Improve Crisis Core Thread

[Unlucky]

That's what happens when Nomura is Uncreative Director.

Wiki says Second Class is purple in CC, although it had a more reddish hue than the OG's purple. But yeah, Zack's is different for some reason (dark blue).

I guess we just have to be grateful there were only two belts added in there.

 

[ForceStealer]

2nd is still red. Zack just had a special uniform, probably because he was Angeal's pet or something.

That's red?

Well it's no

, that's for sure

 

[Clement Rage]

Good idea. I always thought it made no sense that the researcher had been left all alone in the mansion to supervise 'the experiment' and yet the moment Zack steps outside the place is crawling with Shinra infantrymen. Apart from anything else, who raised the alarm?

If I designed tanks for Hojo, I'd include a feature where an alarm goes off in the Shinra building if someone punches a tank apart from the inside, and I would most certainly keep a garrison close by, though not in the town where it could be notice by people passing.

As for why they didn't investigate the manor, they have a much better chance of taking on a SOLDIER 1st in a wide open space than rushing down a corridor two at a time.

Why did Zack stay? He just woke up after four years in a tank, he may not be in a state to go anywhere without recovery time.

Improving the game: Have Zack hesitate a little about killing Genesis copies that used to be his friends and colleagues.

 

[jazzflower92]

Also make it be a reason why Genesis needs to go down especially if he forced them turn into copies against their will.

 

[Unlucky]

As for why they didn't investigate the manor, they have a much better chance of taking on a SOLDIER 1st in a wide open space than rushing down a corridor two at a time.

And instead of luring him out, they let him recuperate?

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Improving the game: Have Zack hesitate a little about killing Genesis copies that used to be his friends and colleagues.

I would agree, if not for one thing: all the Genesis copies look like Genesis. They are indistinguishable from each other and Zack has no idea which ones might once have been guys he knew well, and which are random strangers. So that gut instinct which stops us killing friends and colleagues just isn't going to be there. While he might know intellectually that he's killing a thing that used to be someone he knew, it isn't that person any more. I see him being more bothered by what Genesis had done to them than by the fact that he now had to kill them.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

They are indistinguishable from each other and Zack has no idea which ones might once have been guys he knew well, and which are random strangers.

Why not? They just look like Genesis, but they have none of his personality traits, and unless you assume that in a scenario Genesis just going to engage Zack in combat without saying anything (which is a possibility, but knowing Genesis, unlikely), if I had a self absorbed, talkative friend who cloned himself into like, 50 dudes, I'd assume that the hordes of mad, silent dudes who rush me without a second thought probably aren't him.

 

[Roger]

Why not? They just look like Genesis, but they have none of his personality traits, and unless you assume that in a scenario Genesis just going to engage Zack in combat without saying anything (which is a possibility, but knowing Genesis, unlikely), if I had a self absorbed, talkative friend who cloned himself into like, 50 dudes, I'd assume that the hordes of mad, silent dudes who rush me without a second thought probably aren't him.

He says they are indistinguishable from each other not Genesis himself. They didn't obtain Genesis personality traits but given all the clones that chant "S-cells" endlessly during their pursuit of Zack and Cloud, they certainly do not retain their own personality.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

No, but I never said that, though.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

I didn't really understand your point, Mog. My point was that if, let's say, your entire office was turned into zombies who all looked identical to someone you thought of as your enemy, retaining none of their individual appearance or personality, you wouldn't respond to them as if they were people you knew. If anything, you might feel you were giving them a merciful release by killing them.

In Before Crisis Zack did try very hard to rescue his two fellow SOLDIERs who were being turned into Ravens, but that was because he knew exactly who they were.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Wow I totally misunderstood your post. I thought you said "Zack had no idea if the G Soldiers he was killing was really Genesis" and you ACTUALLY said "What if those guys were his former friends"

My bad.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

No, my bad for not writing clearly.

 

[Clement Rage]

My point was that if, let's say, your entire office was turned into zombies who all looked identical to someone you thought of as your enemy, retaining none of their individual appearance or personality, you wouldn't respond to them as if they were people you knew. If anything, you might feel you were giving them a merciful release by killing them.

Ah, but you might at least wonder if there was a way to cure them, and hesitate the first time you ran into them. I'm not asking for a bunch of angsty internal monologues, but he should've at least wondered if there was another option or a cure to the copying process at some point.

 

[jazzflower92]

You know the Genesis Copies thing sounds like it could have defiantly be the plot of a zombie movie.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

That's red?

Well it's no

, that's for sure

Fair enough. I wish it were a brighter red too. I don't like this burgundy shit. I feel like it's the color of heartburn -- or maybe that's just because I feel heartburn when looking at the Compilation uniforms.

Ah, but you might at least wonder if there was a way to cure them, and hesitate the first time you ran into them. I'm not asking for a bunch of angsty internal monologues, but he should've at least wondered if there was another option or a cure to the copying process at some point.

That really should have happened, if only because it's weird that Zack wouldn't wonder about it, particularly given his reactions to Essai and Sebastian in Before Crisis.

If I designed tanks for Hojo, I'd include a feature where an alarm goes off in the Shinra building if someone punches a tank apart from the inside, and I would most certainly keep a garrison close by, though not in the town where it could be notice by people passing.

All the townspeople were Shin-Ra employees, though, at least some of which were reporting to Hojo. It wouldn't be weird to them.

As for why they didn't investigate the manor, they have a much better chance of taking on a SOLDIER 1st in a wide open space than rushing down a corridor two at a time.

I have to disagree. You give Zack a wide, open space to fight in, he's going to dodge your gunfire, as he does in Last Order. Heck, at one point in Junon during CC, three Genesis copies are standing down the street from him and shooting, yet they miss even without him making an effort to dodge. Giving him room is just a bad idea.

The smarter way would be to 300 him -- just group a bunch of guys with guns at one end of a corridor from him and fill the air with many strings of bullets.

Even in the game's final battle, where he died, it was still a bad idea to give him space to move around. Of all those guys who went up against him in the wastelands, only three survived. That's crazy and also really points to not giving him room being the best way to beat him.

 

[Abortedj]

Fair enough. I wish it were a brighter red too. I don't like this burgundy shit. I feel like it's the color of heartburn -- or maybe that's just because I feel heartburn when looking at the Compilation uniforms.

Wouldn't a bright red be a liability in combat? Not that this is the most realistic of worlds or anything, but still seems like some something might just be a step too far.

Also, I would really like it if Aeris or Aerith (or whatever it is they caller now) would be less of a cock-tease. I don't mean they need to make her a whore, but it be nice if she gave some kind of sign that she was actually in to Zack as more than a "dude to fetch things".

 

[Rydeen]

You give Zack a wide, open space to fight in, he's going to dodge your gunfire, as he does in Last Order. Heck, at one point in Junon during CC, three Genesis copies are standing down the street from him and shooting, yet they miss even without him making an effort to dodge. Giving him room is just a bad idea.

The smarter way would be to 300 him -- just group a bunch of guys with guns at one end of a corridor from him and fill the air with many strings of bullets.

Even in the game's final battle, where he died, it was still a bad idea to give him space to move around. Of all those guys who went up against him in the wastelands, only three survived. That's crazy and also really points to not giving him room being the best way to beat him.

I chuckled a bit because this reminds me of how the actual gameplay, for me, revolved around the concept of utilizing lots of space with which to flank my opponent.

And I viewed Zack's seemingly emotionally weightless relationship with Aeris in this game as being something of a breather for him, where he could leave the stress of Shinra behind for a little while and have building a flower carriage be his biggest concern. Really doesn't line them up as the most amorously intense of lovers, but they weren't exactly intended to be that "serious" in the original game anyway.

 

[Unlucky]

I could think of a dozen excuses why the Nibelheim incident played out the way it did, but in the end it still comes down to bad and lazy writing in this turd of a prequel.

Same with the Genesis copies. I honestly don't think that none of the writers have even thought of rogue SOLDIERS at some point, or at least bothered with giving them identities before transforming into Genesis 'zombies'.

But mehh, that would just complicate the plot. Let's just give 'em Gackt. They love Gackt.

As for the colors, they didn't need to be rainbow happy. But they didn't have to be too dull either. It's like they had to change everything because 'gritty and serious'. Why, Cloud's purple SOLDIER uniform in Dissidia 012 didn't look bad at all right?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

They've gone dull with the colors on everything. SOLDIER uniforms, Turk uniforms, the look of everything in Advent Children, the slums in Crisis Core, etc.

 

[Rydeen]

A burned village has never been done in a video game before, it's just so profound in and of itself. Why would the characters actually need to care and show us why said event was so traumatic?

I have just gotten really tired seeing this trope meaninglessly tossed around after playing rpgs for so long. Every time I see it done poorly, especially if in the beginning of a game my eyes nearly get stuck in the back of my head.

 

[Clement Rage]

Fair enough. I wish it were a brighter red too. I don't like this burgundy shit. I feel like it's the color of heartburn -- or maybe that's just because I feel heartburn when looking at the Compilation uniforms.



That really should have happened, if only because it's weird that Zack wouldn't wonder about it, particularly given his reactions to Essai and Sebastian in Before Crisis.



All the townspeople were Shin-Ra employees, though, at least some of which were reporting to Hojo. It wouldn't be weird to them.



I have to disagree. You give Zack a wide, open space to fight in, he's going to dodge your gunfire, as he does in Last Order. Heck, at one point in Junon during CC, three Genesis copies are standing down the street from him and shooting, yet they miss even without him making an effort to dodge. Giving him room is just a bad idea.

The smarter way would be to 300 him -- just group a bunch of guys with guns at one end of a corridor from him and fill the air with many strings of bullets.

Even in the game's final battle, where he died, it was still a bad idea to give him space to move around. Of all those guys who went up against him in the wastelands, only three survived. That's crazy and also really points to not giving him room being the best way to beat him.

The point of rebuilding Nibelheim was to make it look like nothing had happened. Other people pass through the town on occasion, and a massive military garrison there for no reason would draw unnecessary attention.

Zack's a SOLDIER 1st, you go up against him you're pretty much fucked no matter what you do. But he even mentions in the game that he actually found the encounter in Nibelheim tough "How could I be having trouble against these guys?"

Y'know, I interpret the end of crisis core as being like the end of the fellowship of the ring. There's a shot of a helicopter shining a spotlight on Zack and then flying away, I interpret that as some other survivors pulling out once they're certain he's done for and leaving the commander to finish him.

Narrow corridor works in our world, but Zack can easily just cut himself a new door, and throw magic right back at them. Area effect spells work better in a confined space.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Even in the game's final battle, where he died, it was still a bad idea to give him space to move around. Of all those guys who went up against him in the wastelands, only three survived. That's crazy and also really points to not giving him room being the best way to beat him.

I don't think only three survived, only because it's really fucking stupid military doctrine to fight from a battalion down to the last man without anyone making a tactical retreat, (if nothing else, the helicopters probably flew away) and Shinra doesn't seem like the type of commanding environment where retreat is heavily stigmatized.

I don't really like the line of thought that 'Zack like, whittled down the entire Shinra Army, bro'. The game's narrative indicates that a battalion level force engaged Zack that day, and in an overall military force, a battalion is an extremely small amount of an army's total manpower. Don't get me wrong, it's an inhuman amount of force vs. one guy, but certainly not an entire army.

 

[ForceStealer]

They've gone dull with the colors on everything. SOLDIER uniforms, Turk uniforms, the look of everything in Advent Children, the slums in Crisis Core, etc.

Let's not get carried away here. I don't like that the SOLDIER uniforms changed either, but Crisis Core was not dull, dark or gritty. Weren't we just complaining on the other page that the slums were too bright and chipper?

Advent Children did have the gray and blue color palette (though Complete brightened it considerably), Dirge used black and red but that's because those are Vincent's colors. Crisis Core matched VII's color palette pretty well. Junon is just as burnt orange, the Shinra building is lots of blues and greens. The backgrounds aren't quite as vibrant but that was the beuaty of prerendered backgrounds versus the PSP rendering everything in real time.

 

[Roger]

Let's not get carried away here. I don't like that the SOLDIER uniforms changed either, but Crisis Core was not dull, dark or gritty. Weren't we just complaining on the other page that the slums were too bright and chipper?

Advent Children did have the gray and blue color palette (though Complete brightened it considerably), Dirge used black and red but that's because those are Vincent's colors. Crisis Core matched VII's color palette pretty well. Junon is just as burnt orange, the Shinra building is lots of blues and greens. The backgrounds aren't quite as vibrant but that was the beuaty of prerendered backgrounds versus the PSP rendering everything in real time.

??? Dirge put blue makolines on absolutely everything. I don't know what you mean by black and red being it's colors. The interface is red but that's about it.

 

[ForceStealer]

Everything to do with Deepground, yes. But the missions were frequently at night or sunest with lots of blacks and reds like the train graveyard or the assault on the WRO or Edge.

Whatever, my point was Crisis Core shares FF7's palette despite the uniform changes while the other two do not.