SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[A-to-Z]

Maybe because I only became a fan after Remake, but I also don’t understand how “all her unique traits are now tied to Zack” Aerith loved flowers even before they met, she already planted the reunion flowers outside her house, and loved ribbons (wore them in childhood) along with the color pink before Zack, because she herself picked the ribbon according to her preference. The traits tied to Zack are, in my opinion, surface-level aspects of her character.

I feel like we shouldn’t attribute her entire career as a flower-seller to him either because he’s been absent for most of it, he just gave her the idea (and I get maybe that’s what you don’t like). If they wanted to show that Zack helped Aerith realize that she wanted to spread flowers all around Midgar, then yes the game should have invested more time into making this connection feel more natural (along with the many other lore concepts and relationships that CC introduced which could’ve been more polished in writing)

Overall ZA just have a shared history (they once shared a dream, both looked forward to their future together without expecting to part ways), and Zack dying paints Aerith as someone who moves on with her life despite her losses. For me what always made Aerith unique was her Cetra heritage, her backstory, personality, and character development arc; none of which can be credited to Zack, as her love interest, he’s just one of the many factors that adds to them, with or without CC I think those remain consistent and unscathed.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Maybe because I only became a fan after Remake, but I also don’t understand how “all her unique traits are now tied to Zack” Aerith loved flowers even before they met, she already planted the reunion flowers outside her house, and loved ribbons (wore them in childhood) along with the color pink before Zack, because she herself picked the ribbon according to her preference. The traits tied to Zack are, in my opinion, surface-level aspects of her character.

I feel like we shouldn’t attribute her entire career as a flower-seller to him either because he’s been absent for most of it, he just gave her the idea (and I get maybe that’s what you don’t like). If they wanted to show that Zack helped Aerith realize that she wanted to spread flowers all around Midgar, then yes the game should have invested more time into making this connection feel more natural (along with the many other lore concepts and relationships that CC introduced which could’ve been more polished in writing)

Overall ZA just have a shared history (they once shared a dream, both looked forward to their future together without expecting to part ways), and Zack dying paints Aerith as someone who moves on with her life despite her losses. For me what always made Aerith unique was her Cetra heritage, her backstory, personality, and character development arc; none of which can be credited to Zack, as her love interest, he’s just one of the many factors that adds to them, with or without CC I think those remain consistent and unscathed.

Yeah it's admittedly I think mostly frustration. At least my feelings were. Frustration because of the situation. I think if CC had been released a year after OG or 5 years after maybe this wouldn't be the reaction. Maybe it would have been easily accepted even. But as a CA fan of OG ten years passed then this released. Zack in Maiden was not painted in the best light, Zack in general was mostly absent, Dismantled said she loved Cloud more. All of these things set these ideas and expectations and those ideas lingered for ten years.

I don't think all of Aerith was erased by Zack. Just it did feel that way and on the surface it looked that way and Nojima had a quote saying he tried to tie as many aspects of Zack to her as possible because he felt sorry for her. So that just added to the upset. Especially when even moments she had with Cloud were now originally with Zack. I felt like I had been lead on and while I didn't particularly think Aerith was ruined I wanted more of those moments where she is more dynamic like in OG. Alas CC was not the game for that.

It didn't make me a Zerith hater or anything. But I am just saying I completely understand why the initial reaction of many CAs was rejection and to get upset. I don't think every assessment is fair. Like no it didn't ruin her character, no Zack is not bad for her. As I said some takes about CC are exaggerated but I see where it came from.

 

[tenabrus]

"Pink Hell" was a common derogatory nickname for the CloudXAeris invisionfree board, but the sentiment was hardly unique there.

Snapshot, for the curious. And the zetaboard version. Some of it is still searchable through the Wayback Machine.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Maybe because I only became a fan after Remake, but I also don’t understand how “all her unique traits are now tied to Zack” Aerith loved flowers even before they met, she already planted the reunion flowers outside her house, and loved ribbons (wore them in childhood) along with the color pink before Zack, because she herself picked the ribbon according to her preference. The traits tied to Zack are, in my opinion, surface-level aspects of her character.

I feel like we shouldn’t attribute her entire career as a flower-seller to him either because he’s been absent for most of it, he just gave her the idea (and I get maybe that’s what you don’t like). If they wanted to show that Zack helped Aerith realize that she wanted to spread flowers all around Midgar, then yes the game should have invested more time into making this connection feel more natural (along with the many other lore concepts and relationships that CC introduced which could’ve been more polished in writing)

Overall ZA just have a shared history (they once shared a dream, both looked forward to their future together without expecting to part ways), and Zack dying paints Aerith as someone who moves on with her life despite her losses. For me what always made Aerith unique was her Cetra heritage, her backstory, personality, and character development arc; none of which can be credited to Zack, as her love interest, he’s just one of the many factors that adds to them, with or without CC I think those remain consistent and unscathed.

I found that quite often the "all her unique traits are now tied to Zack" really meant "Everything we had claimed for Cloud x Aerith is now Zack x Aerith instead" and yes. That was the point. Not as a malicious dig against shippers, but to elaborate on just what all Aerith's first love actually meant to her, and why Cloud did fascinate her so much because of it.

Snapshot, for the curious. And the zetaboard version. Some of it is still searchable through the Wayback Machine.

That color scheme- more hideous than I recalled - was why it got the moniker Pink Hell. I forget when exactly the name changeover happened.

 

[Eerie]

A few points:

Introducing Zack would have been fine but the way it went was to basically show us that Clerith wasn't special in anyway because the scenes we even associated with Aerith and Cloud were now ZA moments.

Like I respect writers and canon but there is a thing also called understanding your audience too. You don't just let your audience for ten years think their fave female character has this super special arc then suddenly go no everything you love about her is due to this guy and expect them to just happily go "OK". I love Zerith but yes at first I was definitely like what is this?? And I know if the shoe was on the other foot CTs would definitely understand what I mean.

The problem is that the CA fandom saw it this way, but Nojima saw it as "protecting Aerith from wrong statements" (especially the date line).

The devs, and Nojima especially, simply don't have the same idea about this game, the characters and their relationships than the players, especially shippers. In Rebirth they've taken away a lot of CT motifs too, yet CT is still there. Them not having that callback shows that it wasn't that important - but the OG having so few scenes betweens CA and CT also meant that we tend to cling to little things.

The OG scene in Gonagaga is actually very short and gives the impression she isn't that upset because she's talking about him probably finding some other girl. Like yes we should catch on she was in denial but the game doesn't really give us an indication to actually think this.

A friend of mine aboslutely loved Aerith in the OG but never shipped CA because it was very obvious to her that Aerith was not over Zack. So she shipped CT instead.

But, would he if he had his mind back? That's always been the question to me. We know the "real" Cloud loves Tifa, but in the OG, we'll never know about Aerith.

I will be fair, and I will tell you that maybe you see it that way, but the reason why people don't is precisely because Tifa is here and we see Cloud being in love with her. Hell, he even use "ai" while attacking her in Gongaga, showing that yes, he's talking about that kind of love when he thinks about Tifa.
It's a game where you cannot say "oh but if.." no. It doesn't work like that. If Tifa didn't exist, Aerith wouldn't either because they're the same coin, so the story would be vastly different. That's the truth. And we know who Cloud loves: despite having two girls who have romantic feelings for him, he only kisses one. There's a reason, why it's here, in part 2, before Aerith dies: it's to show WHO Cloud loves, even with Aerith around. There's a reason why so many articles are like "hey, the Tifa date is the most romantic! You have to see that!" because hell, in 27 years we finally see Cloud kiss his love interest in game. That's HUGE and I have the feeling that for some players it completely goes unnoticed because they are so entrenched with the idea that he cannot be in love with Tifa.

I went back and rewatched the carriage scene and I retroactively was upset like “TIFA HE COULD HAVE DIED????”
But I guess, as I think was mentioned here before, Tifa just has that much faith in him at that point that I don’t think she truly believes that he’d die on her like that. I never finished Intergrade so I didn’t know she had scenes where she was looking for him even a little. But I think at that point too, Cloud has already told her that he’s staying in Midgar to keep his promise to her? Which probably just strengthens her faith in him, especially since he remembers after all those years apart. At this point she believes that he made it into SOLDIER and everything too. Not long before this he just stumbles into Midgar and they find each other again, like it was fate. So I guess I can’t blame her for having that much faith in him lol.

Tifa was super worried and this is exactly why she acted super rashly. When she has strong feelings like that she does rash things, it's one of her character's traits (rage, but not only). She's an action girl, and thinks too much - she tries to erase the feelings/thoughts by acting, usually not in the best way.

The trick with the affection value shell game is that you can choose to say nice or mean things to Aerith, but you can't actually choose to say anything mean to Tifa.

It's still the same in Rebirth TBH, you can be quite mean to Aerith, but Tifa's worst options are rather neutral.

 

[tenabrus]

It didn't make me a Zerith hater or anything. But I am just saying I completely understand why the initial reaction of many CAs was rejection and to get upset. I don't think every assessment is fair like no it didn't ruin her character as I said some takes about CC are exaggerated but I see where it came from.

While I've more or less come around to Crisis Core, I was in the same boat, although not for Clerith/Zerith reasons. I think it's a problem with a lot of prequel storytelling, that they naturally tend to eliminate the mystique of backstory in the original work via explanation. Zack in the OG was much more conceptual in nature, but Zack in CC has to put up or shut up in being the image of the idealized love Aerith hasn't been able to let go of, and the idealized hero Cloud wishes he could be.

I also feel like, once it seems like they collectively memory holed Cloud's original fake persona with the KH version, it made it a bit more inexplicable that Aerith would really associate them with each other, and they felt like it was necessary to try and explain what exactly Aerith thought she saw in Cloud that made her think of Zack, and why her attachment would be so pronounced. Hence giving Cloud's introduction and her early dynamic with Cloud to Zack.

The silver lining for CAs, I imagine, is that by making Zack so distinct from Cloud, it does add credence to Aerith genuinely coming to care for Cloud as his own unique person, whereas OG Cloud never really steps out of Zack's shadow before she dies.

 

[Stiggie]

Such a complicated situation.

That's precisely with the added context of Crisis Core that I learned to love Aerith when I couldn't stand her in OG.

I feel so sorry for the devs. Must be so hard to make every corner of the fandom happy. FF7 is such a big thing, with differents fans, so many wishes.

That's why they should just pick a lane and stick with it, stop people from having their expectations ruined by just pulling off the bandaid

 

[tenabrus]

I will be fair, and I will tell you that maybe you see it that way, but the reason why people don't is precisely because Tifa is here and we see Cloud being in love with her. Hell, he even use "ai" while attacking her in Gongaga, showing that yes, he's talking about that kind of love when he thinks about Tifa.

Some people also don't pick up on Cloud having any feelings for Tifa, or Aerith having any feelings for Zack, or whatever. There are plenty of people who feel very very strongly that the game actually is saying Cloud is always in love with Aerith and never loves anyone else. I don't agree with them, but that people can form an opinion isn't proof the viability of that opinion.

It's a game where you cannot say "oh but if.." no. It doesn't work like that. If Tifa didn't exist, Aerith wouldn't either because they're the same coin, so the story would be vastly different.

Are you just generally objecting to the existence of hypotheticals? Naturally the story would be different, but it is interesting to explore alternative possibilities. I will point out that the remake trilogy is itself an exploration of possibility. Obviously many of the interactions we see between all of the characters, including Cloud and Tifa's kiss, did not exist in the original. Rebirth means accepting an alternate story with these characters where this makes sense.

That's HUGE and I have the feeling that for some players it completely goes unnoticed because they are so entrenched with the idea that he cannot be in love with Tifa.

I feel like you're missing my point entirely. I prefer CT and have for many years. I feel the OG ends with CT, and that it's not ambiguous either. I feel the Compilation deliberately plays coy about it, but at worst is just coy about the exact nature of Cloud and Tifa's relationship, rather than the idea Cloud is still so in love with Aerith his greatest wish is to die and be reunited with her.

I am in no way missing the significance of Cloud kissing Tifa but not kissing Aerith. But I am also willing to explore alternative dynamics, the complexities of these characters and their feelings and their situations; I'm not interested in reducing them down to the simplest version of themselves that best supports the romantic pairing I prefer.

And, not for nothing, but that's ultimately the reason I think FF7 supports Cloud/Tifa, because you can completely argue for the existence of Cloud and Aerith's romantic feelings for each other and argue for Cloud and Tifa's, and the Cloti endgame still makes sense. But you cannot do the opposite: making the romantic argument for Tifa and Cloud totally undercuts Cloud/Aerith, so it must be disregarded or ignored.

EDIT: And to be clear, I'm not arguing "would Cloud love Aerith more than Tifa?". That's not the point of the question. The question is more about exploring how Cloud's "real" feelings relate to Aerith. Could he have loved Aerith if he were the real him? How much does it "count" for Cloud to have romantic feelings for Aerith before--is the time Cloud and Tifa spent bonding when he was not himself irrelevant? If not, why would it be different for Aerith? And so on.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Some people also don't pick up on Cloud having any feelings for Tifa, or Aerith having any feelings for Zack, or whatever. There are plenty of people who feel very very strongly that the game actually is saying Cloud is always in love with Aerith and never loves anyone else. I don't agree with them, but that people can form an opinion isn't proof the viability of that opinion.

Are you just generally objecting to the existence of hypotheticals? Naturally the story would be different, but it is interesting to explore alternative possibilities. I will point out that the remake trilogy is itself an exploration of possibility. Obviously many of the interactions we see between all of the characters, including Cloud and Tifa's kiss, did not exist in the original. Rebirth means accepting an alternate story with these characters where this makes sense.

I feel like you're missing my point entirely. I prefer CT and have for many years. I feel the OG ends with CT, and that it's not ambiguous either. I feel the Compilation deliberately plays coy about it, but at worst is just coy about the exact nature of Cloud and Tifa's relationship, rather than the idea Cloud is still so in love with Aerith his greatest wish is to die and be reunited with her.

I am in no way missing the significance of Cloud kissing Tifa but not kissing Aerith. But I am also willing to explore alternative dynamics, the complexities of these characters and their feelings and their situations; I'm not interested in reducing them down to the simplest version of themselves that best supports the romantic pairing I prefer.

And, not for nothing, but that's ultimately the reason I think FF7 supports Cloud/Tifa, because you can completely argue for the existence of Cloud and Aerith's romantic feelings for each other and argue for Cloud and Tifa's, and the Cloti endgame still makes sense. But you cannot do the opposite: making the romantic argument for Tifa and Cloud totally undercuts Cloud/Aerith, so it must be disregarded or ignored.

I said many years ago that you can make an argument for Cloud and Tifa being a couple in the endgame without every mentioning Aerith or whether or not Cloud loved her or not or how. C/T is an Aerith neutral proposition. C/A, by contrast, cannot ignore Tifa, because and not to put too fine a point on it, there is no Cloud as we know him without Tifa (Zack too in a lessened capacity). In a hypothetical world where there was no cute girl next door, Cloud never is inspired to leave home to join SOLDIER to become someone special to her. Or lets say she dies before the events of the game, then Cloud never recovers himself after Zack being gunned down.

You cannot have a Cloud that finds himself in the circumstances to meet Aerith without a Tifa in the picture somewhere. Not without rewriting the entire scenario so massively as to make it an entire Alternate Universe scenario.

 

[Stiggie]

I said many years ago that you can make an argument for Cloud and Tifa being a couple in the endgame without every mentioning Aerith or whether or not Cloud loved her or not or how. C/T is an Aerith neutral proposition. C/A, by contrast, cannot ignore Tifa, because and not to put too fine a point on it, there is no Cloud as we know him without Tifa (Zack too in a lessened capacity). In a hypothetical world where there was no cute girl next door, Cloud never is inspired to leave home to join SOLDIER to become someone special to her. Or lets say she dies before the events of the game, then Cloud never recovers himself after Zack being gunned down.

You cannot have a Cloud that finds himself in the circumstances to meet Aerith without a Tifa in the picture somewhere. Not without rewriting the entire scenario so massively as to make it an entire Alternate Universe scenario.

I'll do you one better, I could describe clouds entire internal story arc as it pertains to ffvii without ever mentioning Aerith. This always sounds more insulting than I intend it, but I could replace Aerith with a random holy summoning mcguffin and the story would still be fully intact.

Also, to come back to everything being about zack, couldn't it be argued that the og did the same for cloud? The entire premise of the games resolution is that everything that we believed was uniquely cloud was essentially received from Zack. It kinda makes everything of aerith actually being zack almost meta, it's just two zacks flirting with each other apparently XD

It's also arguable that the lifestream reveal makes it so that everything people liked about cloud and aerith, namely him being her bodyguard, is suddenly repurposed to actually be about tifa. You can always feel like that if you choose to take stuff the worst way.


Anyway, I still just vehemently oppose the idea that just because you discover how a person became a certain way that that somehow invalidates it. Cc explains how aerith, the young girl, became aerith, the woman.

 

[LNK]

But to be honest, I don’t like the argument that weapons of the planet are helping/protecting Tifa…which makes it sound like she is the “chosen one”…
One thing I really like in Og is that Cloud and Tifa really just feel like nobodies…

The thing is, the planet isn't necessarily protecting Tifa. It's protecting itself

 

[Sacky]

I said many years ago that you can make an argument for Cloud and Tifa being a couple in the endgame without every mentioning Aerith or whether or not Cloud loved her or not or how. C/T is an Aerith neutral proposition. C/A, by contrast, cannot ignore Tifa, because and not to put too fine a point on it, there is no Cloud as we know him without Tifa (Zack too in a lessened capacity). In a hypothetical world where there was no cute girl next door, Cloud never is inspired to leave home to join SOLDIER to become someone special to her. Or lets say she dies before the events of the game, then Cloud never recovers himself after Zack being gunned down.

You cannot have a Cloud that finds himself in the circumstances to meet Aerith without a Tifa in the picture somewhere. Not without rewriting the entire scenario so massively as to make it an entire Alternate Universe scenario.

Yeah when I try to think of a Cloud without Tifa wether people like it or not Clouds whole character does revolve around Tifa since it's what made him who he is. I guess without Tifa cloud would just be more angry at everyone never join soldier. Have no one in Nibelhiem but his mom and then be killed when Sephiroth burns down the village. He and his mom would still be ostracized by the village so Aerith meeting this Cloud even if she could I think she would feel sympathy for him but not anything more

 

[Sacky]

Yeah when I try to think of a Cloud without Tifa wether people like it or not Clouds whole character does revolve around Tifa since it's what made him who he is. I guess without Tifa cloud would just be more angry at everyone never join soldier. Have no one in Nibelhiem but his mom and then be killed when Sephiroth burns down the village. He and his mom would still be ostracized by the village so Aerith meeting this Cloud even if she could I think she would feel sympathy for him but not anything more

Say Tifa died though oh wait he would probably just shut down. Say Zack got him to Midgar and he did recover but then there's Zack. say theres no Zack or Zack and Aerith were never a thing but then Cloud wouldn't believe he's a soldier. The only scenario it would work in is if Aerith never died and Soldier Cloud chose Aeirth for some reason over Tifa but then Cloud never gains his true self back and probably just ends up mako poisoned after events in northern crater with no way to help him. Though I guess if he loved Aerith she could possibly help in lifestream but then why would he believe her when she wasn't there his subconscious needs someone who was with him in the memory. Ignore my late night rambling But yeah the whole story really falls apart and is so drastically different

 

[Ryushikaze]

I'll do you one better, I could describe clouds entire internal story arc as it pertains to ffvii without ever mentioning Aerith. This always sounds more insulting than I intend it, but I could replace Aerith with a random holy summoning mcguffin and the story would still be fully intact.

Yeah, Aerith being the person to summon Holy is her role in the greater narrative, but her being the one to die at Sephiroth's hand could have been taken by anyone but Tifa and Cloud's narrative would probably play out more or less identically. Why Sephypoo would kill them would take a lot more narrative massaging, mind you, as he killed Aerith because she could actively interfere with his big plan. Maybe someone noble sacrifice shoves her out of the way or something, I don't know.

Also, to come back to everything being about zack, couldn't it be argued that the og did the same for cloud? The entire premise of the games resolution is that everything that we believed was uniquely cloud was essentially received from Zack. It kinda makes everything of aerith actually being zack almost meta, it's just two zacks flirting with each other apparently XD

Well, Cloud LITERALLY took his persona from Zack, Aerith just acted like she did in OG because she wanted Zack back and subconsciously threw those desires onto the blondie acting unusually like him. Slightly different scenarios.

It's also arguable that the lifestream reveal makes it so that everything people liked about cloud and aerith, namely him being her bodyguard, is suddenly repurposed to actually be about tifa. You can always feel like that if you choose to take stuff the worst way.

I mean, at the end of the shell game you have to show where the pretty lady has always been, after all.

Anyway, I still just vehemently oppose the idea that just because you discover how a person became a certain way that that somehow invalidates it. Cc explains how aerith, the young girl, became aerith, the woman.

There is a lot to love narratively about Crisis Core. I just wish there was more variety in mission maps.

Yeah when I try to think of a Cloud without Tifa wether people like it or not Clouds whole character does revolve around Tifa since it's what made him who he is. I guess without Tifa cloud would just be more angry at everyone never join soldier. Have no one in Nibelhiem but his mom and then be killed when Sephiroth burns down the village. He and his mom would still be ostracized by the village so Aerith meeting this Cloud even if she could I think she would feel sympathy for him but not anything more

I'm not sure they were actually ostracized by the village. Cloud was on the outs with the village boys but that was because he was being a weirdo and THAT was because of Tifa, but we never get any indication that Claudia was disliked. IIRC she and Tifa's mom were quite close when the latter was still alive.

Say Tifa died though oh wait he would probably just shut down. Say Zack got him to Midgar and he did recover but then there's Zack. say theres no Zack or Zack and Aerith were never a thing but then Cloud wouldn't believe he's a soldier. The only scenario it would work in is if Aerith never died and Soldier Cloud chose Aeirth for some reason over Tifa but then Cloud never gains his true self back and probably just ends up mako poisoned after events in northern crater with no way to help him. Though I guess if he loved Aerith she could possibly help in lifestream but then why would he believe her when she wasn't there his subconscious needs someone who was with him in the memory. Ignore my late night rambling But yeah the whole story really falls apart and is so drastically different

Yeah, without Tifa bringing him back from Mako poisoning the story would necessarily be entirely different, even if Zack was alive.

 

[Eerie]

Are you just generally objecting to the existence of hypotheticals?

In this very thread, yes. We're talking canon, not "what ifs". Too many times have I seen people moving goalposts in LTDs. Yeah but what if Aerith lived in the OG? Why would the OG be different than Rebirth for that matter? It's not. Tifa doesn't exist? Neither does Cloud. It's that simple, it's also the reason why the Cloud in the other worlds doesn't wake up: because there's no Tifa around, the reason why he goes back to being catatonic in Gongaga after she falls in the pool of mako.

The story is written in such way that to me it's not really interesting to think about "yeah but what about CA is Tifa didn't exist?" because it would NOT be FFVII. I don't see the point. That's what fanfiction is for, and I'm totally OK with it there. CA in canon exist to push the illusion, CT the reality, it was so in Remake, it is also so in Rebirth. So of course you can argue that CA looks romantic if there's no Tifa around but that's missing completely the point. I'm sorry if I sound rash lol it's 1am but if you ask me, I'm probably part of the CT extremists because I don't think Cloud sees Aerith romantically, and I don't think that narratively it would work - it creates a messy story for both Cloud and Tifa; you can't give Aerith what's Tifa's, ie you cannot give her a romance with Cloud. And him calling her decisively a nakama in the church when she basically is confessing, and her seeing that they're not on the same level is the biggest proof of it.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Can't stop thinking about what Nojima said about the song, that Aerith went to write it, it was one thing, but she started to really get into it, ending up putting a lot of things, she got carried away, was overthinking, had to start over, something like that, and it made me think of the scenes before the show, the one where Cloud sees she is busy and decides not to interrupt her afterall, then with Cait Sith, also outside of cut scenes when you as player talk to her but she is busy. I wonder if Nojima was thinking about those scenes, I hope he knows they didn't go unnoticed or unappreciated in the end.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Anyway, I still just vehemently oppose the idea that just because you discover how a person became a certain way that that somehow invalidates it. Cc explains how aerith, the young girl, became aerith, the woman.

I never once said I think anything in Crisis Core completely invalidates Aerith's arc or Aerith's belongings. Yes it's still her, it's still her ribbon, her flowers etc. But in a game where she has limited screentime anyway they just could have done a lot more with her than that. And the reason they chose for how she became that way didn't sit well with many. And I explained why it didn't sit well. And the impression it gave. As I said Zack influencing her is fine giving her gifts etc. People are a product of their history which includes Zack I even wrote a blog post about this before saying I DON'T think it invalidates Aerith or ruins her character. But if people didn't like how it was handled I personally don't blame them.

However, in other aspects of Crisis Core I think they actually did a good job establishing Aerith's other sides of her personality which we don't often see. Her more quiet side which was present in OG in rare moments, we also see her fear of sky and it ties with the theme of freedom in her story. It also gave her some normalcy something she really wished for. As giving Zack get development. A-to-Z summarized really well what Crisis Core did achieve with Aerith's character and arc. These are all good things.
Before Crisis also did good things it just happened to be a mobile game but her leaving to look for Zack would have fit well in CC too.

To be very fair it provided a good foundation for their relationship. Intimate moments and established their feelings. I just wanted more of that less of Genesis shenanigans. More interactions. Stuff like that.

 

[Hellenic]

and why wouldn’t you? She seems like a good healer and magic damage dealer

I actually never really got drawn to using her for that, couse her normal attack was pretty bad and i don't think the game made the characters feel different enough to make me feel like i needed her for magic or healing either really. Other characters could handle that just fine.

That said i did use her in the mod called New Threat where they did make the characters more specialized for roles and she actually fit that caster archetype better than others.

So glad the remake series made the characters feel a lot more different and it wasn't all just based around materia setups for the most part.

 

[GamerSkull]

I actually never really got drawn to using her for that, couse her normal attack was pretty bad and i don't think the game made the characters feel different enough to make me feel like i needed her for magic or healing either really. Other characters could handle that just fine.

That said i did use her in the mod called New Threat where they did make the characters more specialized for roles and she actually fit that caster archetype better than others.

So glad the remake series made the characters feel a lot more different and it wasn't all just based around materia setups for the most part.

This reminds me that I need to check out some of the mods for FFVII. It might make for a varied playthrough since I feel like I know the OG game pretty well at this point.

As for using characters in party, I actually try to rotate frequently so that every characters gets their turn in the sun. And I do use Aerith more on occasion, mostly because I know she won’t be around in the second half of the game.

But yes, I do think there’s not too much of a difference between characters in the OG, you can essentially use anyone for anything, even if some characters might have slightly better stats in a given category.

 

[Hellenic]

Honestly I just think she was already under the assumption that he was alive, maybe a broken bone or two, but not dead, partially because Cloud even says "this aint the end of the line for you, or me".

I guess that's a fair point. Still wish there was some sorta bigger reaction all things considered, but oh well. At least we got Cloud dashing after her as an addition there.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

That's why they should just pick a lane and stick with it, stop people from having their expectations ruined by just pulling off the bandaid

I think ReTrilogy is doing that but maybe right now it's set up and part 3 will be the payoff. In terms of direction it seems to me they set up CT pretty clearly. We'll wait and see for ZA but so far I do think everything is set up for closure for them too.

 

[Hellenic]

I went back and rewatched the carriage scene and I retroactively was upset like “TIFA HE COULD HAVE DIED????”
But I guess, as I think was mentioned here before, Tifa just has that much faith in him at that point that I don’t think she truly believes that he’d die on her like that. I never finished Intergrade so I didn’t know she had scenes where she was looking for him even a little. But I think at that point too, Cloud has already told her that he’s staying in Midgar to keep his promise to her? Which probably just strengthens her faith in him, especially since he remembers after all those years apart. At this point she believes that he made it into SOLDIER and everything too. Not long before this he just stumbles into Midgar and they find each other again, like it was fate. So I guess I can’t blame her for having that much faith in him lol.

Just to correct a bit, Intergrade is the PS5 version of Remake, while Intermission is the Yuffie DLC itself. Anyhow, i guess i could give her the benefit of the doubt that she just had that much faith in Cloud to not really worry about it a whole lot, but it still does irk me a bit after how she looked while Barret had to carry her away. No biggie overall though.

 

[Hellenic]

I mean, Cloud fell off a mountain and got scraped knees. It's not his physical safety she's worried about.

Yeah this is another good point actually. I guess i just got whiplashed after the Sector 5 fall scene and expected more out of the reunion reaction after i guess.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Can't stop thinking about what Nojima said about the song, that Aerith went to write it, it was one thing, but she started to really get into it, ending up putting a lot of things, she got carried away, was overthinking, had to start over, something like that, and it made me think of the scenes before the show, the one where Cloud sees she is busy and decides not to interrupt her afterall, then with Cait Sith, also outside of cut scenes when you as player talk to her but she is busy. I wonder if Nojima was thinking about those scenes, I hope he knows they didn't go unnoticed or unappreciated in the end.

It's really beautiful I think. It fits her character so well too to sit there and overthink. I think Rebirth goes above and beyond with character moments like this.

 

[Stiggie]

This reminds me that I need to check out some of the mods for FFVII. It might make for a varied playthrough since I feel like I know the OG game pretty well at this point.

As for using characters in party, I actually try to rotate frequently so that every characters gets their turn in the sun. And I do use Aerith more on occasion, mostly because I know she won’t be around in the second half of the game.

But yes, I do think there’s not too much of a difference between characters in the OG, you can essentially use anyone for anything, even if some characters might have slightly better stats in a given category.

Is it heresy to say that in my last Remake playthrough I replaced Tifa with 2b? It was oddly fitting.

(also turned Barret into Thanos, Cloud into Zack, and Aerith into a FFIX garnet outfit, but I mostly played with 2b)