SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 16 Spoiler Discussion
- Thread starter Lex
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LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
I can't bring myself to do it. We're not supposed to be making ruckus!
Tennyo
Higher Further Faster
I can't resist messing up environmental objects if I have the option. While playing Uncharted 4 I do believe there was a lot of environmental objects that you could mess around with. I would jump on the tables just so I could knock stuff off.
I just... can't help it.
I just... can't help it.
Cannon_Fodder
Pro Adventurer
Took the elevator this time through; I honestly enjoyed it more than the stairs. Some good character moments, and even though there's only one joke, I found it hilarious.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
We all got so excited over the Crisis Core reference to Kunsel (inexplicably a fan favourite), that we forgot to ask the obvious question: why would a Public Security grunt go get a SOLDIER? And a SOLDIER 3rd class to boot IIRC. Kunsel is nothing to do with PSM. Why would he even know Cloud? Why would his name mean anything to Cloud?
Inb4u - Kunsel is such a good friend of Zack's and Zack and Cloud were such besties that Cloud used to hang out all the time with Zack and Kunsel.
Don't they all know that Zack is dead? Odd that they would say nothing about it.
Inb4u - Kunsel is such a good friend of Zack's and Zack and Cloud were such besties that Cloud used to hang out all the time with Zack and Kunsel.
Don't they all know that Zack is dead? Odd that they would say nothing about it.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
I think that's probably the intended implication Lic, that because Kunsel was good friends with Zack, he was also probably the next person Cloud was most familiar/friendly with after Zack. Also Kunsel seems like he's a relatively nice guy, so perhaps he has friends/acquaintances outside of SOLDIER, especially since SOLDIER got meshed into Heidegger's authors after Lazard's departure.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
Well they clearly thought Cloud was dead too.
And Cloud was actively trying to be in SOLDIER, that he knows a 3rd Class is less surprising than him knowing 1st Class Zack.
The Twilight Mexican
Ex-SeeD-ingly good
- AKA
- TresDias
Kunsel was a 2nd. 
As for going to grab him because of Cloud, if nothing else it makes sense because Kunsel refused to believe Zack was dead in CC, so a guy who was on that mission with him showing up alive would be important to Kun.
As for going to grab him because of Cloud, if nothing else it makes sense because Kunsel refused to believe Zack was dead in CC, so a guy who was on that mission with him showing up alive would be important to Kun.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Kunsel is creepy. He knows everything. He invites Zack out on the town and then dumps him alone in Sector 8. He's kind of sketchy tbh. You know when he sent those emails saying "I'm on your side man. Just tell me where you are," after Zack broke out of Nibelheim? I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him. I always felt that, all the way through CC, so to find that he's seen as a nice guy and close trusted friend of Zack by the fandom seems really weird.
It would still make more sense if Cloud's trooper friend went to get their Lieutenant, but I understand why SE wanted to work a Crisis Core reference in there. Kunsel's a known character.
It would still make more sense if Cloud's trooper friend went to get their Lieutenant, but I understand why SE wanted to work a Crisis Core reference in there. Kunsel's a known character.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
Lic really assumes the worst of every character, lol
Oops
But I agree, if Kunsel didn't believe Zack was dead, he probably tried to get information on who everyone else on the mission was.
Oops
But I agree, if Kunsel didn't believe Zack was dead, he probably tried to get information on who everyone else on the mission was.
The Twilight Mexican
Ex-SeeD-ingly good
- AKA
- TresDias
You're thinking of Luxiere. He was the sneaky snake.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
True... but why would PSM - who have a notorious ongoing rivalry with SOLDIER - run to get him? I mean, it wasn't that long ago that the renegade SOLDIER Zack killed, what, like 1,000 of them in his last stand.
Unless that didn't happen.....
I didn't trust either Kunsel or Luxiere.
I trust the Turks.
Just think about it. Who actually tried to save Zack's life? Anyway, Kunsel isn't in the DMV so he can't have meant that much to Zack.
Unless that didn't happen.....
I didn't trust either Kunsel or Luxiere.
I trust the Turks.
Just think about it. Who actually tried to save Zack's life? Anyway, Kunsel isn't in the DMV so he can't have meant that much to Zack.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
(what is/are PSM?)
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
I mean just like in real life militaries, soldiers aren't all a hive mind, there are exceptions to the rules. Is it is really that unbelievable to your that Kunsel had grunt friends/acquaintances (including Cloud). Or is this like some kinda of pet peeve for you? Like Tseng in the Remake apparently not having enough of a "manly jaw" for you (which I do not understand at all)?
Odysseus
Ninja Potato
- AKA
- Ody
ForceStealer
Double Growth
It was the M throwing me off as well 
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
I don't even know what they're officially called. Heidegger's Public Safety Force or Public Safety Maintenance, something like that - the Shinra army.
Look, does this not sound creepy at all to you?
So Zack is doing his best to keep his life a secret from this unbearably nosy 2nd Kunsel, who just won't take No for an answer.
Kunsel's like the Johnny to Zack's Cloud.
Kunsel: "Zack, bro, just talk to me man, you know you can tell me anything!"
Zack: "I heard you moved on my girl while I was out of town. And don't call me bro."
Yes. Kunsel goes down to 'check on' Aerith while Zack's away, only to find the Turks are already keeping an eye on her. Zack didn't ask him to do 'check on' Aerith and never shared any information about Aerith with Kunsel. Kunsel tried to help Aerith with the broken flower wagon and Aerith told him to sling his hook.
Creepy.
As to Kunsel being friends with Cloud... I was under the impression that Cloud didn't have any friends in the Shinra military or in SOLDIER, aside from Zack who was kind to him because Zack was kind and matey with everyone. I don't want to get into another discussion about whether or not Zack and Cloud were close friends before they went to Nibelheim. I think it's pretty clear that SE have characterised Cloud as a loner who didn't have close friends. Maybe Zack was the exception because Zack could break through anyone's defenses. But I'm not on board for the suggestion that Cloud enjoyed a normal, active social life when he was training in the Shinra military, or that he regularly hung out with 2nd Class SOLDIERS.
Look, does this not sound creepy at all to you?
So Zack is doing his best to keep his life a secret from this unbearably nosy 2nd Kunsel, who just won't take No for an answer.
Kunsel's like the Johnny to Zack's Cloud.
Kunsel: "Zack, bro, just talk to me man, you know you can tell me anything!"
Zack: "I heard you moved on my girl while I was out of town. And don't call me bro."
Yes. Kunsel goes down to 'check on' Aerith while Zack's away, only to find the Turks are already keeping an eye on her. Zack didn't ask him to do 'check on' Aerith and never shared any information about Aerith with Kunsel. Kunsel tried to help Aerith with the broken flower wagon and Aerith told him to sling his hook.
Creepy.
As to Kunsel being friends with Cloud... I was under the impression that Cloud didn't have any friends in the Shinra military or in SOLDIER, aside from Zack who was kind to him because Zack was kind and matey with everyone. I don't want to get into another discussion about whether or not Zack and Cloud were close friends before they went to Nibelheim. I think it's pretty clear that SE have characterised Cloud as a loner who didn't have close friends. Maybe Zack was the exception because Zack could break through anyone's defenses. But I'm not on board for the suggestion that Cloud enjoyed a normal, active social life when he was training in the Shinra military, or that he regularly hung out with 2nd Class SOLDIERS.
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The Twilight Mexican
Ex-SeeD-ingly good
- AKA
- TresDias
Wasn't that because Zack was supposed to do it and she was waiting for him?
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Well, that's what Kunsel says. However, it's canonical that Zack did not trust him with information. Maybe Zack told Aerith that if Kunsel ever came nosing around she should send him packing.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
As Tres said, I think it's easier to assume that Kunsel, with his vested interest in Zack's fate, would want to be informed if someone saw Cloud - who he would know was on the Nibelheim mission with him than immediately leap to Cloud and Kunsel bein buds. I don't think it's a stretch that troopers stationed at the Shinra building would be familiar with a SOLDIER that also seems to be permanently stationed at HQ.
Eh. It's canonical that he's a lousy texter
Eh. It's canonical that he's a lousy texter
Odysseus
Ninja Potato
- AKA
- Ody
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Now you've made me think of Kunsel and Zack as this Key & Peele sketchEh. It's canonical that he's a lousy texter
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
So, Kunsel is friends with Zack, Zack very recently killed a large number of troopers, and now their fellow troopers want to help Zack's friend Kunsel?
I mean it's a stretch, but yes, it's not beyond the bounds of possibility. Still, the simplest explanation is that SE wanted to tip the hat to Crisis Core and all the Kunsel fans out there.
I mean it's a stretch, but yes, it's not beyond the bounds of possibility. Still, the simplest explanation is that SE wanted to tip the hat to Crisis Core and all the Kunsel fans out there.