If it’s Rocket Town, Nibelheim, or Gongaga, we’re looking at 4, maybe 5. If it’s the Temple of the Ancients, the End of Disc 1, or the Northern Crater, we’re looking at a trilogy.

That is all assuming that the time ghost shit doesn’t add on at least 1 more part’s worth of story on top of the mammoth script they are working with.

 

[frosty]

This would also be terrible business sense for S-E. To be frank, if players knew exactly how many parts the FFVII Remake saga would be, audience members could talk themselves into waiting until it was "complete" and not spend to see the story unfold during the relevant fiscal quarters. Part of the hype and hook of this series is seeing what happens, when and for how long. And that's not even considering how competitors could develop around such a project as well.

Yep.

The other thing, which a lot of people also don't realize is that creative people, no matter how senior or decorated they are in the company, are generally not at all authorized to speak about business plans even if they know it at the tip of the fingers and were heavily involved. This is just added level of protection to ensure media and public only get business information from one source (usually the CFO, at an "official" venue, like a shareholders briefing). Companies of these size also slap "no forward looking statements" embargoes on their key personnel - which means absolutely NO ONE - even if say, you're say, Bob Iger, is allowed to even whisper anything about future plans during certain periods of the year.

Hence, combing Nomura / Nojima's statements usually won't give much clues because all he is authorized to talk about publicly is the creative process... resulting in non-committal answers on parts and launch dates even though people may pose these questions to them again and again. They can only speak of things beyond their creative scope, only when it has already come to past.

 

[KindOfBlue]

My experience as a lifelong Marvel fan has taught me not to be in such a rush to find out where the story is going before the story is even told on the creators’ own terms

 

[Eerie]

Something just struck my mind;

- Remake part 1: Midgar, guest character: Red XIII. DLC: Yuffie.
- Remake part 2: Nibelheim to Nibelheim, guest character: Vincent. DLC: Cid.
- Remake part 3: Rocket Town to Northern Crater. DLC: Zack (and Aerith).
- Remake part 4: > end.

I mean, I would sign for this lol.

 

[Torrie]

- Remake part 1: Midgar, guest character: Red XIII. DLC: Yuffie.
- Remake part 2: Nibelheim to Nibelheim, guest character: Vincent. DLC: Cid.
- Remake part 3: Rocket Town to Northern Crater. DLC: Zack (and Aerith).
- Remake part 4: > end.

Even if I used to believe it would be just two parts (yeah, it's my lonely vote up there haha), a trilogy looks more and more feasible to me right now. And Zack DLC sounds exactly like a perfect opportunity either to clarify what on planet he is doing in the game right now, or to faithfully remake some Crisis Core episodes. I know CC remake is my hill to die on, but a girl can dream.

 

[msia2k75]

Something just struck my mind;

- Remake part 1: Midgar, guest character: Red XIII. DLC: Yuffie.
- Remake part 2: Nibelheim to Nibelheim, guest character: Vincent. DLC: Cid.
- Remake part 3: Rocket Town to Northern Crater. DLC: Zack (and Aerith).
- Remake part 4: > end.

I mean, I would sign for this lol.

This is exactly what i'm expecting.

EDIT: ... with maybe one difference, i expect part 3 to start in Wutai.

 

[Fiz]

Something just struck my mind;

- Remake part 1: Midgar, guest character: Red XIII. DLC: Yuffie.
- Remake part 2: Nibelheim to Nibelheim, guest character: Vincent. DLC: Cid.
- Remake part 3: Rocket Town to Northern Crater. DLC: Zack (and Aerith).
- Remake part 4: > end.

I mean, I would sign for this lol.

Didn’t they say that integrade would be the only DLC/expansion until the main story of remake is complete?

I more or less agree with your breakdown though, structurally it seems like the most sensible approach.

 

[Eerie]

Ah, they said they wouldn't be doing any DLC for the whole Remake, or just between part 1 and part 2? I can't remember, I thought it was the latter... welp *takes DLC plans back home* but it was a good idea!

And yeah, with them announcing that Wutai was very far away (so not in next game), I think it's probably AT LEAST a 4 parts game. And I can't really see it being a 5 parts or more, narratively it wouldn't really make sense anymore (plus I'm sure the devs want to end Remake before they're 70 haha... and us 60).