SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[liuliuliu]

t. And his (delusional) relief at her being 'alive' would overshadow Tifa in that moment. It would overshadow literally everything and that makes sense. His brain would be like you should treasure her, she loves you, she almost died - she's been a great person in your life, you love her, you should treasure her.

That intense love you described will confuse the hell out of people…. I hope they don’t go with this route. But I definitely can see they do this to attract (bait?) more people in pt3. I just hope if they choose to do it please get it over by Ch4 so it will be bearable. I prefer a comatose Cloud over a lunatic Cloud.

Honestly I’m quite worried about Rebirth sales, and pt3 in general . I hope they would stick with UE4 instead of trying to move to UE5 to save some development cycles. Hope they can get this out as soon as possible.

I think devs says they got inspired by empire strikes back and have Rebirth ended at one of the lowest points in OG. but the the thing is it doesn’t take 100 hours to watch a movie and it doesn’t take 3 years for next one to come out.

 

[r_monk]

I think Cissnei is the type that has to constantly explain that she's not hitting on everyone. Poor girl has resting love interest face.

She and Tifa should get together. Tifa could teach her how to properly cook those mushrooms.

 

[Rin]

I agree she said he wasn't an ex but "dunno what he was ... but I miss him"

I mean to be fair.... what WAS he? They weren't close enough to be friends and they certainly weren't dating. He might have flirted at first but that's before meeting Aerith and he doesn't do it again after. By the end, he just wants her out of his way because she's a Turk and she's threatening his and Clouds safety.

Her relationship with him is pretty undefinable. It goes too deep to be acquaintances, but again they're not friends, and they aren't even really co-workers. It's a weird space to live in for her, I'm sure.

 

[faefolk]

Interesting take on the White Materia. Regarding the White Materia in the end:

Spoiler

Are you sure it was “corrupted” by Cloud? It seems like he just put it back in his pocket and then picked up the Black Materia.

Nevertheless, I’m really glad that the White Materia is seemingly going to be used as a plot device in Part 3 since in OG it kinda just falls and is never seen again. I like the theory where the White Materia will play a role in Cloud gaining back his memories in the Lifestream sequence with Tifa, similar to how it seems like Aerith “gained back” her powers/memories when Cloud handed her the White Materia in the Sleeping Forest.

Dude you have just blown my mind. I think you're right. I didn't realise it was a different orb. O_O
I can't believe I missed that. I had read in the leaks that it was corrupted so clearly my brain just interpreted the information as I had previously read. Thanks for pointing this out haha that makes me way less nervous!

 

[r_monk]

Dude you have just blown my mind. I think you're right. I didn't realise it was a different orb. O_O
I can't believe I missed that. I had read in the leaks that it was corrupted so clearly my brain just interpreted the information as I had previously read. Thanks for pointing this out haha that makes me way less nervous!

Yeah, my take was that she took him into the other world because she needed a fully juiced-up white materia, which she didn't have in the main world. No idea what the hell the empty one is going to do, though, but that's a fantastic theory.

 

[faefolk]

That intense love you described will confuse the hell out of people…. I hope they don’t go with this route. But I definitely can see they do this to attract (bait?) more people in pt3. I just hope if they choose to do it please get it over by Ch4 so it will be bearable. I prefer a comatose Cloud over a lunatic Cloud.

Honestly I’m quite worried about Rebirth sales, and pt3 in general . I hope they would stick with UE4 instead of trying to move to UE5 to save some development cycles. Hope they can get this out as soon as possible.

I think devs says they got inspired by empire strikes back and have Rebirth ended at one of the lowest points in OG. but the the thing is it doesn’t take 100 hours to watch a movie and it doesn’t take 3 years for next one to come out.

Oh I didn't mean the intense love was him being crazy at all. I mean like... That's genuinely a very normal reaction to someone dying. Especially suddenly and tragically. It kind of takes over everything and your thoughts about that person become very consuming. Same with someone you care for almost dying.

I think Cloud would continue to have intense love for Aerith and Zack his whole life, even after the events of the game. It would just kind of settle into something less all-consuming in the aftermath.

Also clarifying that intense love does not equal romantic love and reiterating my view that Clouds brain would be unable to process what kind of love he is feeling - just that it's very intense. Love and grief go hand in hand.

 

[faefolk]

Yeah, my take was that she took him into the other world because she needed a fully juiced-up white materia, which she didn't have in the main world. No idea what the hell the empty one is going to do, though, but that's a fantastic theory.

It will be cool if they do something with the second empty holy materia. I'm guessing they may since they made a point of him looking at it during the closing scene.

 

[Rin]

Yeah, my take was that she took him into the other world because she needed a fully juiced-up white materia, which she didn't have in the main world. No idea what the hell the empty one is going to do, though, but that's a fantastic theory.

Aerith says it's empty because she lost her memories, so that means the white materia is probably tied to having a strong sense of self. Perhaps, once Tifa and Cloud fall into the LS and his true self is restored that will recharge the white materia?

 

[GamerSkull]

I guess I’ll have the hot take that I actually like AC. Hehehe

Well, at least the Complete version.

 

[faefolk]

I guess I’ll have the hot take that I actually like AC. Hehehe

Well, at least the Complete version.

Me too! I think it's kind of cool that they have a story with a boatload of trauma that has a realistic sequel where that trauma is still deeply affecting the characters. As much as I desperately want the characters to be happy and okay - I like that they made me sit with the discomfort of knowing Cloud wouldn't magically be fine after all that trauma.

It's a slow journey towards healing. I appreciate the honesty in that.

 

[Hix]

I mean to be fair.... what WAS he? They weren't close enough to be friends and they certainly weren't dating. He might have flirted at first but that's before meeting Aerith and he doesn't do it again after. By the end, he just wants her out of his way because she's a Turk and she's threatening his and Clouds safety.

Her relationship with him is pretty undefinable. It goes too deep to be acquaintances, but again they're not friends, and they aren't even really co-workers. It's a weird space to live in for her, I'm sure.

I'd say acquaintances is probably the closest.

Zack doesn't even know her real name (it's not Cissnei) or really anything about her - and she doesn't really know him as a person, beyond the facade, either - but they share a mostly friendly rapport for most of Crisis Core. Plot developments complicate that a bit, but in all I'd say "acquaintances" fits the best even still.

I guess I’ll have the hot take that I actually like AC. Hehehe

Well, at least the Complete version.

Right there with you. I mean the overarching plot is fluff and some of the dialogue is horrendous, but it's a visually entertaining movie with (speaking of Complete) a satisfying conclusion for the characters.

Cloud is able to let go of any residual guilt over Zack/Aerith"s deaths and move on with his family. The two main couples of the franchise are together - CT in life, ZA in death - and, in general, the movie does a decent job of displaying trauma rather than taking the easy route and ignoring it.

I'd love if they gave it the Remake trilogy treatment and further expanded on it, but if it's the end of the line just as-is I think it's fine.

 

[null]

I guess I’ll have the hot take that I actually like AC. Hehehe

Well, at least the Complete version.

The nice things I have to say about it are:

• It was visually light years ahead of its time
• Fight scenes were all incredible
• OST is incredible (still jog to it)
• OG flashbacks were incredible
• Fusion sword is damn cool
• Fenrir is damn cool
• Omnislash v5 is damn cool
• Vincent is damn cool
• Rufus is damn cool (should be dead but he is damn cool)
• Loz taught my 3 year old daughter to say wheeeeres motheerrr

 

[starcape91]

I don’t think the empty materia will be the thing that helps Cloud become whole again, but I could see it changing in some way once he is better.

 

[Empyrea]

Gotta wonder how these scenes would be viewed if a man acted like Aerith and a woman acted like Cloud. Would these still feel semi-romantic in that circumstance or super creepy?

I've had a guy do that to me. Let it be known he didn't get away with just a slap -- I punched him, multiple times.

 

[Maidenofwar]

I don't think this is developer intentions at all. Furthermore everyone always go after Aerith but other characters aren't actually gentle with their touch and just shove others around. Not only this but Cloud is kind of well ... Cloud with other characters, even Tifa, it's not just Aerith, when he finds something isn't fun, or gets a bit upset, it's shown.

 

[Rin]

I don't think this is developer intentions at all. Furthermore everyone always go after Aerith but other characters aren't actually gentle with their touch and just shove others around. Not only this but Cloud is kind of well ... Cloud with other characters, even Tifa, it's not just Aerith, when he finds something isn't fun, or gets a bit upset, it's shown.

This is what I meant earlier in that Aerith doesn't get special treatment from Cloud. He treats her the same way he treats all his friends. The only person who gets overt special attention is Tifa, as Cloud has officially been established as not being interested in initiating a kiss with anyone else or confirming romantic feelings with anyone else.

Aerith isn't really doing anything horrible but she does push his boundaries, just like Yuffie and Barret, and therefore Cloud gets snappy with them most often. This doesn't mean he doesn't care about them or that they aren't his friends. They just get on his nerves a little more than others lol

 

[Maidenofwar]

He snaps at Tifa too, and isn't always having fun on their quests.

I was also referring to Barret outright hauling Yuffie away or push/shoving her, or how the party is physical with say Cait Sith. It's kind of rough.

 

[Rin]

I can't recall a time he snaps at Tifa during their quests but I haven't done them all. Can you give me an example? I can think of him being grumpy and snappy w/ her in Remake but not Rebirth

 

[faefolk]

This is what I meant earlier in that Aerith doesn't get special treatment from Cloud. He treats her the same way he treats all his friends. The only person who gets overt special attention is Tifa, as Cloud has officially been established as not being interested in initiating a kiss with anyone else or confirming romantic feelings with anyone else.

He snaps at Tifa too, and isn't always having fun on their quests.

I agree with both of you. Cloud definitely is kind of an ass and that definitely extends to Tifa too at times. I would agree that overall he is much more gentle with Tifa and with much more 'initiative taking romantic undertones' - especially after he recalls their promise in Remake and gains a bit of his former self back. He's also much softer again with her between apologising for Kalm and the Temple of the Ancients. After that he really falls into Jenovas mind-fkery and is just the worst to everyone lol.

But I definitely think that Cloud is shown to be kind of a softie towards females in general. He's pretty soft with Jessie in Remake, soft with Tifa, soft with Aerith and has started being real big brothery with Yuffie now she's been around for a bit. He just tries so hard to be aloof all the time and it makes him act like a d-bag lmao. I don't think anyone is safe from Clouds cool act, even Tifa. (but again I agree with Rin that he's significantly more encouraging/soft with Tifa)

 

[Maidenofwar]

Spoiler

One example is later in Nibelheim, Tifa is talking about her memories, and she says something about Cloud having fun/being happy, and Cloud is all like you think I was happy!?, and Tifa was whoops guess we still don't really know each other that well, or something. I vaguely remember something about Cloud thinking frogs weren't going to be all that fun, though I might be remembering that wrong. There might be others.

 

[faefolk]

I can't recall a time he snaps at Tifa during their quests but I haven't done them all. Can you give me an example? I can think of him being grumpy and snappy w/ her in Remake but not Rebirth

Obviously he's low key the worst in Kalm but I agree that post-water tower remembrance in Remake and post apology for his behaviour in Kalm in Rebirth he is significantly better and just full simping. He's an AH again in the Temple of the Ancients but definitely a key difference with these examples is that the moments in Rebirth he is awful to Tifa are when he is under the control of/being heavily manipulated by Sephiroth/Jenova.

It definitely says a lot that it takes alien interference to get him to be a dick to her lmao.

 

[faefolk]

Spoiler

One example is later in Nibelheim, Tifa is talking about her memories, and she says something about Cloud having fun/being happy, and Cloud is all like you think I was happy!?, and Tifa was whoops guess we still don't really know each other that well, or something. I vaguely remember something about Cloud thinking frogs weren't going to be all that fun, though I might be remembering that wrong. There might be others.

I didn't see that so much as snappy re Nibelheim. Especially given the greater context of that conversation being positive and nice. Also the frog thing I kind of get but he also was trying to be cool and she knows that which is why she yeets him back onto the lake lol. Ribbit ribbit.

Dude needs to accept that he's just a dork

 

[Rin]

Spoiler

One example is later in Nibelheim, Tifa is talking about her memories, and she says something about Cloud having fun/being happy, and Cloud is all like you think I was happy!?, and Tifa was whoops guess we still don't really know each other that well, or something. I vaguely remember something about Cloud thinking frogs weren't going to be all that fun, though I might be remembering that wrong. There might be others.

ah, I see what you mean but this isn't quite what I was talking about in regards to being snappy. I don't consider him to be snapping at Tifa in either of those moments, just blunt/honest.

When I'm talking about Cloud being snappy with Aerith I'm specifically talking about the Costa del Sol "date" when he straight up tells her that he doesn't want her to consider the task they're doing to be romantic and he just keeps getting more and more frustrated with her as the side quest goes on to the point of even calling her mean at the end of it. If there's an equivalent of this level of frustration that happens with Tifa, I haven't seen it. This is what I mean about Aerith pushing his boundaries but it's not her being malicious or doing anything wrong. Shes just being herself but he's not into it.

 

[Rin]

It definitely says a lot that it takes alien interference to get him to be a dick to her lmao.

Yeah, precisely. There are moments with Aerith where I'm taken aback by some of the things he says/how he says them and I'm like "WHOA, be nice!!" And I don't count the Jenova influence stuff cause, yeah, that's not really him lol but most of the time when he's being rude to her he's not under Jenova influence in the first place. He's just very hot and cold with her tbh

 

[Maidenofwar]

The side quest was positive and nice, and wholesome as a whole, but Cloud still seemed a bit put out to me, somewhat bothered by Tifa saying/ thinking that, and Tifa going guess we still aren't that close that late in the game had me a bit wait what, but I agree at least it ended on a positive note, and of course I just love the quest as a whole because cats

I still haven't done a lot of these quests myself yet these are just my remembering from friend's stream but I'm really looking forward to the cats. I'm saved just before the second boss in Gongaga reactor. Again I do see things differently as Aerith and Tifa seemed a bit put out by Cloud calling Zack a loser, saying to forget him, and started to say that man is dead, that ended on tragic note, but to me Cloud came across a bit salty at first over Zack getting called charming etc, if he was just curious he had a funny way of showing it. I don't think it's too much of a stretch because of the Ultimania saying Cloud might have complicated feelings at the thought of Aerith being on a date with another.